erik
New Member
Posts โข 204
Likes โข 151
March 2013
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by erik on May 9, 2016 21:00:52 GMT 1, A few days ago I posted an ad for an original Banksy - I was offered several pieces by member - bab or Joshua Nadel as he calls himself. He had 4 pieces in hand along with COA from PC.
Thanks to Rebelate's previous warnings, I approached this guy with some caution, but initially everything seemed legit. When the seller asked me to wire 80% of the agreed amount by PayPal, I asked Eric from Black Apple to give me a hand in the deal. Coincidentally, and just from my vague description of the piece, he could tell me that this particular work was sold to one of BF's forum members only a few weeks earlier.
Just thought I should post in case anyone else is dealing with this guy.
A few days ago I posted an ad for an original Banksy - I was offered several pieces by member - bab or Joshua Nadel as he calls himself. He had 4 pieces in hand along with COA from PC.
Thanks to Rebelate's previous warnings, I approached this guy with some caution, but initially everything seemed legit. When the seller asked me to wire 80% of the agreed amount by PayPal, I asked Eric from Black Apple to give me a hand in the deal. Coincidentally, and just from my vague description of the piece, he could tell me that this particular work was sold to one of BF's forum members only a few weeks earlier.
Just thought I should post in case anyone else is dealing with this guy.
|
|
Harveyn
Forum Guardian
Full Member
Posts โข 7,686
Likes โข 4,839
July 2007
Staff Member
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Harveyn on May 9, 2016 21:06:44 GMT 1, A few days ago I posted an ad for an original Banksy - I was offered several pieces by member - bab or Joshua Nadel as he calls himself. He had 4 pieces in hand along with COA from PC. Thanks to Rebelate's previous warnings, I approached this guy with some caution, but initially everything seemed legit. When the seller asked me to wire 80% of the agreed amount by PayPal, I asked Eric from Black Apple to give me a hand in the deal. Coincidentally, and just from my vague description of the piece, he could tell me that this particular work was sold to one of BF's forum members only a few weeks earlier. Just thought I should post in case anyone else is dealing with this guy.
I can confirm that the piece offered to Erik was not in Joshua Nadel's (BAB) hands, he was not authorized to sell it and the work indeed is not for sale.
A few days ago I posted an ad for an original Banksy - I was offered several pieces by member - bab or Joshua Nadel as he calls himself. He had 4 pieces in hand along with COA from PC. Thanks to Rebelate's previous warnings, I approached this guy with some caution, but initially everything seemed legit. When the seller asked me to wire 80% of the agreed amount by PayPal, I asked Eric from Black Apple to give me a hand in the deal. Coincidentally, and just from my vague description of the piece, he could tell me that this particular work was sold to one of BF's forum members only a few weeks earlier. Just thought I should post in case anyone else is dealing with this guy.
I can confirm that the piece offered to Erik was not in Joshua Nadel's (BAB) hands, he was not authorized to sell it and the work indeed is not for sale.
|
|
|
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Coach on May 9, 2016 21:46:58 GMT 1, A few days ago I posted an ad for an original Banksy - I was offered several pieces by member - bab or Joshua Nadel as he calls himself. He had 4 pieces in hand along with COA from PC. Thanks to Rebelate's previous warnings, I approached this guy with some caution, but initially everything seemed legit. When the seller asked me to wire 80% of the agreed amount by PayPal, I asked Eric from Black Apple to give me a hand in the deal. Coincidentally, and just from my vague description of the piece, he could tell me that this particular work was sold to one of BF's forum members only a few weeks earlier.ย Just thought I should post in case anyone else is dealing with this guy.ย
I can confirm that the piece offered to Erik was not in Joshua Nadel's (BAB) hands, he was not authorized to sell it and the work indeed is not for sale.
The piece was offered by a forum member?
A few days ago I posted an ad for an original Banksy - I was offered several pieces by member - bab or Joshua Nadel as he calls himself. He had 4 pieces in hand along with COA from PC. Thanks to Rebelate's previous warnings, I approached this guy with some caution, but initially everything seemed legit. When the seller asked me to wire 80% of the agreed amount by PayPal, I asked Eric from Black Apple to give me a hand in the deal. Coincidentally, and just from my vague description of the piece, he could tell me that this particular work was sold to one of BF's forum members only a few weeks earlier.ย Just thought I should post in case anyone else is dealing with this guy.ย
I can confirm that the piece offered to Erik was not in Joshua Nadel's (BAB) hands, he was not authorized to sell it and the work indeed is not for sale.
