Matt
Junior Member
Posts • 2,350
Likes • 3,438
September 2014
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YOU killed street art, by Matt on Feb 5, 2015 21:02:08 GMT 1, Seems to me a lot of the "I invest in art" theme we see on here just shows a lot of people are kidding themselves.
For one, the term "art" is used very loosely. You can call it art if it makes you fell better about spending stupid amounts of cash for it but honestly it is mostly "stuff" and "pictures"
Moreover when you see this "buying of stuff" as an investment, chances are you are not as smart as you think because mechanically a few will win big, a few will get by, and most will fund the wins of the few.
So I will say it : I know f**k-all about art, and I spend silly amounts of cash on pictures.
The good news is, I know a lot more about my job, and am paid well enough to do it, so I can spend silly amounts on pictures as a hobby and not kid myself about being "an investor in art".
The other good news is that there are plenty threads on here that are great fun to read and plenty great people too !
Seems to me a lot of the "I invest in art" theme we see on here just shows a lot of people are kidding themselves.
For one, the term "art" is used very loosely. You can call it art if it makes you fell better about spending stupid amounts of cash for it but honestly it is mostly "stuff" and "pictures"
Moreover when you see this "buying of stuff" as an investment, chances are you are not as smart as you think because mechanically a few will win big, a few will get by, and most will fund the wins of the few.
So I will say it : I know f**k-all about art, and I spend silly amounts of cash on pictures.
The good news is, I know a lot more about my job, and am paid well enough to do it, so I can spend silly amounts on pictures as a hobby and not kid myself about being "an investor in art".
The other good news is that there are plenty threads on here that are great fun to read and plenty great people too !
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Deleted
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Feb 5, 2015 21:08:23 GMT 1, Street art isn't going anywhere. Tomorrow, the day after, the next day, whatever, someone can pick up some chalk or paint and express themselves. Doesn't matter how many artists come and go, or prints, canvas editions, high prices at auctions, sell-out advertising campaigns, etc, fundamentally, street art can (and does) go back to its roots at any time. It can evolve, spread, change, be corrupted, but it can't be stopped. Not while people still have freewill. You might not like certain aspects of the scene, but that doesn't cover all of it. Feel free not to like artists creating adverts for shoe companies, using their talents for evil or putting out shallow, mind-numbing Valentine's prints. But that's not all that street art has to offer. For every artist that hits the big time and rides the print express straight to mundane town, there will be new people that come along with fresh ideas and talent. Yes, then people will want to own something of the artist. Or some will just want to make money from them. Like street art? That's fine. You don't have to buy anything. We all want our favourite artists to eat and have money for paint, mind-expanding substances and lawyers though. Money always taints things. Money takes advantage. There will be many people that see street art as a stepping stone to art career or financial success. But it doesn't mean that's all there is. There will always be new artists and new ways for people to express themselves. Street art is fine. It's just that there's a very shallow aspect of it that rears its well-groomed head sometimes. Just ignore it and concentrate on what you like. And don't let anyone make you do anything you're not comfortable with. Aint that the truth.
Lol @ Lawyers!.
Street art isn't going anywhere. Tomorrow, the day after, the next day, whatever, someone can pick up some chalk or paint and express themselves. Doesn't matter how many artists come and go, or prints, canvas editions, high prices at auctions, sell-out advertising campaigns, etc, fundamentally, street art can (and does) go back to its roots at any time. It can evolve, spread, change, be corrupted, but it can't be stopped. Not while people still have freewill. You might not like certain aspects of the scene, but that doesn't cover all of it. Feel free not to like artists creating adverts for shoe companies, using their talents for evil or putting out shallow, mind-numbing Valentine's prints. But that's not all that street art has to offer. For every artist that hits the big time and rides the print express straight to mundane town, there will be new people that come along with fresh ideas and talent. Yes, then people will want to own something of the artist. Or some will just want to make money from them. Like street art? That's fine. You don't have to buy anything. We all want our favourite artists to eat and have money for paint, mind-expanding substances and lawyers though. Money always taints things. Money takes advantage. There will be many people that see street art as a stepping stone to art career or financial success. But it doesn't mean that's all there is. There will always be new artists and new ways for people to express themselves. Street art is fine. It's just that there's a very shallow aspect of it that rears its well-groomed head sometimes. Just ignore it and concentrate on what you like. And don't let anyone make you do anything you're not comfortable with. Aint that the truth. Lol @ Lawyers!.
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Shoeless
Junior Member
Posts • 1,105
Likes • 613
February 2011
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YOU killed street art, by Shoeless on Feb 6, 2015 2:58:51 GMT 1, Sorry guys....
Sorry guys....
