Deleted
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 14, 2014 19:54:29 GMT 1, ... not to ploppi ... I see a different tree.
... not to ploppi ... I see a different tree.
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Deleted
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 14, 2014 20:25:34 GMT 1, To me the bastardisation makes sense, the thing is each one is unique, no 2 will/can be exactly the same(drip of paint here/overrun there/different amounts of paint applied to each one) but theres 10 of them, they will have slight differences therefore are original. How many times did monet etc paint the same scene...lots but they're considered original, if he numbered the lilley ponds ed50 that wouldn't make them not originals. Damien Hirst is alledged to have said the same thing about the endless spot paintings churned out by his workers. I wouldn't call them assistants considering he wasn't around when most were painted by hand.
Now we have a lot of spot paintings that are bruned. Entered at auction and failed to sell.
Monet didn't use stencils and his paintings are all unique and different even though he might have had a dozen easels set up with paintings he worked on as he found it more productive and also when he lost the eye or feel of one painting he would move onto another painting of a different scene.
Makes no difference if he used stencils or not to be honest and the ed banksy "originals" are all unique, i wont comment on the spots cause their just not for me but if id have looked at them in my younger years of hoffman and mushrooms it would prob be a different story...
To me the bastardisation makes sense, the thing is each one is unique, no 2 will/can be exactly the same(drip of paint here/overrun there/different amounts of paint applied to each one) but theres 10 of them, they will have slight differences therefore are original. How many times did monet etc paint the same scene...lots but they're considered original, if he numbered the lilley ponds ed50 that wouldn't make them not originals. Damien Hirst is alledged to have said the same thing about the endless spot paintings churned out by his workers. I wouldn't call them assistants considering he wasn't around when most were painted by hand.
Now we have a lot of spot paintings that are bruned. Entered at auction and failed to sell.
Monet didn't use stencils and his paintings are all unique and different even though he might have had a dozen easels set up with paintings he worked on as he found it more productive and also when he lost the eye or feel of one painting he would move onto another painting of a different scene.
Makes no difference if he used stencils or not to be honest and the ed banksy "originals" are all unique, i wont comment on the spots cause their just not for me but if id have looked at them in my younger years of hoffman and mushrooms it would prob be a different story...
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Deleted
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 14, 2014 20:31:40 GMT 1, Not forgetting that Monet painted the nรฉnuphars (water lilies) and his garden during different days and times of day and different seasons where to the untrained eye they look the same but arent.
To me an original stencil painting is one that is painted by the original artist. Not farmed out for assistants to paint while the artist goes down the pub.
Not forgetting that Monet painted the nรฉnuphars (water lilies) and his garden during different days and times of day and different seasons where to the untrained eye they look the same but arent.
To me an original stencil painting is one that is painted by the original artist. Not farmed out for assistants to paint while the artist goes down the pub.
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Hubble Bubble
Junior Member
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Posts โข 4,104
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December 2010
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Hubble Bubble on Aug 14, 2014 20:36:35 GMT 1, I find it interesting that the creation of a print run, with it's screens and tests and proofs etc, would probably require more time and effort than the creation of a stencilled canvas run.
I find it interesting that the creation of a print run, with it's screens and tests and proofs etc, would probably require more time and effort than the creation of a stencilled canvas run.
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Deleted
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 14, 2014 20:45:15 GMT 1, I find it interesting that the creation of a print run, with it's screens and tests and proofs etc, would probably require more time and effort than the creation of a stencilled canvas run. but making the screens is a lot faster and easier than hand cutting elaborate stencils.
I agree that screens are made from original art which takes a lot to hand paint or draw but these days lots of "artists" just turn photo images into clever looking screen prints.
It's frustrating seing screen prints for sale and there is no information saying if the screen print is based on original hand drawn or painted art or based on some photograph jigged about and collaged in photoshop dobe etc
I find it interesting that the creation of a print run, with it's screens and tests and proofs etc, would probably require more time and effort than the creation of a stencilled canvas run. but making the screens is a lot faster and easier than hand cutting elaborate stencils.
I agree that screens are made from original art which takes a lot to hand paint or draw but these days lots of "artists" just turn photo images into clever looking screen prints.
