cmodart
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March 2014
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by cmodart on Jun 4, 2015 1:49:24 GMT 1, Thanks. I think that sometimes galleries and artists see what a print goes for on ebay and think that's their market value. They don't stop to consider that they were selling from a larger supply on the initial release. The secondary market is usually around 10% of the initial supply with almost as much demand. So prices are naturally driven up.Β Maybe they think they could really take the profits that can be made on secondary market and 'which should rightfully be the artist's' - as another member said here earlier. And even with such a large edition at that price, maybe there could really be 99 lining up to buy it. BUT for me to pay that price for a print, the work has to break new ground and offers something radically different which you can't get from the rest of her prints (unless one thinks turning the Xs 45 degree qualifies as progress and creative). Those factors aside and based purely on the superficial, I don't even like the look of this!
The supply/demand curve fully explains the supposed profit by the flippers. The reason for the price increase is often the reduction of supply, together with the demand, partly created by the sellout, hence the increase in price potential.
Thanks. I think that sometimes galleries and artists see what a print goes for on ebay and think that's their market value. They don't stop to consider that they were selling from a larger supply on the initial release. The secondary market is usually around 10% of the initial supply with almost as much demand. So prices are naturally driven up.Β Maybe they think they could really take the profits that can be made on secondary market and 'which should rightfully be the artist's' - as another member said here earlier. And even with such a large edition at that price, maybe there could really be 99 lining up to buy it. BUT for me to pay that price for a print, the work has to break new ground and offers something radically different which you can't get from the rest of her prints (unless one thinks turning the Xs 45 degree qualifies as progress and creative). Those factors aside and based purely on the superficial, I don't even like the look of this! The supply/demand curve fully explains the supposed profit by the flippers. The reason for the price increase is often the reduction of supply, together with the demand, partly created by the sellout, hence the increase in price potential. |
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bairbl
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May 2015
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by bairbl on Jun 4, 2015 2:00:51 GMT 1, It's the willingness to pay of each person who wants the print. Someone said earlier there might be 20 people willing to pay $1,500+. Let's say that's true. Now if the run sells out instantly and half those people don't get a print during the general sale then that means there are ten people willing to pay $1,500 that still want a print. Therefore assuming they buy a print off of the secondary market immediately, it will have "positive flipping value". If it doesn't sell out instantly and everyone willing to pay $1,500+ gets a print, then nobody would pay more than they could buy if from the Gallery for, but certainly would pay less, so you could say it has "negative flipping value". "Instant flipping" (aka flipping) must be thought of in a stochastic scenario (without the passage of time; taking an economic picture so to speak). In a dynamic scenario (involving the passage of time), the supply and demand curves become relevant. But selling something after the passage of time isn't really "flipping".
It's the willingness to pay of each person who wants the print. Someone said earlier there might be 20 people willing to pay $1,500+. Let's say that's true. Now if the run sells out instantly and half those people don't get a print during the general sale then that means there are ten people willing to pay $1,500 that still want a print. Therefore assuming they buy a print off of the secondary market immediately, it will have "positive flipping value". If it doesn't sell out instantly and everyone willing to pay $1,500+ gets a print, then nobody would pay more than they could buy if from the Gallery for, but certainly would pay less, so you could say it has "negative flipping value". "Instant flipping" (aka flipping) must be thought of in a stochastic scenario (without the passage of time; taking an economic picture so to speak). In a dynamic scenario (involving the passage of time), the supply and demand curves become relevant. But selling something after the passage of time isn't really "flipping".
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South Bound
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May 2014
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by South Bound on Jun 4, 2015 2:27:56 GMT 1, I feel pretty confident this print will sell out quickly, BUT not to individuals. They will do what Elephants and Castles did with Ben Eine's "Revolution" print and be divided up amongst other galleries so that PTA can proudly display the sold out gfx on their website (just like E & C did) therefore not harming their's or MH's brand. You will probably see a bunch on the secondary market a week or two after the release.
I feel pretty confident this print will sell out quickly, BUT not to individuals. They will do what Elephants and Castles did with Ben Eine's "Revolution" print and be divided up amongst other galleries so that PTA can proudly display the sold out gfx on their website (just like E & C did) therefore not harming their's or MH's brand. You will probably see a bunch on the secondary market a week or two after the release.
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sohohoho
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April 2011
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by sohohoho on Jun 4, 2015 2:33:50 GMT 1, For this release there's a list of cons the length of ones arm. One look at eBay asking prices and you can see why they've priced it at $1.5k:
www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=maya+hayuk&_sop=3
Doesn't make it right though. Asking prices are exactly that, asking prices. There's a reason why they've all got the option of best offer.
This release has had/will have a negative impact on all concerned (artist, publisher and collector), and I very much doubt it's one step back before two steps forward.
