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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by Sebastian Dusseldorf on May 17, 2021 18:04:22 GMT 1, Now adding some migration politics and conspiracy to a debate that got derailed to discussing Memes, while some others struggle to use the expression Holocaust. I think this thread is adding as much value to the Middle Eastern crises as a proper airstrike.
Now adding some migration politics and conspiracy to a debate that got derailed to discussing Memes, while some others struggle to use the expression Holocaust. I think this thread is adding as much value to the Middle Eastern crises as a proper airstrike.
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Reader
Junior Member
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June 2016
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by Reader on May 17, 2021 18:12:15 GMT 1, They've been saying the same since Guttenberg..Radio, TV, Computer, Smart phone... jazz, rock n roll, gangsta rap :-). I think memes are evolving into being highly effecient means of conveying information, just that the "right" are much better at it. A good friend wrote a book a couple of years ago on the theme which is interesting. Nope, memes are more often than not factually incorrect and used to enforce opinion and rhetoric. Perhaps if you were to do some unbiased reading and research you would have a better grasp on this issue and the history which has led to where we are. I'd highly recommend the book, builds nicely on Adorno and Horkeimer, both Jewish German scholars, Horkeimer might even have been Orthodox if I remember correctly. Pretty confident that the bias I have on the topic is derived from reading and research and isn't innate. :-)
They've been saying the same since Guttenberg..Radio, TV, Computer, Smart phone... jazz, rock n roll, gangsta rap :-). I think memes are evolving into being highly effecient means of conveying information, just that the "right" are much better at it. A good friend wrote a book a couple of years ago on the theme which is interesting. Nope, memes are more often than not factually incorrect and used to enforce opinion and rhetoric. Perhaps if you were to do some unbiased reading and research you would have a better grasp on this issue and the history which has led to where we are. I'd highly recommend the book, builds nicely on Adorno and Horkeimer, both Jewish German scholars, Horkeimer might even have been Orthodox if I remember correctly. Pretty confident that the bias I have on the topic is derived from reading and research and isn't innate. :-)
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sgolby
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November 2012
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by sgolby on May 17, 2021 18:29:26 GMT 1, Reader, I will check them out.
Reader, I will check them out.
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Reader
Junior Member
Posts • 1,215
Likes • 2,678
June 2016
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by Reader on May 17, 2021 18:42:57 GMT 1, Just to expand on a few of those points... 1. Zionism - is and ideology which calls for a jewish state as a reaction to waves of anti semitism throughout history. No argument here, other than it calls for an exclusively Jewish ethnostate and the dispacment of ALL Palestinians. Let's not be coy here. - I am not being Coy, however the use of the word zionist in todays lexicon means Israeli, when in reality I do not believe that the average Jewish Israeli believes in Israel being Jewish ethno state with the displacement of all Palestinians. However I do believe that there should be a Jewish state, after all th other religions have their own states why not the Jews?2. ....but to believe the Jews had the power to take it for themselves is willful blindness. I don't think anyone implied this, so it's a straw man argument and a distraction -as I said, they had very powerful colonial allies and still do of course. YOU COULD NOT BE MORE WRONG. They did not at all have very powerful colonial allies. They had worldwide support for the first time since biblical times. You can go ahead and believe it to be a straw man argument, but you are wrong. Today, they have ONE very powerful ally and it is the US, and I happen to believe as I said that that support should be conditioned on human rights. The Palestinians however have several allies, however none of them do more than pay lip service to them which has been a significant part of the historical problem. Hamas has an incredibly ally in Bibi and the right wing of Knesset, because while not stated, the only way to prevent peace is by claiming you have no partner because of Hamas. 3. On Ancestral rights -countries don't have a "right" to exist. Israel was founded on the crime of ethnic cleansing and the principles of apartheid. They certainly don't have the "right" to their expansionist settler policy. Agreed, Israel was indeed founded as a result of the Ethnic cleansing of the Jews. Here you should really pay attention to history. The rise of the Jewish Apartheid state has coincided with the rise of Likud and Bibi, it did not exist as a powerful movement in Israel until then. Despite that being a convenient narrative. It is indeed currently under the control of a nationalist racist man, and his party whose perverse endgame is the unification of Israel to and the marginalization of all Palestinians. 4. While criticism of Israel is not anti semitism, the use of that criticism to call for the end of Israel is a terribly tragic argument. Calling for an end to the occupation of your land isn't anti-semitic. Indiginous groups the world over are fighting to roll back settler expansion and gain basic human rights, from Native Americans to Sami and Aboriginals. They and their allies must be allowed to make and voice their arguments without being called "anti-semitic". Right but in this case you have the chicken and egg scenario, you name indigenous groups without acknowledging that the Jews were forcefully removed from their homeland which included Israel, so why is it not right for Jews to have a place in their ancestral homeland a just like the other groups you mention. Further, just as you must be allowed to advocate for Palestine without being an Anti-Semite, so to I must be allowed to advocate for Israel without being called a colonialist, zionist, racist, jewish nationalist, supporter of Apartheid. 5. Both sides are guilty of Murder... The "both sides" argument is a nonesense. It's like blaming children defending themselves with chairs for being shot in school shootings. Dropping missiles on residential areas and indiscriminately killing civililans, many of them children, is, according to Amnesty and International law, a war crime. Not that the IDF are known for adhering to this. Again, you are conflating the events of the past 20 years and applying them unilaterally. Do not forget what led to the rise of Bibi, unjustified as his ascension may be. It was terrorism, it was fear mongering based on the murder of Jews and terrorist actions. Again, I agree that Bibi's regime is guilty of war crimes, however don't pretend Hamas or Islamic Jihad are sesame street characters. They are not, they are vicious and stamp out dissent with ruthlessness equal to that of the IDF and the Israeli police.6. It is absolutely possible for criticism of Israel and Zionism to exist without anti semitic tropes, however that criticism too often devolves into such Anti Semitism. So ? There are many Jews and Jewish support organisations in Israel and abroad that are opponents of Zionism. Usually tarred as "self hating Jews". It's perfectly legitimate to critique Zionism no matter how it may "devolve". SO? really? I can give you 6 million reasons why it matters. They are tarred with those names by the same people who you should worry about. The right wingers. However, there is a very real difference between criticism of Israel and Zionsim, and Anti Semitism. Again, I don't allow my criticism of hammas, hezbollah, etc, to ever escalate to anti muslim rhetoric and when I hear anti muslim rhetoric I fight against it because it is severely counter productive. When you say "So?" you lose the argument and give in to weakness and hatred. you can not claim to really be for peace if you are ok with that.7. Defund Israel, Defend Palestine, again while seemingly cute, is silly, because it is not that simple. Neither is climate change but we should still presumably be conscious consumers and recycle. The Boycott, Divest and Sanction movement is gathering pace, and does in fact also target Governmental funding, bonds and investments. It's also Palestinian lead, so I'm confident they've taken your "Silly" and "Not that simple" arguments into account and decided to act. bdsmovement.net/get-involved/what-to-boycottAgain, you are trying to simplify an insanely complex issue. This is not one simply about money. This should be about creating a climate whereby the regional players and international community work together to exert pressure on the right wing of the knesset to change their ways. It is about looking at the Jewish question and Palestinian question with open eyes and trying to construct a solution whereby there is peace. INstead of wasting energy on defunding Israel, perhaps efforts should be made to see where Palestinian funding is going? Perhaps pressure needs to be put on Iran and Qatar to begin using the aid money they send to constructing more than military enforcements. Perhaps political pressure needs to be applied not to destroy Israel but to construct a new Israel and Palestine?