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Shoeless
Junior Member
Posts • 1,105
Likes • 613
February 2011
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YOU killed street art, by Shoeless on Feb 6, 2015 3:14:54 GMT 1, Excellent discussion....and oddly, something I was thinking about this morning. If all my art suddenly became worthless, would I regret it or like it any less? Until that day comes, who knows? But I do enjoy it now. Im spending silly money on something because I enjoy it. Sure, Ive sold some things as tastes change but I wouldn't be able to afford the new art without an occasional sale. I try not to buy into hype, but sometimes you have to make a quick decision or risk paying double for missing out. I guess that would be my biggest gripe about it....as denada said, its become more about hyping the next big thing rather than appreciating quality work. Art is in the eye of the beholder, but I don't understand how some of these artists are hyped so hard. To each their own I suppose.
Regardless, I'll continue to buy what I like and if it all stops tomorrow, I'll be happy with what Ive got.
Excellent discussion....and oddly, something I was thinking about this morning. If all my art suddenly became worthless, would I regret it or like it any less? Until that day comes, who knows? But I do enjoy it now. Im spending silly money on something because I enjoy it. Sure, Ive sold some things as tastes change but I wouldn't be able to afford the new art without an occasional sale. I try not to buy into hype, but sometimes you have to make a quick decision or risk paying double for missing out. I guess that would be my biggest gripe about it....as denada said, its become more about hyping the next big thing rather than appreciating quality work. Art is in the eye of the beholder, but I don't understand how some of these artists are hyped so hard. To each their own I suppose. Regardless, I'll continue to buy what I like and if it all stops tomorrow, I'll be happy with what Ive got.
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pollywaffle
New Member
Posts • 124
Likes • 124
December 2013
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YOU killed street art, by pollywaffle on Feb 6, 2015 3:17:27 GMT 1, While it could indeed be argued that this forum does a degree of harm, it also does good. After joining this forum, seeing what people are talking about and being introduced to new artists, I've now made purchases from artists I never knew before and I now love. It has given me much joy and more exposure to culture. On the other hand, collecting for the sake of collecting is a side effect and certainly something I've fallen in the trap of wanting to do. Fortunately, I'm a poor uni student so I don't always have spare funds to make purchases. I'm currently studying to become a primary school teacher. I was recently teaching a year two class and we were talking about varying art styles. I felt great to show different artists and their styles, some of which I'd learnt from here. That being said, the kids were rubbish at making art and I certainly didn't hang any of their pieces on the wall. Dreadful.
While it could indeed be argued that this forum does a degree of harm, it also does good. After joining this forum, seeing what people are talking about and being introduced to new artists, I've now made purchases from artists I never knew before and I now love. It has given me much joy and more exposure to culture. On the other hand, collecting for the sake of collecting is a side effect and certainly something I've fallen in the trap of wanting to do. Fortunately, I'm a poor uni student so I don't always have spare funds to make purchases. I'm currently studying to become a primary school teacher. I was recently teaching a year two class and we were talking about varying art styles. I felt great to show different artists and their styles, some of which I'd learnt from here. That being said, the kids were rubbish at making art and I certainly didn't hang any of their pieces on the wall. Dreadful.
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Stoko
Artist
Junior Member
Posts • 1,706
Likes • 1,108
June 2010
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YOU killed street art, by Stoko on Feb 6, 2015 7:46:46 GMT 1, Seeing as how there's a lot of contributors to this thread: Anybody want to buy my unsigned Wall & Piece, 6th edition?
Seeing as how there's a lot of contributors to this thread: Anybody want to buy my unsigned Wall & Piece, 6th edition?
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Deleted
Posts • 0
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Feb 6, 2015 7:56:10 GMT 1, This forum is what you make of it, like a filet mignon that fell on your head from a high windowsill.
This forum is what you make of it, like a filet mignon that fell on your head from a high windowsill.
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maxf
New Member
Posts • 470
Likes • 331
October 2012
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YOU killed street art, by maxf on Feb 6, 2015 8:55:37 GMT 1, I'm pretty sure if I was losing money on my collection I would get bored of collecting very quickly. I like having pretty things on my walls but I expect to make an ROI on my purchases. Why though (not picking on you individually, as its a common held view)? I lost money on my TV, my hi-fi, the paint on my walls, my sofa and pretty much everything I've bought for my house. I certainly don't expect to make a return on those things. It's just the cost of living somewhere comfortable, decorated how I want it.
I buy stuff because I like it and want it on my walls to look at every day. I have 1 piece out of maybe 30 which isn't framed and on the wall - I picked that up as some trade bait, and even that is a bit uncomfortable with me. Value is secondary to me (although equally I don't want to lose my shirt on every deal - holding value at cost would be nice). I don't want a piece of art I truly love looking at to rise in value to the point where I have to decide if it is viable to keep or if the new car/bathroom etc takes priority - I appreciate Im in a tiny minority here though.
