NOLA
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January 2021
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Christie's Art Auctions , by NOLA on Mar 31, 2021 12:37:07 GMT 1, Christie's have applied the same principle as if a telephone line had dropped out during bidding. They have treated all the bids that have been entered as 'absentee' bids and just opened up the 'telephone lines' again for 48 hours. The problem I see is that many of those bids are not really 'absentee' (max) bids but in response to other bidders so I think the best course of action should have been to start over with all bids removed and extend for a period of time perhaps over the Easter weekend.
Christie's have applied the same principle as if a telephone line had dropped out during bidding. They have treated all the bids that have been entered as 'absentee' bids and just opened up the 'telephone lines' again for 48 hours. The problem I see is that many of those bids are not really 'absentee' (max) bids but in response to other bidders so I think the best course of action should have been to start over with all bids removed and extend for a period of time perhaps over the Easter weekend.
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dzigavertov
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March 2021
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Christie's Art Auctions , by dzigavertov on Mar 31, 2021 12:45:29 GMT 1, woodman I agree with your points - I don't think we have vastly different opinions. I also think Christie's should offer some sort of reduction in fees for both sellers and buyers as way of compensating for the massive anti-climax for the sellers and the buyers. I expected better After anger and bargaining, acceptance finally waits. I feel you, you could have been 20k richer last night (course it's all about the dollar for seller - fuck all else). Hope you get the best outcome From the extension.
woodman I agree with your points - I don't think we have vastly different opinions. I also think Christie's should offer some sort of reduction in fees for both sellers and buyers as way of compensating for the massive anti-climax for the sellers and the buyers. I expected better After anger and bargaining, acceptance finally waits. I feel you, you could have been 20k richer last night (course it's all about the dollar for seller - fuck all else). Hope you get the best outcome From the extension. Not sure I get you there mate - were you a winning bidder? |
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orchid
Junior Member
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May 2018
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Christie's Art Auctions , by orchid on Mar 31, 2021 13:18:34 GMT 1, After anger and bargaining, acceptance finally waits. I feel you, you could have been 20k richer last night (course it's all about the dollar for seller - fuck all else). Hope you get the best outcome From the extension. Not sure I get you there mate - were you a winning bidder?ย
You were happy and accepting and now bitter and angry. That's understandable, mate. Hope you do better with the extension. Stay happy ๐ค
After anger and bargaining, acceptance finally waits. I feel you, you could have been 20k richer last night (course it's all about the dollar for seller - fuck all else). Hope you get the best outcome From the extension. Not sure I get you there mate - were you a winning bidder?ย You were happy and accepting and now bitter and angry. That's understandable, mate. Hope you do better with the extension. Stay happy ๐ค |
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Cocteau 101
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January 2007
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Christie's Art Auctions , by Cocteau 101 on Mar 31, 2021 14:27:02 GMT 1, Has someone got the condition report for GWB unsigned.
Has someone got the condition report for GWB unsigned.
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marquis
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January 2020
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Christie's Art Auctions , by marquis on Mar 31, 2021 14:30:46 GMT 1, Has someone got the condition report for Girl With Balloon unsigned.
- the full sheet
- the screenprinted surface is in very good condition, with no apparent scuffs
- the sheet has been overmounted, resulting in slightly noticeable bands of discolouration at the sheet edges (the original paper tone). The discolouration measures approximately 50 mm. above, and 5 mm. at left, right and below [please ask the department for images]
- there is a tiny handling crease to the right of the girl (only visible in a raking light)
- the sheet is hinged with two paper hinges at the upper sheet edge on the reverse
Otherwise as described in the catalogue and in very good condition.
This work is offered framed. The frame is a metal 'Art Republic' frame. Framed with Glass.