Israel cannot expect peace as long as it pursues apartheid and ethnic cleansing, that's a fact. Everything you mention, the path to peace, whether one state or two state solutions, has been tabled for decades. Israel has proved time and time again, that this isn't in fact what they desire, certainly not from a Zionist perspective. It's a ruse. And whilst we "discuss" it, the ethnic cleansing continues apace. Defending illegal and immoral attacks on innocent civillians, literally defending war crimes based on some abstract notion that Israel has a "right" to exist as an ethnostate isn't going to hold up any longer. This is a battle between a colonizer and the colonized. It is not about two equal sides fighting for a piece of land. We have a colonial power and a native people who are fighting against an ethnic cleansing that has been going on since 1948. You should be outraged at the behaviour of Israel in provoking the current state of affairs. The underlying causes are obvious, 40 percent of the population in Jerusalem are Palestinians who are subject to a separate set of draconian laws.
Recent restrictions made it incredibly difficult for Palestinians to gather at al-Aqsa during Ramadam. People protested and the Police immediatly turned the place into a war zone, with stun grenades and brutal arrests. They then used "Skunk Water" to flush the site, turning an holy place into stinking disaster area. The humiliation became total when the police let ultranationalists dance with Israeli flags in front of the Palestinians. How much oppression and humiliation does Israel think they can get away with without people reacting? Around the world, and in Gaza? This is the context. And then, after rockets have been fired from Gaza, where two million people have been imprisoned for almost 14 years, people are asking, "But why are they firing rockets?"...and people like yourself are all over the internet saying "why can't Israel exist" "what about Anti Semitism", "it's too complex for a meme".. etc etc. Right now, it's far more important to deal with the matters at hand, and we should all be condemning the actions of Israel without fear of being branded anti-semitic. Children are being blown to pieces.
Times are changing and the powers that be are going to have to change the record.. this one's all played out now. It's been quite interesting seeing the shift of public opinion, hopefully the tide is turning and we can exert enough pressure to have Biden and co demand significant policy changes.
Just to expand on a few of those points... 1. Zionism - is and ideology which calls for a jewish state as a reaction to waves of anti semitism throughout history. No argument here, other than it calls for an exclusively Jewish ethnostate and the dispacment of ALL Palestinians. Let's not be coy here. - I am not being Coy, however the use of the word zionist in todays lexicon means Israeli, when in reality I do not believe that the average Jewish Israeli believes in Israel being Jewish ethno state with the displacement of all Palestinians. However I do believe that there should be a Jewish state, after all th other religions have their own states why not the Jews?2. ....but to believe the Jews had the power to take it for themselves is willful blindness. I don't think anyone implied this, so it's a straw man argument and a distraction -as I said, they had very powerful colonial allies and still do of course. YOU COULD NOT BE MORE WRONG. They did not at all have very powerful colonial allies. They had worldwide support for the first time since biblical times. You can go ahead and believe it to be a straw man argument, but you are wrong. Today, they have ONE very powerful ally and it is the US, and I happen to believe as I said that that support should be conditioned on human rights. The Palestinians however have several allies, however none of them do more than pay lip service to them which has been a significant part of the historical problem. Hamas has an incredibly ally in Bibi and the right wing of Knesset, because while not stated, the only way to prevent peace is by claiming you have no partner because of Hamas. 3. On Ancestral rights -countries don't have a "right" to exist. Israel was founded on the crime of ethnic cleansing and the principles of apartheid. They certainly don't have the "right" to their expansionist settler policy. Agreed, Israel was indeed founded as a result of the Ethnic cleansing of the Jews. Here you should really pay attention to history. The rise of the Jewish Apartheid state has coincided with the rise of Likud and Bibi, it did not exist as a powerful movement in Israel until then. Despite that being a convenient narrative. It is indeed currently under the control of a nationalist racist man, and his party whose perverse endgame is the unification of Israel to and the marginalization of all Palestinians. 4. While criticism of Israel is not anti semitism, the use of that criticism to call for the end of Israel is a terribly tragic argument. Calling for an end to the occupation of your land isn't anti-semitic. Indiginous groups the world over are fighting to roll back settler expansion and gain basic human rights, from Native Americans to Sami and Aboriginals. They and their allies must be allowed to make and voice their arguments without being called "anti-semitic". Right but in this case you have the chicken and egg scenario, you name indigenous groups without acknowledging that the Jews were forcefully removed from their homeland which included Israel, so why is it not right for Jews to have a place in their ancestral homeland a just like the other groups you mention. Further, just as you must be allowed to advocate for Palestine without being an Anti-Semite, so to I must be allowed to advocate for Israel without being called a colonialist, zionist, racist, jewish nationalist, supporter of Apartheid. 5. Both sides are guilty of Murder... The "both sides" argument is a nonesense. It's like blaming children defending themselves with chairs for being shot in school shootings. Dropping missiles on residential areas and indiscriminately killing civililans, many of them children, is, according to Amnesty and International law, a war crime. Not that the IDF are known for adhering to this. Again, you are conflating the events of the past 20 years and applying them unilaterally. Do not forget what led to the rise of Bibi, unjustified as his ascension may be. It was terrorism, it was fear mongering based on the murder of Jews and terrorist actions. Again, I agree that Bibi's regime is guilty of war crimes, however don't pretend Hamas or Islamic Jihad are sesame street characters. They are not, they are vicious and stamp out dissent with ruthlessness equal to that of the IDF and the Israeli police.6. It is absolutely possible for criticism of Israel and Zionism to exist without anti semitic tropes, however that criticism too often devolves into such Anti Semitism. So ? There are many Jews and Jewish support organisations in Israel and abroad that are opponents of Zionism. Usually tarred as "self hating Jews". It's perfectly legitimate to critique Zionism no matter how it may "devolve". SO? really? I can give you 6 million reasons why it matters. They are tarred with those names by the same people who you should worry about. The right wingers. However, there is a very real difference between criticism of Israel and Zionsim, and Anti Semitism. Again, I don't allow my criticism of hammas, hezbollah, etc, to ever escalate to anti muslim rhetoric and when I hear anti muslim rhetoric I fight against it because it is severely counter productive. When you say "So?" you lose the argument and give in to weakness and hatred. you can not claim to really be for peace if you are ok with that.7. Defund Israel, Defend Palestine, again while seemingly cute, is silly, because it is not that simple. Neither is climate change but we should still presumably be conscious consumers and recycle. The Boycott, Divest and Sanction movement is gathering pace, and does in fact also target Governmental funding, bonds and investments. It's also Palestinian lead, so I'm confident they've taken your "Silly" and "Not that simple" arguments into account and decided to act. bdsmovement.net/get-involved/what-to-boycottAgain, you are trying to simplify an insanely complex issue. This is not one simply about money. This should be about creating a climate whereby the regional players and international community work together to exert pressure on the right wing of the knesset to change their ways. It is about looking at the Jewish question and Palestinian question with open eyes and trying to construct a solution whereby there is peace. INstead of wasting energy on defunding Israel, perhaps efforts should be made to see where Palestinian funding is going? Perhaps pressure needs to be put on Iran and Qatar to begin using the aid money they send to constructing more than military enforcements. Perhaps political pressure needs to be applied not to destroy Israel but to construct a new Israel and Palestine?
