Urban Art Association

the forum is a tool, the debate has raged for decades in other formats. this isnt new and isnt restricted to (that utterly sickening media construct & portmanteau) "street art"

there is little street about a privately educated, st martins graduate making something on a peckham warehouse side. there is something very street about a kid living 500m from the artwork, soending his time tagging his neighbourhood.

the forum is only a vehicle

interesting topic, agree on some levels, but if street art stayed on the street and was not commodified you wouldn't have had the opportunity to get something for your own wall at home.

There's some decent threads under Street Art which rarely talk about money and for those that want something there's the £50 art thread which has some cracking pieces which I don't think people buy motivated by future worth.

I came into all this backwards - was interested in pieces I saw to buy (particularly Eine) and then from there am now interested in walking round the streets checking out street art.  Maybe it's all swings and roundabouts?

I also only buy what I like, all of my art is on display, no folder under the bed, and as of yet haven't sold anything either.

It does get a bit frustrating when people hype artists work so much then sell a few months later, for profit, thinking that everyone will have forgotten their opinion. That being said its hard to keep the discussion about the art as so many flippers on here, who get very defensive if something critical is said of an artists work as that will effect the profit of the piece that they are hoping to sell in the future (see Sandra Chevrier thread)

There are also the galleries who pose as individuals, I understand that making money from art is their job, it's just a shame to see them take advantage of peoples need for a quick sale due to whatever financial issue, unexpected bills... Then list the piece on their websites with a huge mark up in price.

Maybe its not just this forum but ebay and the internet as a whole that has contributed to the problem. As 'urban art' becomes more popular and mainstream that brings with it people realising the potential to make money, we have created a capitalist world after all.

Street art isn't going anywhere. Tomorrow, the day after, the next day, whatever, someone can pick up some chalk or paint and express themselves. Doesn't matter how many artists come and go, or prints, canvas editions, high prices at auctions, sell-out advertising campaigns, etc, fundamentally, street art can (and does) go back to its roots at any time. It can evolve, spread, change, be corrupted, but it can't be stopped. Not while people still have freewill.

You might not like certain aspects of the scene, but that doesn't cover all of it. Feel free not to like artists creating adverts for shoe companies, using their talents for evil or putting out shallow, mind-numbing Valentine's prints. But that's not all that street art has to offer. For every artist that hits the big time and rides the print express straight to mundane town, there will be new people that come along with fresh ideas and talent. Yes, then people will want to own something of the artist. Or some will just want to make money from them.

Like street art? That's fine. You don't have to buy anything. We all want our favourite artists to eat and have money for paint, mind-expanding substances and lawyers though.

Money always taints things. Money takes advantage. There will be many people that see street art as a stepping stone to art career or financial success. But it doesn't mean that's all there is. There will always be new artists and new ways for people to express themselves.

Street art is fine. It's just that there's a very shallow aspect of it that rears its well-groomed head sometimes. Just ignore it and concentrate on what you like. And don't let anyone make you do anything you're not comfortable with.

there is an addiction problem too... i swore i'd only buy stuff that went straight on the wall but a year later am guilty of storing stuff waiting to frame.  it's not about keeping to resell or anything like that, it's just this forum, you see stuff you've never heard of before and can't help buying.  need a 12 steps group.

Thought this quote I read today in an interview might be relevant, it was referring to what some have termed Crapstraction but you can put Street Art in the same sentence it still says alot about where the market is and a root of most of the issues at hand.

"When Jerry Saltz asks, “why does so much new abstraction look the same?” I respond by asking “why does so much art, period, look the same today?” What are the larger systems that allow for an unprecedentedly large number of artists to share some part of the spotlight and to produce work that emerges from a similar set of precedents, deals with a similar set of issues and, yes, bears superficial formal similarities. A pious refusal of money, which I would point out is not even necessarily a possibility on the part of these young artists who have found their production quite literally annexed by speculators (save full-fledged dropping out of the system, and even then I’m not so sure since artists have concluded production on several of the bodies of work that, at one time or another, drew the interest of speculators), and the work has continued to be traded back and forth, often resulting in market ignorance of the subsequent work made by these artists.