Has someone got the condition report for Girl With Balloon unsigned. - the full sheet - the screenprinted surface is in very good condition, with no apparent scuffs - the sheet has been overmounted, resulting in slightly noticeable bands of discolouration at the sheet edges (the original paper tone). The discolouration measures approximately 50 mm. above, and 5 mm. at left, right and below [please ask the department for images] - there is a tiny handling crease to the right of the girl (only visible in a raking light) - the sheet is hinged with two paper hinges at the upper sheet edge on the reverse Otherwise as described in the catalogue and in very good condition. This work is offered framed. The frame is a metal 'Art Republic' frame. Framed with Glass. |
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dzigavertov
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๐จ๏ธ 42
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March 2021
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Christie's Art Auctions , by dzigavertov on Mar 31, 2021 14:39:03 GMT 1, Not sure I get you there mate - were you a winning bidder? You were happy and accepting and now bitter and angry. That's understandable, mate. Hope you do better with the extension. Stay happy ๐ค
And certainly not angry  Cheers for the good wishes
Not sure I get you there mate - were you a winning bidder? You were happy and accepting and now bitter and angry. That's understandable, mate. Hope you do better with the extension. Stay happy ๐ค I am not bitter at all fella, far from it, I admit I am disappointed with the way the sale fizzled out and then started again, but no bitterness whatsoever. Not sure where you get that from tbh. I do think the thing has been poorly delivered by Christie's....but I am still very happy to be about to make a cracking wedge on the 75 quid I spent on it in the first place. And certainly not angry Cheers for the good wishes |
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GMA
Junior Member
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October 2015
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Christie's Art Auctions , by GMA on Mar 31, 2021 14:44:55 GMT 1, You were happy and accepting and now bitter and angry. That's understandable, mate. Hope you do better with the extension. Stay happy ๐ค I am not bitter at all fella, far from it, I admit I am disappointed with the way the sale fizzled out and then started again, but no bitterness whatsoever. Not sure where you get that from tbh. I do think the thing has been poorly delivered by Christie's....but I am still very happy to be about to make a cracking wedge on the 75 quid I spent on it in the first place. And certainly not angry Cheers for the good wishes
If you wanted, could you potentially pull it out of the auction and do it another time? I don't know your circumstances, I don't know the piece either but I think if it was me, I'd be considering that. But only if there weren't any penalties for doing it.
You were happy and accepting and now bitter and angry. That's understandable, mate. Hope you do better with the extension. Stay happy ๐ค I am not bitter at all fella, far from it, I admit I am disappointed with the way the sale fizzled out and then started again, but no bitterness whatsoever. Not sure where you get that from tbh. I do think the thing has been poorly delivered by Christie's....but I am still very happy to be about to make a cracking wedge on the 75 quid I spent on it in the first place. And certainly not angry Cheers for the good wishes If you wanted, could you potentially pull it out of the auction and do it another time? I don't know your circumstances, I don't know the piece either but I think if it was me, I'd be considering that. But only if there weren't any penalties for doing it. |
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Pattycakes
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June 2007
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Christie's Art Auctions , by Pattycakes on Mar 31, 2021 14:56:11 GMT 1, woodman I agree with your points - I don't think we have vastly different opinions. I also think Christie's should offer some sort of reduction in fees for both sellers and buyers as way of compensating for the massive anti-climax for everyone involved. I expected better
woodman I agree with your points - I don't think we have vastly different opinions. I also think Christie's should offer some sort of reduction in fees for both sellers and buyers as way of compensating for the massive anti-climax for everyone involved. I expected better Really depends what they are charging you, if your on 0 or near to it then there isn't much they can offer. The fact the sale went spectacularly wrong is deeply unfortunate but inevitable given the system both they and Sotheby's use. If there had been a live sale albeit online, with only online bidding like the vast majority of auction houses do now then this would not have happened. |
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dzigavertov
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๐จ๏ธ 42
๐๐ป 108
March 2021
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Christie's Art Auctions , by dzigavertov on Mar 31, 2021 16:13:01 GMT 1, woodman I agree with your points - I don't think we have vastly different opinions. I also think Christie's should offer some sort of reduction in fees for both sellers and buyers as way of compensating for the massive anti-climax for everyone involved. I expected better Really depends what they are charging you, if your on 0 or near to it then there isn't much they can offer. The fact the sale went spectacularly wrong is deeply unfortunate but inevitable given the system both they and Sotheby's use. If there had been a live sale albeit online, with only online bidding like the vast majority of auction houses do now then this would not have happened.