The piece was offered by a forum member? |
|
erik
New Member
Posts โข 204
Likes โข 151
March 2013
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by erik on May 9, 2016 21:55:59 GMT 1, Yes, I received a PM.
Yes, I received a PM.
|
|
DrWhite
Junior Member
Posts โข 4,107
Likes โข 5,395
August 2012
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by DrWhite on May 9, 2016 21:58:09 GMT 1,
Thanks for posting the warning for others.
Thanks for posting the warning for others.
|
|
nex
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,573
Likes โข 1,819
February 2009
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by nex on May 9, 2016 23:23:29 GMT 1, Could this individual please be banned?
He tried to sell me a Nola that wasn't his.
Could this individual please be banned?
He tried to sell me a Nola that wasn't his.
|
|
|
|
rebelate
New Member
Posts โข 813
Likes โข 520
November 2010
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by rebelate on May 10, 2016 1:05:04 GMT 1, Wow, Erik, I'm glad my post was able to help. 80% of an original Banksy would have been a huge hit to take if indeed it was a scam...which it sounds like it was.
I'm just happy I was able to help out the community. I'm the first one to call out people when they try and pull this type of shady behavior and many times I get a lot of heat for doing it, but at the end of the day when I hear a story like this it is all worth it. We're playing with way too much money to not look out for each other on these Banksy transactions.
And, just like Eric, I am also willing to lend a hand if anyone from out of town needs help facilitating a deal in LA.
Wow, Erik, I'm glad my post was able to help. 80% of an original Banksy would have been a huge hit to take if indeed it was a scam...which it sounds like it was.
I'm just happy I was able to help out the community. I'm the first one to call out people when they try and pull this type of shady behavior and many times I get a lot of heat for doing it, but at the end of the day when I hear a story like this it is all worth it. We're playing with way too much money to not look out for each other on these Banksy transactions.
And, just like Eric, I am also willing to lend a hand if anyone from out of town needs help facilitating a deal in LA.
|
|
Deleted
Posts โข 0
Likes โข
January 1970
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Deleted on May 10, 2016 1:14:22 GMT 1, And that's why the new for sale threads are utter nonsense.
And that's why the new for sale threads are utter nonsense.
|
|
londonboy
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,295
Likes โข 1,181
June 2013
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by londonboy on May 10, 2016 4:26:50 GMT 1, And that's why the new for sale threads are utter nonsense.
Absolutely ..
The sales thread were a mine of informations for everybody..
The forum certainly lost a lot of dynamic since the changes in the sales/looking for threads..
We all know it..
And that's why the new for sale threads are utter nonsense. Absolutely .. The sales thread were a mine of informations for everybody.. The forum certainly lost a lot of dynamic since the changes in the sales/looking for threads.. We all know it.. |
|
samfrost
New Member
Posts โข 782
Likes โข 526
June 2014
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by samfrost on May 10, 2016 4:34:04 GMT 1, Nice tip! This technique is all too common in the art world...selling what you don't have and clipping the difference between original seller and new buyer. Welcome to the shady dealings of the art world!
Nice tip! This technique is all too common in the art world...selling what you don't have and clipping the difference between original seller and new buyer. Welcome to the shady dealings of the art world!
|
|
Deleted
Posts โข 0
Likes โข
January 1970
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Deleted on May 10, 2016 5:54:18 GMT 1, And that's why the new for sale threads are utter nonsense. Absolutely .. The sales thread were a mine of informations for everybody.. The forum certainly lost a lot of dynamic since the changes in the sales/looking for threads.. We all know it..
And that's why the new for sale threads are utter nonsense. Absolutely .. The sales thread were a mine of informations for everybody.. The forum certainly lost a lot of dynamic since the changes in the sales/looking for threads.. We all know it.. I became very, very wary of buying new stuff on here as of late as there's no way to know if the seller is in any way legit. |
|
Black Apple Art
Art Gallery
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,007
Likes โข 3,970
September 2013
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Black Apple Art on May 10, 2016 8:01:29 GMT 1, Nice tip! This technique is all too common in the art world...selling what you don't have and clipping the difference between original seller and new buyer. Welcome to the shady dealings of the art world!