The fact that Wade Guyton printing off numerous additional canvases of a work that went for auction at Christie’s did nothing to stop that painting from setting a record price is just one clear example that today value actually accrues more to methods of hype and distribution—much like special edition sneakers—rather than to old ideas of connoisseurship and the “original.” Today a “collector” wants to own the same things his ten friends do. It’s a status symbol, a register of a certain kind of taste (though more in the sense of hip clothing than of traditional notions of what establishes quality in art), a certain level of economic achievement, and corresponding entry into an “in crowd” who all have the same art portfolio. For critics to hold onto old romantic ideas of the artist as a dignified bohemian nobly toiling away in poverty don’t hold up any longer, and the point is that even if the artist acts in that way it means nothing when his or her work is activated as a product, whose distribution and reception is essentially dictated by the market." Alex Beacon

I think everyone falls into appreciating an artist that might be Hyped at the current moment but most of the people in here seem to have their favorites that never get mentioned and a genuine appreciation for the work which is refreshing. Yet you will always get the other side of things as well, its just natural. I have spent the last 5 years championing artists I believe in and some will reach a Hype level others will never be appreciated for their talent. Its the way things are and I find peace in knowing that what I do is out of a genuine need to share a perspective that might go unnoticed. You have to take the good with the bad I guess.

^love it

I don't recall a time when this forum was anything other than a vehicle for making money.A few years ago it was mostly a London based group of members lapping up the cream, now it's spread across the country/world.I don't remember many if any threads discussing the merits of particular artists.

Greedy band-wagon jumpers diluted the scene as did the members creating mini-bubbles

A little look at London & Bristol art threads prove people still get up just for the buzz.

ps. I love this forum, the core group here are incredible to one another.

I would tend to disagree with pretty much all of these comments, and am surprised at times by the self-loathing that pops up...must be the comic book nerd thing.  

This site is just one of many that exist to service the scene, and like the others has its pros and cons, some toothless twats and some regular and quite fun peeps - like most places in life.  Being older, I've learned to avoid the twats and enjoy the peeps.

Like others I considered myself knowledgable about art - in NYC I regularly hit the museums, the galleries, and the tiny happenings.  I do the same when I travel.  And I make art.  As I know about art I find what goes on in the art world fascinating, including auction results of Bacon to Banksy.

For me it is easy to determine who has the chops and who doesn't, at least in my opinion.  This might be why I was impressed with the recent Borondo show - after having a complete stranger on this forum meet me in Shoreditch and give me a tour of the local street art in Shoreditch...and a copy of the Banksy Sotheby catalog...and afterwards I bought the pints.  Thanks to this forum.

I think you are confusing "street art", whatever that is...in NYC we always called it graffiti...with "urban art"...as this forum is called the Urban Art Association...which by definition seems derived from the concept of street art. "Urban Art" a much better catchphrase than "Street Art" - "Street Art" sounds like a polite UK term for "Graffiti".  If an artist has been given the ok to do a large piece on a building then they are a "Muralist".

For me I've gathered some awesome art that looks amazing on my walls...getting the framed Dale Marshall recently was a high well worth having, and it looks great on the wall.  I tore off the bubblewrap as if it was a Christmas present (actually it was...from me to me!).  

I do think there's exploitation in this scene - GP a prime example.  And a lot of boring repetitive art.  As a fan / small time collector one has to separate the wheat from the chaff.  I'm cool with that.

More like a vehicle for SPENDING money!

I've never sold a piece on here or anywhere else, bought a couple of pieces for someone else off Coach, I use the forum to find out about new stuff, keep abreast of what's going on, make the odd silly comment, have a laugh and sometimes a row. I am constantly amazed at the depth of knowledge of some of the forum members and generally, the willingness of most of the forumites to help each other out. Oh and to generally hate every MB release. The forum still is a great place to visit and to think that the odd couple of a hundred active people on here can dramatically effect the art 'movement' is strange to say the least.

This forum is a guilty pleasure and complete escape from my "real" world. I have learned realms over the past few years about street art and often witness member kindness (Andy's raffle, still travelling, etc). Yes, there is a lot of money and hype but sharing in the thrill of the hunt and the agony of defeat at not catching a release also builds a sense of community. Plus, I laugh...often.

I just like pretty pictures.