Hubble Bubble
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 4,117
๐๐ป 3,567
December 2010
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Yes or No, by Hubble Bubble on Sept 19, 2014 8:30:58 GMT 1, I hear you, eschiff but aren't we forever locked in a cycle like this, no matter who 'wins'. What, for instance, would have happened if 'Yes' had nudged it? Would folk be feeling for the 1.5 million who had voted to stay as they are and now faced life in a country they didn't want to live inโฆ
Also, I think that to describe the 'No' vote as a vote for 'fear of the unknown' is a disparaging view of a decision taken by a highly educated and politically savvy electorate. The 'No' voters weighed up the options as presented to them and, had the case for 'Yes' been stronger, would, no doubt, have been swayed. As it was, they chose positively, not negatively. To portray a 'No' as a negative, simply because the option is phrased that way, is disingenuous and was, I think, a tactic used by the 'Yes' campaign that angered many of the undecided and moved them closer towards the 'No' vote.
It's intriguing how these questions are phrased, isn't it. For instanceโฆ the question could easily have been "Do you feel Scotland should remain part of the United Kingdom?" In which case the 'Yes' voters would have had to vote 'No' and the dynamic of 'change' instantly has a less positive feel about it.
I also feel that 'change' isn't necessarily always a good thing. The grass isn't always greener on the other side. Sometimes it is but sometimes it isn't. But, then again, one of my mantras in life is 'you only regret the things you don't do, never the things that you do'โฆ so maybe you're right in one sense.
Hey ho. Such a complex issue and that's just from an Englishman who is happy to have Scotland in the Union or as a separate country - looking in. Imagine how difficult it must have been/must still be for those living in Scotland.
I hear you, eschiff but aren't we forever locked in a cycle like this, no matter who 'wins'. What, for instance, would have happened if 'Yes' had nudged it? Would folk be feeling for the 1.5 million who had voted to stay as they are and now faced life in a country they didn't want to live inโฆ
Also, I think that to describe the 'No' vote as a vote for 'fear of the unknown' is a disparaging view of a decision taken by a highly educated and politically savvy electorate. The 'No' voters weighed up the options as presented to them and, had the case for 'Yes' been stronger, would, no doubt, have been swayed. As it was, they chose positively, not negatively. To portray a 'No' as a negative, simply because the option is phrased that way, is disingenuous and was, I think, a tactic used by the 'Yes' campaign that angered many of the undecided and moved them closer towards the 'No' vote.
It's intriguing how these questions are phrased, isn't it. For instanceโฆ the question could easily have been "Do you feel Scotland should remain part of the United Kingdom?" In which case the 'Yes' voters would have had to vote 'No' and the dynamic of 'change' instantly has a less positive feel about it.
I also feel that 'change' isn't necessarily always a good thing. The grass isn't always greener on the other side. Sometimes it is but sometimes it isn't. But, then again, one of my mantras in life is 'you only regret the things you don't do, never the things that you do'โฆ so maybe you're right in one sense.
Hey ho. Such a complex issue and that's just from an Englishman who is happy to have Scotland in the Union or as a separate country - looking in. Imagine how difficult it must have been/must still be for those living in Scotland.
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eschiff
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,064
๐๐ป 1,000
January 2010
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Yes or No, by eschiff on Sept 19, 2014 8:43:36 GMT 1, that's true, if yes had won than the no voters would feel pretty put out. I read a great article (tried to find it but alas couldn't) about how long and hard it was for them to phrase the question and how many iterations it went through.
I guess what I never understood was with the fear about the currency, or the lack of oil in North Sea, what was the no's ultimate outcome? That scotland would become a lawless place? Or that inflation would lead to high unemployment and lead to a disintegration of the society? I just never got the end game though I understood the concerns.
that's true, if yes had won than the no voters would feel pretty put out. I read a great article (tried to find it but alas couldn't) about how long and hard it was for them to phrase the question and how many iterations it went through.
I guess what I never understood was with the fear about the currency, or the lack of oil in North Sea, what was the no's ultimate outcome? That scotland would become a lawless place? Or that inflation would lead to high unemployment and lead to a disintegration of the society? I just never got the end game though I understood the concerns.
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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Yes or No, by Deleted on Sept 19, 2014 8:57:08 GMT 1, Whitโs fur yeโll no go by ye, lang may yer lum reek.
Whitโs fur yeโll no go by ye, lang may yer lum reek.
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Hubble Bubble
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 4,117
๐๐ป 3,567
December 2010
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Yes or No, by Hubble Bubble on Sept 19, 2014 9:01:02 GMT 1, Indeed 
Indeed |
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balibob
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,782
๐๐ป 326
November 2010
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Yes or No, by balibob on Sept 19, 2014 9:29:36 GMT 1, Does this mean that I still have to like Andy Murray?