Nice tip! This technique is all too common in the art world...selling what you don't have and clipping the difference between original seller and new buyer. Welcome to the shady dealings of the art world! Welcome to sales threads with no comments ( aka no safeguards ) , a proper flushing of some great members and where the majority vote has zero effect on policy. |
|
rebelate
New Member
Posts โข 813
Likes โข 520
November 2010
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by rebelate on May 10, 2016 8:20:30 GMT 1, I find it pretty crazy that BAB would be doing deals like this on the forums with Erik while not addressing my thread of this one now.
BTW this is BAB at 00:33 of this video just incase anyone has a run in with him.
link to video
I find it pretty crazy that BAB would be doing deals like this on the forums with Erik while not addressing my thread of this one now. BTW this is BAB at 00:33 of this video just incase anyone has a run in with him. link to video |
|
Deleted
Posts โข 0
Likes โข
January 1970
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Deleted on May 10, 2016 9:00:36 GMT 1, Do you think he will get banned? Or only when someone loses a few thousand?
Well done OP for not losing out ( i would call the person who attempted the fraud a name, but i would get banned for profanity) Too much of this going on in our little world
www.fraudaid.com/backstage/why_con_artists_scam-01.htm
Do you think he will get banned? Or only when someone loses a few thousand? Well done OP for not losing out ( i would call the person who attempted the fraud a name, but i would get banned for profanity) Too much of this going on in our little world www.fraudaid.com/backstage/why_con_artists_scam-01.htm |
|
|
|
|
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Happy Shopper on May 10, 2016 10:40:51 GMT 1, Worth reporting to the Police in LA?
If you guys have clear proof he was offering pieces he didn't own and had no access to... and asked for payment. That's attempted fraud (if that's a crime!?)
Even if Joshua Nadel isn't his real name, if rebelate has proof he's the guy buying the Bomb Hugger placard at Julien's Auctions, the police should be able to track him down.
Worth reporting to the Police in LA?
If you guys have clear proof he was offering pieces he didn't own and had no access to... and asked for payment. That's attempted fraud (if that's a crime!?)
Even if Joshua Nadel isn't his real name, if rebelate has proof he's the guy buying the Bomb Hugger placard at Julien's Auctions, the police should be able to track him down.
|
|
11
Junior Member
Posts โข 4,810
Likes โข 6,711
February 2011
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by 11 on May 10, 2016 10:53:37 GMT 1, I do believe the inability to post on sales threads has given certain people the opportunity to exploit members by selling work they don't even own. I'm sure this will be a growing practice
I do believe the inability to post on sales threads has given certain people the opportunity to exploit members by selling work they don't even own. I'm sure this will be a growing practice
|
|
|
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Happy Shopper on May 10, 2016 10:57:28 GMT 1, I don't think the new sales thread system would effect people looking for pieces and contacted by PM by fraudsters.
I don't think the new sales thread system would effect people looking for pieces and contacted by PM by fraudsters.
|
|
ramo
New Member
Posts โข 269
Likes โข 70
February 2009
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by ramo on May 10, 2016 11:00:06 GMT 1, Imo we are not talking just about a ban. If he have tried to sell things which doesent belong to him and you can proof that I would call it fraud. And this is not a reason for a ban on a forum only!
Imo we are not talking just about a ban. If he have tried to sell things which doesent belong to him and you can proof that I would call it fraud. And this is not a reason for a ban on a forum only!
|
|
kel
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,111
Likes โข 511
October 2008
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by kel on May 10, 2016 11:53:06 GMT 1, There is a gap in the market to control the private sales of expensive art similar to solicitor or conveyancer when selling a house. Though you are all going to tell me this already exists.
There is a gap in the market to control the private sales of expensive art similar to solicitor or conveyancer when selling a house. Though you are all going to tell me this already exists.
|
|
|
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Daniel Silk on May 10, 2016 12:31:32 GMT 1, Any proven illegal activity should be taken to the Police.
An online forum is not able to solve this type of problem, but it can provide a place for the information to be shared and hopefully that can limit these issues in the future.
Please remember that before knocking this site, that you are reading about this on here! if it was not posted on here, maybe none of us would know.
Any proven illegal activity should be taken to the Police.
An online forum is not able to solve this type of problem, but it can provide a place for the information to be shared and hopefully that can limit these issues in the future.
Please remember that before knocking this site, that you are reading about this on here! if it was not posted on here, maybe none of us would know.
|
|
|
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Daniel Silk on May 10, 2016 12:35:16 GMT 1, I cant find a member here under the names mentioned? can somebody please post the members correct account name please?
