mission
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November 2019
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by mission on Jun 9, 2023 16:57:25 GMT 1,
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mission
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 277
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November 2019
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by mission on Jun 9, 2023 17:02:09 GMT 1, I thought it appropriate to let you know about issues I am having with Graffik Gallery and Ollie Cox. I bought these two Invader street pieces from them last year. However, after contacting Invader, i have been advised that they are fake and Graffik are refusing to refund me what I paid. Invader has confirmed that โ they are (in his words) โabsolutely fakeโ and are โjust a few tiles bought and assembledโ. I know that street artists donโt like their art being removed from the street and I understand that โ and Invader was very clear about that aspect and how it destroys the street aspect when removed. But he was also very clear that he didnโt assemble or place the tiles the art that Graffik had sold me โ and that whoever was selling it would know that.
When I spoke to Graffik, they initially agreed to refund but then they changed their mind because, so they said, the gallery didnโt have the cash available which, by itself raises other questions especially as Ollie stated that he โneeded the money [from the sale] to keep the gallery afloatโ.
I am disappointed by Graffikโs response. The invoice clearly stated that the art that was by Invader but Graffik also hold themselves out as experts in Invader street art โthe gallery is described as having โcarved a master statusโ and having โexpertiseโ in โthe realm of street artโ. Additionally, Invader is listed as one of the galleryโs main artists (https://shop.graffikgallery.co.uk/collections/invader-art).
I purchased these for my own private collection, due to spiralling prices on his Alias works....I have been offered 5 figures ยฃยฃ for them but have chosen to speak out instead against this Gallery, as i am aware they are and have sold other street works by Invader...in fact numerous .
I understand that i should never have purchased them in the first place but hey....BIG MISTAKE...
I thought it appropriate to let you know about issues I am having with Graffik Gallery and Ollie Cox. I bought these two Invader street pieces from them last year. However, after contacting Invader, i have been advised that they are fake and Graffik are refusing to refund me what I paid. Invader has confirmed that โ they are (in his words) โabsolutely fakeโ and are โjust a few tiles bought and assembledโ. I know that street artists donโt like their art being removed from the street and I understand that โ and Invader was very clear about that aspect and how it destroys the street aspect when removed. But he was also very clear that he didnโt assemble or place the tiles the art that Graffik had sold me โ and that whoever was selling it would know that.
When I spoke to Graffik, they initially agreed to refund but then they changed their mind because, so they said, the gallery didnโt have the cash available which, by itself raises other questions especially as Ollie stated that he โneeded the money [from the sale] to keep the gallery afloatโ.
I am disappointed by Graffikโs response. The invoice clearly stated that the art that was by Invader but Graffik also hold themselves out as experts in Invader street art โthe gallery is described as having โcarved a master statusโ and having โexpertiseโ in โthe realm of street artโ. Additionally, Invader is listed as one of the galleryโs main artists (https://shop.graffikgallery.co.uk/collections/invader-art).
I purchased these for my own private collection, due to spiralling prices on his Alias works....I have been offered 5 figures ยฃยฃ for them but have chosen to speak out instead against this Gallery, as i am aware they are and have sold other street works by Invader...in fact numerous .
I understand that i should never have purchased them in the first place but hey....BIG MISTAKE...
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Deleted on Jun 9, 2023 17:12:50 GMT 1, Buy street art , get burnt.
Buy street art , get burnt.
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Masong
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,223
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March 2017
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Masong on Jun 9, 2023 17:24:51 GMT 1, If I was invader I would deny that they were anything to do with me even if they were mine. It would be my lesson to people not to remove them from the street which is where they were meant to be.
If I was invader I would deny that they were anything to do with me even if they were mine. It would be my lesson to people not to remove them from the street which is where they were meant to be.
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Georgie Poppit
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,558
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February 2021
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Georgie Poppit on Jun 9, 2023 17:35:03 GMT 1, Sounds like the fault is with the gallery selling products which arenโt as advertised - theyโre selling them as Invaderโs work which they are not regardless of how they were acquired.
