neutral
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February 2007
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by neutral on Feb 6, 2008 23:54:12 GMT 1, This thread is priceless !!!
This thread is priceless !!!
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Gurn
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August 2007
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by Gurn on Feb 6, 2008 23:58:04 GMT 1, 8-)Help,my eyes,my eyes
8-)Help,my eyes,my eyes
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by crazyarsemother on Feb 6, 2008 23:59:35 GMT 1, f5 why don't you explain why its sh**e. It might be more interesting.
f5 why don't you explain why its sh**e. It might be more interesting.
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jamesreeve5
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September 2012
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by jamesreeve5 on Feb 7, 2008 0:07:24 GMT 1, Sorry Gurn, I don't mean to be patronizing, but thank you for your compliments...
I cannot speak for this particular CT piece as I am not familiar with it. Most likely done 50 years ago, it represents a breaking away from not only figurative tradition, but nearly abstract tradition as well. It takes Modernism, and Abstract Expression (the kind epitomized by Pollock) to a new level. Whereas Pollock was just painting purely what he felt, Twombly presents the remains of an emotional reaction (the Iliad, the four seasons). This in some respects might be easier for the viewer as they have a physical thing to reference the visual on (literature or music). Furthermore his style extends beyond the brush (and beyond Pollocks brush drip technique) into using his body and any number of other things, something that could be seen as a precursor to the spraycan as brush. While his pictures may look like scribbles, he was obsessed with classical composition, and when looking at the pieces in person one can see how well the "scribble" actually fills the canvas, something that the artist Basquiat was quite good at doing as well.
Sorry Gurn, I don't mean to be patronizing, but thank you for your compliments...
I cannot speak for this particular CT piece as I am not familiar with it. Most likely done 50 years ago, it represents a breaking away from not only figurative tradition, but nearly abstract tradition as well. It takes Modernism, and Abstract Expression (the kind epitomized by Pollock) to a new level. Whereas Pollock was just painting purely what he felt, Twombly presents the remains of an emotional reaction (the Iliad, the four seasons). This in some respects might be easier for the viewer as they have a physical thing to reference the visual on (literature or music). Furthermore his style extends beyond the brush (and beyond Pollocks brush drip technique) into using his body and any number of other things, something that could be seen as a precursor to the spraycan as brush. While his pictures may look like scribbles, he was obsessed with classical composition, and when looking at the pieces in person one can see how well the "scribble" actually fills the canvas, something that the artist Basquiat was quite good at doing as well.
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jamesreeve5
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September 2012
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by jamesreeve5 on Feb 7, 2008 0:09:28 GMT 1, f5 why don't you explain why its sh**e. It might be more interesting.
good idea
f5 why don't you explain why its sh**e. It might be more interesting. good idea
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f5ers
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October 2007
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by f5ers on Feb 7, 2008 0:10:57 GMT 1, Did you just copy that from one of your so called books
Did you just copy that from one of your so called books
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jamesreeve5
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September 2012
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by jamesreeve5 on Feb 7, 2008 0:11:03 GMT 1, 8-)Help,my eyes,my eyes
read the article though, and it sounds quite a bit like attitude on the first page of this thread...
8-)Help,my eyes,my eyes read the article though, and it sounds quite a bit like attitude on the first page of this thread...
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Gurn
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August 2007
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by Gurn on Feb 7, 2008 0:15:22 GMT 1, I've just been looking at the "Lapanto" series for the 2001 Venice Biennale and have to say that the piece on this thread does not do him justice to someone who is uninitiated....Not really a fan of Pollock but love what I've seen of Clyfford Still(or am I moving into pure abstraction now)............stop me if I'm talking bollocks ;D
I've just been looking at the "Lapanto" series for the 2001 Venice Biennale and have to say that the piece on this thread does not do him justice to someone who is uninitiated....Not really a fan of Pollock but love what I've seen of Clyfford Still(or am I moving into pure abstraction now)............stop me if I'm talking bollocks ;D
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jamesreeve5
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September 2012
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by jamesreeve5 on Feb 7, 2008 0:18:38 GMT 1, Did you just copy that from one of your so called books
"so called books" haha, I'm at work, wrote it off the top my head.
Did you just copy that from one of your so called books "so called books" haha, I'm at work, wrote it off the top my head.
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by crazyarsemother on Feb 7, 2008 0:24:25 GMT 1, What? Were they not really books? Whats this have you been asking to look at pretend books. You trickster.