It's frustrating seing screen prints for sale and there is no information saying if the screen print is based on original hand drawn or painted art or based on some photograph jigged about and collaged in photoshop dobe etc
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astrobboy
New Member
Posts โข 399
Likes โข 239
September 2008
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by astrobboy on Aug 14, 2014 22:55:50 GMT 1, ""I was offered one or two prints for a decent price and almost pulled the trigger but they weren't a print that I really loved""
Does that mean the novelty has worn off?
The art doesn't have the same effect it had originally or that you are dissapointed with whats been produced lately?
As Plip quoted, "..but they weren't a print that I really loved".
For me to want to lay down the cash that these prints demand these days, I have to love looking at the piece every day as I am going to hang it on my wall. (don't get me started on the topic of hoarding prints under the bed in portfolios).
"Mind you, if a print that I really like comes across my path for a good price, of course I will pick it up, but those chances are slim to none, and I am fine with that." Doesn't sound like you're out at all mate. Yeah, good point. I guess I'm saying I'm out of buying (or trying to buy) pieces at the current market prices.
Read more: urbanartassociation.com/thread/119911/out-anymore#ixzz3APCq1e2z
""I was offered one or two prints for a decent price and almost pulled the trigger but they weren't a print that I really loved""
Does that mean the novelty has worn off?
The art doesn't have the same effect it had originally or that you are dissapointed with whats been produced lately?
As Plip quoted, "..but they weren't a print that I really loved". For me to want to lay down the cash that these prints demand these days, I have to love looking at the piece every day as I am going to hang it on my wall. (don't get me started on the topic of hoarding prints under the bed in portfolios). "Mind you, if a print that I really like comes across my path for a good price, of course I will pick it up, but those chances are slim to none, and I am fine with that." Doesn't sound like you're out at all mate. Yeah, good point. I guess I'm saying I'm out of buying (or trying to buy) pieces at the current market prices. Read more: urbanartassociation.com/thread/119911/out-anymore#ixzz3APCq1e2z
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Unica
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,058
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November 2013
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Unica on Aug 15, 2014 0:11:01 GMT 1, ""I was offered one or two prints for a decent price and almost pulled the trigger but they weren't a print that I really loved""
Does that mean the novelty has worn off?
The art doesn't have the same effect it had originally or that you are dissapointed with whats been produced lately?
As Plip quoted, "..but they weren't a print that I really loved". For me to want to lay down the cash that these prints demand these days, I have to love looking at the piece every day as I am going to hang it on my wall. (don't get me started on the topic of hoarding prints under the bed in portfolios). "Mind you, if a print that I really like comes across my path for a good price, of course I will pick it up, but those chances are slim to none, and I am fine with that." Doesn't sound like you're out at all mate. Yeah, good point. I guess I'm saying I'm out of buying (or trying to buy) pieces at the current market prices. I get it your out! But when the next good comes around your back in.
""I was offered one or two prints for a decent price and almost pulled the trigger but they weren't a print that I really loved""
Does that mean the novelty has worn off?
The art doesn't have the same effect it had originally or that you are dissapointed with whats been produced lately?
As Plip quoted, "..but they weren't a print that I really loved". For me to want to lay down the cash that these prints demand these days, I have to love looking at the piece every day as I am going to hang it on my wall. (don't get me started on the topic of hoarding prints under the bed in portfolios). "Mind you, if a print that I really like comes across my path for a good price, of course I will pick it up, but those chances are slim to none, and I am fine with that." Doesn't sound like you're out at all mate. Yeah, good point. I guess I'm saying I'm out of buying (or trying to buy) pieces at the current market prices. I get it your out! But when the next good comes around your back in.
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Unica
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,058
Likes โข 1,220
November 2013
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Unica on Aug 15, 2014 0:16:23 GMT 1, Damien Hirst is alledged to have said the same thing about the endless spot paintings churned out by his workers. I wouldn't call them assistants considering he wasn't around when most were painted by hand.
Now we have a lot of spot paintings that are bruned. Entered at auction and failed to sell.
Monet didn't use stencils and his paintings are all unique and different even though he might have had a dozen easels set up with paintings he worked on as he found it more productive and also when he lost the eye or feel of one painting he would move onto another painting of a different scene.
Makes no difference if he used stencils or not to be honest and the ed banksy "originals" are all unique, i wont comment on the spots cause their just not for me but if id have looked at them in my younger years of hoffman and mushrooms it would prob be a different storyโฆ I have to agree with Castle they are originals IMO as each one is different and done by hand, I certainly wouldn't be as bold to call them unique but original for sure. All done by hand and not one identical.