Sounds like the fault is with the gallery selling products which arenโt as advertised - theyโre selling them as Invaderโs work which they are not regardless of how they were acquired.
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by concrete jungle on Jun 9, 2023 17:46:00 GMT 1, Dealt with Ollie back in the day and found him decent enough - actually sold him a sizeable Invader print at one point and all went well. Times probably hard enough for galleries at the minute - but alarm bells should have been ringing on any sort of Invader street pieces (same for Banksy) - thereโs enough info on here to raise the red flags. That being said Iโd agree that if this is mis sold (which it appears to be) a full refund should be forthcoming, cash flow issues or not. The alternative might be accepting a return payment plan, or some other piece in stock in lieu, but thatโs if you are feeling generous. Pretty sure you can go the legal route on this, but probably not ideal for you or the galleryโฆ..
Dealt with Ollie back in the day and found him decent enough - actually sold him a sizeable Invader print at one point and all went well. Times probably hard enough for galleries at the minute - but alarm bells should have been ringing on any sort of Invader street pieces (same for Banksy) - thereโs enough info on here to raise the red flags. That being said Iโd agree that if this is mis sold (which it appears to be) a full refund should be forthcoming, cash flow issues or not. The alternative might be accepting a return payment plan, or some other piece in stock in lieu, but thatโs if you are feeling generous. Pretty sure you can go the legal route on this, but probably not ideal for you or the galleryโฆ..
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mission
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 277
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November 2019
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by mission on Jun 9, 2023 17:54:35 GMT 1, Lawyers involved itโs going to Court!! I agree with everything above but these were sold as โ1000%โ real and โas good as it getsโ by Graffik .. with regards to street works .. extremely disappointing that he is unwilling to address the situation .
Lawyers involved itโs going to Court!! I agree with everything above but these were sold as โ1000%โ real and โas good as it getsโ by Graffik .. with regards to street works .. extremely disappointing that he is unwilling to address the situation .
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Masong
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,223
๐๐ป 2,887
March 2017
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Masong on Jun 9, 2023 18:05:49 GMT 1, Lawyers involved itโs going to Court!! I agree with everything above but these were sold as โ1000%โ real and โas good as it getsโ by Graffik .. with regards to street works .. extremely disappointing that he is unwilling to address the situation . It sounds like youโre not being demanding enough with the gallery. You have the best evidence in your favour, that they are not real direct from the artist. Calling them out on here might not be beneficial in your favour for a fast resolve.
Lawyers involved itโs going to Court!! I agree with everything above but these were sold as โ1000%โ real and โas good as it getsโ by Graffik .. with regards to street works .. extremely disappointing that he is unwilling to address the situation . It sounds like youโre not being demanding enough with the gallery. You have the best evidence in your favour, that they are not real direct from the artist. Calling them out on here might not be beneficial in your favour for a fast resolve.
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mission
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 277
๐๐ป 394
November 2019
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by mission on Jun 9, 2023 18:09:12 GMT 1, They have blocked me on every channel , they have not replied to my Solicitors letters , they donโt take calls .. Iโm pretty much done with trying .. I need to be careful what I say on here for legal reasons But I can certainly state the facts !!
They have blocked me on every channel , they have not replied to my Solicitors letters , they donโt take calls .. Iโm pretty much done with trying .. I need to be careful what I say on here for legal reasons But I can certainly state the facts !!
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Charlie Bronson on Jun 9, 2023 18:10:51 GMT 1, No matter the galleryโs financial situation, as soon as it was proven these are fake, they shouldโve refunded your money. What an absolute shit move by graffik. I just came across several posts about this on IG; their name is forever tarnished, and by not making this right, rightfully so.
No matter the galleryโs financial situation, as soon as it was proven these are fake, they shouldโve refunded your money. What an absolute shit move by graffik. I just came across several posts about this on IG; their name is forever tarnished, and by not making this right, rightfully so.
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Loobaz
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 321
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July 2011
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Loobaz on Jun 9, 2023 18:33:07 GMT 1, It'd be interesting to know the gallery's story as to where, and from whom, they were obtained.