woodman I agree with your points - I don't think we have vastly different opinions. I also think Christie's should offer some sort of reduction in fees for both sellers and buyers as way of compensating for the massive anti-climax for everyone involved. I expected better Really depends what they are charging you, if your on 0 or near to it then there isn't much they can offer. The fact the sale went spectacularly wrong is deeply unfortunate but inevitable given the system both they and Sotheby's use. If there had been a live sale albeit online, with only online bidding like the vast majority of auction houses do now then this would not have happened. Sellers fees are 10% on anything under 60k |
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Wendero
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๐จ๏ธ 537
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January 2021
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Christie's Art Auctions , by Wendero on Mar 31, 2021 16:30:40 GMT 1, 10% sellers fee...what a steal
people either decide to sell via auction house and get 10% of the final price withheld .... or they decide to sell privately BUT pretending to sell like an auction house (then asking: BP / VAT / ARR)
fucking auction houses
10% sellers fee...what a steal
people either decide to sell via auction house and get 10% of the final price withheld .... or they decide to sell privately BUT pretending to sell like an auction house (then asking: BP / VAT / ARR)
fucking auction houses
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gross
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๐จ๏ธ 180
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January 2020
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Christie's Art Auctions , by gross on Mar 31, 2021 16:43:41 GMT 1, Really depends what they are charging you, if your on 0 or near to it then there isn't much they can offer. The fact the sale went spectacularly wrong is deeply unfortunate but inevitable given the system both they and Sotheby's use. ย If there had been a live sale albeit online, with only online bidding like the vast majority of auction houses do now then this would not have happened.ย Sellers fees are 10% on anything under 60k
I have never paid to sale with them
Really depends what they are charging you, if your on 0 or near to it then there isn't much they can offer. The fact the sale went spectacularly wrong is deeply unfortunate but inevitable given the system both they and Sotheby's use. ย If there had been a live sale albeit online, with only online bidding like the vast majority of auction houses do now then this would not have happened.ย Sellers fees are 10% on anything under 60k I have never paid to sale with them |
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theclash
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May 2020
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Christie's Art Auctions , by theclash on Mar 31, 2021 16:55:03 GMT 1, Sellers fees are 10% on anything under 60k I have never paid to sale with them
This is one area the forum can add value, understanding where you can squeeze the intermediaries to
Sellers fees are 10% on anything under 60k I have never paid to sale with them This is one area the forum can add value, understanding where you can squeeze the intermediaries to |
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lv90210
Junior Member
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January 2018
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Christie's Art Auctions , by lv90210 on Mar 31, 2021 17:01:18 GMT 1, Really depends what they are charging you, if your on 0 or near to it then there isn't much they can offer. The fact the sale went spectacularly wrong is deeply unfortunate but inevitable given the system both they and Sotheby's use. If there had been a live sale albeit online, with only online bidding like the vast majority of auction houses do now then this would not have happened. Sellers fees are 10% on anything under 60k
Really depends what they are charging you, if your on 0 or near to it then there isn't much they can offer. The fact the sale went spectacularly wrong is deeply unfortunate but inevitable given the system both they and Sotheby's use. If there had been a live sale albeit online, with only online bidding like the vast majority of auction houses do now then this would not have happened. Sellers fees are 10% on anything under 60k If you have agreed to pay them 10% to sell your print they have pulled your pants down then pushed you onto a bush of nettles..... |
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dzigavertov
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March 2021
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Christie's Art Auctions , by dzigavertov on Mar 31, 2021 17:33:20 GMT 1, Sellers fees are 10% on anything under 60k If you have agreed to pay them 10% to sell your print they have pulled your pants down then pushed you onto a bush of nettles.....