If prices were cheaper I'd buy more - as they are, I can't. I used to collect old Star Wars toys - they saw massive price rises (well into 4 figures for the right pieces, 5 figures for some). After the initial joy of the windfall, it quickly became untenable for normal people to carry on collecting or complete their collections. It became more about the value than anything else - then the joy goes and it turns a hobby into a chore.
I'm pretty sure if I was losing money on my collection I would get bored of collecting very quickly. I like having pretty things on my walls but I expect to make an ROI on my purchases. Why though (not picking on you individually, as its a common held view)? I lost money on my TV, my hi-fi, the paint on my walls, my sofa and pretty much everything I've bought for my house. I certainly don't expect to make a return on those things. It's just the cost of living somewhere comfortable, decorated how I want it. I buy stuff because I like it and want it on my walls to look at every day. I have 1 piece out of maybe 30 which isn't framed and on the wall - I picked that up as some trade bait, and even that is a bit uncomfortable with me. Value is secondary to me (although equally I don't want to lose my shirt on every deal - holding value at cost would be nice). I don't want a piece of art I truly love looking at to rise in value to the point where I have to decide if it is viable to keep or if the new car/bathroom etc takes priority - I appreciate Im in a tiny minority here though. If prices were cheaper I'd buy more - as they are, I can't. I used to collect old Star Wars toys - they saw massive price rises (well into 4 figures for the right pieces, 5 figures for some). After the initial joy of the windfall, it quickly became untenable for normal people to carry on collecting or complete their collections. It became more about the value than anything else - then the joy goes and it turns a hobby into a chore.
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Dr Plip
Junior Member
Posts • 7,043
Likes • 8,981
August 2011
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YOU killed street art, by Dr Plip on Feb 6, 2015 10:02:16 GMT 1,
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Balboa
New Member
Posts • 975
Likes • 1,407
November 2007
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YOU killed street art, by Balboa on Feb 6, 2015 10:19:21 GMT 1, Get rid of the 'art wanted' and 'art for sale' section. Problem solved.
Get rid of the 'art wanted' and 'art for sale' section. Problem solved.
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cmodart
Junior Member
Posts • 1,568
Likes • 1,864
March 2014
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YOU killed street art, by cmodart on Feb 6, 2015 10:45:13 GMT 1, Everyone wants to be the last guy to move to the neighborhood. All the rest are spoiling it.
Everyone wants to be the last guy to move to the neighborhood. All the rest are spoiling it.
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dashboll
New Member
Posts • 973
Likes • 1,037
January 2013
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YOU killed street art, by dashboll on Feb 6, 2015 11:27:50 GMT 1, Get rid of the 'art wanted' and 'art for sale' section. Problem solved. or just look at the street art threads
i think it depends on the person selling, I've had a beejoir 20 spot at cost £150 and invader still life at cost £240ish both from the art for sale thread, not a penny profit made
you do get the odd ray of sunshine where a member doesn't have wall space but wants to move bits on. like to think i'd do the same, but don't quote me on that!
Get rid of the 'art wanted' and 'art for sale' section. Problem solved. or just look at the street art threads i think it depends on the person selling, I've had a beejoir 20 spot at cost £150 and invader still life at cost £240ish both from the art for sale thread, not a penny profit made you do get the odd ray of sunshine where a member doesn't have wall space but wants to move bits on. like to think i'd do the same, but don't quote me on that!
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Deleted
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Feb 6, 2015 11:28:45 GMT 1, Video killed the Radio Star.
If peope want to call folk art, street art. Then i'm happy for them.
www.kansastravel.org/kansasart.htm
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Deleted
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Feb 6, 2015 11:38:34 GMT 1, was anyone interested in "street art" before it was trendy in the media?
before galleries took on street artists and promoted them?
before "street art" festivals were organised and promoted by people using public money in order to promote certain artists and sell their editions and canvases?
the free hand street art is spontaneous, done with feeling and abstract urban expressionist in some ways.
the stencilled street art is pre planned organised stencils done indoors and then sprayed outdoors.
when did people become interested in collecting "street art" ?
Just because a print sells for 30K in a saleroom means nothing.
Prints were done in large editions and if every print from that edition was offered for auction at the same time, then it's real value would be a fraction of 30K.
was anyone interested in "street art" before it was trendy in the media?
before galleries took on street artists and promoted them?
before "street art" festivals were organised and promoted by people using public money in order to promote certain artists and sell their editions and canvases?
the free hand street art is spontaneous, done with feeling and abstract urban expressionist in some ways.
the stencilled street art is pre planned organised stencils done indoors and then sprayed outdoors.
when did people become interested in collecting "street art" ?
Just because a print sells for 30K in a saleroom means nothing.
Prints were done in large editions and if every print from that edition was offered for auction at the same time, then it's real value would be a fraction of 30K.