Surely, there would have to be a paper trail in that regard for accounting purposes, and if not, you'd have to wonder who was putting them together in the first place?
Hope it gets resolved quickly mission.
It'd be interesting to know the gallery's story as to where, and from whom, they were obtained. Surely, there would have to be a paper trail in that regard for accounting purposes, and if not, you'd have to wonder who was putting them together in the first place? Hope it gets resolved quickly mission.
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by John The Badgers on Jun 9, 2023 19:00:38 GMT 1, Thank you for your honesty Mission, and really sorry to hear of this issue.
Just my input, but my main concern is if they were 'requiring the funds to stay afloat', a real chance they would declare bankruptcy in advance of paying any of their debtors, yourself included.
I would be going in as fast, and as 'hard' as possible to get what is owed to you before they potentially do this. All the signs are there for this to happen.
All the best with sorting.
Thank you for your honesty Mission, and really sorry to hear of this issue.
Just my input, but my main concern is if they were 'requiring the funds to stay afloat', a real chance they would declare bankruptcy in advance of paying any of their debtors, yourself included.
I would be going in as fast, and as 'hard' as possible to get what is owed to you before they potentially do this. All the signs are there for this to happen.
All the best with sorting.
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mission
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 277
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November 2019
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by mission on Jun 9, 2023 19:06:09 GMT 1, Thanks .. Iโm also posting in case anyone has consigned artworks to them ..
Thanks .. Iโm also posting in case anyone has consigned artworks to them ..
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by John The Badgers on Jun 9, 2023 19:26:38 GMT 1, Nice one Mission.
Just to add to the above, you could instigate a claim yourself via The Small Claims Court? This I have personally found to be a very effective, cost effective, way of getting what is owed.
All the best with sorting.
Nice one Mission.
Just to add to the above, you could instigate a claim yourself via The Small Claims Court? This I have personally found to be a very effective, cost effective, way of getting what is owed.
All the best with sorting.
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Wanchope
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,499
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February 2020
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Wanchope on Jun 9, 2023 19:48:33 GMT 1, Sorry for you mission, whilst like most I donโt agree with street pieces being removed and sold, they have properly and royally fxxxed up here! What also annoys me, and this goes for a lot of modern day twats, if you canโt afford your lifestyle then donโt live that kind of life. I own a business and could rinse my bank account like lots of my competitors but I donโt because you need to keep a buffer zone and when they all die of death I will still be fighting strong. So basically I canโt stand the response of โcanโt afford to refund youโ. Everyone nowadays think they can open and run a business but few have the accumen or will power to say Iโll earn the right to have x y or z. Sorry for the rant but this story has properly hit a nerve and am sorry for you mission!
Hope it al works out
Sorry for you mission, whilst like most I donโt agree with street pieces being removed and sold, they have properly and royally fxxxed up here! What also annoys me, and this goes for a lot of modern day twats, if you canโt afford your lifestyle then donโt live that kind of life. I own a business and could rinse my bank account like lots of my competitors but I donโt because you need to keep a buffer zone and when they all die of death I will still be fighting strong. So basically I canโt stand the response of โcanโt afford to refund youโ. Everyone nowadays think they can open and run a business but few have the accumen or will power to say Iโll earn the right to have x y or z. Sorry for the rant but this story has properly hit a nerve and am sorry for you mission!