Does this mean that I still have to like Andy Murray?
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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Yes or No, by Deleted on Sept 19, 2014 10:48:34 GMT 1, I see Braveheart is now on continuous loop on all TV stations north of Carlisle. What about the millions of Scots who live in England? I hope if the vote is yes, that we insist that they finally learn to speak English. My best mate is a Glaswegian, cant understand a fcuking word he says until he's had 3 pints and calms down to a frenzy. Theres some great talent from Glasgow, not a shy bunch that's for sure haha
I see Braveheart is now on continuous loop on all TV stations north of Carlisle. What about the millions of Scots who live in England? I hope if the vote is yes, that we insist that they finally learn to speak English. My best mate is a Glaswegian, cant understand a fcuking word he says until he's had 3 pints and calms down to a frenzy. Theres some great talent from Glasgow, not a shy bunch that's for sure haha
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johnnyh
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 4,492
๐๐ป 2,102
March 2011
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Yes or No, by johnnyh on Sept 19, 2014 11:23:55 GMT 1, There's a lot to be said for the benefits of the yes vote!!
Not quite sure how or why you came access that musical extravaganza....although the worrying thing for me is that I watched it all!!!
There's a lot to be said for the benefits of the yes vote!!
Not quite sure how or why you came access that musical extravaganza....although the worrying thing for me is that I watched it all!!!
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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Yes or No, by Deleted on Sept 19, 2014 11:33:26 GMT 1, There's a lot to be said for the benefits of the yes vote!! Not quite sure how or why you came access that musical extravaganza....although the worrying thing for me is that I watched it all!!! LOL I know where youre coming from, heres an interview of sorts after the song was put on you tube 
There's a lot to be said for the benefits of the yes vote!! Not quite sure how or why you came access that musical extravaganza....although the worrying thing for me is that I watched it all!!! LOL I know where youre coming from, heres an interview of sorts after the song was put on you tube
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Warm Gun
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 4,646
๐๐ป 1,130
August 2009
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Yes or No, by Warm Gun on Sept 19, 2014 14:30:44 GMT 1, The best thing to come out of all this referendum shananagins is that I now have another reason to dislike Andy 'the gob' Murray. Hoorah!
The best thing to come out of all this referendum shananagins is that I now have another reason to dislike Andy 'the gob' Murray. Hoorah!
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me7777
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 433
๐๐ป 299
January 2011
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Yes or No, by me7777 on Sept 19, 2014 17:10:00 GMT 1, Well it wasn't what I was hoping and dreaming of but I'm so very proud to have been one of the 45%!
1.6m people that put hope before fear are the real winners!
Well it wasn't what I was hoping and dreaming of but I'm so very proud to have been one of the 45%!
1.6m people that put hope before fear are the real winners!
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iamzero
Full Member
๐จ๏ธ 9,190
๐๐ป 8,545
May 2011
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Yes or No
Sept 19, 2014 17:40:33 GMT 1
via mobile
Yes or No, by iamzero on Sept 19, 2014 17:40:33 GMT 1, Glad that they decided to stay united but would love to hear why the Scottish MP's think its right to have their own government that the English are not allowed to vote on but have decided to get all grumpy that they won't be allowed to vote on English policies in the future?
Glad that they decided to stay united but would love to hear why the Scottish MP's think its right to have their own government that the English are not allowed to vote on but have decided to get all grumpy that they won't be allowed to vote on English policies in the future?
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Warm Gun
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 4,646
๐๐ป 1,130
August 2009
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Yes or No, by Warm Gun on Sept 19, 2014 18:43:40 GMT 1, Looks like Salmond has taken this hard, he's stepping down.
Looks like Salmond has taken this hard, he's stepping down.
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iamzero
Full Member
๐จ๏ธ 9,190
๐๐ป 8,545
May 2011
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Yes or No
Sept 19, 2014 18:59:53 GMT 1
via mobile
Yes or No, by iamzero on Sept 19, 2014 18:59:53 GMT 1, Am I the only one sniggering at Salmond taking it hard?
Am I the only one sniggering at Salmond taking it hard?
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me7777
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 433
๐๐ป 299
January 2011
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Yes or No, by me7777 on Sept 19, 2014 19:55:47 GMT 1, Glad that they decided to stay united but would love to hear why the Scottish MP's think its right to have their own government that the English are not allowed to vote on but have decided to get all grumpy that they won't be allowed to vote on English policies in the future?
The others tow the party line, it's wrong and should be changed!