Sellers fees are 10% on anything under 60k If you have agreed to pay them 10% to sell your print they have pulled your pants down then pushed you onto a bush of nettles..... I never expected anyone to sell something of mine and not receive payment. After some rudimentary searches beforehand, it seemed this is around the going rate for selling a single print at auction. |
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Spenie
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November 2014
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Christie's Art Auctions , by Spenie on Mar 31, 2021 17:48:09 GMT 1, Not for a Banksy print, most offer no fees, they make enough with the buyers premium.
Not for a Banksy print, most offer no fees, they make enough with the buyers premium.
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Christie's Art Auctions , by Lord Lucas Roham on Mar 31, 2021 17:54:20 GMT 1, If you have agreed to pay them 10% to sell your print they have pulled your pants down then pushed you onto a bush of nettles.....ย I never expected anyone to sell something of mine and not receive payment. After some rudimentary searches beforehand, it seemed this is around the going rate for selling a single print at auction.
You can negotiate quite easily.
If you have agreed to pay them 10% to sell your print they have pulled your pants down then pushed you onto a bush of nettles.....ย I never expected anyone to sell something of mine and not receive payment. After some rudimentary searches beforehand, it seemed this is around the going rate for selling a single print at auction. You can negotiate quite easily. |
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Spenie
Junior Member
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November 2014
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Christie's Art Auctions , by Spenie on Mar 31, 2021 19:36:28 GMT 1, Not for a Banksy print, most offer no fees, they make enough with the buyers premium. Is this through your experience or what you've read on this forum? 
Not for a Banksy print, most offer no fees, they make enough with the buyers premium. Is this through your experience or what you've read on this forum? Experience. Don't believe a lot of what I read on here |
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Lazarus II
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August 2019
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Christie's Art Auctions , by Lazarus II on Mar 31, 2021 20:21:07 GMT 1, Is this through your experience or what you've read on this forum? Experience. Don't believe a lot of what I read on hereย
BOOM BOOM !
Is this through your experience or what you've read on this forum? Experience. Don't believe a lot of what I read on hereย BOOM BOOM ! |
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robo
Junior Member
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November 2006
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Christie's Art Auctions , by robo on Mar 31, 2021 22:52:50 GMT 1, Not for a Banksy print, most offer no fees, they make enough with the buyers premium.
I think small or medium houses do; the big ones will lower fees but not drop em entirely IMHO.
Not for a Banksy print, most offer no fees, they make enough with the buyers premium. I think small or medium houses do; the big ones will lower fees but not drop em entirely IMHO. |
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LJCal
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December 2019
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Christie's Art Auctions , by LJCal on Mar 31, 2021 23:37:18 GMT 1, If you have agreed to pay them 10% to sell your print they have pulled your pants down then pushed you onto a bush of nettles..... I never expected anyone to sell something of mine and not receive payment. After some rudimentary searches beforehand, it seemed this is around the going rate for selling a single print at auction.
If you have agreed to pay them 10% to sell your print they have pulled your pants down then pushed you onto a bush of nettles..... I never expected anyone to sell something of mine and not receive payment. After some rudimentary searches beforehand, it seemed this is around the going rate for selling a single print at auction. Theyโre not they get 25% buyers premium theyโre making an absolute killing, and for the lot your selling max should be 5% if youโre a repeat seller it should be zero, this is why Iโve never sold with Christieโs. |
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bob60
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May 2014
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Christie's Art Auctions , by bob60 on Apr 1, 2021 6:02:40 GMT 1, If you have agreed to pay them 10% to sell your print they have pulled your pants down then pushed you onto a bush of nettles..... I never expected anyone to sell something of mine and not receive payment. After some rudimentary searches beforehand, it seemed this is around the going rate for selling a single print at auction.
If you have agreed to pay them 10% to sell your print they have pulled your pants down then pushed you onto a bush of nettles..... I never expected anyone to sell something of mine and not receive payment. After some rudimentary searches beforehand, it seemed this is around the going rate for selling a single print at auction. If I was you I would have tried to withdraw my print after this fiasco, and I really don't want to make you feel bad but it does sound like you are paying way too much commission to sell. |
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lv90210
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,030
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January 2018
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Christie's Art Auctions , by lv90210 on Apr 1, 2021 8:37:39 GMT 1, Christies all over the place yet again this morning, I'd be very worried if I had any skin in this game either way today.