How about Warhol, he did a lot of what I would consider originals in what you may consider an edition. Various different $, flower and portrait paintings. All of the same image, some in different colors others almost identical. I think most people would consider them originals. Here are some examples.
www.artvalue.com/auctionresult--warhol-andy-1928-1987-usa-flowers-4132412.htm www.artvalue.com/auctionresult--warhol-andy-1928-1987-usa-flowers-4059019.htm www.artvalue.com/auctionresult--warhol-andy-1928-1987-usa-flowers-4071087.htm www.artvalue.com/auctionresult--warhol-andy-1928-1987-usa-dollar-sign-4060690.htm www.artvalue.com/auctionresult--warhol-andy-1928-1987-usa-dollar-sign-3962595.htm www.artvalue.com/auctionresult--warhol-andy-1928-1987-usa-dollar-sign-3887558.htm www.artvalue.com/auctionresult--warhol-andy-1928-1987-usa-dollar-sign-3426966.htm
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doctor
New Member
Posts โข 308
Likes โข 254
September 2012
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by doctor on Aug 15, 2014 1:54:27 GMT 1, Not much difference between stencils and screens if you ask me.
But no one did.
<walks away sad>
Not much difference between stencils and screens if you ask me.
But no one did.
<walks away sad>
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Ottomatik
Junior Member
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Posts โข 4,216
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March 2009
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Ottomatik on Aug 15, 2014 2:32:45 GMT 1, So, you're annoyed with the secondary market on Banksy prints. Who the frack isn't?
Get over it!
Bunch o' crybabies up in here!
Dude, rejoice in the fact that you're 'lucky' enough to already own one.
So, you're annoyed with the secondary market on Banksy prints. Who the frack isn't?
Get over it!
Bunch o' crybabies up in here!
Dude, rejoice in the fact that you're 'lucky' enough to already own one.
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Deleted
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 15, 2014 2:35:21 GMT 1, The problem really is that Banksy has transitioned to an extremely legitimate artist respected by all likes of people, including the upper class. Once this happens, the original fans can no longer purchase the work due to demand increase. It's like when you're favorite local band gets big, but a thousand times worse.
That said, this isn't necessarily a problem as Banksy hasn't changed - he's still good ol' Banksy. This simply means we can't own his art anymore. The same way we can't go see Arctic Monkeys in a basement like ten years ago (bad comparison but you know what I mean).
I agree that following new artists is fun and seems to be a more rewarding experience than trying to collect Banksys. And I fully agree with the concept of people wanting to own a Banksy regardless of image now.
I kind of wish he'd start doing screenprints again; I understand why he chose to stop, but he'd be making so many people happier; mainly the ones who really like his art (as they won't care about an oversaturated market, they'll just be happy to have a print like any other fan for any other artist). And it would almost purify the way the market approaches his art, as people would be much more likely to buy based on image.
The problem really is that Banksy has transitioned to an extremely legitimate artist respected by all likes of people, including the upper class. Once this happens, the original fans can no longer purchase the work due to demand increase. It's like when you're favorite local band gets big, but a thousand times worse.
That said, this isn't necessarily a problem as Banksy hasn't changed - he's still good ol' Banksy. This simply means we can't own his art anymore. The same way we can't go see Arctic Monkeys in a basement like ten years ago (bad comparison but you know what I mean).
I agree that following new artists is fun and seems to be a more rewarding experience than trying to collect Banksys. And I fully agree with the concept of people wanting to own a Banksy regardless of image now.
I kind of wish he'd start doing screenprints again; I understand why he chose to stop, but he'd be making so many people happier; mainly the ones who really like his art (as they won't care about an oversaturated market, they'll just be happy to have a print like any other fan for any other artist). And it would almost purify the way the market approaches his art, as people would be much more likely to buy based on image.