Glad that they decided to stay united but would love to hear why the Scottish MP's think its right to have their own government that the English are not allowed to vote on but have decided to get all grumpy that they won't be allowed to vote on English policies in the future? SNP MPs choose not to vote on English only matters at Westminster! The others tow the party line, it's wrong and should be changed! |
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love
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,649
๐๐ป 391
October 2009
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Yes or No, by love on Sept 20, 2014 15:24:51 GMT 1, 
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johnnyh
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 4,492
๐๐ป 2,102
March 2011
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Yes or No, by johnnyh on Sept 20, 2014 16:10:39 GMT 1, Glad that they decided to stay united but would love to hear why the Scottish MP's think its right to have their own government that the English are not allow. ed to vote on but have decided to get all grumpy that they won't be allowed to vote on English policies in the future? SNP MPs choose not to vote on English only matters at Westminster! The others tow the party line, it's wrong and should be changed!
so this will be a major problem of ever unseating the Tories from power. It is of course right
labour will have to defend the right so they will lose a huge amount of seats to UKIP as will the Tories and liberals as UKIP policy in the next election will be to claw back the tax subsidy given to the Scottish promised to be continued by the 3 other parties. So this will be a massive vote winner for UkIP in the next election.
Glad that they decided to stay united but would love to hear why the Scottish MP's think its right to have their own government that the English are not allow. ed to vote on but have decided to get all grumpy that they won't be allowed to vote on English policies in the future? SNP MPs choose not to vote on English only matters at Westminster! The others tow the party line, it's wrong and should be changed! Yep this is one of the big consequences of the vote. if you remove the votes from Scotland,nIreland and Wales labour lose about 63 votes which means even if they won an election they would amost certainly lose all the votes on English law. So you could technically have Govt who couldn't rule. so this will be a major problem of ever unseating the Tories from power. It is of course right labour will have to defend the right so they will lose a huge amount of seats to UKIP as will the Tories and liberals as UKIP policy in the next election will be to claw back the tax subsidy given to the Scottish promised to be continued by the 3 other parties. So this will be a massive vote winner for UkIP in the next election. |
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Cornish Crayon
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 3,965
๐๐ป 2,902
December 2007
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Yes or No, by Cornish Crayon on Sept 20, 2014 17:24:34 GMT 1, Surely this is thread closed
Thank you
Surely this is thread closed
Thank you
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johnnyh
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 4,492
๐๐ป 2,102
March 2011
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Yes or No, by johnnyh on Sept 21, 2014 0:14:26 GMT 1, Surely this is thread closed Thank you
thank you
ps why do threads have to close?
Surely this is thread closed Thank you So are you now the official thread closer??? thank you ps why do threads have to close? |
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me7777
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 433
๐๐ป 299
January 2011
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Yes or No, by me7777 on Sept 21, 2014 10:36:34 GMT 1,
To Be Continued!
To Be Continued!
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johnnyh
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 4,492
๐๐ป 2,102
March 2011
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Yes or No, by johnnyh on Sept 21, 2014 11:59:44 GMT 1, 
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me7777
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 433
๐๐ป 299
January 2011
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Yes or No, by me7777 on Sept 25, 2014 18:40:52 GMT 1, Well it's a week later and many of the no voters are having regrets!
So far this week
The extra oil that wasn't there has suddenly appeared and will last for decades.
Parties can't agree on the new powers they promised!
More Austerity announced!
Fracking licences awarded and arriving on my doorstep!
Another War in Iraq!
I just want to say thanks to the No voters for being so kind!
Well it's a week later and many of the no voters are having regrets!
So far this week
The extra oil that wasn't there has suddenly appeared and will last for decades.
Parties can't agree on the new powers they promised!
More Austerity announced!
Fracking licences awarded and arriving on my doorstep!
Another War in Iraq!
I just want to say thanks to the No voters for being so kind!
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mouser
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,236
๐๐ป 1,148
April 2011
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Yes or No, by mouser on Sept 25, 2014 18:45:13 GMT 1, Well it's a week later and many of the no voters are having regrets! So far this week The extra oil that wasn't there has suddenly appeared and will last for decades. Parties can't agree on the new powers they promised! More Austerity announced! Fracking licences awarded and arriving on my doorstep! Another War in Iraq! I just want to say thanks to the No voters for being so kind!
Well it's a week later and many of the no voters are having regrets! So far this week The extra oil that wasn't there has suddenly appeared and will last for decades. Parties can't agree on the new powers they promised! More Austerity announced! Fracking licences awarded and arriving on my doorstep! Another War in Iraq! I just want to say thanks to the No voters for being so kind! very sad, very disappointing but sadly no great surprise... and its only going to get a LOT worse now that the options have been removed, nothing to bargain with. The ironic thing is, all of the scarem ongering done by the No campaign looks to be coming true without the yes vote..... |
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