Hope it al works out
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artlife11
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 372
๐๐ป 239
January 2020
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by artlife11 on Jun 9, 2023 19:57:07 GMT 1, Sorry for you mission, whilst like most I donโt agree with street pieces being removed and sold, they have properly and royally fxxxed up here! What also annoys me, and this goes for a lot of modern day twats, if you canโt afford your lifestyle then donโt live that kind of life. I own a business and could rinse my bank account like lots of my competitors but I donโt because you need to keep a buffer zone and when they all die of death I will still be fighting strong. So basically I canโt stand the response of โcanโt afford to refund youโ. Everyone nowadays think they can open and run a business but few have the accumen or will power to say Iโll earn the right to have x y or z. Sorry for the rant but this story has properly hit a nerve and am sorry for you mission! Hope it al works out Lots to come out hear. Im going to get some popcorn. small claims is much easier now and costs less than ยฃ100 I think. I donโt think graffikโs will survive this for many reasons
Sorry for you mission, whilst like most I donโt agree with street pieces being removed and sold, they have properly and royally fxxxed up here! What also annoys me, and this goes for a lot of modern day twats, if you canโt afford your lifestyle then donโt live that kind of life. I own a business and could rinse my bank account like lots of my competitors but I donโt because you need to keep a buffer zone and when they all die of death I will still be fighting strong. So basically I canโt stand the response of โcanโt afford to refund youโ. Everyone nowadays think they can open and run a business but few have the accumen or will power to say Iโll earn the right to have x y or z. Sorry for the rant but this story has properly hit a nerve and am sorry for you mission! Hope it al works out Lots to come out hear. Im going to get some popcorn. small claims is much easier now and costs less than ยฃ100 I think. I donโt think graffikโs will survive this for many reasons
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orchid
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,464
๐๐ป 1,150
May 2018
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by orchid on Jun 9, 2023 20:14:26 GMT 1, I don't get why the gallery's financial situation is relevant? Start a claim.
I don't get why the gallery's financial situation is relevant? Start a claim.
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Deleted on Jun 9, 2023 20:59:18 GMT 1, Because they are obviously going to go into administration and there will be no money coming back.,
you canโt get blood from a stone and this gallery sounds done
Because they are obviously going to go into administration and there will be no money coming back.,
you canโt get blood from a stone and this gallery sounds done
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Terry Fuckwitt
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 3,600
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October 2019
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Terry Fuckwitt on Jun 9, 2023 21:47:48 GMT 1, The moral of the story, don't buy lifted street art... The only winners are the thieves that steal them. Robin Barton learnt the hard way too recently
The moral of the story, don't buy lifted street art... The only winners are the thieves that steal them. Robin Barton learnt the hard way too recently
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Terry Fuckwitt
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 3,600
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October 2019
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Terry Fuckwitt on Jun 9, 2023 21:49:20 GMT 1, Why were you contacting invader? To ask if they were real? I don't understand what sort of answer you were expecting
Why were you contacting invader? To ask if they were real? I don't understand what sort of answer you were expecting
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Jeezuz Jones Snr on Jun 9, 2023 22:27:33 GMT 1, Sorry to hear this mate and hope they are forced pay you back the full amount. Their response is really bad. As if they expect you to give up! Just thinking wouldn't Invader get the police involved also as it's fraud?
Looking at their website and for them to raise funds (as they are broke) they have a lot of art they can sell and even just to sell all the banksy's (do they own them?) at auction will raise a few hundred thousand and can pay you out.
Hope it gets sorted quickly fella and keep us updated ๐
Sorry to hear this mate and hope they are forced pay you back the full amount. Their response is really bad. As if they expect you to give up! Just thinking wouldn't Invader get the police involved also as it's fraud?
Looking at their website and for them to raise funds (as they are broke) they have a lot of art they can sell and even just to sell all the banksy's (do they own them?) at auction will raise a few hundred thousand and can pay you out.
Hope it gets sorted quickly fella and keep us updated ๐
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by concrete jungle on Jun 9, 2023 22:39:44 GMT 1, Sorry to hear this mate and hope they are forced pay you back the full amount. Their response is really bad. As if they expect you to give up! Just thinking wouldn't Invader get the police involved also as it's fraud? Looking at their website and for them to raise funds (as they are broke) they have a lot of art they can sell and even just to sell all the banksy's (do they own them?) at auction will raise a few hundred thousand and can pay you out. Hope it gets sorted quickly fella and keep us updated ๐ In my experience a lot of the art work is likely to be in 3rd party ownership with Graffik acting as a broker. So not as straight forward as quick sell off - although they may well have some โstockโ; sadly the amount of debt may eat that up pretty quickly - and as other posters mentioned, worst case scenario is they file for bankruptcy - which will seriously complicate any chance of getting your money back. Wondering if they own or rent the gallery - it was a nice space from memory and probably worth a few quidโฆ..