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Deleted
Posts • 0
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Feb 6, 2015 11:57:50 GMT 1, For me the people falling over themselves to buy the '99% sure it could be Banksy' Outis print summed up what the urban art market has become. There's still real fans out there but sadly there's lots just in it to make a quick buck. You want to read the Espresso Beans forum to see this at it's worst. I gave up on that site long ago as I got sick of the constant talk about making money.
For me the people falling over themselves to buy the '99% sure it could be Banksy' Outis print summed up what the urban art market has become. There's still real fans out there but sadly there's lots just in it to make a quick buck. You want to read the Espresso Beans forum to see this at it's worst. I gave up on that site long ago as I got sick of the constant talk about making money.
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Deleted
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Feb 6, 2015 12:18:23 GMT 1, Street art isn't dead, it just smells funny.
Street art isn't dead, it just smells funny.
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Deleted
Posts • 0
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Feb 6, 2015 13:32:20 GMT 1, was anyone interested in "street art" before it was trendy in the media?
before galleries took on street artists and promoted them?
before "street art" festivals were organised and promoted by people using public money in order to promote certain artists and sell their editions and canvases?
the free hand street art is spontaneous, done with feeling and abstract urban expressionist in some ways.
the stencilled street art is pre planned organised stencils done indoors and then sprayed outdoors.
when did people become interested in collecting "street art" ?
Just because a print sells for 30K in a saleroom means nothing.
Prints were done in large editions and if every print from that edition was offered for auction at the same time, then it's real value would be a fraction of 30K.
been around graffiti since about 1993 when I used to buy The Source magazine just to see the graffiti section. I'd try and copy Kaws FC And Cope2's styles, I was in awe. I moved to San Francisco in 1996 and saw it all in person, I did my first piece that year and ran around the city painting for the next 7 years. Been around for a while.
This forum is great, and I've said it before, has NOTHING to do with graffiti or street art in the real world. The percentage of buyers on here is such a small percentage in the grand scheme of things. This forum definitely feeds a few people i wouldn't call 'artists' though.
Take away the sales sections and you'll have to visit a gallery to buy the works you want. Do you really want that? I've made some of my favorite purchases on this forum for incredibly fair prices. I've also sold and traded on here, sometimes for cheap, but usually for market value. I now follow some incredible collectors on Instagram because of this forum, and I still have the wonder and amazement of who Wiz really is.
Without the bitching, this place is amazing. The group is amazing, everyone is very passionate about art, their favorite artists, their collections, their future, etc.
Street art, graffiti, post graffiti art, urban contemporary, urban art, or whatever it is the kids are calling it these days is and has evolved. It made it with the big boys in the big galleries who used to call it "gutter art". That's something to be proud of, not scoff at.
I want to read an art history book in 20 years and see how it's written. How this whole thing plays out and looks from afar.
was anyone interested in "street art" before it was trendy in the media?
before galleries took on street artists and promoted them?
before "street art" festivals were organised and promoted by people using public money in order to promote certain artists and sell their editions and canvases?
the free hand street art is spontaneous, done with feeling and abstract urban expressionist in some ways.
the stencilled street art is pre planned organised stencils done indoors and then sprayed outdoors.
when did people become interested in collecting "street art" ?
Just because a print sells for 30K in a saleroom means nothing.
Prints were done in large editions and if every print from that edition was offered for auction at the same time, then it's real value would be a fraction of 30K.
been around graffiti since about 1993 when I used to buy The Source magazine just to see the graffiti section. I'd try and copy Kaws FC And Cope2's styles, I was in awe. I moved to San Francisco in 1996 and saw it all in person, I did my first piece that year and ran around the city painting for the next 7 years. Been around for a while. This forum is great, and I've said it before, has NOTHING to do with graffiti or street art in the real world. The percentage of buyers on here is such a small percentage in the grand scheme of things. This forum definitely feeds a few people i wouldn't call 'artists' though. Take away the sales sections and you'll have to visit a gallery to buy the works you want. Do you really want that? I've made some of my favorite purchases on this forum for incredibly fair prices. I've also sold and traded on here, sometimes for cheap, but usually for market value. I now follow some incredible collectors on Instagram because of this forum, and I still have the wonder and amazement of who Wiz really is. Without the bitching, this place is amazing. The group is amazing, everyone is very passionate about art, their favorite artists, their collections, their future, etc. Street art, graffiti, post graffiti art, urban contemporary, urban art, or whatever it is the kids are calling it these days is and has evolved. It made it with the big boys in the big galleries who used to call it "gutter art". That's something to be proud of, not scoff at. I want to read an art history book in 20 years and see how it's written. How this whole thing plays out and looks from afar.
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YOU killed street art, by Jeezuz Jones Snr on Feb 6, 2015 13:45:41 GMT 1, Seven deadly sins and Huxfour greats posts above...Ive mentioned this before but how about dan (forum owner) just locates the 'for sale/ wanted/in search off' etc. In a sales section and not in the 'new posts' section.