Just doing my dissertaion which has to be in on Friday about Relational Aesthetics and Bourriaud's reaction to Greenberganist Modernist theories - don't suppose you know much about that to do you James? Like about 8,000 words in my in tray by the morning?
What? Were they not really books? Whats this have you been asking to look at pretend books. You trickster.
Just doing my dissertaion which has to be in on Friday about Relational Aesthetics and Bourriaud's reaction to Greenberganist Modernist theories - don't suppose you know much about that to do you James? Like about 8,000 words in my in tray by the morning?
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jamesreeve5
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September 2012
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by jamesreeve5 on Feb 7, 2008 0:28:17 GMT 1, oh yea I'll send you a PM in about 10 minutes!
oh yea I'll send you a PM in about 10 minutes!
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by crazyarsemother on Feb 7, 2008 0:35:13 GMT 1, Great but don't make me look in at any more books. I don't need a load of books to know that Tiravanija getting a load of mates around to eat curry is a load of sh@e.
Great but don't make me look in at any more books. I don't need a load of books to know that Tiravanija getting a load of mates around to eat curry is a load of sh@ e.
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Cocteau 101
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January 2007
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by Cocteau 101 on Feb 7, 2008 1:01:19 GMT 1, This thread illustrates perfectly how "underground / genre breaking art" is perceived. I love Pollock, Rothko, abstract expressionism but also love street art. Both incite passion and vitriol in equal measure - when abstract expressionism first came into public conciousness some people thought it was crap the same view some people have of Banksy being puerile etc etc.
People if they can be arsed should read the "intellectualism" surrounding art purely for some sort of perspective other than their own and it might provide them with added insight. I agree with ricosg on Twombly but then again we are both big abstract fans and our street art side also leans to some abstraction i.e. Parla. This thread also illustrates the diversity of people who by street art.
This thread illustrates perfectly how "underground / genre breaking art" is perceived. I love Pollock, Rothko, abstract expressionism but also love street art. Both incite passion and vitriol in equal measure - when abstract expressionism first came into public conciousness some people thought it was crap the same view some people have of Banksy being puerile etc etc.
People if they can be arsed should read the "intellectualism" surrounding art purely for some sort of perspective other than their own and it might provide them with added insight. I agree with ricosg on Twombly but then again we are both big abstract fans and our street art side also leans to some abstraction i.e. Parla. This thread also illustrates the diversity of people who by street art.
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by hollywouldifhecoul on Feb 7, 2008 1:15:08 GMT 1, Mose is one smart mofo. Mos def dig the style in which you use our written language, brother. "Valuation does not equal, or even usually reflect, merit." That phrase is art within itself.
Mose is one smart mofo. Mos def dig the style in which you use our written language, brother. "Valuation does not equal, or even usually reflect, merit." That phrase is art within itself.
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by darjeeling on Feb 7, 2008 4:36:35 GMT 1, There's more energy and meaning put into that Twombly canvas than in 90% of the crap touted around this forum. And by meaning I'm not talking about some obvious anti corporate statement or some stupid joke. This kind of moronic post makes me wonder why I even bother to come here. Twombly is in every museum worth a shit in the western world and has dozens of books and hundreds of exhibitions to his credit. When nick walker, beejoiur, or whatever next months flavor is accomplishes that then you you might have something to compare.
Maybe if he spray painted some corporate logos and switchblades on that canvas you guys would think it's great?
There's more energy and meaning put into that Twombly canvas than in 90% of the crap touted around this forum. And by meaning I'm not talking about some obvious anti corporate statement or some stupid joke. This kind of moronic post makes me wonder why I even bother to come here. Twombly is in every museum worth a shit in the western world and has dozens of books and hundreds of exhibitions to his credit. When nick walker, beejoiur, or whatever next months flavor is accomplishes that then you you might have something to compare.
Maybe if he spray painted some corporate logos and switchblades on that canvas you guys would think it's great?
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artstylee
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January 2008
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by artstylee on Feb 7, 2008 6:37:48 GMT 1, Just the fact that you guys can argue weather Twombly or Banksy is better just proves how powerful the art is.
At the end of the day, both painters were just expressing what's real to them at the time. & Both are innovational for their time.
An arguement stating that one or the other is "Better" than the other is going to go nowhere.
You can't discredit Banksy, because if there was no Banksy forum we (the younger art collecting community) probably wouldn't be discussing Twombly at all. The high end academic art community is usually 3 steps behind which the current auction prices reflect.