Cowboy central.
Christies all over the place yet again this morning, I'd be very worried if I had any skin in this game either way today.
Cowboy central.
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robo
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,582
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November 2006
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Christie's Art Auctions , by robo on Apr 1, 2021 8:46:08 GMT 1, Christies all over the place yet again this morning, I'd be very worried if I had any skin in this game either way today.ย Cowboy central.
You seem to be the only one stressing today and yesterday. Hoping to put people off bidding so you can snap em up, eh? ๐
Christies all over the place yet again this morning, I'd be very worried if I had any skin in this game either way today.ย Cowboy central. You seem to be the only one stressing today and yesterday. Hoping to put people off bidding so you can snap em up, eh? ๐ |
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Hubble Bubble
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December 2010
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Christie's Art Auctions , by Hubble Bubble on Apr 1, 2021 8:58:51 GMT 1, Christies all over the place yet again this morning, I'd be very worried if I had any skin in this game either way today. Cowboy central.
Christies all over the place yet again this morning, I'd be very worried if I had any skin in this game either way today. Cowboy central. Why, what's been happening? I just check the bids which don't seem to have moved |
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wave
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March 2007
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Christie's Art Auctions , by wave on Apr 1, 2021 9:10:49 GMT 1, Bit of a minefielld understanding the โadditionalโ costs of auction houses. So in the case of say Very Little Helps that originally hammered at 75k but the โsoldโ price listed was 93,750k (BP 25%). What does the seller actually end up getting?
Bit of a minefielld understanding the โadditionalโ costs of auction houses. So in the case of say Very Little Helps that originally hammered at 75k but the โsoldโ price listed was 93,750k (BP 25%). What does the seller actually end up getting?
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lv90210
Junior Member
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January 2018
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Christie's Art Auctions , by lv90210 on Apr 1, 2021 9:12:11 GMT 1, Christies all over the place yet again this morning, I'd be very worried if I had any skin in this game either way today. Cowboy central. You seem to be the only one stressing today and yesterday. Hoping to put people off bidding so you can snap em up, eh? ๐
Christies all over the place yet again this morning, I'd be very worried if I had any skin in this game either way today. Cowboy central. You seem to be the only one stressing today and yesterday. Hoping to put people off bidding so you can snap em up, eh? ๐ shhhhhh |
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Rubberneck
Junior Member
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October 2018
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Christie's Art Auctions , by Rubberneck on Apr 1, 2021 9:12:52 GMT 1, Christies all over the place yet again this morning, I'd be very worried if I had any skin in this game either way today. Cowboy central. You seem to be the only one stressing today and yesterday. Hoping to put people off bidding so you can snap em up, eh? ๐
Christies all over the place yet again this morning, I'd be very worried if I had any skin in this game either way today. Cowboy central. You seem to be the only one stressing today and yesterday. Hoping to put people off bidding so you can snap em up, eh? ๐ Is it working though? lots ended already seemingly .. |
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lv90210
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,030
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January 2018
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Christie's Art Auctions , by lv90210 on Apr 1, 2021 9:16:24 GMT 1, You seem to be the only one stressing today and yesterday. Hoping to put people off bidding so you can snap em up, eh? ๐ Is it working though? lots ended already seemingly ..
You seem to be the only one stressing today and yesterday. Hoping to put people off bidding so you can snap em up, eh? ๐ Is it working though? lots ended already seemingly .. what a mess. |
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Hubble Bubble
Junior Member
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December 2010
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Christie's Art Auctions , by Hubble Bubble on Apr 1, 2021 9:32:33 GMT 1, Bit of a minefielld understanding the โadditionalโ costs of auction houses. So in the case of say Very Little Helps that originally hammered at 75k but the โsoldโ price listed was 93,750k (BP 25%). What does the seller actually end up getting? This correct? Seller would get 67,500k? (Based in 10% seller fee on 75k) Auction house pockets the 26k+?
