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stop selling on prints? opinions, by sausageboonwee on Apr 22, 2007 17:51:55 GMT 1, Apparently this has been suggested in the UK and may be introduced here generally. That's all I've heard, I have no doubt someone will add to this. I certainly hope so.
Apparently this has been suggested in the UK and may be introduced here generally. That's all I've heard, I have no doubt someone will add to this. I certainly hope so.
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affart
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April 2007
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by affart on Apr 22, 2007 18:08:26 GMT 1, Wheres the link on Nicks site ??
Cheers
Wheres the link on Nicks site ??
Cheers
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affart
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April 2007
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by affart on Apr 22, 2007 18:14:59 GMT 1, Cool found it, cheers fella.
Cool found it, cheers fella.
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Run Pig Run
Junior Member
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January 2006
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by Run Pig Run on Apr 22, 2007 18:25:56 GMT 1, if his work wasn't bought to sell he would never be doing so well today. while the artist may feel a little uncomfortable with people buying just to sell it's probably best they keep thier mouth shut because in five years time this could all be over.
if his work wasn't bought to sell he would never be doing so well today. while the artist may feel a little uncomfortable with people buying just to sell it's probably best they keep thier mouth shut because in five years time this could all be over.
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by Daniel Silk on Apr 22, 2007 18:42:48 GMT 1, if his work wasn't bought to sell he would never be doing so well today. while the artist may feel a little uncomfortable with people buying just to sell it's probably best they keep thier mouth shut because in five years time this could all be over.
Yeah, Im with you on this one  loads of competition going on this year so artists cant be picky on who's buying and for what reasons 
if his work wasn't bought to sell he would never be doing so well today. while the artist may feel a little uncomfortable with people buying just to sell it's probably best they keep thier mouth shut because in five years time this could all be over. Yeah, Im with you on this one loads of competition going on this year so artists cant be picky on who's buying and for what reasons |
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affart
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by affart on Apr 22, 2007 18:45:10 GMT 1, Lots of competition! 
Lots of competition! |
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by mose on Apr 22, 2007 19:22:23 GMT 1, passed to me by a friend. This is in reference to the Ghetto Ghost Edition:
""An invoice will be generated and sent to you on PDF. On the invoice is a Resale Clause. This clause will state that Mr. Walker is entitled to 10% of any future resale of the print and that the print at no time may be placed on e-bay or a similar auction site.
You will be required to sign the contract and then fax it back. Please keep a copy and then you must mail the original contract back to the Gallery.
The print will be released once the Faxed copy arrives, the gallery will allow 7 days for the fax to arrive. After which the print will be made available to the next person, with no extension.
We are sorry, demand is high, only 10 prints will be made available to the UK, and we are quite serious about the resale of the prints. "
passed to me by a friend. This is in reference to the Ghetto Ghost Edition:
""An invoice will be generated and sent to you on PDF. On the invoice is a Resale Clause. This clause will state that Mr. Walker is entitled to 10% of any future resale of the print and that the print at no time may be placed on e-bay or a similar auction site.
You will be required to sign the contract and then fax it back. Please keep a copy and then you must mail the original contract back to the Gallery.
The print will be released once the Faxed copy arrives, the gallery will allow 7 days for the fax to arrive. After which the print will be made available to the next person, with no extension.
We are sorry, demand is high, only 10 prints will be made available to the UK, and we are quite serious about the resale of the prints. "
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by beejoir1 on Apr 22, 2007 19:34:53 GMT 1, It sounds full of shit to me, I'd wipe my ass on the paper and send it back to the gallery, damn.... I might just do that!
It sounds full of shit to me, I'd wipe my ass on the paper and send it back to the gallery, damn.... I might just do that!
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by manchestermike on Apr 22, 2007 19:40:33 GMT 1, It sounds full of s**t to me, I'd wipe my ass on the paper and send it back to the gallery, damn.... I might just do that!
Summed it up perfectly there Chris 
It sounds full of s**t to me, I'd wipe my ass on the paper and send it back to the gallery, damn.... I might just do that! Summed it up perfectly there Chris |
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by mammal2 on Apr 22, 2007 19:40:39 GMT 1, Thats stupid. Aint never going to happen!
Thats stupid. Aint never going to happen!
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by manchestermike on Apr 22, 2007 19:41:29 GMT 1, Thats stupid. Aint never going to happen!
Think the point is, it is happening.