I cant find a member here under the names mentioned? can somebody please post the members correct account name please?
|
|
tartarus
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,628
Likes โข 2,168
February 2013
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by tartarus on May 10, 2016 12:39:05 GMT 1, Any proven illegal activity should be taken to the Police. An online forum is not able to solve this type of problem, but it can provide a place for the information to be shared and hopefully that can limit these issues in the future. Please remember that before knocking this site, that you are reading about this on here! if it was not posted on here, maybe none of us would know.
Are you now also saying you will leave these people on here to do as they please even though they have been called out by well trusted members? Not to mention pretty conclusively too!
We need as much protection on here as we can give each other Dan, not less and less of it!
Any proven illegal activity should be taken to the Police. An online forum is not able to solve this type of problem, but it can provide a place for the information to be shared and hopefully that can limit these issues in the future. Please remember that before knocking this site, that you are reading about this on here! if it was not posted on here, maybe none of us would know. switch the sales threads back!! then we can be way MORE proactive about this stuff. Are you now also saying you will leave these people on here to do as they please even though they have been called out by well trusted members? Not to mention pretty conclusively too! We need as much protection on here as we can give each other Dan, not less and less of it! |
|
|
|
tartarus
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,628
Likes โข 2,168
February 2013
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by tartarus on May 10, 2016 12:39:52 GMT 1, There is a gap in the market to control the private sales of expensive art similar to solicitor or conveyancer when selling a house. Though you are all going to tell me this already exists.
There is a gap in the market to control the private sales of expensive art similar to solicitor or conveyancer when selling a house. Though you are all going to tell me this already exists. escrow? |
|
|
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Daniel Silk on May 10, 2016 12:46:12 GMT 1, Any proven illegal activity should be taken to the Police. An online forum is not able to solve this type of problem, but it can provide a place for the information to be shared and hopefully that can limit these issues in the future. Please remember that before knocking this site, that you are reading about this on here! if it was not posted on here, maybe none of us would know. switch the sales threads back!! then we can be way MORE proactive about this stuff. Are you now also saying you will leave these people on here to do as they please even though they have been called to by well trusted members? Not to mention pretty conclusively too! We need as much protection on here as we can give each other Dan, not less and less of it!
Any proven illegal activity should be taken to the Police. An online forum is not able to solve this type of problem, but it can provide a place for the information to be shared and hopefully that can limit these issues in the future. Please remember that before knocking this site, that you are reading about this on here! if it was not posted on here, maybe none of us would know. switch the sales threads back!! then we can be way MORE proactive about this stuff. Are you now also saying you will leave these people on here to do as they please even though they have been called to by well trusted members? Not to mention pretty conclusively too! We need as much protection on here as we can give each other Dan, not less and less of it! I had just posted asking for the name of the member being talked about, as I was looking at banning that account. But please remember that doesnt solve the problem! its still possible for these types of people to open new accounts and start again, and we cant do anything about that. |
|
|
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Daniel Silk on May 10, 2016 12:48:27 GMT 1, To be clear, this was an deal made via PM, Private Messages?
To be clear, this was an deal made via PM, Private Messages?
|
|
Harveyn
Forum Guardian
Full Member
Posts โข 7,686
Likes โข 4,839
July 2007
Staff Member
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Harveyn on May 10, 2016 12:54:31 GMT 1, I cant find a member here under the names mentioned? can somebody please post the members correct account name please?
I cant find a member here under the names mentioned? can somebody please post the members correct account name please? Dan the users name was BAB and when I checked last night it existed. They have either changed the name or deleted their account. I think the account was 5 or 6 months old with 50+ posts from recollection. |
|
tartarus
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,628
Likes โข 2,168
February 2013
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by tartarus on May 10, 2016 12:54:56 GMT 1, switch the sales threads back!! then we can be way MORE proactive about this stuff. Are you now also saying you will leave these people on here to do as they please even though they have been called to by well trusted members? Not to mention pretty conclusively too! We need as much protection on here as we can give each other Dan, not less and less of it! I had just posted asking for the name of the member being talked about, as I was looking at banning that account. But please remember that doesnt solve the problem! its still possible for these types of people to open new accounts and start again, and we cant do anything about that.