It's all about $$ these days, we all know that.. so at least the new post section will just be about art, shows, people's purchaes and the other great ongoing threads?? And less of the fucking 20page bitching sales threads.. Thoughts??
Seven deadly sins and Huxfour greats posts above...Ive mentioned this before but how about dan (forum owner) just locates the 'for sale/ wanted/in search off' etc. In a sales section and not in the 'new posts' section.
It's all about $$ these days, we all know that.. so at least the new post section will just be about art, shows, people's purchaes and the other great ongoing threads?? And less of the fucking 20page bitching sales threads.. Thoughts??
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Deleted
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Feb 6, 2015 14:54:14 GMT 1, Just have no comments allowed in sales threads. Problem solved.
Just have no comments allowed in sales threads. Problem solved.
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Deleted
Posts • 0
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Feb 6, 2015 14:57:34 GMT 1, i shot street art
but i did not shoot its deputy
i shot street art
but i did not shoot its deputy
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loother
New Member
Posts • 467
Likes • 590
October 2014
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YOU killed street art, by loother on Feb 6, 2015 17:19:13 GMT 1, I remember having an interesting conversation with Adam Neate about the state of 'street art' / 'urban art' or whatever you want to call it, at one of his signings at Elms Lesters [snip] I think Neate is falling into an easy trap there, in believing the time the scene was fresh was the time he was fresh to the scene. Of course it felt fresh to him then, and of course it feels a little less overwhelming nearly a decade on. I think there are probably young artists coming into the scene now to whom it feels fresh enough, and people who had been painting walls 15 years ago for whom it was starting to become stale just as Neate was arriving in 2006. The same is true of those who consume rather than produce art; our interest will wax and wane, and we will be tempted to point the finger elsewhere when we are bumping along the bottom of the cycle, when the issue is most probably, at root, with ourselves.
I also think it is wrong to dismiss prints and galleries. I suspect that few of us live in areas where street art is prevalent and constantly refreshed, and that most of us see most of it online, fleetingly. And I think it is natural for people who see some art they really connect with to want to be able to see it more easily, and more frequently. Galleries and editions exist to serve this demand, which seems (in theory) a noble enough cause.
I am constantly amazed at the price some of these things command, and feel that extremely limited editions and rapidly spiralling secondary prices seem to directly contradict the spirit of street art. Not only does this put art out of the reach of many, it has further negative side-effects: the process of buying art becomes quite competitive, which I fear brings out the worst in some people, and also results in people buying, in a hurry, art they don't really want, which then washes up on here or eBay. Others meanwhile hijack the process in the pursuit of simple profit, which I find morally questionable, even if I can understand the attraction. Personally I'd like to see more open or, at worst, timed editions, and take the bun-fighting and profiteering out it entirely. I think this would make the world, and this forum in particular, a better place (though of course there's plenty of beauty in both already).
I remember having an interesting conversation with Adam Neate about the state of 'street art' / 'urban art' or whatever you want to call it, at one of his signings at Elms Lesters [snip] I think Neate is falling into an easy trap there, in believing the time the scene was fresh was the time he was fresh to the scene. Of course it felt fresh to him then, and of course it feels a little less overwhelming nearly a decade on. I think there are probably young artists coming into the scene now to whom it feels fresh enough, and people who had been painting walls 15 years ago for whom it was starting to become stale just as Neate was arriving in 2006. The same is true of those who consume rather than produce art; our interest will wax and wane, and we will be tempted to point the finger elsewhere when we are bumping along the bottom of the cycle, when the issue is most probably, at root, with ourselves. I also think it is wrong to dismiss prints and galleries. I suspect that few of us live in areas where street art is prevalent and constantly refreshed, and that most of us see most of it online, fleetingly. And I think it is natural for people who see some art they really connect with to want to be able to see it more easily, and more frequently. Galleries and editions exist to serve this demand, which seems (in theory) a noble enough cause. I am constantly amazed at the price some of these things command, and feel that extremely limited editions and rapidly spiralling secondary prices seem to directly contradict the spirit of street art. Not only does this put art out of the reach of many, it has further negative side-effects: the process of buying art becomes quite competitive, which I fear brings out the worst in some people, and also results in people buying, in a hurry, art they don't really want, which then washes up on here or eBay. Others meanwhile hijack the process in the pursuit of simple profit, which I find morally questionable, even if I can understand the attraction. Personally I'd like to see more open or, at worst, timed editions, and take the bun-fighting and profiteering out it entirely. I think this would make the world, and this forum in particular, a better place (though of course there's plenty of beauty in both already).