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Unica
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,058
Likes โข 1,220
November 2013
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Unica on Aug 15, 2014 5:24:46 GMT 1, I'm out. I can't do it anymore. I am lucky enough to own a Banksy print that I honestly love. I got it years ago when the prices were reasonable (compared to now). Recently I thought, you know what, it would be cool to have another on the wall so I started the search. My initial finds were a bit of a shock but I persevered and continued on. I was offered one or two prints for a decent price and almost pulled the trigger but they weren't a print that I really loved and figured I was only buying it because of the value and I would have been getting a good deal. I am (more than) lucky to have secured a piece of art that I love years ago and I am thankful every day that I look at it. I feel sorry for people coming to the party this late in the game. My decision - buy a few pieces from other artists I like and go on another overseas holiday. Life is for getting out there and experiencing things. When the cost of an unsigned print is the same as a holiday and some other art, it's really hard to justify buying a piece of paper with a pretty picture on it that doesn't even have a scribbled pencil signature on it. Mind you, if a print that I really like comes across my path for a good price, of course I will pick it up, but those chances are slim to none, and I am fine with that. I am the first to admit, this is easier for me as I already own a piece. And as a side note, what have I discovered in this recent search: 1) Everyone thinks they have a "mint" print, even when its been handled and framed 2) Private prices are the pretty much the same as Gallery prices these days 3) Judging by the want-ads, peolpe don't seem to care what banksy they have as long as it is a banksy May I inquire to which Banksy print you already have?
I'm out. I can't do it anymore. I am lucky enough to own a Banksy print that I honestly love. I got it years ago when the prices were reasonable (compared to now). Recently I thought, you know what, it would be cool to have another on the wall so I started the search. My initial finds were a bit of a shock but I persevered and continued on. I was offered one or two prints for a decent price and almost pulled the trigger but they weren't a print that I really loved and figured I was only buying it because of the value and I would have been getting a good deal. I am (more than) lucky to have secured a piece of art that I love years ago and I am thankful every day that I look at it. I feel sorry for people coming to the party this late in the game. My decision - buy a few pieces from other artists I like and go on another overseas holiday. Life is for getting out there and experiencing things. When the cost of an unsigned print is the same as a holiday and some other art, it's really hard to justify buying a piece of paper with a pretty picture on it that doesn't even have a scribbled pencil signature on it. Mind you, if a print that I really like comes across my path for a good price, of course I will pick it up, but those chances are slim to none, and I am fine with that. I am the first to admit, this is easier for me as I already own a piece. And as a side note, what have I discovered in this recent search: 1) Everyone thinks they have a "mint" print, even when its been handled and framed 2) Private prices are the pretty much the same as Gallery prices these days 3) Judging by the want-ads, peolpe don't seem to care what banksy they have as long as it is a banksy May I inquire to which Banksy print you already have?
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alittle
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,575
Likes โข 1,315
November 2012
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by alittle on Aug 15, 2014 5:41:13 GMT 1, Don't own a Banksy. Don't care.
Don't own a Banksy. Don't care.
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Unica
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,058
Likes โข 1,220
November 2013
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Unica on Aug 15, 2014 6:07:39 GMT 1, Don't own a Banksy. Don't care. I was asking Astroboy. Glad you don't have one and don't care. More for those that do.
Don't own a Banksy. Don't care. I was asking Astroboy. Glad you don't have one and don't care. More for those that do.
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alittle
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,575
Likes โข 1,315
November 2012
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by alittle on Aug 15, 2014 6:30:29 GMT 1, Don't own a Banksy. Don't care. I was asking Astroboy. Glad you don't have one and don't care. More for those that do. If I was responding to you, I would have quoted you.
Don't own a Banksy. Don't care. I was asking Astroboy. Glad you don't have one and don't care. More for those that do. If I was responding to you, I would have quoted you.
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jonb
New Member
Posts โข 82
Likes โข 90
July 2014
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by jonb on Aug 15, 2014 9:08:16 GMT 1, I have problems with the art market. To me the effect of the art market seeming to legitimise artists through sales effects not only what is bought, but also what is produced and it seems to me stultifies the artist. For me street art works because of the direct connection between artist and viewer. Once people want to own a 'Banksy' and artists become reliant on the income to support themselves it has an effect on what is produced.
The person who wants to own or in other words have a connection to a particular artist will have a preference for work which is in that artists style. They tend to want a 'Banksy' which looks like a 'Banksy' The effect of this is that an any artist who supports themselves by sales of their work is pressurised to produce art to their standard style rather than experiment.
The problem with that is that talent is not used to drive visual art forward finding new ways to look and see, but is used to just ratify the needs of the market.