Although that "switchblade" comment was funny,
The majority of older people can't relate to this BRP/POW/LAZ Poster/Street/Stencil Art movement. Because it's not really for them.
Chances are if you had a Twombly and, god forbid, passed away, your kids would sell it to buy up Banksy stuff.
"New School Rules" - Russy Simmons (Rev. Run son).
PS. Banksy haters are going to look dumb when prints are selling like Warhol stuff 10-15 years from now.
Just the fact that you guys can argue weather Twombly or Banksy is better just proves how powerful the art is.
At the end of the day, both painters were just expressing what's real to them at the time. & Both are innovational for their time.
An arguement stating that one or the other is "Better" than the other is going to go nowhere.
You can't discredit Banksy, because if there was no Banksy forum we (the younger art collecting community) probably wouldn't be discussing Twombly at all. The high end academic art community is usually 3 steps behind which the current auction prices reflect.
Although that "switchblade" comment was funny,
The majority of older people can't relate to this BRP/POW/LAZ Poster/Street/Stencil Art movement. Because it's not really for them.
Chances are if you had a Twombly and, god forbid, passed away, your kids would sell it to buy up Banksy stuff.
"New School Rules" - Russy Simmons (Rev. Run son).
PS. Banksy haters are going to look dumb when prints are selling like Warhol stuff 10-15 years from now.
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jamesreeve5
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September 2012
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by jamesreeve5 on Feb 7, 2008 8:57:39 GMT 1,
?
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by fergy on Feb 7, 2008 9:50:51 GMT 1, "All of you are idiots. Seriously, do some research and shut your mouths. Cy Twombly is one of the most influential artists of the last 100 years. You know, like how the Beatles affected every piece of music that came after them. Kinda like that. yea" Well said. A forum for someone that makes stencils from photocopies is hardly the place to slag trained veteran artists. I imagine that Twombly piece was a doodle intended for inclusion on a a bigger canvas. He didn't put that sketch on a pedestal - the buyers did you burke. Anyway, I loved the way Twombly included scribbles and writing in his work - when I first saw his work it reminded me of a bus stop on an estate I lived in. Now thats 'street' for ya! ;D
"All of you are idiots. Seriously, do some research and shut your mouths. Cy Twombly is one of the most influential artists of the last 100 years. You know, like how the Beatles affected every piece of music that came after them. Kinda like that. yea" Well said. A forum for someone that makes stencils from photocopies is hardly the place to slag trained veteran artists. I imagine that Twombly piece was a doodle intended for inclusion on a a bigger canvas. He didn't put that sketch on a pedestal - the buyers did you burke. Anyway, I loved the way Twombly included scribbles and writing in his work - when I first saw his work it reminded me of a bus stop on an estate I lived in. Now thats 'street' for ya! ;D
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stuey09
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August 2008
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by stuey09 on Feb 7, 2008 10:36:37 GMT 1, There's more energy and meaning put into that Twombly canvas than in 90% of the crap touted around this forum. And by meaning I'm not talking about some obvious anti corporate statement or some stupid joke. This kind of moronic post makes me wonder why I even bother to come here. Twombly is in every museum worth a s**t in the western world and has dozens of books and hundreds of exhibitions to his credit. When nick walker, beejoiur, or whatever next months flavor is accomplishes that then you you might have something to compare. Maybe if he spray painted some corporate logos and switchblades on that canvas you guys would think it's great?
If you really want to present a reasoned argument, you might get further by typing from the brain rather than the heart.
There's more energy and meaning put into that Twombly canvas than in 90% of the crap touted around this forum.
Does this mean that 10% of the crap has more energy and meaning...
When nick walker, beejoiur, or whatever next months flavor is accomplishes that then you you might have something to compare.
If you're going to single out artists at least get their names right. Also some people on here have been collecting Nick and Beejoir's work for a lot longer than you're giving them credit for and are not necessarily interested in 'next months flavor' (sic)
Maybe if he spray painted some corporate logos and switchblades on that canvas you guys would think it's great?
Who're 'You guys'? Don't tar everyone on here with the same brush. There are plenty of open minded forum members with a sound appreciation of diverse art that can see through the obvious.
This kind of moronic post makes me wonder why I even bother to come here.
I was just thinking the same.