Sorry to hear this mate and hope they are forced pay you back the full amount. Their response is really bad. As if they expect you to give up! Just thinking wouldn't Invader get the police involved also as it's fraud? Looking at their website and for them to raise funds (as they are broke) they have a lot of art they can sell and even just to sell all the banksy's (do they own them?) at auction will raise a few hundred thousand and can pay you out. Hope it gets sorted quickly fella and keep us updated ๐ In my experience a lot of the art work is likely to be in 3rd party ownership with Graffik acting as a broker. So not as straight forward as quick sell off - although they may well have some โstockโ; sadly the amount of debt may eat that up pretty quickly - and as other posters mentioned, worst case scenario is they file for bankruptcy - which will seriously complicate any chance of getting your money back. Wondering if they own or rent the gallery - it was a nice space from memory and probably worth a few quidโฆ..
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Jeezuz Jones Snr on Jun 9, 2023 23:01:34 GMT 1, Sorry to hear this mate and hope they are forced pay you back the full amount. Their response is really bad. As if they expect you to give up! Just thinking wouldn't Invader get the police involved also as it's fraud? Looking at their website and for them to raise funds (as they are broke) they have a lot of art they can sell and even just to sell all the banksy's (do they own them?) at auction will raise a few hundred thousand and can pay you out. Hope it gets sorted quickly fella and keep us updated ๐ In my experience a lot of the art work is likely to be in 3rd party ownership with Graffik acting as a broker. So not as straight forward as quick sell off - although they may well have some โstockโ; sadly the amount of debt may eat that up pretty quickly - and as other posters mentioned, worst case scenario is they file for bankruptcy - which will seriously complicate any chance of getting your money back. Wondering if they own or rent the gallery - it was a nice space from memory and probably worth a few quidโฆ.. Good post and yes as I was scrolling through their website I was thinking how many do they actually own or physically have in their gallery? As this is fraud, there needs to be investigation into have they sold any other fakes?
Sorry to hear this mate and hope they are forced pay you back the full amount. Their response is really bad. As if they expect you to give up! Just thinking wouldn't Invader get the police involved also as it's fraud? Looking at their website and for them to raise funds (as they are broke) they have a lot of art they can sell and even just to sell all the banksy's (do they own them?) at auction will raise a few hundred thousand and can pay you out. Hope it gets sorted quickly fella and keep us updated ๐ In my experience a lot of the art work is likely to be in 3rd party ownership with Graffik acting as a broker. So not as straight forward as quick sell off - although they may well have some โstockโ; sadly the amount of debt may eat that up pretty quickly - and as other posters mentioned, worst case scenario is they file for bankruptcy - which will seriously complicate any chance of getting your money back. Wondering if they own or rent the gallery - it was a nice space from memory and probably worth a few quidโฆ.. Good post and yes as I was scrolling through their website I was thinking how many do they actually own or physically have in their gallery? As this is fraud, there needs to be investigation into have they sold any other fakes?
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LJCal
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,980
๐๐ป 4,523
December 2019
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by LJCal on Jun 9, 2023 23:11:59 GMT 1, They've filed one set of accounts since 2019, so over 4 years one filing. Looks like they're lining up to go pop, I'd say make sure you get together with other creditors and appoint your own administrator if they do file for VA, don't let them appoint some matey IP. People have this false idea that you can fold companies with impunity where you've behaved improperly, this is a big misconception. I'd be willing to bet money that there is a massive directors loan account; what most clueless business owners forget is that this is an asset to the business that upon liquidation the administrator will look to collect. Furthermore these loans create big personal tax liabilities with HMRC, hiding behind the corporation won't work when it comes to HMRC or when an administrator demands payment of the debt to the company, the director is personally liable in both circumstances. Furthermore if it can be demonstrated that the owner was trading whilst insolvent and engaged in deception this becomes a criminal matter which could lead to prosecution and various pretty nasty sanctions, there's no hiding behind the corporate veil when it comes to crime. Even if criminal intent cannot be proven I'd say based on the way they've managed the business from a filing and tax point of view the insolvency service will highly likely investigate them and ban them from being a director for a number of years, I would bring the case to the attention of the insolvency service in the event the business is put into liquidation. All of this should be spelled out in no uncertain terms to the directors who may think that they can just rip people off and walk away from the company debts and suffer no consequences. It's sounds highly possible in this case that should the business go there could be significant liability for the directors.