Thats stupid. Aint never going to happen! Think the point is, it is happening. |
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notitle
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by notitle on Apr 22, 2007 19:41:41 GMT 1, what a load of shite. i don't know how the law has ever been enforced anywhere?
i respect that the artist has put a lot of time and effort into creating their own original work, but you sell it at a price you are happy with, then it's the customers property as far as i'm concerned. it's not like someone is copying it and selling knock-offs.
does the same apply to selling books or cds?
what a load of shite. i don't know how the law has ever been enforced anywhere?
i respect that the artist has put a lot of time and effort into creating their own original work, but you sell it at a price you are happy with, then it's the customers property as far as i'm concerned. it's not like someone is copying it and selling knock-offs.
does the same apply to selling books or cds?
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dwight
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November 2006
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by dwight on Apr 22, 2007 19:47:09 GMT 1, And you guys say that we are morons here in the US....that's the biggest load of bull I've ever heard. It also makes "mr walker" sound like a d-bag...but then again, mona simpson isn't exactly groundbreaking art...
And you guys say that we are morons here in the US....that's the biggest load of bull I've ever heard. It also makes "mr walker" sound like a d-bag...but then again, mona simpson isn't exactly groundbreaking art...
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bombshelter
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September 2006
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by bombshelter on Apr 22, 2007 19:52:39 GMT 1, It sounds full of s**t to me, I'd wipe my ass on the paper and send it back to the gallery, damn.... I might just do that!
That's funny as F**k..lol 
It sounds full of s**t to me, I'd wipe my ass on the paper and send it back to the gallery, damn.... I might just do that! That's funny as F**k..lol |
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by beejoir1 on Apr 22, 2007 19:56:59 GMT 1, It sounds full of s**t to me, I'd wipe my ass on the paper and send it back to the gallery, damn.... I might just do that! That's funny as F**k..lol
I'm not joking, poncy twats like this need to be sorted out! You sell something ...... its SOLD gone and has nothing to do with you.
Where can I get one of these faxes???
It sounds full of s**t to me, I'd wipe my ass on the paper and send it back to the gallery, damn.... I might just do that! That's funny as F**k..lol I'm not joking, poncy twats like this need to be sorted out! You sell something ...... its SOLD gone and has nothing to do with you. Where can I get one of these faxes??? |
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ABC
Artist
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by ABC on Apr 22, 2007 19:58:14 GMT 1, Was wondering peoples opinions there is a post on nick walkers forum about there being a "clause" in the invoices of nicks work in the states. that if sold on a % of the sell on fee would be given back to nick? can anyone shead a little more light on this and opinions? seems a little odd and totally unpoliceable. And does it matter? Should they try and stop it? Any ideas how to?
To be honest to him, its EU law in art nowadays that if you sell on an original and you was the initial purchaser you are required to pay the artist back a percentage (4% I think). If you sell through auctions (Bonham's etc etc) this happens already. Ebay are looking at this too but I cannot imagine how they would ever do it.
Was wondering peoples opinions there is a post on nick walkers forum about there being a "clause" in the invoices of nicks work in the states. that if sold on a % of the sell on fee would be given back to nick? can anyone shead a little more light on this and opinions? seems a little odd and totally unpoliceable. And does it matter? Should they try and stop it? Any ideas how to? To be honest to him, its EU law in art nowadays that if you sell on an original and you was the initial purchaser you are required to pay the artist back a percentage (4% I think). If you sell through auctions (Bonham's etc etc) this happens already. Ebay are looking at this too but I cannot imagine how they would ever do it. |
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nombei
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September 2006
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by nombei on Apr 22, 2007 19:59:53 GMT 1, interesting. i don't see how the resale of an item can be regulated like this, but i suppose if you sign a contract and agree to the terms then you should honor the contract.
interesting. i don't see how the resale of an item can be regulated like this, but i suppose if you sign a contract and agree to the terms then you should honor the contract.
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by beejoir1 on Apr 22, 2007 20:04:57 GMT 1, I'll take my 4% in beer please!!!
I'll take my 4% in beer please!!!
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by corblimeylimey on Apr 22, 2007 20:12:53 GMT 1, The weird thing is Nick isn't really in a strong resale position, the Black Monas are hardly reaching cost price on ebay and one of our forum members, buddings, made a ยฃ160 loss before fees on his AP Baby Moll! ( 120106944471 )
banksyforum.proboards82.com/index.cgi?board=ebaychat&action=display&thread=1174302728
When this sort of thing happens will Nick pay a percentage of the loss? ;D
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pezlow
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January 2007
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by pezlow on Apr 22, 2007 20:13:55 GMT 1, I think the EU law only applies to pieces worth over ยฃ10,000. And if you got 10K for Ghetto Ghost you probably wouldn't worry too much about giving 10% back to nick.
I think the EU law only applies to pieces worth over ยฃ10,000. And if you got 10K for Ghetto Ghost you probably wouldn't worry too much about giving 10% back to nick.