I have problems with the art market. To me the effect of the art market seeming to legitimise artists through sales effects not only what is bought, but also what is produced and it seems to me stultifies the artist. For me street art works because of the direct connection between artist and viewer. Once people want to own a 'Banksy' and artists become reliant on the income to support themselves it has an effect on what is produced.
The person who wants to own or in other words have a connection to a particular artist will have a preference for work which is in that artists style. They tend to want a 'Banksy' which looks like a 'Banksy' The effect of this is that an any artist who supports themselves by sales of their work is pressurised to produce art to their standard style rather than experiment.
The problem with that is that talent is not used to drive visual art forward finding new ways to look and see, but is used to just ratify the needs of the market.
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angel41
Artist
New Member
Posts โข 411
Likes โข 473
May 2013
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by angel41 on Aug 15, 2014 11:29:50 GMT 1, "To be an artist you have to give up everything, including the desire to be a good artist." Jasper Johns
"To be an artist you have to give up everything, including the desire to be a good artist." Jasper Johns
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 15, 2014 11:54:50 GMT 1, I have problems with the art market. To me the effect of the art market seeming to legitimise artists through sales effects not only what is bought, but also what is produced and it seems to me stultifies the artist. For me street art works because of the direct connection between artist and viewer. Once people want to own a 'Banksy' and artists become reliant on the income to support themselves it has an effect on what is produced. The person who wants to own or in other words have a connection to a particular artist will have a preference for work which is in that artists style. They tend to want a 'Banksy' which looks like a 'Banksy' The effect of this is that an any artist who supports themselves by sales of their work is pressurised to produce art to their standard style rather than experiment. The problem with that is that talent is not used to drive visual art forward finding new ways to look and see, but is used to just ratify the needs of the market. Its a tough way to make a living especially in the current economic climate, it must be a constant tug of war with many artists trying to be true to themselves and also produce work which will sell because ultimately most artists want to be recognised for their artistry and to be able to make a living doing what they love, that way they get to do it all the time. I've known artists who have struggled to make ends meet for 30 years, following their own path and one particular artist who spent many nights sleeping in his studio in a practically derelict building with his coat as a blanket and never veered to painting to please anyone but himself, not everyone wants or are able to make that sacrifice. Theres artists I work with who would tell me do one if I tried to direct them to paint something similar to another piece because it sold quick, and others who would knock 10 out the same and sell them as one offs if they thought they'd all sell, different artists different people.
I have problems with the art market. To me the effect of the art market seeming to legitimise artists through sales effects not only what is bought, but also what is produced and it seems to me stultifies the artist. For me street art works because of the direct connection between artist and viewer. Once people want to own a 'Banksy' and artists become reliant on the income to support themselves it has an effect on what is produced. The person who wants to own or in other words have a connection to a particular artist will have a preference for work which is in that artists style. They tend to want a 'Banksy' which looks like a 'Banksy' The effect of this is that an any artist who supports themselves by sales of their work is pressurised to produce art to their standard style rather than experiment. The problem with that is that talent is not used to drive visual art forward finding new ways to look and see, but is used to just ratify the needs of the market. Its a tough way to make a living especially in the current economic climate, it must be a constant tug of war with many artists trying to be true to themselves and also produce work which will sell because ultimately most artists want to be recognised for their artistry and to be able to make a living doing what they love, that way they get to do it all the time. I've known artists who have struggled to make ends meet for 30 years, following their own path and one particular artist who spent many nights sleeping in his studio in a practically derelict building with his coat as a blanket and never veered to painting to please anyone but himself, not everyone wants or are able to make that sacrifice. Theres artists I work with who would tell me do one if I tried to direct them to paint something similar to another piece because it sold quick, and others who would knock 10 out the same and sell them as one offs if they thought they'd all sell, different artists different people.
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jonb
New Member
Posts โข 82
Likes โข 90
July 2014
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by jonb on Aug 15, 2014 13:09:22 GMT 1, Yes you are right, but the table only has to be tilled a little to alter results. Yes there are artists with great integrity, and those who will deliberately walk the most awkward path possible, but the table is tilted.
There are lots of presumptions in the 'art market' which when pointed to a lot of people will say are false, however the dominance of evaluating art in commercial terms goes ever onward, and I do not think that is a healthy environment for an artist to be in.
Yes you are right, but the table only has to be tilled a little to alter results. Yes there are artists with great integrity, and those who will deliberately walk the most awkward path possible, but the table is tilted.