They've filed one set of accounts since 2019, so over 4 years one filing. Looks like they're lining up to go pop, I'd say make sure you get together with other creditors and appoint your own administrator if they do file for VA, don't let them appoint some matey IP. People have this false idea that you can fold companies with impunity where you've behaved improperly, this is a big misconception. I'd be willing to bet money that there is a massive directors loan account; what most clueless business owners forget is that this is an asset to the business that upon liquidation the administrator will look to collect. Furthermore these loans create big personal tax liabilities with HMRC, hiding behind the corporation won't work when it comes to HMRC or when an administrator demands payment of the debt to the company, the director is personally liable in both circumstances. Furthermore if it can be demonstrated that the owner was trading whilst insolvent and engaged in deception this becomes a criminal matter which could lead to prosecution and various pretty nasty sanctions, there's no hiding behind the corporate veil when it comes to crime. Even if criminal intent cannot be proven I'd say based on the way they've managed the business from a filing and tax point of view the insolvency service will highly likely investigate them and ban them from being a director for a number of years, I would bring the case to the attention of the insolvency service in the event the business is put into liquidation. All of this should be spelled out in no uncertain terms to the directors who may think that they can just rip people off and walk away from the company debts and suffer no consequences. It's sounds highly possible in this case that should the business go there could be significant liability for the directors.
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LJCal
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,980
๐๐ป 4,523
December 2019
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by LJCal on Jun 9, 2023 23:14:09 GMT 1, In my experience a lot of the art work is likely to be in 3rd party ownership with Graffik acting as a broker. So not as straight forward as quick sell off - although they may well have some โstockโ; sadly the amount of debt may eat that up pretty quickly - and as other posters mentioned, worst case scenario is they file for bankruptcy - which will seriously complicate any chance of getting your money back. Wondering if they own or rent the gallery - it was a nice space from memory and probably worth a few quidโฆ.. Good post and yes as I was scrolling through their website I was thinking how many do they actually own or physically have in their gallery? As this is fraud, there needs to be investigation into have they sold any other fakes? They'll rent for sure based on their balance sheet from 2019, 99% of what they sell is on consignment and I'm sure any decent inventory will be "sold" cheap before the liquidators are called in.
In my experience a lot of the art work is likely to be in 3rd party ownership with Graffik acting as a broker. So not as straight forward as quick sell off - although they may well have some โstockโ; sadly the amount of debt may eat that up pretty quickly - and as other posters mentioned, worst case scenario is they file for bankruptcy - which will seriously complicate any chance of getting your money back. Wondering if they own or rent the gallery - it was a nice space from memory and probably worth a few quidโฆ.. Good post and yes as I was scrolling through their website I was thinking how many do they actually own or physically have in their gallery? As this is fraud, there needs to be investigation into have they sold any other fakes? They'll rent for sure based on their balance sheet from 2019, 99% of what they sell is on consignment and I'm sure any decent inventory will be "sold" cheap before the liquidators are called in.
