Poster Bob
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 5,891
๐๐ป 5,527
September 2013
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AP DN
Dec 9, 2019 18:12:25 GMT 1
AP DN, by Poster Bob on Dec 9, 2019 18:12:25 GMT 1, They are not an AP in any sense and are not more valuable in any way.
They are not an AP in any sense and are not more valuable in any way.
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eyectopus
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,104
๐๐ป 794
June 2008
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AP DN
Dec 9, 2019 18:16:42 GMT 1
via mobile
AP DN, by eyectopus on Dec 9, 2019 18:16:42 GMT 1,
Duplicate Number I think
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Dive Jedi
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 6,194
๐๐ป 9,453
October 2015
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AP DN
Dec 9, 2019 18:18:12 GMT 1
AP DN, by Dive Jedi on Dec 9, 2019 18:18:12 GMT 1, Dual Number
Banksy print were numbered as they were sold, and not with proper administration.
So if they forgot they already sold # 87, they numbered another one #87.
When both requested a PC COA, the second one was named # 87 DN.
Dual Number Banksy print were numbered as they were sold, and not with proper administration. So if they forgot they already sold # 87, they numbered another one #87. When both requested a PC COA, the second one was named # 87 DN. |
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Dive Jedi
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 6,194
๐๐ป 9,453
October 2015
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AP DN
Dec 9, 2019 18:33:21 GMT 1
AP DN, by Dive Jedi on Dec 9, 2019 18:33:21 GMT 1, Thanks. I've never heard of dual or duplicate numbers before. Sounds a bit dodgy to me.
The agency is not called Pest Control for nothing. 
If prints come with a COA from PC the prints themselves are fine.
Thanks. I've never heard of dual or duplicate numbers before. Sounds a bit dodgy to me. The administration was dodgy. The agency is not called Pest Control for nothing. If prints come with a COA from PC the prints themselves are fine. |
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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AP DN
Dec 9, 2019 18:34:18 GMT 1
via mobile
AP DN, by Deleted on Dec 9, 2019 18:34:18 GMT 1, They are perfectly legit. Iโd prefer to not have an AP D/N as I wouldnโt want to share numbers but thatโs just my opinion.
They are perfectly legit. Iโd prefer to not have an AP D/N as I wouldnโt want to share numbers but thatโs just my opinion.
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Pipes
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,438
๐๐ป 2,883
January 2012
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AP DN
Dec 9, 2019 19:18:10 GMT 1
via mobile
AP DN, by Pipes on Dec 9, 2019 19:18:10 GMT 1, Whatโs the print - is it an AP? (A coloured variant) or is the numbering from the normal edition?
Whatโs the print - is it an AP? (A coloured variant) or is the numbering from the normal edition?
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Poster Bob
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 5,891
๐๐ป 5,527
September 2013
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AP DN
Dec 9, 2019 19:38:16 GMT 1
AP DN, by Poster Bob on Dec 9, 2019 19:38:16 GMT 1, They are not an AP in any sense and are not more valuable in any way. COA will say AP though? Do we just disregard that bit?
They are not an AP in any sense and are not more valuable in any way. COA will say AP though? Do we just disregard that bit? Again, they are not an AP in any sense and are not more valuable in any way. |
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Majestic
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,042
๐๐ป 1,462
January 2016
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AP DN
Dec 9, 2019 19:41:32 GMT 1
via mobile
AP DN, by Majestic on Dec 9, 2019 19:41:32 GMT 1, COA will say AP though? Do we just disregard that bit? Again, they are not an AP in any sense and are not more valuable in any way.
Yes we established that bit.
So what does the AP part mean in this instance?
COA will say AP though? Do we just disregard that bit? Again, they are not an AP in any sense and are not more valuable in any way. Yes we established that bit. So what does the AP part mean in this instance? |
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Majestic
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,042
๐๐ป 1,462
January 2016
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AP DN
Dec 9, 2019 19:47:15 GMT 1
via mobile
AP DN, by Majestic on Dec 9, 2019 19:47:15 GMT 1, [br
Link doesn't work buddy
[br Link doesn't work buddy |
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pippyt75
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,010
๐๐ป 1,265
March 2015
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AP DN
Dec 9, 2019 20:57:14 GMT 1
via mobile
AP DN, by pippyt75 on Dec 9, 2019 20:57:14 GMT 1, They should be the same price as a standard edition. End of.
They should be the same price as a standard edition. End of.
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Sundowner
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 4,227
๐๐ป 2,429
September 2008
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AP DN
Dec 11, 2019 13:49:46 GMT 1
AP DN, by Sundowner on Dec 11, 2019 13:49:46 GMT 1, They are perfectly legit. Iโd prefer to not have an AP D/N as I wouldnโt want to share numbers but thatโs just my opinion.