There are lots of presumptions in the 'art market' which when pointed to a lot of people will say are false, however the dominance of evaluating art in commercial terms goes ever onward, and I do not think that is a healthy environment for an artist to be in.
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 15, 2014 14:33:55 GMT 1, There's so much more to having an art collection than owning a Banksy. To be honest there's a lot more to life than owning art, yeah enjoy it and if you see something you like and can afford then buy it but don't let it take over your life and stop you owning and doing other things.
Art is after all just pretty pictures on your wall. Life is about experiences and enjoying yourself. You have to ask yourself :- when you're lying on your deathbed (ok a bit morbid I know!) will you be regretting not buying that expensive piece of art for thousands or be happy that you spent your money on things you enjoyed doing eg hobbies, cars, once in a lifetime trips etc etc.
Just my tuppance worth anyway.
There's so much more to having an art collection than owning a Banksy. To be honest there's a lot more to life than owning art, yeah enjoy it and if you see something you like and can afford then buy it but don't let it take over your life and stop you owning and doing other things.
Art is after all just pretty pictures on your wall. Life is about experiences and enjoying yourself. You have to ask yourself :- when you're lying on your deathbed (ok a bit morbid I know!) will you be regretting not buying that expensive piece of art for thousands or be happy that you spent your money on things you enjoyed doing eg hobbies, cars, once in a lifetime trips etc etc.
Just my tuppance worth anyway.
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 15, 2014 14:47:10 GMT 1, I cannot/ refuse to pay the ยฃยฃ for a Bnasky now, but still want to fill the house with art. There is plenty of good stuff around at cost - at the start of the year I got a beautiful hand pulled Deller silky from the Glasgow Festival for ยฃ400 - a decent print and a worthwhile cause. that would have got me 1/20th of a mid range signed banksy - I know what I would sooner have on the wall - dont get dragged into the hype, leave it to the wankers to blow their QE funded wedge on shitty Bankshy prints with a squiggle in the corner*
![](http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2013/10/25/1382704868728/Jeremy-Deller-print-009.jpg)
* likely not his either. alledgedly
I cannot/ refuse to pay the ยฃยฃ for a Bnasky now, but still want to fill the house with art. There is plenty of good stuff around at cost - at the start of the year I got a beautiful hand pulled Deller silky from the Glasgow Festival for ยฃ400 - a decent print and a worthwhile cause. that would have got me 1/20th of a mid range signed banksy - I know what I would sooner have on the wall - dont get dragged into the hype, leave it to the wankers to blow their QE funded wedge on shitty Bankshy prints with a squiggle in the corner* ![](http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2013/10/25/1382704868728/Jeremy-Deller-print-009.jpg) * likely not his either. alledgedly
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Deleted
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 15, 2014 15:47:05 GMT 1, I cannot/ refuse to pay the ยฃยฃ for a Bnasky now, but still want to fill the house with art. There is plenty of good stuff around at cost - at the start of the year I got a beautiful hand pulled Deller silky from the Glasgow Festival for ยฃ400 - a decent print and a worthwhile cause. that would have got me 1/20th of a mid range signed banksy - I know what I would sooner have on the wall - dont get dragged into the hype, leave it to the wankers to blow their QE funded wedge on s**tty Bankshy prints with a squiggle in the corner* ![](http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2013/10/25/1382704868728/Jeremy-Deller-print-009.jpg) * likely not his either. alledgedly A testosterone fuelled bitchy rant, why don't you just sell me all your shitty signed Banksys including that J&J signed you mentioned earlier, I cant think for a second why you'd want to keep them considering your standpoint, had a bad day or something?
I cannot/ refuse to pay the ยฃยฃ for a Bnasky now, but still want to fill the house with art. There is plenty of good stuff around at cost - at the start of the year I got a beautiful hand pulled Deller silky from the Glasgow Festival for ยฃ400 - a decent print and a worthwhile cause. that would have got me 1/20th of a mid range signed banksy - I know what I would sooner have on the wall - dont get dragged into the hype, leave it to the wankers to blow their QE funded wedge on s**tty Bankshy prints with a squiggle in the corner* ![](http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2013/10/25/1382704868728/Jeremy-Deller-print-009.jpg) * likely not his either. alledgedly A testosterone fuelled bitchy rant, why don't you just sell me all your shitty signed Banksys including that J&J signed you mentioned earlier, I cant think for a second why you'd want to keep them considering your standpoint, had a bad day or something?