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Deleted
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Feb 6, 2015 17:26:06 GMT 1, I remember having an interesting conversation with Adam Neate about the state of 'street art' / 'urban art' or whatever you want to call it, at one of his signings at Elms Lesters [snip] I think Neate is falling into an easy trap there, in believing the time the scene was fresh was the time he was fresh to the scene. Of course it felt fresh to him then, and of course it feels a little less overwhelming nearly a decade on. I think there are probably young artists coming into the scene now to whom it feels fresh enough, and people who had been painting walls 15 years ago for whom it was starting to become stale just as Neate was arriving in 2006. The same is true of those who consume rather than produce art; our interest will wax and wane, and we will be tempted to point the finger elsewhere when we are bumping along the bottom of the cycle, when the issue is most probably, at root, with ourselves. I also think it is wrong to dismiss prints and galleries. I suspect that few of us live in areas where street art is prevalent and constantly refreshed, and that most of us see most of it online, fleetingly. And I think it is natural for people who see some art they really connect with to want to be able to see it more easily, and more frequently. Galleries and editions exist to serve this demand, which seems (in theory) a noble enough cause. I am constantly amazed at the price some of these things command, and feel that extremely limited editions and rapidly spiralling secondary prices seem to directly contradict the spirit of street art. Not only does this put art out of the reach of many, it has further negative side-effects: the process of buying art becomes quite competitive, which I fear brings out the worst in some people, and also results in people buying, in a hurry, art they don't really want, which then washes up on here or eBay. Others meanwhile hijack the process in the pursuit of simple profit, which I find morally questionable, even if I can understand the attraction. Personally I'd like to see more open or, at worst, timed editions, and take the bun-fighting and profiteering out it entirely. I think this would make the world, and this forum in particular, a better place (though of course there's plenty of beauty in both already). This. Great post.
I remember having an interesting conversation with Adam Neate about the state of 'street art' / 'urban art' or whatever you want to call it, at one of his signings at Elms Lesters [snip] I think Neate is falling into an easy trap there, in believing the time the scene was fresh was the time he was fresh to the scene. Of course it felt fresh to him then, and of course it feels a little less overwhelming nearly a decade on. I think there are probably young artists coming into the scene now to whom it feels fresh enough, and people who had been painting walls 15 years ago for whom it was starting to become stale just as Neate was arriving in 2006. The same is true of those who consume rather than produce art; our interest will wax and wane, and we will be tempted to point the finger elsewhere when we are bumping along the bottom of the cycle, when the issue is most probably, at root, with ourselves. I also think it is wrong to dismiss prints and galleries. I suspect that few of us live in areas where street art is prevalent and constantly refreshed, and that most of us see most of it online, fleetingly. And I think it is natural for people who see some art they really connect with to want to be able to see it more easily, and more frequently. Galleries and editions exist to serve this demand, which seems (in theory) a noble enough cause. I am constantly amazed at the price some of these things command, and feel that extremely limited editions and rapidly spiralling secondary prices seem to directly contradict the spirit of street art. Not only does this put art out of the reach of many, it has further negative side-effects: the process of buying art becomes quite competitive, which I fear brings out the worst in some people, and also results in people buying, in a hurry, art they don't really want, which then washes up on here or eBay. Others meanwhile hijack the process in the pursuit of simple profit, which I find morally questionable, even if I can understand the attraction. Personally I'd like to see more open or, at worst, timed editions, and take the bun-fighting and profiteering out it entirely. I think this would make the world, and this forum in particular, a better place (though of course there's plenty of beauty in both already). This. Great post.
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Deleted
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Feb 6, 2015 17:28:23 GMT 1, People who collect street art cannot keep everything they buy. Even people with deep pockets sell off some purchases that they dont like as much as when they bought them. Other people without deep pockets generally buy and hope to re sell something for a profit and buy something else.
Thats all normal and no one minds.
There seems to be a lot of hype surrounding pending releases of ltd editions and shortly before or after threads made saying looking for something by the same artist.
What a coincidence.
Would someone who bought a print for 10K like it as much if their 10K purchase lost value and was only saleable for 1K?
This forum hasn't killed street art as I doubt a lot of people on here even know what street art is.
I dont see many if any hand bombed graffiti sold on here.
Some interesting advice online regarding investing in art.
Which seems to be a domain of the mega rich investors.
www.hilliergallery.co.uk/uploads/files/Hillier_Art_Investment_Report.pdf
""One of the most interesting areas to explore here is exactly how much work the artist produces and how readily available it is. Does the painter ‘churn it out’ on a commercial basis and make it available to as many people as possible or is there a very limited supply such that the work has become, in the true sense, sought after. As a general rule, as with most commodities, scarcity tends to go hand in hand with value or worth, so it is advisable to treat work that you see all over the place, on display in many galleries, with extreme caution. Such popular pieces may look attractive and may fall into the ‘every home should have one’ category but they are unlikely to be a wise long term investment.""
www.forbes.com/sites/kathryntully/2012/09/14/eight-tips-for-would-be-art-investors/
www.gsb.stanford.edu/insights/research-art-good-investment
People who collect street art cannot keep everything they buy. Even people with deep pockets sell off some purchases that they dont like as much as when they bought them. Other people without deep pockets generally buy and hope to re sell something for a profit and buy something else.