Israel cannot expect peace as long as it pursues apartheid and ethnic cleansing, that's a fact. Everything you mention, the path to peace, whether one state or two state solutions, has been tabled for decades. Israel has proved time and time again, that this isn't in fact what they desire, certainly not from a Zionist perspective. It's a ruse. And whilst we "discuss" it, the ethnic cleansing continues apace. Defending illegal and immoral attacks on innocent civillians, literally defending war crimes based on some abstract notion that Israel has a "right" to exist as an ethnostate isn't going to hold up any longer. This is a battle between a colonizer and the colonized. It is not about two equal sides fighting for a piece of land. We have a colonial power and a native people who are fighting against an ethnic cleansing that has been going on since 1948. You should be outraged at the behaviour of Israel in provoking the current state of affairs. The underlying causes are obvious, 40 percent of the population in Jerusalem are Palestinians who are subject to a separate set of draconian laws. Recent restrictions made it incredibly difficult for Palestinians to gather at al-Aqsa during Ramadam. People protested and the Police immediatly turned the place into a war zone, with stun grenades and brutal arrests. They then used "Skunk Water" to flush the site, turning an holy place into stinking disaster area. The humiliation became total when the police let ultranationalists dance with Israeli flags in front of the Palestinians. How much oppression and humiliation does Israel think they can get away with without people reacting? Around the world, and in Gaza? This is the context. And then, after rockets have been fired from Gaza, where two million people have been imprisoned for almost 14 years, people are asking, "But why are they firing rockets?"...and people like yourself are all over the internet saying "why can't Israel exist" "what about Anti Semitism", "it's too complex for a meme".. etc etc. Right now, it's far more important to deal with the matters at hand, and we should all be condemning the actions of Israel without fear of being branded anti-semitic. Children are being blown to pieces. Times are changing and the powers that be are going to have to change the record.. this one's all played out now. It's been quite interesting seeing the shift of public opinion, hopefully the tide is turning and we can exert enough pressure to have Biden and co demand significant policy changes.
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sgolby
Junior Member
Posts • 1,890
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November 2012
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by sgolby on May 17, 2021 19:20:35 GMT 1, Reader, the difference between my outrage and yours is that I am not the one preaching the destruction of a country because it has lost its way. If that were the case we should/could call for the downfall of the US, Australia, the UK, Belgium, France, India, Pakistan, Palestine, and the list goes on and on and on. Don't fool yourself into believing you are the righteous and the rest of us are lost.
Good luck to you, I am done trying to have a dialogue with someone who is hell bent on viewing the world through a narrow lens. One day, hopefully you will be able to accept that multiple things can be true and that the answer is often an amalgamation of ideas and not one certain set of facts.
Perhaps read this and a book called the lemon tree by sandy toland, perhaps read differing opinions on this crisis and add some much needed history to your informational diet and you'll be able to formulate an opinion which doesn't read like diet prada in long form.
www.nytimes.com/2021/05/16/opinion/israel-netanyahu-hamas.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage
Reader, the difference between my outrage and yours is that I am not the one preaching the destruction of a country because it has lost its way. If that were the case we should/could call for the downfall of the US, Australia, the UK, Belgium, France, India, Pakistan, Palestine, and the list goes on and on and on. Don't fool yourself into believing you are the righteous and the rest of us are lost. Good luck to you, I am done trying to have a dialogue with someone who is hell bent on viewing the world through a narrow lens. One day, hopefully you will be able to accept that multiple things can be true and that the answer is often an amalgamation of ideas and not one certain set of facts. Perhaps read this and a book called the lemon tree by sandy toland, perhaps read differing opinions on this crisis and add some much needed history to your informational diet and you'll be able to formulate an opinion which doesn't read like diet prada in long form. www.nytimes.com/2021/05/16/opinion/israel-netanyahu-hamas.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage
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Reader
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June 2016
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by Reader on May 17, 2021 19:33:25 GMT 1, Reader , the difference between my outrage and yours is that I am not the one preaching the destruction of a country because it has lost its way. If that were the case we should/could call for the downfall of the US, Australia, the UK, Belgium, France, India, Pakistan, Palestine, and the list goes on and on and on. Don't fool yourself into believing you are the righteous and the rest of us are lost. Good luck to you, I am done trying to have a dialogue with someone who is hell bent on viewing the world through a narrow lens. One day, hopefully you will be able to accept that multiple things can be true and that the answer is often an amalgamation of ideas and not one certain set of facts. Perhaps read this and a book called the lemon tree by sandy toland, perhaps read differing opinions on this crisis and add some much needed history to your informational diet and you'll be able to formulate an opinion which doesn't read like diet prada in long form. www.nytimes.com/2021/05/16/opinion/israel-netanyahu-hamas.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage Yes, it's a difficult and uncomfortable conversation for many to have, I'm far from preaching, more secular if truth be told, but can see I míght come across as arrogant at times. The partition of India and Pakistan could well be a model but not without its problems. The difference between all the countries you mention, though some are built on Eurocentric white supremacy, none of them are currently and very actively trying to create an exclusively white christian nation state, though of course Trump tried. Right Wing Zionists and ultranationalists are dedicated to the development of an exclusively Jewish nation protected by a brutal military apartheid regime. This massive shift to the far right is quite a recent phenomena, Likud in 77?. But i'm pretty confident if we were watching European settlers slaughtering their way across the midwest and creating open prisons for native american "savages" in 2021 in order to create the USA, we'd have something to say about it. There is no other example in human history of a nation being reestablished after such a long period of existence as a diaspora, so we're living through something in real time that we have no precedent for other than past colonising processes. Israel can obviously no longer do this alone. So yes, we're agreed, it has lost its way and hopefully public opinion can help turn the tide against the path they're on. They'd do well to get back to Socialist Zionist principles.