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LJCal
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,980
๐๐ป 4,523
December 2019
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by LJCal on Jun 9, 2023 23:18:56 GMT 1, They've filed one set of accounts since 2019, so over 4 years one filing. Looks like they're lining up to go pop, I'd say make sure you get together with other creditors and appoint your own administrator if they do file for VA, don't let them appoint some matey IP. People have this false idea that you can fold companies with impunity where you've behaved improperly, this is a big misconception. I'd be willing to bet money that there is a massive directors loan account; what most clueless business owners forget is that this is an asset to the business that upon liquidation the administrator will look to collect. Furthermore these loans create big personal tax liabilities with HMRC, hiding behind the corporation won't work when it comes to HMRC or when an administrator demands payment of the debt to the company, the director is personally liable in both circumstances. Furthermore if it can be demonstrated that the owner was trading whilst insolvent and engaged in deception this becomes a criminal matter which could lead to prosecution and various pretty nasty sanctions, there's no hiding behind the corporate veil when it comes to crime. Even if criminal intent cannot be proven I'd say based on the way they've managed the business from a filing and tax point of view the insolvency service will highly likely investigate them and ban them from being a director for a number of years, I would bring the case to the attention of the insolvency service in the event the business is put into liquidation. All of this should be spelled out in no uncertain terms to the directors who may think that they can just rip people off and walk away from the company debts and suffer no consequences. It's sounds highly possible in this case that should the business go there could be significant liability for the directors. I'd also write to the director who stepped down in 2022 who maybe thinks he's off the hook because he's resigned, this is absolutely not the case. He is also very likely to carry significant responsibility and liability if it can be demonstrated that the business was being run improperly during his directorship, based on the company's filings this would be pretty easy to demonstrate.
They've filed one set of accounts since 2019, so over 4 years one filing. Looks like they're lining up to go pop, I'd say make sure you get together with other creditors and appoint your own administrator if they do file for VA, don't let them appoint some matey IP. People have this false idea that you can fold companies with impunity where you've behaved improperly, this is a big misconception. I'd be willing to bet money that there is a massive directors loan account; what most clueless business owners forget is that this is an asset to the business that upon liquidation the administrator will look to collect. Furthermore these loans create big personal tax liabilities with HMRC, hiding behind the corporation won't work when it comes to HMRC or when an administrator demands payment of the debt to the company, the director is personally liable in both circumstances. Furthermore if it can be demonstrated that the owner was trading whilst insolvent and engaged in deception this becomes a criminal matter which could lead to prosecution and various pretty nasty sanctions, there's no hiding behind the corporate veil when it comes to crime. Even if criminal intent cannot be proven I'd say based on the way they've managed the business from a filing and tax point of view the insolvency service will highly likely investigate them and ban them from being a director for a number of years, I would bring the case to the attention of the insolvency service in the event the business is put into liquidation. All of this should be spelled out in no uncertain terms to the directors who may think that they can just rip people off and walk away from the company debts and suffer no consequences. It's sounds highly possible in this case that should the business go there could be significant liability for the directors. I'd also write to the director who stepped down in 2022 who maybe thinks he's off the hook because he's resigned, this is absolutely not the case. He is also very likely to carry significant responsibility and liability if it can be demonstrated that the business was being run improperly during his directorship, based on the company's filings this would be pretty easy to demonstrate.
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artlife11
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 372
๐๐ป 239
January 2020
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by artlife11 on Jun 10, 2023 1:01:01 GMT 1, They've filed one set of accounts since 2019, so over 4 years one filing. Looks like they're lining up to go pop, I'd say make sure you get together with other creditors and appoint your own administrator if they do file for VA, don't let them appoint some matey IP. People have this false idea that you can fold companies with impunity where you've behaved improperly, this is a big misconception. I'd be willing to bet money that there is a massive directors loan account; what most clueless business owners forget is that this is an asset to the business that upon liquidation the administrator will look to collect. Furthermore these loans create big personal tax liabilities with HMRC, hiding behind the corporation won't work when it comes to HMRC or when an administrator demands payment of the debt to the company, the director is personally liable in both circumstances. Furthermore if it can be demonstrated that the owner was trading whilst insolvent and engaged in deception this becomes a criminal matter which could lead to prosecution and various pretty nasty sanctions, there's no hiding behind the corporate veil when it comes to crime. Even if criminal intent cannot be proven I'd say based on the way they've managed the business from a filing and tax point of view the insolvency service will highly likely investigate them and ban them from being a director for a number of years, I would bring the case to the attention of the insolvency service in the event the business is put into liquidation. All of this should be spelled out in no uncertain terms to the directors who may think that they can just rip people off and walk away from the company debts and suffer no consequences. It's sounds highly possible in this case that should the business go there could be significant liability for the directors. I'd also write to the director who stepped down in 2022 who maybe thinks he's off the hook because he's resigned, this is absolutely not the case. He is also very likely to carry significant responsibility and liability if it can be demonstrated that the business was being run improperly during his directorship, based on the company's filings this would be pretty easy to demonstrate. I think they have bankrupted companys before. they were punting DotMeisterโs for ยฃยฃยฃ as serious street art to the locals. I did go to a show for Ru Knox who is a great Artist but wasnโt great and young girl was knowledge less about works on display & I think Ru Knox has moved on the better things.