There's more energy and meaning put into that Twombly canvas than in 90% of the crap touted around this forum. And by meaning I'm not talking about some obvious anti corporate statement or some stupid joke. This kind of moronic post makes me wonder why I even bother to come here. Twombly is in every museum worth a s**t in the western world and has dozens of books and hundreds of exhibitions to his credit. When nick walker, beejoiur, or whatever next months flavor is accomplishes that then you you might have something to compare. Maybe if he spray painted some corporate logos and switchblades on that canvas you guys would think it's great? If you really want to present a reasoned argument, you might get further by typing from the brain rather than the heart. There's more energy and meaning put into that Twombly canvas than in 90% of the crap touted around this forum.Does this mean that 10% of the crap has more energy and meaning... When nick walker, beejoiur, or whatever next months flavor is accomplishes that then you you might have something to compare.If you're going to single out artists at least get their names right. Also some people on here have been collecting Nick and Beejoir's work for a lot longer than you're giving them credit for and are not necessarily interested in 'next months flavor' (sic) Maybe if he spray painted some corporate logos and switchblades on that canvas you guys would think it's great?Who're 'You guys'? Don't tar everyone on here with the same brush. There are plenty of open minded forum members with a sound appreciation of diverse art that can see through the obvious. This kind of moronic post makes me wonder why I even bother to come here. I was just thinking the same.
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jB
Junior Member
Posts โข 4,677
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June 2007
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by jB on Feb 8, 2008 4:52:55 GMT 1, There's more energy and meaning put into that Twombly canvas than in 90% of the crap touted around this forum. And by meaning I'm not talking about some obvious anti corporate statement or some stupid joke. This kind of moronic post makes me wonder why I even bother to come here. Twombly is in every museum worth a s**t in the western world and has dozens of books and hundreds of exhibitions to his credit. When nick walker, beejoiur, or whatever next months flavor is accomplishes that then you you might have something to compare. Maybe if he spray painted some corporate logos and switchblades on that canvas you guys would think it's great? If you really want to present a reasoned argument, you might get further by typing from the brain rather than the heart. There's more energy and meaning put into that Twombly canvas than in 90% of the crap touted around this forum.Does this mean that 10% of the crap has more energy and meaning... When nick walker, beejoiur, or whatever next months flavor is accomplishes that then you you might have something to compare.If you're going to single out artists at least get their names right. Also some people on here have been collecting Nick and Beejoir's work for a lot longer than you're giving them credit for and are not necessarily interested in 'next months flavor' (sic) Maybe if he spray painted some corporate logos and switchblades on that canvas you guys would think it's great?Who're 'You guys'? Don't tar everyone on here with the same brush. There are plenty of open minded forum members with a sound appreciation of diverse art that can see through the obvious. This kind of moronic post makes me wonder why I even bother to come here. I was just thinking the same. Bravo stuey! couldnt say it better myself
There's more energy and meaning put into that Twombly canvas than in 90% of the crap touted around this forum. And by meaning I'm not talking about some obvious anti corporate statement or some stupid joke. This kind of moronic post makes me wonder why I even bother to come here. Twombly is in every museum worth a s**t in the western world and has dozens of books and hundreds of exhibitions to his credit. When nick walker, beejoiur, or whatever next months flavor is accomplishes that then you you might have something to compare. Maybe if he spray painted some corporate logos and switchblades on that canvas you guys would think it's great? If you really want to present a reasoned argument, you might get further by typing from the brain rather than the heart. There's more energy and meaning put into that Twombly canvas than in 90% of the crap touted around this forum.Does this mean that 10% of the crap has more energy and meaning... When nick walker, beejoiur, or whatever next months flavor is accomplishes that then you you might have something to compare.If you're going to single out artists at least get their names right. Also some people on here have been collecting Nick and Beejoir's work for a lot longer than you're giving them credit for and are not necessarily interested in 'next months flavor' (sic) Maybe if he spray painted some corporate logos and switchblades on that canvas you guys would think it's great?Who're 'You guys'? Don't tar everyone on here with the same brush. There are plenty of open minded forum members with a sound appreciation of diverse art that can see through the obvious. This kind of moronic post makes me wonder why I even bother to come here. I was just thinking the same. Bravo stuey! couldnt say it better myself
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pezlow
Junior Member
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January 2007
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by pezlow on Feb 8, 2008 10:57:20 GMT 1, I think I am going to start a thread about marcel duchamp next. That should provoke some reaction Or maybe Carl Andre....
I think I am going to start a thread about marcel duchamp next. That should provoke some reaction Or maybe Carl Andre....