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by arcam on Apr 22, 2007 20:17:40 GMT 1, It sounds full of s**t to me, I'd wipe my ass on the paper and send it back to the gallery, damn.... I might just do that!
It's a load of bollocks alright. Once something is sold, the individual should be free to do with it what he or she likes. If someone is willing to support an artist by buying their work, why shouldn't they profit if the value of said work increases several years later? For f**k sake, it's no different to someone building a house, selling it for ยฃ100K only for it to be worth ยฃ1Million a few years laters. It's tough s**t.
*end of rant *  Sorry but that takes the biscuit. 
It sounds full of s**t to me, I'd wipe my ass on the paper and send it back to the gallery, damn.... I might just do that! It's a load of bollocks alright. Once something is sold, the individual should be free to do with it what he or she likes. If someone is willing to support an artist by buying their work, why shouldn't they profit if the value of said work increases several years later? For f**k sake, it's no different to someone building a house, selling it for ยฃ100K only for it to be worth ยฃ1Million a few years laters. It's tough s**t. *end of rant * Sorry but that takes the biscuit. |
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by corblimeylimey on Apr 22, 2007 20:34:06 GMT 1, I think the EU law only applies to pieces worth over ยฃ10,000. And if you got 10K for Ghetto Ghost you probably wouldn't worry too much about giving 10% back to nick.
From one of my above links...
"Only disposals for a value in excess of โฌ1,000 where the parties are acting in the course of a business, will be affected. In addition, the disposal will not be regarded as a "resale" where the seller acquired the work within the previous three years and the subsequent sale price is for less than โฌ10,000.
The royalty is calculated as a percentage of the resale price, with a tapering scale starting at four per cent for works valued to โฌ50,000 (net) and decreasing to 0.25 per cent for the proportion of resales over โฌ500,000. The maximum permitted royalty payment on any one sale is โฌ12,500. Responsibility for payment vests with the reseller and one art market professional, typically the sellerโs agent, though it could be the buyerโs agent where there is no sellerโs agent. VAT is not payable on the resale royalties."
I think the EU law only applies to pieces worth over ยฃ10,000. And if you got 10K for Ghetto Ghost you probably wouldn't worry too much about giving 10% back to nick. From one of my above links... "Only disposals for a value in excess of โฌ1,000 where the parties are acting in the course of a business, will be affected. In addition, the disposal will not be regarded as a "resale" where the seller acquired the work within the previous three years and the subsequent sale price is for less than โฌ10,000. The royalty is calculated as a percentage of the resale price, with a tapering scale starting at four per cent for works valued to โฌ50,000 (net) and decreasing to 0.25 per cent for the proportion of resales over โฌ500,000. The maximum permitted royalty payment on any one sale is โฌ12,500. Responsibility for payment vests with the reseller and one art market professional, typically the sellerโs agent, though it could be the buyerโs agent where there is no sellerโs agent. VAT is not payable on the resale royalties." |
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ABC
Artist
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August 2006
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by ABC on Apr 22, 2007 20:36:34 GMT 1, I thought it only applied to originals too and not prints
I thought it only applied to originals too and not prints
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by tomhills1 on Apr 22, 2007 20:37:58 GMT 1, the lst two posts sum it up perfectly, apart from beejoir's first (i'd love to see that fax!), a: it has to be over ยฃ10k and i also think it has to be within a certain time period, though don't quote me on that and b: once it's gone it's gone. end of. we can all look back at POW prices back in the day and see where those values are at now, even the current banksy's are under-priced. but to try to second-guess the futere market and insert some kind of covenant is just insane and like has already been pointed out - un-enforcable.
good luck though nick.
in fact, surely just signing (or deficating beejoir), isn't a legally binding contract? to my knowledge, you have to have a couple of witnesses, possibly independant too, to qualify as a contract?
kind of takes away somewhat the essence of art as a freedom of expression.
the lst two posts sum it up perfectly, apart from beejoir's first (i'd love to see that fax!), a: it has to be over ยฃ10k and i also think it has to be within a certain time period, though don't quote me on that and b: once it's gone it's gone. end of. we can all look back at POW prices back in the day and see where those values are at now, even the current banksy's are under-priced. but to try to second-guess the futere market and insert some kind of covenant is just insane and like has already been pointed out - un-enforcable. good luck though nick. in fact, surely just signing (or deficating beejoir), isn't a legally binding contract? to my knowledge, you have to have a couple of witnesses, possibly independant too, to qualify as a contract? kind of takes away somewhat the essence of art as a freedom of expression. |
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wildbill
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January 2007
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by wildbill on Apr 22, 2007 20:40:02 GMT 1,
WTF!! Its not stock, theres no dividends, no residual benefits for the artist. Its art for Fu*#s sake! Not a 401K plan.