Reader , the difference between my outrage and yours is that I am not the one preaching the destruction of a country because it has lost its way. If that were the case we should/could call for the downfall of the US, Australia, the UK, Belgium, France, India, Pakistan, Palestine, and the list goes on and on and on. Don't fool yourself into believing you are the righteous and the rest of us are lost. Good luck to you, I am done trying to have a dialogue with someone who is hell bent on viewing the world through a narrow lens. One day, hopefully you will be able to accept that multiple things can be true and that the answer is often an amalgamation of ideas and not one certain set of facts. Perhaps read this and a book called the lemon tree by sandy toland, perhaps read differing opinions on this crisis and add some much needed history to your informational diet and you'll be able to formulate an opinion which doesn't read like diet prada in long form. www.nytimes.com/2021/05/16/opinion/israel-netanyahu-hamas.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage Yes, it's a difficult and uncomfortable conversation for many to have, I'm far from preaching, more secular if truth be told, but can see I míght come across as arrogant at times. The partition of India and Pakistan could well be a model but not without its problems. The difference between all the countries you mention, though some are built on Eurocentric white supremacy, none of them are currently and very actively trying to create an exclusively white christian nation state, though of course Trump tried. Right Wing Zionists and ultranationalists are dedicated to the development of an exclusively Jewish nation protected by a brutal military apartheid regime. This massive shift to the far right is quite a recent phenomena, Likud in 77?. But i'm pretty confident if we were watching European settlers slaughtering their way across the midwest and creating open prisons for native american "savages" in 2021 in order to create the USA, we'd have something to say about it. There is no other example in human history of a nation being reestablished after such a long period of existence as a diaspora, so we're living through something in real time that we have no precedent for other than past colonising processes. Israel can obviously no longer do this alone. So yes, we're agreed, it has lost its way and hopefully public opinion can help turn the tide against the path they're on. They'd do well to get back to Socialist Zionist principles.
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tab1
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September 2011
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by tab1 on May 17, 2021 19:38:24 GMT 1, Banksys pet project of the walled off hotel has worked wonders and the aim of informing visitors through the museum tour and city tours of the struggles of Palestine has met its objectives it seems by this thread. Hundreds of posts discussing merchandise on multiple threads and the endless chatter about value but hardly any discussion with current events which was the aim of the hotel to highlight. Any discussions about Israels government policies and stance and automatically it is anti Semitic and a few get their knickers in a twist?
Banksys pet project of the walled off hotel has worked wonders and the aim of informing visitors through the museum tour and city tours of the struggles of Palestine has met its objectives it seems by this thread. Hundreds of posts discussing merchandise on multiple threads and the endless chatter about value but hardly any discussion with current events which was the aim of the hotel to highlight. Any discussions about Israels government policies and stance and automatically it is anti Semitic and a few get their knickers in a twist?
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sgolby
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November 2012
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by sgolby on May 17, 2021 19:54:43 GMT 1, @tab1 perhaps you should read my comments before assuming you know what I wrote. I never accused anyone of being an anti semite. What I said was that too often criticism of the state of israel devolves into antisemitism. Also, important to note that there is a difference between criticism of the Israeli government and condemnation of Israel as a whole.
@tab1 perhaps you should read my comments before assuming you know what I wrote. I never accused anyone of being an anti semite. What I said was that too often criticism of the state of israel devolves into antisemitism. Also, important to note that there is a difference between criticism of the Israeli government and condemnation of Israel as a whole.
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tab1
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September 2011
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by tab1 on May 17, 2021 20:06:42 GMT 1, @tab1 perhaps you should read my comments before assuming you know what I wrote. I never accused anyone of being an anti semite. What I said was that too often criticism of the state of israel devolves into antisemitism. Also, important to note that there is a difference between criticism of the Israeli government and condemnation of Israel as a whole.
Sensitivity is running high, this was not directed towards you, if you care to read the whole thread.
@tab1 perhaps you should read my comments before assuming you know what I wrote. I never accused anyone of being an anti semite. What I said was that too often criticism of the state of israel devolves into antisemitism. Also, important to note that there is a difference between criticism of the Israeli government and condemnation of Israel as a whole. Sensitivity is running high, this was not directed towards you, if you care to read the whole thread.
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tab1
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September 2011
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by tab1 on May 17, 2021 20:09:57 GMT 1, Banksys pet project of the walled off hotel has worked wonders and the aim of informing visitors through the museum tour and city tours of the struggles of Palestine has met its objectives it seems by this thread. Hundreds of posts discussing merchandise on multiple threads and the endless chatter about value but hardly any discussion with current events which was the aim of the hotel to highlight. Any discussions about Israels government policies and stance and automatically it is anti Semitic and a few get their knickers in a twist? That was a party political broadcast by the Champagne Socialist Party .
oh dear, thought as much, there'll be no end to the madness. The very definition of a troll. If you look at the hate hypocrisy that you create and the division you try to establish.because it doesn’t fit with your and your few friends agenda you try and fake woke cancel gang up on influence others to hate .well this monkey says NO .you haven’t got power over me .
We do not expect to get much sense from you,it’s ok, carry on and amuse yourself little pet
Banksys pet project of the walled off hotel has worked wonders and the aim of informing visitors through the museum tour and city tours of the struggles of Palestine has met its objectives it seems by this thread. Hundreds of posts discussing merchandise on multiple threads and the endless chatter about value but hardly any discussion with current events which was the aim of the hotel to highlight. Any discussions about Israels government policies and stance and automatically it is anti Semitic and a few get their knickers in a twist? That was a party political broadcast by the Champagne Socialist Party . oh dear, thought as much, there'll be no end to the madness. The very definition of a troll. If you look at the hate hypocrisy that you create and the division you try to establish.because it doesn’t fit with your and your few friends agenda you try and fake woke cancel gang up on influence others to hate .well this monkey says NO .you haven’t got power over me . We do not expect to get much sense from you,it’s ok, carry on and amuse yourself little pet
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sgolby
Junior Member
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November 2012
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by sgolby on May 17, 2021 20:22:02 GMT 1, tab1 it came on the heals of my posts so I assumed you were addressing me. Don't worry, my sensitivity is at a fairly consistent state, right in between zen and curb stomp anger, which is where I like it to be.
tab1 it came on the heals of my posts so I assumed you were addressing me. Don't worry, my sensitivity is at a fairly consistent state, right in between zen and curb stomp anger, which is where I like it to be.
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Zippy
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April 2006
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by Zippy on May 17, 2021 20:37:46 GMT 1, . Any discussions about Israels government policies and stance and automatically it is anti Semitic and a few get their knickers in a twist? [/quote]
Tab1, I think this quote is way off. I have enjoyed reading Reader’s and Sgolby’s posts as instead of getting personal and rude, they have both been polite and fair with their critiscism and disagreements on views. This is refreshing for the forum and whatever one’s views are, it is fair to hear and think about other opinions as this helps educate one another.
I don’t think anyone thought it was automatically anti semetic. We should encourage different views and thoughts.
. Any discussions about Israels government policies and stance and automatically it is anti Semitic and a few get their knickers in a twist? [/quote]
Tab1, I think this quote is way off. I have enjoyed reading Reader’s and Sgolby’s posts as instead of getting personal and rude, they have both been polite and fair with their critiscism and disagreements on views. This is refreshing for the forum and whatever one’s views are, it is fair to hear and think about other opinions as this helps educate one another.