They are perfectly legit. Iโd prefer to not have an AP D/N as I wouldnโt want to share numbers but thatโs just my opinion. Agreed Jonny |
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lv90210
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,030
๐๐ป 1,926
January 2018
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AP DN
Dec 11, 2019 13:53:01 GMT 1
AP DN, by lv90210 on Dec 11, 2019 13:53:01 GMT 1, I've been offered many a 'AP D/N' in my time and have always stayed clear.
There NOT AP's - fact.
They are just duplicates and IMO less desirable as they are mistakes.
I've been offered many a 'AP D/N' in my time and have always stayed clear.
There NOT AP's - fact.
They are just duplicates and IMO less desirable as they are mistakes.
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Graham H
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,304
๐๐ป 2,417
November 2012
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AP DN
Dec 11, 2019 14:25:07 GMT 1
AP DN, by Graham H on Dec 11, 2019 14:25:07 GMT 1, I love looking at my AP DN print.. makes no difference to me..
It doesn't share numbers as its marked with a number and AP D/N.. and they are AP's as they are marked so.. doesnt mean that as an AP they have to be any different than the ' normal ' print.. just like the AP's for Happy Choppers or HAND for example are any different other than numbered and marked as AP from an ' extra' edition
In fact, if pushed, I prefer it as its a bit quirky
I didnt pay a premium, nor did I pay any less than market rate..
Horses for courses.. or, Flower Thrower for DN Flower Thrower in my case.
They are perfectly legit. Iโd prefer to not have an AP D/N as I wouldnโt want to share numbers but thatโs just my opinion.
I love looking at my AP DN print.. makes no difference to me.. It doesn't share numbers as its marked with a number and AP D/N.. and they are AP's as they are marked so.. doesnt mean that as an AP they have to be any different than the ' normal ' print.. just like the AP's for Happy Choppers or HAND for example are any different other than numbered and marked as AP from an ' extra' edition In fact, if pushed, I prefer it as its a bit quirky I didnt pay a premium, nor did I pay any less than market rate.. Horses for courses.. or, Flower Thrower for DN Flower Thrower in my case. They are perfectly legit. Iโd prefer to not have an AP D/N as I wouldnโt want to share numbers but thatโs just my opinion. |
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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AP DN
Dec 11, 2019 17:57:06 GMT 1
AP DN, by Deleted on Dec 11, 2019 17:57:06 GMT 1, Its marked as AP.
I think thats a result for anyone owning one right now.
Its marked as AP.
I think thats a result for anyone owning one right now.
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jarw
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 33
๐๐ป 13
August 2021
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AP DN
Sept 15, 2021 19:26:17 GMT 1
AP DN, by jarw on Sept 15, 2021 19:26:17 GMT 1, there's a Barcode on sotheby's right now....should the DN mistake that Pest Controlled made be a big deal? So they numbered two the same on that lot.....if it affects price what do you think it would go for if it didn't have DN - what % more you think? it's still pest controlled, signed and in good condition...last few auction results were over 100k pound for barcode...if someone can get this for 70k pound probably a good deal? no idea...
there's a Barcode on sotheby's right now....should the DN mistake that Pest Controlled made be a big deal? So they numbered two the same on that lot.....if it affects price what do you think it would go for if it didn't have DN - what % more you think? it's still pest controlled, signed and in good condition...last few auction results were over 100k pound for barcode...if someone can get this for 70k pound probably a good deal? no idea...
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silvermyn
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,612
๐๐ป 781
April 2008
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AP DN
Sept 15, 2021 21:54:22 GMT 1
via mobile
AP DN, by silvermyn on Sept 15, 2021 21:54:22 GMT 1, there's a Barcode on sotheby's right now....should the DN mistake that Pest Controlled made be a big deal?ย So they numbered two the same on that lot.....if it affects price what do you think it would go for if it didn't have DN - what % more you think?ย it's still pest controlled, signed and in good condition...last few auction results were over 100k pound for barcode...if someone can get this for 70k pound probably a good deal?ย no idea...
I'm a bit nerdy so I find this sort of thing quite interesting.
The one currently on at Sotheby's is marked 47/150 DN. It's not marked AP/DN, just DN. That calls into question whether the signed Barcode is indeed an edition of only 150 prints. I would say that unless there is an entire separate edition of 150 signed DNs, then we have to presume that there are at least 151 of the signed prints in the edition including this DN. There is a separate AP edition (if memory serves there were only 2 in the AP edition and they were on a much wider sheet).
We will probably never know how many DNs there are and therefore how many prints there were in the signed edition. For all we know PC could still be issuing DNs for VIPs/friends, but that's just the cynical side of my mind in action rather than based on anything I've seen or heard. However, without a definitive catalogue raisonne I would say it is impossible for the market to be certain.
Will the DN affect the value of this print? I would think not. I suspect the market is driven by condition and authenticity. No two prints will be in the same condition, so if this is a good one then why get hung up on it being a DN? I think I'd be more concerned about having a regular print claiming to be from an edition of 150, knowing full well that with the duplicates there are more than 150 in the edition.