When you sell at auction the defacto position is that you pay the auction house 10% of the hammer (bid) price. So if a buyer bids ยฃ50k then you net ยฃ45k and the house gets ยฃ5k. In reality this is usually negotiable as has been discussed above.
When you buy at auction you bid using the hammer price. So you bid ยฃ50k for a piece. There are add ons. These vary from house to house but are often broadly similar. On a piece of ยฃ50k there would be a 25% premium to pay (commission). So that's ยฃ12.5k. In addition to this there is VAT on the commission. That's 20% of 25% (so 5% of the hammer). Some online auctions charge 1% extra. Some artists in some territories attract ARR (Artist Resale Rights) where 4% on the first 50k (Euros) of the hammer price is paid to the artist... this then slides back to a lower scale as the price of the work climbs. So, any buyer needs to factor in the fact that what they are bidding for the work is only a part of what they will pay for it.
Going back to the ยฃ50k bid. In the instance cited above, for an artist that attracts ARR, an extra 35% will be payable. 34% if the auction is in a saleroom. So, ยฃ50k x 35% = ยฃ17,500. This means the buyer will need to pay the auction house ยฃ67,500 to acquire the piece and the seller will receive ยฃ45,000.
I'm sure someone will let me know if I've got the numbers wrong (notwithstanding the Euro to Sterling assumption of equality on the ARR bit).
Bit of a minefielld understanding the โadditionalโ costs of auction houses. So in the case of say Very Little Helps that originally hammered at 75k but the โsoldโ price listed was 93,750k (BP 25%). What does the seller actually end up getting? This correct? Seller would get 67,500k? (Based in 10% seller fee on 75k) Auction house pockets the 26k+? Not a minefield really and we should have a sticky thread on the forum for this I think @silky ? When you sell at auction the defacto position is that you pay the auction house 10% of the hammer (bid) price. So if a buyer bids ยฃ50k then you net ยฃ45k and the house gets ยฃ5k. In reality this is usually negotiable as has been discussed above. When you buy at auction you bid using the hammer price. So you bid ยฃ50k for a piece. There are add ons. These vary from house to house but are often broadly similar. On a piece of ยฃ50k there would be a 25% premium to pay (commission). So that's ยฃ12.5k. In addition to this there is VAT on the commission. That's 20% of 25% (so 5% of the hammer). Some online auctions charge 1% extra. Some artists in some territories attract ARR (Artist Resale Rights) where 4% on the first 50k (Euros) of the hammer price is paid to the artist... this then slides back to a lower scale as the price of the work climbs. So, any buyer needs to factor in the fact that what they are bidding for the work is only a part of what they will pay for it. Going back to the ยฃ50k bid. In the instance cited above, for an artist that attracts ARR, an extra 35% will be payable. 34% if the auction is in a saleroom. So, ยฃ50k x 35% = ยฃ17,500. This means the buyer will need to pay the auction house ยฃ67,500 to acquire the piece and the seller will receive ยฃ45,000. I'm sure someone will let me know if I've got the numbers wrong (notwithstanding the Euro to Sterling assumption of equality on the ARR bit). |
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Reader
Junior Member
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June 2016
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Christie's Art Auctions , by Reader on Apr 1, 2021 9:42:39 GMT 1, Bit of a minefielld understanding the โadditionalโ costs of auction houses. So in the case of say Very Little Helps that originally hammered at 75k but the โsoldโ price listed was 93,750k (BP 25%). What does the seller actually end up getting?
Bit of a minefielld understanding the โadditionalโ costs of auction houses. So in the case of say Very Little Helps that originally hammered at 75k but the โsoldโ price listed was 93,750k (BP 25%). What does the seller actually end up getting? The VLH is part of a larger consignment so has 0% to pay from the hammer unless it breaks the "high" estimate, it which case they will pay a performance fee of 1%. The difference between the "hammer price" and the sold price, goes to the auction house. |
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Cheers for the good wishes