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Deleted
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 15, 2014 16:07:12 GMT 1, what I don't understand is people who own Banksy's, only to keep them sitting in a portfolio. If you're lucky enough to own one, either display it and enjoy the s**t out of it, or sell it to someone who will
it shouldn't be about their value. if you like it, hang it up. don't keep it just because your hoping it will keep increasing in value. there are plenty of people that would love to stare at it all day
what I don't understand is people who own Banksy's, only to keep them sitting in a portfolio. If you're lucky enough to own one, either display it and enjoy the s**t out of it, or sell it to someone who will
it shouldn't be about their value. if you like it, hang it up. don't keep it just because your hoping it will keep increasing in value. there are plenty of people that would love to stare at it all day
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alittle
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,575
Likes โข 1,315
November 2012
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by alittle on Aug 15, 2014 16:10:52 GMT 1, People purchase art for different reasons and they can do with their art as they choose.
People purchase art for different reasons and they can do with their art as they choose.
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doctor
New Member
Posts โข 308
Likes โข 254
September 2012
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by doctor on Aug 15, 2014 16:12:06 GMT 1, You're both right.
I'd just prefer to have it myself.
All of it.
You're both right.
I'd just prefer to have it myself.
All of it.
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Deleted
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 15, 2014 16:18:53 GMT 1, People purchase art for different reasons and they can do with their art as they choose. true, but if people hoarding Banksy prints unloaded theirs, more prints would be available to people like myself who would love to own one but can't afford to, and prices might just come down a bit
People purchase art for different reasons and they can do with their art as they choose. true, but if people hoarding Banksy prints unloaded theirs, more prints would be available to people like myself who would love to own one but can't afford to, and prices might just come down a bit
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met
Junior Member
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star_silver.png)
Posts โข 2,704
Likes โข 6,383
June 2009
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by met on Aug 15, 2014 16:24:07 GMT 1, I have problems with the art market. To me the effect of the art market seeming to legitimise artists through sales effects not only what is bought, but also what is produced and it seems to me stultifies the artist. For me street art works because of the direct connection between artist and viewer. Once people want to own a 'Banksy' and artists become reliant on the income to support themselves it has an effect on what is produced. The person who wants to own or in other words have a connection to a particular artist will have a preference for work which is in that artists style. They tend to want a 'Banksy' which looks like a 'Banksy' The effect of this is that an any artist who supports themselves by sales of their work is pressurised to produce art to their standard style rather than experiment. The problem with that is that talent is not used to drive visual art forward finding new ways to look and see, but is used to just ratify the needs of the market. Its a tough way to make a living especially in the current economic climate, it must be a constant tug of war with many artists trying to be true to themselves and also produce work which will sell because ultimately most artists want to be recognised for their artistry and to be able to make a living doing what they love, that way they get to do it all the time. I've known artists who have struggled to make ends meet for 30 years, following their own path and one particular artist who spent many nights sleeping in his studio in a practically derelict building with his coat as a blanket and never veered to painting to please anyone but himself, not everyone wants or are able to make that sacrifice. Theres artists I work with who would tell me do one if I tried to direct them to paint something similar to another piece because it sold quick, and others who would knock 10 out the same and sell them as one offs if they thought they'd all sell, different artists different people. For dealers who value not just the bottom line but also artistic integrity, encountering this kind of mindset among any of their artists must leave them highly conflicted.
"Great! It was a popular image in the gallery. I can easily find buyers for these ten, additional, identical works you've made, each marked '1/1'.[You shameless whore, you'd probably sell your own grandmother.]"