I don’t think anyone thought it was automatically anti semetic. We should encourage different views and thoughts.
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LJCal
Junior Member
Posts • 2,825
Likes • 4,240
December 2019
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by LJCal on May 17, 2021 22:49:16 GMT 1, brexit, trump, coronavirus, now isreal. Definately not inviting any of you lot over for dinner! 😂
brexit, trump, coronavirus, now isreal. Definately not inviting any of you lot over for dinner! 😂
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tab1
Full Member
Posts • 8,519
Likes • 3,678
September 2011
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by tab1 on May 17, 2021 22:55:05 GMT 1, We do not expect to get much sense from you,it’s ok, carry on and amuse yourself little pet Well I suppose while you are occupied with me your not asking married men to dig your garden in hot pants or exploiting the poor lady in the video you posted who had clearly lost her sense of proportion, obviously mental illness is just fun and games for you to brighten up you evening’s every day you fall out with someone new .
Obviously you have deep routed issues as you keep fantasizing about this and constantly bring this up? Did you save his picture he posted as your screen saver? Feel left out, pop yours on and share with the forum!little petal You have more of an issue than the member, very strange you are. Try not to listen to the voices 👻
We do not expect to get much sense from you,it’s ok, carry on and amuse yourself little pet Well I suppose while you are occupied with me your not asking married men to dig your garden in hot pants or exploiting the poor lady in the video you posted who had clearly lost her sense of proportion, obviously mental illness is just fun and games for you to brighten up you evening’s every day you fall out with someone new . Obviously you have deep routed issues as you keep fantasizing about this and constantly bring this up? Did you save his picture he posted as your screen saver? Feel left out, pop yours on and share with the forum!little petal You have more of an issue than the member, very strange you are. Try not to listen to the voices 👻
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tab1
Full Member
Posts • 8,519
Likes • 3,678
September 2011
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by tab1 on May 17, 2021 22:59:46 GMT 1, . Any discussions about Israels government policies and stance and automatically it is anti Semitic and a few get their knickers in a twist?
Tab1, I think this quote is way off. I have enjoyed reading Reader’s and Sgolby’s posts as instead of getting personal and rude, they have both been polite and fair with their critiscism and disagreements on views. This is refreshing for the forum and whatever one’s views are, it is fair to hear and think about other opinions as this helps educate one another.
I don’t think anyone thought it was automatically anti semetic. We should encourage different views and thoughts. [/quote]
Again not these two! Obviously everyone’s reading the last posts. We all log in and out of here at different times so not always responding to the latest posts, If you read back through the thread you will have an idea
. Any discussions about Israels government policies and stance and automatically it is anti Semitic and a few get their knickers in a twist? Tab1, I think this quote is way off. I have enjoyed reading Reader’s and Sgolby’s posts as instead of getting personal and rude, they have both been polite and fair with their critiscism and disagreements on views. This is refreshing for the forum and whatever one’s views are, it is fair to hear and think about other opinions as this helps educate one another. I don’t think anyone thought it was automatically anti semetic. We should encourage different views and thoughts. [/quote] Again not these two! Obviously everyone’s reading the last posts. We all log in and out of here at different times so not always responding to the latest posts, If you read back through the thread you will have an idea
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tab1
Full Member
Posts • 8,519
Likes • 3,678
September 2011
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by tab1 on May 17, 2021 23:03:15 GMT 1, tab1 it came on the heals of my posts so I assumed you were addressing me. Don't worry, my sensitivity is at a fairly consistent state, right in between zen and curb stomp anger, which is where I like it to be.
I would of quoted you if I were addressing your points.😉 Discussion is good
tab1 it came on the heals of my posts so I assumed you were addressing me. Don't worry, my sensitivity is at a fairly consistent state, right in between zen and curb stomp anger, which is where I like it to be. I would of quoted you if I were addressing your points.😉 Discussion is good
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tab1
Full Member
Posts • 8,519
Likes • 3,678
September 2011
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by tab1 on May 18, 2021 0:00:46 GMT 1, Obviously you have deep routed issues as you keep fantasizing about this and constantly bring this up? Did you save his picture he posted as your screen saver? Feel left out, pop yours on and share with the forum!little petal You have more of an issue than the member, very strange you are. Try not to listen to the voices 👻 Had Dm from members telling me about you and what a crank you are .actually feel sorry for you ,because this forum is all you hold on to in your pitiful life ,it’s your everything. 😹don’t let the voices win, be safe with your buddies poppit, listen to them and you will be safe . If I’m a crank what the hell are you with all your deluded posts, twit 👻bore off sad lost soul, I’m off to 😿please get out your screen saver and amuse yourself and stop bugging me
Obviously you have deep routed issues as you keep fantasizing about this and constantly bring this up? Did you save his picture he posted as your screen saver? Feel left out, pop yours on and share with the forum!little petal You have more of an issue than the member, very strange you are. Try not to listen to the voices 👻 Had Dm from members telling me about you and what a crank you are .actually feel sorry for you ,because this forum is all you hold on to in your pitiful life ,it’s your everything. 😹don’t let the voices win, be safe with your buddies poppit, listen to them and you will be safe . If I’m a crank what the hell are you with all your deluded posts, twit 👻bore off sad lost soul, I’m off to 😿please get out your screen saver and amuse yourself and stop bugging me
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sgolby
Junior Member
Posts • 1,890
Likes • 2,892
November 2012
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by sgolby on May 18, 2021 0:05:31 GMT 1, tab1 it came on the heals of my posts so I assumed you were addressing me. Don't worry, my sensitivity is at a fairly consistent state, right in between zen and curb stomp anger, which is where I like it to be. I would of quoted you if I were addressing your points.😉 Discussion is good
Appreciate you
tab1 it came on the heals of my posts so I assumed you were addressing me. Don't worry, my sensitivity is at a fairly consistent state, right in between zen and curb stomp anger, which is where I like it to be. I would of quoted you if I were addressing your points.😉 Discussion is good Appreciate you
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Reader
Junior Member
Posts • 1,215
Likes • 2,678
June 2016
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by Reader on May 18, 2021 0:37:28 GMT 1, My kid brother sent me this which I thought was pretty insightful.
A friend from Israel just posted the following take on the situation in the Middle East, it is a fascinating read & puts the entire nightmare into context
“The current violence in Israel is the result of an organized plan orchestrated by Israel’s prime minister Binyamin Netanyahu. Netanyahu, who is now standing trial for multiple counts of bribery, fraud and breach of trust, has provoked the latest round of violence as part of his desperate attempts to cling to power and sabotage democratic attempts to replace him following the recent elections in Israel. It is no coincidence that the latest round of violence was sparked just as Netanyahu failed to form a coalition government, and the mandate to put together a ruling coalition passed on democratically to his political rivals.
To prevent the forming of a new coalition that would replace him in power – which for the first time in Israel’s history was to include both Jewish and Arab political parties – Netanyahu worked insistently via his ultra-right wing proxies to escalate violence between Jews and Arabs.