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pezlow
Junior Member
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January 2007
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by pezlow on Feb 8, 2008 11:02:12 GMT 1, In fact here you go. What do you guys think of this art
James/ricosg you are not allowed to answer for a while
In fact here you go. What do you guys think of this art James/ricosg you are not allowed to answer for a while
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Fearkiller
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September 2006
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by Fearkiller on Feb 8, 2008 11:10:22 GMT 1, I think I am going to start a thread about marcel duchamp next. That should provoke some reaction Or maybe Carl Andre....
morning,
why not posting some of Hermann nitschยดs work? :-D
this should provoke some reactions: *not safe for work or for vegetarians*
www.kreuz.net/article/article.5246.attachment1.jpg
greetz
I think I am going to start a thread about marcel duchamp next. That should provoke some reaction Or maybe Carl Andre.... morning, why not posting some of Hermann nitschยดs work? :-D this should provoke some reactions: *not safe for work or for vegetarians* www.kreuz.net/article/article.5246.attachment1.jpggreetz
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benya
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April 2006
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by benya on Feb 8, 2008 12:04:34 GMT 1, In fact here you go. What do you guys think of this art James/ricosg you are not allowed to answer for a while
ummmmm......
it is an extremely important peice in the history of art
In fact here you go. What do you guys think of this art James/ricosg you are not allowed to answer for a while ummmmm...... it is an extremely important peice in the history of art
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jamesreeve5
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September 2012
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by jamesreeve5 on Feb 8, 2008 18:00:32 GMT 1, I had my first real "moment of enlightenment" about art where that light bulb goes on over your head while looking at Duchamp's "A Bride Stripped Bare by her Bachelors" (the original though, not the copy of it thats in the Tate)
I had my first real "moment of enlightenment" about art where that light bulb goes on over your head while looking at Duchamp's "A Bride Stripped Bare by her Bachelors" (the original though, not the copy of it thats in the Tate)
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jcjcjc
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October 2007
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by jcjcjc on Feb 8, 2008 18:24:56 GMT 1, This is one of the most impassioned posts I've read on the forum and raises some interesting questions:
Does price = quality? By extension, does art need to have a financial value other than to satisfy the vanity of those that want to own it? Is the person who starts a movement better than the person who evolves it to take it where it needs to be? History is easy to see in retrospect but can you see what is relevant whilst it is happening?
What you chaps think?
This is one of the most impassioned posts I've read on the forum and raises some interesting questions:
Does price = quality? By extension, does art need to have a financial value other than to satisfy the vanity of those that want to own it? Is the person who starts a movement better than the person who evolves it to take it where it needs to be? History is easy to see in retrospect but can you see what is relevant whilst it is happening?
What you chaps think?
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Gurn
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August 2007
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by Gurn on Feb 8, 2008 18:26:50 GMT 1, Duchamp's Fountain changed the way people thought about what is and isn't art and still is an incredibly subversive piece.To say this isn't art is to say that grafitti isn't art,but,to say this is art is to say that two chinese guys pissing on it is also art.
Duchamp's Fountain changed the way people thought about what is and isn't art and still is an incredibly subversive piece.To say this isn't art is to say that grafitti isn't art,but,to say this is art is to say that two chinese guys pissing on it is also art.
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jcjcjc
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October 2007
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by jcjcjc on Feb 8, 2008 18:45:26 GMT 1, "two chinese guys pissing on it is also art" why would that not be art if the guys doing the pissing thought it was art?
How is that less artistic than someone piling bricks on the floor or sh**ing in a can? What art is and was has changed through the ages. How are we to say what the art of tomorrow will be.
"two chinese guys pissing on it is also art" why would that not be art if the guys doing the pissing thought it was art?
How is that less artistic than someone piling bricks on the floor or sh**ing in a can? What art is and was has changed through the ages. How are we to say what the art of tomorrow will be.
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Gurn
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August 2007
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For anyone who thought prices @ Bonhams were nuts!, by Gurn on Feb 8, 2008 18:51:44 GMT 1, "two chinese guys pissing on it is also art" why would that not be art if the guys doing the pissing thought it was art? How is that less artistic than someone piling bricks on the floor or sh**ing in a can? What art is and was has changed through the ages. How are we to say what the art of tomorrow will be. That is my point exactly,and also Duchamp's IMO
"two chinese guys pissing on it is also art" why would that not be art if the guys doing the pissing thought it was art? How is that less artistic than someone piling bricks on the floor or sh**ing in a can? What art is and was has changed through the ages. How are we to say what the art of tomorrow will be. That is my point exactly,and also Duchamp's IMO
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