I have problems with the art market. To me the effect of the art market seeming to legitimise artists through sales effects not only what is bought, but also what is produced and it seems to me stultifies the artist. For me street art works because of the direct connection between artist and viewer. Once people want to own a 'Banksy' and artists become reliant on the income to support themselves it has an effect on what is produced. The person who wants to own or in other words have a connection to a particular artist will have a preference for work which is in that artists style. They tend to want a 'Banksy' which looks like a 'Banksy' The effect of this is that an any artist who supports themselves by sales of their work is pressurised to produce art to their standard style rather than experiment. The problem with that is that talent is not used to drive visual art forward finding new ways to look and see, but is used to just ratify the needs of the market. Its a tough way to make a living especially in the current economic climate, it must be a constant tug of war with many artists trying to be true to themselves and also produce work which will sell because ultimately most artists want to be recognised for their artistry and to be able to make a living doing what they love, that way they get to do it all the time. I've known artists who have struggled to make ends meet for 30 years, following their own path and one particular artist who spent many nights sleeping in his studio in a practically derelict building with his coat as a blanket and never veered to painting to please anyone but himself, not everyone wants or are able to make that sacrifice. Theres artists I work with who would tell me do one if I tried to direct them to paint something similar to another piece because it sold quick, and others who would knock 10 out the same and sell them as one offs if they thought they'd all sell, different artists different people. For dealers who value not just the bottom line but also artistic integrity, encountering this kind of mindset among any of their artists must leave them highly conflicted. "Great! It was a popular image in the gallery. I can easily find buyers for these ten, additional, identical works you've made, each marked '1/1'.[You shameless whore, you'd probably sell your own grandmother.]"
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JAlternatiรณn
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,268
Likes โข 963
December 2011
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by JAlternatiรณn on Aug 15, 2014 16:47:20 GMT 1, This is a strange thread.
This is a strange thread.
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Deleted
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 15, 2014 16:56:32 GMT 1, People purchase art for different reasons and they can do with their art as they choose. true, but if people hoarding Banksy prints unloaded theirs, more prints would be available to people like myself who would love to own one but can't afford to, and prices might just come down a bit That would be nice, wont happen Fed, plenty already framed and owned, if more sprang from folios they would be snapped up at market price IMO.
People purchase art for different reasons and they can do with their art as they choose. true, but if people hoarding Banksy prints unloaded theirs, more prints would be available to people like myself who would love to own one but can't afford to, and prices might just come down a bit That would be nice, wont happen Fed, plenty already framed and owned, if more sprang from folios they would be snapped up at market price IMO.
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
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January 1970
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I'm out. I can't do it anymore., by Deleted on Aug 15, 2014 17:04:00 GMT 1, Its a tough way to make a living especially in the current economic climate, it must be a constant tug of war with many artists trying to be true to themselves and also produce work which will sell because ultimately most artists want to be recognised for their artistry and to be able to make a living doing what they love, that way they get to do it all the time. I've known artists who have struggled to make ends meet for 30 years, following their own path and one particular artist who spent many nights sleeping in his studio in a practically derelict building with his coat as a blanket and never veered to painting to please anyone but himself, not everyone wants or are able to make that sacrifice. Theres artists I work with who would tell me do one if I tried to direct them to paint something similar to another piece because it sold quick, and others who would knock 10 out the same and sell them as one offs if they thought they'd all sell, different artists different people. For dealers who value not just the bottom line but also artistic integrity, encountering this kind of mindset among any of their artists must leave them highly conflicted. "Great! It was a popular image in the gallery. I can easily find buyers for these ten, additional, identical works you've made, each marked '1/1'.[You shameless whore, you'd probably sell your own grandmother.]"I know many artists who would do that, I didn't say I would sell them. I hope the whore comment wasn't directed at me. I don't get conflicted much, if I don't agree with it I don't do it.
Its a tough way to make a living especially in the current economic climate, it must be a constant tug of war with many artists trying to be true to themselves and also produce work which will sell because ultimately most artists want to be recognised for their artistry and to be able to make a living doing what they love, that way they get to do it all the time. I've known artists who have struggled to make ends meet for 30 years, following their own path and one particular artist who spent many nights sleeping in his studio in a practically derelict building with his coat as a blanket and never veered to painting to please anyone but himself, not everyone wants or are able to make that sacrifice. Theres artists I work with who would tell me do one if I tried to direct them to paint something similar to another piece because it sold quick, and others who would knock 10 out the same and sell them as one offs if they thought they'd all sell, different artists different people. For dealers who value not just the bottom line but also artistic integrity, encountering this kind of mindset among any of their artists must leave them highly conflicted. "Great! It was a popular image in the gallery. I can easily find buyers for these ten, additional, identical works you've made, each marked '1/1'.[You shameless whore, you'd probably sell your own grandmother.]"I know many artists who would do that, I didn't say I would sell them. I hope the whore comment wasn't directed at me. I don't get conflicted much, if I don't agree with it I don't do it.
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