Nick shoud be happy that people are buying his work at all. The last thing he needs to be doing right now is biting the hands that are feeding him and try to squeeze out some extra penny's. GREEDY NONSENSE!
There's thousands of great artist out there that have work better than his that would be stoked to sell a single piece for half of what his sh*t sells for.
WTF!! Its not stock, theres no dividends, no residual benefits for the artist. Its art for Fu*#s sake! Not a 401K plan.
Nick shoud be happy that people are buying his work at all. The last thing he needs to be doing right now is biting the hands that are feeding him and try to squeeze out some extra penny's. GREEDY NONSENSE!
There's thousands of great artist out there that have work better than his that would be stoked to sell a single piece for half of what his sh*t sells for.
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by corblimeylimey on Apr 22, 2007 20:40:34 GMT 1, I thought it only applied to originals too and not prints
All the facts are in the links I posted but I don't blame anyone for not reading them as they're pretty boring.
"The type of artistic works covered by the Regulations, are extensive covering ceramics, glassware and jewellery as well as the more obvious types of fine art. However, the right will only apply in respect of works that are limited in number, so that, for example, mass produced items will fall outside the ambit of the Regulations."
I thought it only applied to originals too and not prints All the facts are in the links I posted but I don't blame anyone for not reading them as they're pretty boring. "The type of artistic works covered by the Regulations, are extensive covering ceramics, glassware and jewellery as well as the more obvious types of fine art. However, the right will only apply in respect of works that are limited in number, so that, for example, mass produced items will fall outside the ambit of the Regulations." |
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by corblimeylimey on Apr 22, 2007 20:44:26 GMT 1, the lst two posts sum it up perfectly, apart from beejoir's first (i'd love to see that fax!), a: it has to be over ยฃ10k and i also think it has to be within a certain time period, though don't quote me on that
Sorry to ignore your no quote request ;D
FYI
"In keeping with the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, the resale right lasts for the life of the artist plus 70 years save that although the right is transferable upon death, neither artists nor their heirs can assign such right or use the right by way of security. Moreover, the right can not be waived by the artists or their heirs and any agreement to share or repay the royalties will be unenforceable."
the lst two posts sum it up perfectly, apart from beejoir's first (i'd love to see that fax!), a: it has to be over ยฃ10k and i also think it has to be within a certain time period, though don't quote me on that Sorry to ignore your no quote request ;D FYI "In keeping with the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, the resale right lasts for the life of the artist plus 70 years save that although the right is transferable upon death, neither artists nor their heirs can assign such right or use the right by way of security. Moreover, the right can not be waived by the artists or their heirs and any agreement to share or repay the royalties will be unenforceable." |
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by tomhills1 on Apr 22, 2007 20:48:13 GMT 1, Only disposals for a value in excess of โฌ1,000 where the parties are acting in the course of a business, will be affected. In addition, the disposal will not be regarded as a "resale" where the seller acquired the work within the previous three years and the subsequent sale price is for less than โฌ10,000.
so does that not equate a timescale? 
but don't quote me on it ;D
Only disposals for a value in excess of โฌ1,000 where the parties are acting in the course of a business, will be affected. In addition, the disposal will not be regarded as a "resale" where the seller acquired the work within the previous three years and the subsequent sale price is for less than โฌ10,000. so does that not equate a timescale? but don't quote me on it ;D |
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stop selling on prints? opinions, by corblimeylimey on Apr 22, 2007 20:56:03 GMT 1, Only disposals for a value in excess of โฌ1,000 where the parties are acting in the course of a business, will be affected. In addition, the disposal will not be regarded as a "resale" where the seller acquired the work within the previous three years and the subsequent sale price is for less than โฌ10,000. so does that not equate a timescale? but don't quote me on it ;D
I've quoted you again ;D
Lots of legal speak, pretty confusing isn't it?
What about the part that says "where the parties are acting in the course of a business" that makes a difference of paying the charge above โฌ1000 instead of โฌ10,000.
It's all very confusing, but I don't really care as it's not likely to affect me.
Only disposals for a value in excess of โฌ1,000 where the parties are acting in the course of a business, will be affected. In addition, the disposal will not be regarded as a "resale" where the seller acquired the work within the previous three years and the subsequent sale price is for less than โฌ10,000. so does that not equate a timescale? but don't quote me on it ;D I've quoted you again ;D Lots of legal speak, pretty confusing isn't it? What about the part that says "where the parties are acting in the course of a business" that makes a difference of paying the charge above โฌ1000 instead of โฌ10,000. It's all very confusing, but I don't really care as it's not likely to affect me. |
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loads of competition going on this year so artists cant be picky on who's buying and for what reasons 
Sorry but that takes the biscuit. 