I suspect that most editions have been affected by this issue but prices seem unaffected by the lack of certainty around the true edition size. People picking on the DN being a problem IMHO are really missing the point of the wider issue with the edition size.
there's a Barcode on sotheby's right now....should the DN mistake that Pest Controlled made be a big deal?ย So they numbered two the same on that lot.....if it affects price what do you think it would go for if it didn't have DN - what % more you think?ย it's still pest controlled, signed and in good condition...last few auction results were over 100k pound for barcode...if someone can get this for 70k pound probably a good deal?ย no idea... I'm a bit nerdy so I find this sort of thing quite interesting. The one currently on at Sotheby's is marked 47/150 DN. It's not marked AP/DN, just DN. That calls into question whether the signed Barcode is indeed an edition of only 150 prints. I would say that unless there is an entire separate edition of 150 signed DNs, then we have to presume that there are at least 151 of the signed prints in the edition including this DN. There is a separate AP edition (if memory serves there were only 2 in the AP edition and they were on a much wider sheet). We will probably never know how many DNs there are and therefore how many prints there were in the signed edition. For all we know PC could still be issuing DNs for VIPs/friends, but that's just the cynical side of my mind in action rather than based on anything I've seen or heard. However, without a definitive catalogue raisonne I would say it is impossible for the market to be certain. Will the DN affect the value of this print? I would think not. I suspect the market is driven by condition and authenticity. No two prints will be in the same condition, so if this is a good one then why get hung up on it being a DN? I think I'd be more concerned about having a regular print claiming to be from an edition of 150, knowing full well that with the duplicates there are more than 150 in the edition. I suspect that most editions have been affected by this issue but prices seem unaffected by the lack of certainty around the true edition size. People picking on the DN being a problem IMHO are really missing the point of the wider issue with the edition size. |
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JFCC
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 390
๐๐ป 394
May 2020
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AP DN
Sept 16, 2021 9:54:15 GMT 1
AP DN, by JFCC on Sept 16, 2021 9:54:15 GMT 1, My own view is that a DN is an artist's numbering error caused by Pest Control's poor administration. Sometimes it's the number plus DN other times its AP/DN. Value wise I think it has no effect at all and is perhaps a little quirky reflecting the days when numbering was done in a note book. Personally I steer clear of them, but that is not based on any logic or concern that the edition size is materially effected by them.
A/Ps on the other hand are typically up to 10% of the print run and often quite different to the final print as the artist try's to find the right colour palette and print process consistency.
The Nola APs and Girl With Balloon are an example of finding the right colour palette, where as others are about getting the print process correct. Festival APs are the most obvious example of this. In this case the APs all have a huge colour variation (beige to almost cream), some have print splashes on them, some have the blind stamp and some do not. In essence each is unique.
APs are often numbered differently (A,B,C etc such as Trollys B&W) and signed in different colours.
I personally view all APs as more valuable and will always pay a premium for them.
Finally there are P/Ps which also command a premium as they were gifted to the printers and are even scarcer still, although the variations to final print are less.
My own view is that a DN is an artist's numbering error caused by Pest Control's poor administration. Sometimes it's the number plus DN other times its AP/DN. Value wise I think it has no effect at all and is perhaps a little quirky reflecting the days when numbering was done in a note book. Personally I steer clear of them, but that is not based on any logic or concern that the edition size is materially effected by them.
A/Ps on the other hand are typically up to 10% of the print run and often quite different to the final print as the artist try's to find the right colour palette and print process consistency.
The Nola APs and Girl With Balloon are an example of finding the right colour palette, where as others are about getting the print process correct. Festival APs are the most obvious example of this. In this case the APs all have a huge colour variation (beige to almost cream), some have print splashes on them, some have the blind stamp and some do not. In essence each is unique.
APs are often numbered differently (A,B,C etc such as Trollys B&W) and signed in different colours.
I personally view all APs as more valuable and will always pay a premium for them.
Finally there are P/Ps which also command a premium as they were gifted to the printers and are even scarcer still, although the variations to final print are less.
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jarw
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 33
๐๐ป 13
August 2021
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AP DN
Sept 18, 2021 21:21:20 GMT 1
via mobile
AP DN, by jarw on Sept 18, 2021 21:21:20 GMT 1, Interesting the thought about Pest Control printing and selling DN today for an older print. That was the cynical side of you. For them to do that and then have Banksy sign it with the year of the said print next to the sig would be so misleading and almost in my opinion ruin any credibility they have. It would be so wrong almost criminal in my view. Not sure itโs illegal though. They can print money if they want by just issuing another print if Banksy wanted. Crazy the thought and yes, I supposed they could do that.
Interesting the thought about Pest Control printing and selling DN today for an older print. That was the cynical side of you. For them to do that and then have Banksy sign it with the year of the said print next to the sig would be so misleading and almost in my opinion ruin any credibility they have. It would be so wrong almost criminal in my view. Not sure itโs illegal though. They can print money if they want by just issuing another print if Banksy wanted. Crazy the thought and yes, I supposed they could do that.
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