Thats all normal and no one minds.
There seems to be a lot of hype surrounding pending releases of ltd editions and shortly before or after threads made saying looking for something by the same artist.
What a coincidence.
Would someone who bought a print for 10K like it as much if their 10K purchase lost value and was only saleable for 1K?
This forum hasn't killed street art as I doubt a lot of people on here even know what street art is.
I dont see many if any hand bombed graffiti sold on here.
Some interesting advice online regarding investing in art.
Which seems to be a domain of the mega rich investors.
www.hilliergallery.co.uk/uploads/files/Hillier_Art_Investment_Report.pdf
""One of the most interesting areas to explore here is exactly how much work the artist produces and how readily available it is. Does the painter ‘churn it out’ on a commercial basis and make it available to as many people as possible or is there a very limited supply such that the work has become, in the true sense, sought after. As a general rule, as with most commodities, scarcity tends to go hand in hand with value or worth, so it is advisable to treat work that you see all over the place, on display in many galleries, with extreme caution. Such popular pieces may look attractive and may fall into the ‘every home should have one’ category but they are unlikely to be a wise long term investment.""
www.forbes.com/sites/kathryntully/2012/09/14/eight-tips-for-would-be-art-investors/
www.gsb.stanford.edu/insights/research-art-good-investment
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Deleted
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Jan 10, 2016 15:36:29 GMT 1, Street art has become "de mode" It's the new black as in fashion where ugly people buy expensive clothes to make themselves feel good.
Street art has become "de mode" It's the new black as in fashion where ugly people buy expensive clothes to make themselves feel good.
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chrisell66
New Member
Posts • 117
Likes • 80
February 2012
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YOU killed street art, by chrisell66 on Jan 10, 2016 18:54:15 GMT 1, The moment prices for some stuff hit big money people will talk about value/investment and the rest. How many years have people talked about house prices in London - a house is still 4 walls and a place to sleep regardless of what it cost/is worth - until the day you sell up and bugger off to rural France - then it buys a shed load of art you can't find a framer for.
Equally art makes you happy/think - or it doesn't - call it anything you like and the price is simply a choice we make.
Equally once it becomes print/paintings its never really been "street" its a convenient and fashionable label that judging by what is called street these days seems to encompass a load of pop art and endless Mickey Mouse/Star Wars cliches.
In 5 years there'll be a new trend and half of what is sold as street art will suddenly become the next label. Even in the street art "scene" things go in and out of fashion - 3 years ago RONE meant F5'ing and setting alarms for colonial time - these days it'll still be there in a week (and yep it just means I can buy it when I wake up)
As to killing Street Art - doubt it - people wittering on about investments won't stop anyone spraying/stencilling/starving in their attic. Yep there's a load of dross hyped - I don't have to look at it (Paco Pomet)- there's art I simply don't get (Miaz Brothers - still just blurry to me) - but there's the odd gem. At worst it means someone who'd have sprayed as an outlet whilst stacking shelves gets a career and some recognition outside a select scene.
Back to my ever present music analogy the whole "street art" label reminds me of people arguing about what was heavy metal/heavy rock 20 years ago - the whole selling out is like dance music/grunge becoming popular - and people whinging about over commercial stuff - duh don't listen/buy
The moment prices for some stuff hit big money people will talk about value/investment and the rest. How many years have people talked about house prices in London - a house is still 4 walls and a place to sleep regardless of what it cost/is worth - until the day you sell up and bugger off to rural France - then it buys a shed load of art you can't find a framer for.
Equally art makes you happy/think - or it doesn't - call it anything you like and the price is simply a choice we make.
Equally once it becomes print/paintings its never really been "street" its a convenient and fashionable label that judging by what is called street these days seems to encompass a load of pop art and endless Mickey Mouse/Star Wars cliches.
In 5 years there'll be a new trend and half of what is sold as street art will suddenly become the next label. Even in the street art "scene" things go in and out of fashion - 3 years ago RONE meant F5'ing and setting alarms for colonial time - these days it'll still be there in a week (and yep it just means I can buy it when I wake up)
As to killing Street Art - doubt it - people wittering on about investments won't stop anyone spraying/stencilling/starving in their attic. Yep there's a load of dross hyped - I don't have to look at it (Paco Pomet)- there's art I simply don't get (Miaz Brothers - still just blurry to me) - but there's the odd gem. At worst it means someone who'd have sprayed as an outlet whilst stacking shelves gets a career and some recognition outside a select scene.
Back to my ever present music analogy the whole "street art" label reminds me of people arguing about what was heavy metal/heavy rock 20 years ago - the whole selling out is like dance music/grunge becoming popular - and people whinging about over commercial stuff - duh don't listen/buy
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Deleted
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Jan 10, 2016 19:51:31 GMT 1, Just look at the fact that unfavourable comments about some art can make speculators show their true colours.