The direct result is the wave of chaos, racist hate crimes and violence that has swept the country, as well as the violence between Israel and Hamas in Gaza.
Netanyahu’s plan had several major parts:
1. Provoke tensions in Jerusalem and the al-Aqsa mosque during the Islamic fast of Ramadan. 2. Escalate tensions to boiling point in the Palestinian Jerusalem neighborhood Sheikh Jarah, where Arab-Palestinian residents were to be evicted from the decades-old homes in favor of Jewish settlers. 3. Spark military conflict between Israel and Hamas in Gaza – a move that Netanyahu’s close political ally Itamar Ben Gvir, Jewish supremacist member of the ultra-right wing party Religious Zionism, is documented to have proposed recently to Netanyahu. Netanyahu had full knowledge that this series of provocations, which follow 12 long years of anti-Arab incitement on his part, would spark a wave of violence. He was recently documented as saying that in the past he had rejected proposals to use this dangerous tactic. Now, as he facing removal from power, he chose to embrace it. Here is the turn of events, starting in early April: • April 6 – Following the results of the latest elections, Netanyahu receives the mandate to put together a ruling coalition. However, he knows his chances are slim. • April 9 – Israeli police violently attack peaceful demonstrators against the eviction of Palestinians from their homes in the Jerusalem neighborhood Sheikh Jarah. This unprovoked police violence seemed to come out of nowhere and has no recent precedence in the weekly demonstrations in Sheikh Jarah. • April 12 – Ramadan starts. • April 13 – Israeli police provocatively blocks entrance to Damascus Gate in Jerusalem, a major public place gathering for Jerusalem’s Arab-Palestinian population. The decision has no clear reason or justification, other than to provoke Jerusalem’s Palestinians. Palestinian youth begin to demonstrate and riot against the decision, some violently. • April 18 – Jewish supremacists Itamar Ben Gvir and Bezelel Smutrich visit Damascus Gate in a provocative anti-Arab move. In the following days, groups of ultra-right wing Jewish supremacist militants begin marching in the streets of Jerusalem, calling out “Death to Arabs.” • After two weeks in which Israeli police blocks Damascus Gate, allegedly for “security reasons,” Israel’s Chief Police Commissioner orders the removal of police blockade. These events in April planted multiple seeds of provocation. The final steps orchestrating the eruption of violence took place in May: • May 5 – Netanyahu fails to put together a new coalition government. The mandate to negotiate a new coalition passes on by law to his main political rival, Yair Lapid of the opposition party Yesh Atid. For the first time in Israeli history, the new coalition is slated to include both Jewish and Arab parties. Negotiations are advancing and the new government is reported to be a matter of days away. • May 5 – Jewish supremacist Ben Gvir, whom Netanyahu supported openly throughout the recent elections as a would-be member of his coalition, visits the Jewish-Arab city of Lod as a personal guest of Lod’s mayor, Likud member and a close supporter of Netanyahu. “We are your proxies,” Ben Gvir announces. • May 6 – Ben Gvir (who is now a member of the Israeli parliament) opens an office at the contest neighborhood of Sheikh Jarah, openly inciting against its Arab residents. • May 7 – Israeli police fires stun grenades inside Al Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem, and then into a medical clinic within the Al Aqsa compound. This is done under the jurisdiction of Police Minister Amir Ohana, Likud member and Netanyahu’s close ally. • May 8 – In an unexplained provocative move, buses carrying Israeli-Arab citizens on their way to Jerusalem to pray in Al-Aqsa during the Ramadan, are prevented by Israeli police to proceed to Jerusalem. At the same time, ultra-right wing Jewish supremacists plan to hold the annual highly controversial and provocative “Flag March” through the Islamic Quarter in Jerusalem, to celebrate the nationalist “Jerusalem Day.” Israeli police supports the plan despite the dangerous provocation it represents. • May 10 – Early in the morning, Israeli police again enters Al Aqsa with massive force, again firing stun grenades inside the mosque. Israel police still supports the “Flag March” plan. Only in the afternoon, after Israeli army warns of bloodshed if the march proceeds, does Netanyahu order to cancel the march. In the evening, Hamas in Gaza fires rockets towards Jerusalem. • May 11 – Hamas continues to fire rockets. The Israeli military retaliates, attacking Gaza. At the same, violence erupts in Israeli cities with a mixed Jewish and Arab population. Arab rioters attack Jews, burn synagogues, and vandalize property. Jewish rioters attack mosques, burn down Arab businesses, and attack Arabs. Itamar Ben Gvir visits the Arab/Jewish towns of Ramla, Lod and Acre to further incite violence. The violence is further incited in social networks. Groups of rioters and armed militias are encouraged to take to the streets.
The plan succeeded: Israel is on fire.
In the coming days, the Israeli press reports that Israel’s Chief Police Commissioner alerted Netanyahu and police minister Ohana that Itamar Ben Gvir was “responsible for the Jewish Intifada” – the eruption of Jewish militia violence. Netanyahu ignores the reports and issues no response.
Netanyahu’s method of operation is clear:
Repeatedly over this period of time, Netanyahu sparked the violence by proxy, using his Jewish supremacist coalition allies. Once the fire has been sparked, Netanyahu would take apparently conciliatory steps (remove the Damascus Gate blockade; cancel the Flag March; etc.). However, these feeble steps, meant to distance him from the violence and provide an ‘alibi’, were too little, too late. It is no coincidence that Israel descended into violence precisely as Netanyahu was about to lose political power, and a coalition to replace him was about to form.
The above sequence of dates and events tell the story clearly.
The inescapable conclusion is that after 12 years of hate speech and incitement, Netanyahu orchestrated a careful plan to send Israel into chaos. He laid the groundwork in April, and lit the fire in May. Netanyahu’s heinous crime, against Jews and Arabs alike, must be investigated.”
My kid brother sent me this which I thought was pretty insightful.
A friend from Israel just posted the following take on the situation in the Middle East, it is a fascinating read & puts the entire nightmare into context
“The current violence in Israel is the result of an organized plan orchestrated by Israel’s prime minister Binyamin Netanyahu. Netanyahu, who is now standing trial for multiple counts of bribery, fraud and breach of trust, has provoked the latest round of violence as part of his desperate attempts to cling to power and sabotage democratic attempts to replace him following the recent elections in Israel. It is no coincidence that the latest round of violence was sparked just as Netanyahu failed to form a coalition government, and the mandate to put together a ruling coalition passed on democratically to his political rivals.
To prevent the forming of a new coalition that would replace him in power – which for the first time in Israel’s history was to include both Jewish and Arab political parties – Netanyahu worked insistently via his ultra-right wing proxies to escalate violence between Jews and Arabs.
The direct result is the wave of chaos, racist hate crimes and violence that has swept the country, as well as the violence between Israel and Hamas in Gaza.