Can we not change the FS threads back, then there is an added line of defence for us all!
switch the sales threads back!! then we can be way MORE proactive about this stuff. Are you now also saying you will leave these people on here to do as they please even though they have been called to by well trusted members? Not to mention pretty conclusively too! We need as much protection on here as we can give each other Dan, not less and less of it! I had just posted asking for the name of the member being talked about, as I was looking at banning that account. But please remember that doesnt solve the problem! its still possible for these types of people to open new accounts and start again, and we cant do anything about that. Fair play, i thought by saying it should be reported to the cops you were not going to get involved. Can we not change the FS threads back, then there is an added line of defence for us all! |
|
|
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Daniel Silk on May 10, 2016 13:00:35 GMT 1, I cant find a member here under the names mentioned? can somebody please post the members correct account name please? Dan the users name was BAB and when I checked last night it existed. They have either changed the name or deleted their account. I think the account was 5 or 6 months old with 50+ posts from recollection.
Thanks, yeah it doesn't seem to appear on the members list now.
I just checked the security logs and they deleted their own account about 15 hours ago, but it does allow me to ban their IP address.
I cant find a member here under the names mentioned? can somebody please post the members correct account name please? Dan the users name was BAB and when I checked last night it existed. They have either changed the name or deleted their account. I think the account was 5 or 6 months old with 50+ posts from recollection. Thanks, yeah it doesn't seem to appear on the members list now. I just checked the security logs and they deleted their own account about 15 hours ago, but it does allow me to ban their IP address. |
|
Harveyn
Forum Guardian
Full Member
Posts โข 7,686
Likes โข 4,839
July 2007
Staff Member
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Harveyn on May 10, 2016 13:09:45 GMT 1, Dan the users name was BAB and when I checked last night it existed. They have either changed the name or deleted their account. I think the account was 5 or 6 months old with 50+ posts from recollection. Thanks, yeah it doesn't seem to appear on the members list now. I just checked the security logs and they deleted their own account about 15 hours ago, but it does allow me to ban their IP address. Unfortunately its impossible to stop this IMO.
At best the guy was trying to sell a piece thinking they could go back to the original seller and buy it for less even though they stated they had the work in hand along with PC. Obviously if this was the case they were not aware that it had already been sold. At worst they just intended to take Erik's money and run. The fact that he had asked for 80% to be paid suggests the later was the case.
This goes on all the time and its virtually impossible to stop. I use to think if you did not post images of art that your owned then people would not know of its existence and it would make this type of activity less likely. But the truth is, especially with Banksy that people know the works/images that exist and therefore by posting you own the work it probably is more likely the scam will be detected which is exactly what happened in this instance.
Dan the users name was BAB and when I checked last night it existed. They have either changed the name or deleted their account. I think the account was 5 or 6 months old with 50+ posts from recollection. Thanks, yeah it doesn't seem to appear on the members list now. I just checked the security logs and they deleted their own account about 15 hours ago, but it does allow me to ban their IP address. Unfortunately its impossible to stop this IMO.
At best the guy was trying to sell a piece thinking they could go back to the original seller and buy it for less even though they stated they had the work in hand along with PC. Obviously if this was the case they were not aware that it had already been sold. At worst they just intended to take Erik's money and run. The fact that he had asked for 80% to be paid suggests the later was the case.
This goes on all the time and its virtually impossible to stop. I use to think if you did not post images of art that your owned then people would not know of its existence and it would make this type of activity less likely. But the truth is, especially with Banksy that people know the works/images that exist and therefore by posting you own the work it probably is more likely the scam will be detected which is exactly what happened in this instance.
|
|
|
|
**Warning** Possible Banksy scam, by Daniel Silk on May 10, 2016 13:10:22 GMT 1, I had just posted asking for the name of the member being talked about, as I was looking at banning that account. But please remember that doesnt solve the problem! its still possible for these types of people to open new accounts and start again, and we cant do anything about that. Fair play, i thought by saying it should be reported to the cops you were not going to get involved. Can we not change the FS threads back, then there is an added line of defence for us all!
If any members spot anything shady! anything for sale that doesn't look right, anything by somebody who you have had bad dealings with, your all still free to comment under their sales with warnings and information, nobody is stopping you doing that.
And just like this thread here, if it needs further discussion, then your free start a thread with that members account name in the title.
I had just posted asking for the name of the member being talked about, as I was looking at banning that account. But please remember that doesnt solve the problem! its still possible for these types of people to open new accounts and start again, and we cant do anything about that. Fair play, i thought by saying it should be reported to the cops you were not going to get involved. Can we not change the FS threads back, then there is an added line of defence for us all! If any members spot anything shady! anything for sale that doesn't look right, anything by somebody who you have had bad dealings with, your all still free to comment under their sales with warnings and information, nobody is stopping you doing that. And just like this thread here, if it needs further discussion, then your free start a thread with that members account name in the title. |
|