Anyone with an ounce of patience who wants this print will wait to pick one up cheaper in future.
For this release there's a list of cons the length of ones arm. One look at eBay asking prices and you can see why they've priced it at $1.5k: www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&_nkw=maya+hayuk&_sop=3Doesn't make it right though. Asking prices are exactly that, asking prices. There's a reason why they've all got the option of best offer. This release has had/will have a negative impact on all concerned (artist, publisher and collector), and I very much doubt it's one step back before two steps forward. Anyone with an ounce of patience who wants this print will wait to pick one up cheaper in future. |
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bairbl
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May 2015
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by bairbl on Jun 4, 2015 2:40:23 GMT 1, I am just pointing out that the supply/demand curves do not explain flipping profit/loss. If you had all information and created the real, current supply/demand curves, then they would give you the price at which the Gallery could make the most money. If everyone willing to pay above that price point gets a print, it will not flip at a profit. Over time (with art, usually a long time) those supply/demand curves will change.
I am impartial to this print. Not going to buy this one but definitely going to get a Hayuk, possibly an original.
And I agree, fans do not want to see the people they're a fan of attempt to maximize profits. Consider bands that jack up their concert ticket prices like wildfire when they get popular, $400 face value Rolling Stones and The Who tickets right now that sell for less than that on secondary market. Bad for the fans, bad for the bands' (or artists' image), bad for their promoters.
I am just pointing out that the supply/demand curves do not explain flipping profit/loss. If you had all information and created the real, current supply/demand curves, then they would give you the price at which the Gallery could make the most money. If everyone willing to pay above that price point gets a print, it will not flip at a profit. Over time (with art, usually a long time) those supply/demand curves will change.
I am impartial to this print. Not going to buy this one but definitely going to get a Hayuk, possibly an original.
And I agree, fans do not want to see the people they're a fan of attempt to maximize profits. Consider bands that jack up their concert ticket prices like wildfire when they get popular, $400 face value Rolling Stones and The Who tickets right now that sell for less than that on secondary market. Bad for the fans, bad for the bands' (or artists' image), bad for their promoters.
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bairbl
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by bairbl on Jun 4, 2015 2:42:37 GMT 1, And the supply curve is 90. So technically it's a line. A vertical line in classic economics.
And the supply curve is 90. So technically it's a line. A vertical line in classic economics.
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twist65
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November 2008
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by twist65 on Jun 4, 2015 14:16:02 GMT 1, I've kept out of this one, but there seems to be a consensus that if this print doesn't sell out immediately then its a total failure and overpriced, and I don't agree. Not everyone has to price things the way POW do. It seems that most Print Them All prints are more expensive than other editions by the same artist, because of where they are printed/the press used etc. Social Animals currently have 11 JR prints still available, some 4 or 5 years old, classic images, that have been printed at the same place and priced the same way - and I wouldn't call JR a failure, it's just a different way of doing print releases. They will all sell over time, and those that buy them can make a more considered purchase and hang it on their wall, rather than flip-fest bun-fight and off-load a month down the line if the missus doesn't like it..
I suppose it depends how much value you place in the whole Picasso's old Marinoni press thing. And also with Maya Hayuk this print was kind of the result of a residency, not just "bang us over the image via the internet and we'll print some up.." There are costs associated with that too, and if you buy into the kudos and quality of IDEM prints then it surely makes it a more appealing proposition than a "normal" screen print. Personally I thought MH's work was much more suited to screen printing, and I love the POW prints, but from the images i've seen online the print quality does look fantastic. The image isn't for me, I would prefer to hang a smaller POW screenprint on my wall, but comparing the price to past screen prints by different printers/publishers isn't comparing apples with apples, and in general i'd be happy to pay some sort of premium for a print produced in this way by an artist I loved.
I've kept out of this one, but there seems to be a consensus that if this print doesn't sell out immediately then its a total failure and overpriced, and I don't agree. Not everyone has to price things the way POW do. It seems that most Print Them All prints are more expensive than other editions by the same artist, because of where they are printed/the press used etc. Social Animals currently have 11 JR prints still available, some 4 or 5 years old, classic images, that have been printed at the same place and priced the same way - and I wouldn't call JR a failure, it's just a different way of doing print releases. They will all sell over time, and those that buy them can make a more considered purchase and hang it on their wall, rather than flip-fest bun-fight and off-load a month down the line if the missus doesn't like it..
I suppose it depends how much value you place in the whole Picasso's old Marinoni press thing. And also with Maya Hayuk this print was kind of the result of a residency, not just "bang us over the image via the internet and we'll print some up.." There are costs associated with that too, and if you buy into the kudos and quality of IDEM prints then it surely makes it a more appealing proposition than a "normal" screen print. Personally I thought MH's work was much more suited to screen printing, and I love the POW prints, but from the images i've seen online the print quality does look fantastic. The image isn't for me, I would prefer to hang a smaller POW screenprint on my wall, but comparing the price to past screen prints by different printers/publishers isn't comparing apples with apples, and in general i'd be happy to pay some sort of premium for a print produced in this way by an artist I loved.