Netanyahu’s plan had several major parts:
1. Provoke tensions in Jerusalem and the al-Aqsa mosque during the Islamic fast of Ramadan. 2. Escalate tensions to boiling point in the Palestinian Jerusalem neighborhood Sheikh Jarah, where Arab-Palestinian residents were to be evicted from the decades-old homes in favor of Jewish settlers. 3. Spark military conflict between Israel and Hamas in Gaza – a move that Netanyahu’s close political ally Itamar Ben Gvir, Jewish supremacist member of the ultra-right wing party Religious Zionism, is documented to have proposed recently to Netanyahu. Netanyahu had full knowledge that this series of provocations, which follow 12 long years of anti-Arab incitement on his part, would spark a wave of violence. He was recently documented as saying that in the past he had rejected proposals to use this dangerous tactic. Now, as he facing removal from power, he chose to embrace it. Here is the turn of events, starting in early April: • April 6 – Following the results of the latest elections, Netanyahu receives the mandate to put together a ruling coalition. However, he knows his chances are slim. • April 9 – Israeli police violently attack peaceful demonstrators against the eviction of Palestinians from their homes in the Jerusalem neighborhood Sheikh Jarah. This unprovoked police violence seemed to come out of nowhere and has no recent precedence in the weekly demonstrations in Sheikh Jarah. • April 12 – Ramadan starts. • April 13 – Israeli police provocatively blocks entrance to Damascus Gate in Jerusalem, a major public place gathering for Jerusalem’s Arab-Palestinian population. The decision has no clear reason or justification, other than to provoke Jerusalem’s Palestinians. Palestinian youth begin to demonstrate and riot against the decision, some violently. • April 18 – Jewish supremacists Itamar Ben Gvir and Bezelel Smutrich visit Damascus Gate in a provocative anti-Arab move. In the following days, groups of ultra-right wing Jewish supremacist militants begin marching in the streets of Jerusalem, calling out “Death to Arabs.” • After two weeks in which Israeli police blocks Damascus Gate, allegedly for “security reasons,” Israel’s Chief Police Commissioner orders the removal of police blockade. These events in April planted multiple seeds of provocation. The final steps orchestrating the eruption of violence took place in May: • May 5 – Netanyahu fails to put together a new coalition government. The mandate to negotiate a new coalition passes on by law to his main political rival, Yair Lapid of the opposition party Yesh Atid. For the first time in Israeli history, the new coalition is slated to include both Jewish and Arab parties. Negotiations are advancing and the new government is reported to be a matter of days away. • May 5 – Jewish supremacist Ben Gvir, whom Netanyahu supported openly throughout the recent elections as a would-be member of his coalition, visits the Jewish-Arab city of Lod as a personal guest of Lod’s mayor, Likud member and a close supporter of Netanyahu. “We are your proxies,” Ben Gvir announces. • May 6 – Ben Gvir (who is now a member of the Israeli parliament) opens an office at the contest neighborhood of Sheikh Jarah, openly inciting against its Arab residents. • May 7 – Israeli police fires stun grenades inside Al Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem, and then into a medical clinic within the Al Aqsa compound. This is done under the jurisdiction of Police Minister Amir Ohana, Likud member and Netanyahu’s close ally. • May 8 – In an unexplained provocative move, buses carrying Israeli-Arab citizens on their way to Jerusalem to pray in Al-Aqsa during the Ramadan, are prevented by Israeli police to proceed to Jerusalem. At the same time, ultra-right wing Jewish supremacists plan to hold the annual highly controversial and provocative “Flag March” through the Islamic Quarter in Jerusalem, to celebrate the nationalist “Jerusalem Day.” Israeli police supports the plan despite the dangerous provocation it represents. • May 10 – Early in the morning, Israeli police again enters Al Aqsa with massive force, again firing stun grenades inside the mosque. Israel police still supports the “Flag March” plan. Only in the afternoon, after Israeli army warns of bloodshed if the march proceeds, does Netanyahu order to cancel the march. In the evening, Hamas in Gaza fires rockets towards Jerusalem. • May 11 – Hamas continues to fire rockets. The Israeli military retaliates, attacking Gaza. At the same, violence erupts in Israeli cities with a mixed Jewish and Arab population. Arab rioters attack Jews, burn synagogues, and vandalize property. Jewish rioters attack mosques, burn down Arab businesses, and attack Arabs. Itamar Ben Gvir visits the Arab/Jewish towns of Ramla, Lod and Acre to further incite violence. The violence is further incited in social networks. Groups of rioters and armed militias are encouraged to take to the streets.
The plan succeeded: Israel is on fire.
In the coming days, the Israeli press reports that Israel’s Chief Police Commissioner alerted Netanyahu and police minister Ohana that Itamar Ben Gvir was “responsible for the Jewish Intifada” – the eruption of Jewish militia violence. Netanyahu ignores the reports and issues no response.
Netanyahu’s method of operation is clear:
Repeatedly over this period of time, Netanyahu sparked the violence by proxy, using his Jewish supremacist coalition allies. Once the fire has been sparked, Netanyahu would take apparently conciliatory steps (remove the Damascus Gate blockade; cancel the Flag March; etc.). However, these feeble steps, meant to distance him from the violence and provide an ‘alibi’, were too little, too late. It is no coincidence that Israel descended into violence precisely as Netanyahu was about to lose political power, and a coalition to replace him was about to form.
The above sequence of dates and events tell the story clearly.
The inescapable conclusion is that after 12 years of hate speech and incitement, Netanyahu orchestrated a careful plan to send Israel into chaos. He laid the groundwork in April, and lit the fire in May. Netanyahu’s heinous crime, against Jews and Arabs alike, must be investigated.”
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moron
Junior Member
Posts • 2,711
Likes • 1,050
September 2017
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Reader
Junior Member
Posts • 1,215
Likes • 2,678
June 2016
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by Reader on May 20, 2021 21:55:31 GMT 1,
Gaza’s largest and most beloved book shop and library was destroyed by air strikes on Tuesday. The two-story Samir Mansour book store was built 21 years ago and served as a community centre and book shop for the local Gaza community and Palestinian school children. Tens of thousands of books were destroyed. All of the heart, creativity and talent poured into this magical place is gone.
As a result of the complete siege on Gaza Strip, construction supplies are in extreme short supply and heavily inflated.
Please donate generously and help Palestinians get books back.
All funds will be given directly to Samir Mansour to rent new space and rebuild a new library and book shop.
This fundraiser is managed by Mahvish Rukhsana and Clive Stafford Smith, founder of Reprieve, a legal action non-profit 501(c)(3) organization.