Just look at the fact that unfavourable comments about some art can make speculators show their true colours.
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Dr Plip
Junior Member
Posts • 7,043
Likes • 8,981
August 2011
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YOU killed street art, by Dr Plip on Jan 10, 2016 19:55:41 GMT 1, Just look at the fact that unfavourable comments about some art can make speculators show their true colours. To be fair, favourable comments also seem to wind some people up. Can't please everybody.
Just look at the fact that unfavourable comments about some art can make speculators show their true colours. To be fair, favourable comments also seem to wind some people up. Can't please everybody.
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Deleted
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Jan 10, 2016 20:13:53 GMT 1, I made a thread about community murals and about the murals being preserved that were done deaceds ago.
Not one response.
Even tho the artists are still alive that did some of them, they havent released any prints or changed their facebook status to "urban artist"
Todays street art is so sanitised, legalised, festivalised, organised, monetized
Done legally on walls that it realy community murals with a different name to keep da urban trendies appy. (as in apple)
It's only the print releases and profits that keep people interested.
Where are the freehand graffers on this forum the people who do the freehand stuff and big words with letters no one can read?
I made a thread about community murals and about the murals being preserved that were done deaceds ago.
Not one response.
Even tho the artists are still alive that did some of them, they havent released any prints or changed their facebook status to "urban artist"
Todays street art is so sanitised, legalised, festivalised, organised, monetized
Done legally on walls that it realy community murals with a different name to keep da urban trendies appy. (as in apple)
It's only the print releases and profits that keep people interested.
Where are the freehand graffers on this forum the people who do the freehand stuff and big words with letters no one can read?
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Dr Plip
Junior Member
Posts • 7,043
Likes • 8,981
August 2011
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YOU killed street art, by Dr Plip on Jan 10, 2016 20:21:10 GMT 1, I made a thread about community murals and about the murals being preserved that were done deaceds ago. Not one response. Even tho the artists are still alive that did some of them, they havent released any prints or changed their facebook status to "urban artist" Todays street art is so sanitised, legalised, festivalised, organised, monetized Done legally on walls that it realy community murals with a different name to keep da urban trendies appy. (as in apple) It's only the print releases and profits that keep people interested. Where are the freehand graffers on this forum the people who do the freehand stuff and big words with letters no one can read? Don't. I spent a good 10 minutes this evening staring at some bubble letters on a garage door. Very big, very nice, but I'll be buggered if I could read it. It was right next to a POLICE PATROL THIS AREA sign. They clearly fucking don't. lol
I made a thread about community murals and about the murals being preserved that were done deaceds ago. Not one response. Even tho the artists are still alive that did some of them, they havent released any prints or changed their facebook status to "urban artist" Todays street art is so sanitised, legalised, festivalised, organised, monetized Done legally on walls that it realy community murals with a different name to keep da urban trendies appy. (as in apple) It's only the print releases and profits that keep people interested. Where are the freehand graffers on this forum the people who do the freehand stuff and big words with letters no one can read? Don't. I spent a good 10 minutes this evening staring at some bubble letters on a garage door. Very big, very nice, but I'll be buggered if I could read it. It was right next to a POLICE PATROL THIS AREA sign. They clearly fucking don't. lol
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Deleted
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January 1970
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YOU killed street art, by Deleted on Jan 10, 2016 20:28:38 GMT 1, I made a thread about community murals and about the murals being preserved that were done deaceds ago. Not one response. Even tho the artists are still alive that did some of them, they havent released any prints or changed their facebook status to "urban artist" Todays street art is so sanitised, legalised, festivalised, organised, monetized Done legally on walls that it realy community murals with a different name to keep da urban trendies appy. (as in apple) It's only the print releases and profits that keep people interested. Where are the freehand graffers on this forum the people who do the freehand stuff and big words with letters no one can read? you obviously don't live in a built up environment, because for every legal mural, there are ten thousand stickers, stencils, paste ups and tags vying for your attention. Not one of them interested in legalised, festivalised, organised or being monetized.
I made a thread about community murals and about the murals being preserved that were done deaceds ago. Not one response. Even tho the artists are still alive that did some of them, they havent released any prints or changed their facebook status to "urban artist" Todays street art is so sanitised, legalised, festivalised, organised, monetized Done legally on walls that it realy community murals with a different name to keep da urban trendies appy. (as in apple) It's only the print releases and profits that keep people interested. Where are the freehand graffers on this forum the people who do the freehand stuff and big words with letters no one can read? you obviously don't live in a built up environment, because for every legal mural, there are ten thousand stickers, stencils, paste ups and tags vying for your attention. Not one of them interested in legalised, festivalised, organised or being monetized.
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