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bairbl
New Member
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May 2015
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by bairbl on Jun 4, 2015 14:37:08 GMT 1, I'm sure this will look great, and the quality and size does seem superior to your normal LEs. I said before I am indifferent about this one. If my bank account had an extra zero to the right of it I would probably buy one lol. I was simply trying to clarify the supply/demand argument some others were trying to make. Not for this particular print. The theory applies to any release. Good luck today on the release.
P.S. If I was a betting man, and I am, I would bet this sells out. Maybe not instantly. But eventually for sure.
I'm sure this will look great, and the quality and size does seem superior to your normal LEs. I said before I am indifferent about this one. If my bank account had an extra zero to the right of it I would probably buy one lol. I was simply trying to clarify the supply/demand argument some others were trying to make. Not for this particular print. The theory applies to any release. Good luck today on the release.
P.S. If I was a betting man, and I am, I would bet this sells out. Maybe not instantly. But eventually for sure.
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nighthawk
Junior Member
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February 2013
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by nighthawk on Jun 4, 2015 14:50:58 GMT 1, ...but comparing the price to past screen prints by different printers/publishers isn't comparing apples with apples, and in general i'd be happy to pay some sort of premium for a print produced in this way by an artist I loved.
...but comparing the price to past screen prints by different printers/publishers isn't comparing apples with apples, and in general i'd be happy to pay some sort of premium for a print produced in this way by an artist I loved. Very well said, and 100% agree with you. |
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nighthawk
Junior Member
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February 2013
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by nighthawk on Jun 4, 2015 15:54:00 GMT 1, Up where?
Up where?
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rjf76
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January 2015
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by rjf76 on Jun 4, 2015 15:54:53 GMT 1, Up... And Β£10 cheaper than promised
Up... And Β£10 cheaper than promised Cant see it?! |
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cyberkid
Junior Member
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January 2015
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by cyberkid on Jun 4, 2015 15:55:07 GMT 1, yes...can't find it, too.... 
yes...can't find it, too.... |
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rjf76
Junior Member
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January 2015
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by rjf76 on Jun 4, 2015 15:59:48 GMT 1, yes...can't find it, too....
yes...can't find it, too.... Think this might have been a joke! ;( |
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samfrost
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June 2014
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by samfrost on Jun 4, 2015 16:09:09 GMT 1, These guys are really nailing it with the print release once again. Good luck to all on the hunt. I am on the sidelines for this one.
These guys are really nailing it with the print release once again. Good luck to all on the hunt. I am on the sidelines for this one.
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bsimkin
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April 2006
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by bsimkin on Jun 4, 2015 16:21:37 GMT 1, I've kept out of this one, but there seems to be a consensus that if this print doesn't sell out immediately then its a total failure and overpriced, and I don't agree. Not everyone has to price things the way POW do. It seems that most Print Them All prints are more expensive than other editions by the same artist, because of where they are printed/the press used etc. Social Animals currently have 11 JR prints still available, some 4 or 5 years old, classic images, that have been printed at the same place and priced the same way - and I wouldn't call JR a failure, it's just a different way of doing print releases. They will all sell over time, and those that buy them can make a more considered purchase and hang it on their wall, rather than flip-fest bun-fight and off-load a month down the line if the missus doesn't like it.. I suppose it depends how much value you place in the whole Picasso's old Marinoni press thing. And also with Maya Hayuk this print was kind of the result of a residency, not just "bang us over the image via the internet and we'll print some up.." There are costs associated with that too, and if you buy into the kudos and quality of IDEM prints then it surely makes it a more appealing proposition than a "normal" screen print. Personally I thought MH's work was much more suited to screen printing, and I love the POW prints, but from the images i've seen online the print quality does look fantastic. The image isn't for me, I would prefer to hang a smaller POW screenprint on my wall, but comparing the price to past screen prints by different printers/publishers isn't comparing apples with apples, and in general i'd be happy to pay some sort of premium for a print produced in this way by an artist I loved.
There was a time when Banksy prints sat around on POW... for months. And those only cost 75/150 and are some of his most classic images. Not comparing Maya to the legend himself, but just pointing out that an instant sell out on one print isn't going to make or break her career.