Link : gofund.me/a3672706
Instagram: Samir_mansour_bookshop twitter: @samirbookshop
Gaza’s largest and most beloved book shop and library was destroyed by air strikes on Tuesday. The two-story Samir Mansour book store was built 21 years ago and served as a community centre and book shop for the local Gaza community and Palestinian school children. Tens of thousands of books were destroyed. All of the heart, creativity and talent poured into this magical place is gone. As a result of the complete siege on Gaza Strip, construction supplies are in extreme short supply and heavily inflated. Please donate generously and help Palestinians get books back. All funds will be given directly to Samir Mansour to rent new space and rebuild a new library and book shop. This fundraiser is managed by Mahvish Rukhsana and Clive Stafford Smith, founder of Reprieve, a legal action non-profit 501(c)(3) organization. Link : gofund.me/a3672706Instagram: Samir_mansour_bookshop twitter: @samirbookshop
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moron
Junior Member
Posts • 2,711
Likes • 1,050
September 2017
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by moron on May 20, 2021 22:14:02 GMT 1, Anti Zionism is not anti semitism. Zionism is an ideology not a religion.
Unfortunately the UK government thanks to people like Kier Starmer and other politicians have decided that anyone who is opposed to zionism is an anti semite as Jeremy Corbyn, Ken Livingstone and others have found out to their cost. Jewish people including rabbi's can be and are anti zionists and non Jews can be zionists.
Hamas are funded and backed by Iran and have decided that they are at constant war with Israel and do not believe the state of Israel should exist.
Hamas is not democratically elected.
"""Following the Fatah–Hamas conflict that started in 2006, Hamas formed a government ruling the Gaza Strip without elections. Gazan Prime Minister Haniyye announced in September 2012 the formation of a second Hamas government, also without elections."""
"""2006 parliamentary elections Main article: 2006 Palestinian legislative election At the 2006 legislative election, six parties and 4 independents won seats. Change and Reform (ie., Hamas) won 44.45% of the vote and 74 seats, while Fatah won 41.43% of the vote and 45 seats."""
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elections_in_Palestine#2005_presidential_elections
Hamas won the Palestinian legislative election to serve a 4 year term. When the 4 years was finished, instead of having a new election. Hamas decided to stay in power.
Hamas decided to launch over a thousand missiles randomly at Israel from it's stock of 30,000 missiles. Not caring where they land and who they kill, including missiles that fall short and land in Palestine.
How exactly does launching a thousand plus missiles at Israel, benefit Palestinian people?
Hamas leadership are incredibly wealthy. The majority of Palestinians are poor.
""Khaled el-Azm Prime Minister of Syria in 1948
In listing the reasons for the Arab failure in 1948, notes that “…the fifth factor was the call by the Arab governments to the inhabitants of Palestine to evacuate it (Palestine) and leave for the bordering Arab countries. Since 1948, it is we who have demanded the return of the refugees, while it is we who made them leave. We brought disaster upon a million Arab refugees by inviting them and bringing pressure on them to leave. We have accustomed them to begging…we have participated in lowering their morale and social level…Then we exploited them in executing crimes of murder, arson and throwing stones upon men, women and children…all this in the service of political purposes…”
Source: Memoirs of Khaled el-Azm 1973""
Anti Zionism is not anti semitism. Zionism is an ideology not a religion. Unfortunately the UK government thanks to people like Kier Starmer and other politicians have decided that anyone who is opposed to zionism is an anti semite as Jeremy Corbyn, Ken Livingstone and others have found out to their cost. Jewish people including rabbi's can be and are anti zionists and non Jews can be zionists. Hamas are funded and backed by Iran and have decided that they are at constant war with Israel and do not believe the state of Israel should exist. Hamas is not democratically elected. """Following the Fatah–Hamas conflict that started in 2006, Hamas formed a government ruling the Gaza Strip without elections. Gazan Prime Minister Haniyye announced in September 2012 the formation of a second Hamas government, also without elections.""" """2006 parliamentary elections Main article: 2006 Palestinian legislative election At the 2006 legislative election, six parties and 4 independents won seats. Change and Reform (ie., Hamas) won 44.45% of the vote and 74 seats, while Fatah won 41.43% of the vote and 45 seats."""en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elections_in_Palestine#2005_presidential_elections Hamas won the Palestinian legislative election to serve a 4 year term. When the 4 years was finished, instead of having a new election. Hamas decided to stay in power. Hamas decided to launch over a thousand missiles randomly at Israel from it's stock of 30,000 missiles. Not caring where they land and who they kill, including missiles that fall short and land in Palestine. How exactly does launching a thousand plus missiles at Israel, benefit Palestinian people? Hamas leadership are incredibly wealthy. The majority of Palestinians are poor. ""Khaled el-Azm Prime Minister of Syria in 1948 In listing the reasons for the Arab failure in 1948, notes that “…the fifth factor was the call by the Arab governments to the inhabitants of Palestine to evacuate it (Palestine) and leave for the bordering Arab countries. Since 1948, it is we who have demanded the return of the refugees, while it is we who made them leave. We brought disaster upon a million Arab refugees by inviting them and bringing pressure on them to leave. We have accustomed them to begging…we have participated in lowering their morale and social level…Then we exploited them in executing crimes of murder, arson and throwing stones upon men, women and children…all this in the service of political purposes…” Source: Memoirs of Khaled el-Azm 1973""
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tab1
Full Member
Posts • 8,519
Likes • 3,678
September 2011
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begs
New Member
Posts • 975
Likes • 329
September 2010
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by begs on Aug 14, 2021 6:58:45 GMT 1, Has anyone had any news on when its opening again Thanks folks
Has anyone had any news on when its opening again Thanks folks
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Gunny
Junior Member
Posts • 1,576
Likes • 1,087
July 2012
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by Gunny on Dec 4, 2021 17:26:17 GMT 1, Great to see the hotel is open again - great news! They don't seem to have opened up the online room bookings yet though.
Great to see the hotel is open again - great news! They don't seem to have opened up the online room bookings yet though.
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troika49
New Member
Posts • 206
Likes • 158
November 2019
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by troika49 on Dec 4, 2021 17:50:20 GMT 1, Where was this announced?
Where was this announced?
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Gunny
Junior Member
Posts • 1,576
Likes • 1,087
July 2012
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by Gunny on Dec 4, 2021 18:04:47 GMT 1, Wisam Instagram stories.....
Wisam Instagram stories.....
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Lazarus II
Junior Member
Posts • 1,801
Likes • 2,427
August 2019
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by Lazarus II on Dec 4, 2021 18:09:48 GMT 1, Wisam Instagram stories..... looks like the museum has been replaced with more public area.
Wisam Instagram stories..... looks like the museum has been replaced with more public area.
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begs
New Member
Posts • 975
Likes • 329
September 2010
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by begs on Dec 4, 2021 23:23:36 GMT 1, Also said it was open on Facebook
Also said it was open on Facebook
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mikegood
New Member
Posts • 198
Likes • 201
February 2020
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Banksy - The Walled Off Hotel ★★★, by mikegood on Dec 5, 2021 0:53:27 GMT 1, Interesting ... and the shop seems to have loaded t-shirts, cups and totes... I tried to order a couple but it's not letting me order to the US. Anyone else experiencing that issue?
shop.walledoffhotel.com/
Interesting ... and the shop seems to have loaded t-shirts, cups and totes... I tried to order a couple but it's not letting me order to the US. Anyone else experiencing that issue? shop.walledoffhotel.com/
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