They've filed one set of accounts since 2019, so over 4 years one filing. Looks like they're lining up to go pop, I'd say make sure you get together with other creditors and appoint your own administrator if they do file for VA, don't let them appoint some matey IP. People have this false idea that you can fold companies with impunity where you've behaved improperly, this is a big misconception. I'd be willing to bet money that there is a massive directors loan account; what most clueless business owners forget is that this is an asset to the business that upon liquidation the administrator will look to collect. Furthermore these loans create big personal tax liabilities with HMRC, hiding behind the corporation won't work when it comes to HMRC or when an administrator demands payment of the debt to the company, the director is personally liable in both circumstances. Furthermore if it can be demonstrated that the owner was trading whilst insolvent and engaged in deception this becomes a criminal matter which could lead to prosecution and various pretty nasty sanctions, there's no hiding behind the corporate veil when it comes to crime. Even if criminal intent cannot be proven I'd say based on the way they've managed the business from a filing and tax point of view the insolvency service will highly likely investigate them and ban them from being a director for a number of years, I would bring the case to the attention of the insolvency service in the event the business is put into liquidation. All of this should be spelled out in no uncertain terms to the directors who may think that they can just rip people off and walk away from the company debts and suffer no consequences. It's sounds highly possible in this case that should the business go there could be significant liability for the directors. I'd also write to the director who stepped down in 2022 who maybe thinks he's off the hook because he's resigned, this is absolutely not the case. He is also very likely to carry significant responsibility and liability if it can be demonstrated that the business was being run improperly during his directorship, based on the company's filings this would be pretty easy to demonstrate. I think they have bankrupted companys before. they were punting DotMeisterโs for ยฃยฃยฃ as serious street art to the locals. I did go to a show for Ru Knox who is a great Artist but wasnโt great and young girl was knowledge less about works on display & I think Ru Knox has moved on the better things.
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by shoottheglass on Jun 10, 2023 4:52:51 GMT 1, It's really difficult to have any sympathy when you've been trying to sell the problem on to unsuspecting buyers on here knowing full well they are fake. If the money from the sale 'was' going to charity anyway, whats the problem? You got burnt and you deserve it. Write it off and move on.
It's really difficult to have any sympathy when you've been trying to sell the problem on to unsuspecting buyers on here knowing full well they are fake. If the money from the sale 'was' going to charity anyway, whats the problem? You got burnt and you deserve it. Write it off and move on.
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Terry Fuckwitt
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 3,600
๐๐ป 6,562
October 2019
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Graffik Gallery selling Fake Invaders , by Terry Fuckwitt on Jun 10, 2023 9:25:40 GMT 1, I'll apologise in advance if I'm wrong, but is the OP (mission) of this thread Andrew Lilley? AKA Contemporary Art Trader (CAT) AKA the same guy that sold a load of fake/backdoor invader prints here years ago and refused to refund any money after invader confirmed they weren't authorised... I see there are a lot of good members backing him up in the laugh now thread, where he posted a signed print instead the unsigned print he was selling, so I'm sure I'll get my answer soon enough. If however he is Andrew Lilley, then karma got you good...
I'll apologise in advance if I'm wrong, but is the OP (mission) of this thread Andrew Lilley? AKA Contemporary Art Trader (CAT) AKA the same guy that sold a load of fake/backdoor invader prints here years ago and refused to refund any money after invader confirmed they weren't authorised... I see there are a lot of good members backing him up in the laugh now thread, where he posted a signed print instead the unsigned print he was selling, so I'm sure I'll get my answer soon enough. If however he is Andrew Lilley, then karma got you good...
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