I've kept out of this one, but there seems to be a consensus that if this print doesn't sell out immediately then its a total failure and overpriced, and I don't agree. Not everyone has to price things the way POW do. It seems that most Print Them All prints are more expensive than other editions by the same artist, because of where they are printed/the press used etc. Social Animals currently have 11 JR prints still available, some 4 or 5 years old, classic images, that have been printed at the same place and priced the same way - and I wouldn't call JR a failure, it's just a different way of doing print releases. They will all sell over time, and those that buy them can make a more considered purchase and hang it on their wall, rather than flip-fest bun-fight and off-load a month down the line if the missus doesn't like it.. I suppose it depends how much value you place in the whole Picasso's old Marinoni press thing. And also with Maya Hayuk this print was kind of the result of a residency, not just "bang us over the image via the internet and we'll print some up.." There are costs associated with that too, and if you buy into the kudos and quality of IDEM prints then it surely makes it a more appealing proposition than a "normal" screen print. Personally I thought MH's work was much more suited to screen printing, and I love the POW prints, but from the images i've seen online the print quality does look fantastic. The image isn't for me, I would prefer to hang a smaller POW screenprint on my wall, but comparing the price to past screen prints by different printers/publishers isn't comparing apples with apples, and in general i'd be happy to pay some sort of premium for a print produced in this way by an artist I loved. There was a time when Banksy prints sat around on POW... for months. And those only cost 75/150 and are some of his most classic images. Not comparing Maya to the legend himself, but just pointing out that an instant sell out on one print isn't going to make or break her career. |
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randomname
Junior Member
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June 2013
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by randomname on Jun 4, 2015 16:26:54 GMT 1, I saw a post on Instagram saying it would drop at noon GMT. Or three and a half ours ago if I've got my time zones straight.
I saw a post on Instagram saying it would drop at noon GMT. Or three and a half ours ago if I've got my time zones straight.
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bsimkin
New Member
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April 2006
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by bsimkin on Jun 4, 2015 16:28:12 GMT 1, up
up
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natstan
Junior Member
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March 2013
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by natstan on Jun 4, 2015 16:29:21 GMT 1, Just had a look at the site. it says 'true flag' c215... Lol
Just had a look at the site. it says 'true flag' c215... Lol
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jimmy
New Member
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August 2014
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by jimmy on Jun 4, 2015 16:33:01 GMT 1, its up for those looking
its up for those looking
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FΠ―
Full Member
π¨οΈ 8,264
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May 2013
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by FΠ― on Jun 4, 2015 16:34:29 GMT 1, just would like to add this is up.
its up by the way
just would like to add this is up.
its up by the way
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kapusta
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October 2014
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by kapusta on Jun 4, 2015 16:34:54 GMT 1, I'm pretty sure this is now up!
I'm pretty sure this is now up!
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Stender
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December 2009
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by Stender on Jun 4, 2015 16:36:18 GMT 1, it's up and their site will probably be down as at least 3 of you have visited it.
it's up and their site will probably be down as at least 3 of you have visited it.
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Guaanie
Artist
New Member
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February 2013
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by Guaanie on Jun 4, 2015 16:40:06 GMT 1, Seeing it up there on the site has made it hit home - that really is a LOT of money...
Seeing it up there on the site has made it hit home - that really is a LOT of money...
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Deleted
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January 1970
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by Deleted on Jun 4, 2015 16:43:11 GMT 1, Yikes. It's a lot of money for a mediocre print.
Yikes. It's a lot of money for a mediocre print.
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nighthawk
Junior Member
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February 2013
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by nighthawk on Jun 4, 2015 16:44:50 GMT 1, Who's going to be the first to say they purchased one? 
I do like it, but one can only hang so much Maya unfortunately.
Who's going to be the first to say they purchased one? I do like it, but one can only hang so much Maya unfortunately. |
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cyberkid
Junior Member
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January 2015
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by cyberkid on Jun 4, 2015 16:44:57 GMT 1, Yikes. It's a lot of money for a mediocre print.
Yikes. It's a lot of money for a mediocre print. ...and a edition of nearly 100 !! |
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cyberkid
Junior Member
π¨οΈ 2,375
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January 2015
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by cyberkid on Jun 4, 2015 16:47:11 GMT 1, Who's going to be the first to say they purchased one? I do like it, but one can only hang so much Maya unfortunately.
Who's going to be the first to say they purchased one? I do like it, but one can only hang so much Maya unfortunately. i bagged in today a prefab77 Amsterdame GOLD....stunning !! |
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Stender
New Member
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December 2009
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by Stender on Jun 4, 2015 16:47:34 GMT 1, And the inks run.
And the inks run.
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Deleted
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January 1970
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by Deleted on Jun 4, 2015 16:49:48 GMT 1, This is gonna be epic in person! Already have a spot picked out in the new house! Happy Days!
This is gonna be epic in person! Already have a spot picked out in the new house! Happy Days!
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Gatoraide
New Member
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December 2013
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Maya Hayuk πΊπΈ Street Art β’ New Release β’ Art For Sale , by Gatoraide on Jun 4, 2015 16:50:21 GMT 1, I bit the bullet! Confess that I bought one
I bit the bullet! Confess that I bought one
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