1st Design
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๐จ๏ธ 154
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August 2011
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Help.. Mat brun, by 1st Design on Jun 13, 2020 11:08:36 GMT 1, Hi all
I have 2 Banksy prints there have been framed with Window mounting in the last 10 years. The 2 prints have been separated from the old frame and ready to a new one, I have chosen High floating to both prints. My issue is when we seperated the old frames from the print there was some โlightโ dark area where the mat board have been covered the print. The โframemanโ ask me if I want to have the prints to a paper conservator to โremoveโ the darker area. both prints have with the conservator and I saw them yesterday first time after the consevator have them in hand. The โframemanโ presented the prints like the dark area is disappeared, but after a few second they where visibel for my eye again and now I could also see some โlightโ white area. Honestly I Can not remember for sure if the light area have been there the hole time or it is something bleaching the consevator have done to the print. The frameman told me when I confronted him with my issue that the consevator have told him he have done what i could and the dark and light area allways have been there (original) โI donโt belive thatโ I agreed with the โframemanโ the the consevator will contact me direct next week and tell me the story because the frameman could have misunderstand him. It would been a great help to have a second opinion before he Call me:)
this is my main quistions:
are there any chance the dark/light area could be there original?
I Can not remember if the light area was there before the consevator have it. Is it normal there is some light area i a โmat brunโ?
Is it the consevator there have made the light area?
do some of you have any experience with remove the light area?
And last is it me there is a fool because this issue is not at Big deal (quistion ask from my wire)??
I have used the best frameshop in Denmark/Copenhagen and the consevator is also
the best.. but I still have my issue
I know I ask a lot but could some one offer me to help
with uploading some picture?
I hope to get some feedback, but Great thanks away:)
Jeppe
Hi all
I have 2 Banksy prints there have been framed with Window mounting in the last 10 years. The 2 prints have been separated from the old frame and ready to a new one, I have chosen High floating to both prints. My issue is when we seperated the old frames from the print there was some โlightโ dark area where the mat board have been covered the print. The โframemanโ ask me if I want to have the prints to a paper conservator to โremoveโ the darker area. both prints have with the conservator and I saw them yesterday first time after the consevator have them in hand. The โframemanโ presented the prints like the dark area is disappeared, but after a few second they where visibel for my eye again and now I could also see some โlightโ white area. Honestly I Can not remember for sure if the light area have been there the hole time or it is something bleaching the consevator have done to the print. The frameman told me when I confronted him with my issue that the consevator have told him he have done what i could and the dark and light area allways have been there (original) โI donโt belive thatโ I agreed with the โframemanโ the the consevator will contact me direct next week and tell me the story because the frameman could have misunderstand him. It would been a great help to have a second opinion before he Call me:)
this is my main quistions:
are there any chance the dark/light area could be there original?
I Can not remember if the light area was there before the consevator have it. Is it normal there is some light area i a โmat brunโ?
Is it the consevator there have made the light area?
do some of you have any experience with remove the light area?
And last is it me there is a fool because this issue is not at Big deal (quistion ask from my wire)??
I have used the best frameshop in Denmark/Copenhagen and the consevator is also
the best.. but I still have my issue
I know I ask a lot but could some one offer me to help
with uploading some picture?
I hope to get some feedback, but Great thanks away:)
Jeppe
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Pipes
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,438
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January 2012
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Help.. Mat brun, by Pipes on Jun 13, 2020 11:14:50 GMT 1, My understanding is that UV burn cannot be restored.
The paper that was exposed to UV light has been bleached
You should find out what the restorer did to the print.
I took a print to 2 restorers in NYC which had burn and was told that nothing could be done. I sold the print at a loss and learned a valuable lesson about inspecting prints.
My understanding is that UV burn cannot be restored.
The paper that was exposed to UV light has been bleached
You should find out what the restorer did to the print.
I took a print to 2 restorers in NYC which had burn and was told that nothing could be done. I sold the print at a loss and learned a valuable lesson about inspecting prints.
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Poster Bob
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 5,891
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September 2013
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Help.. Mat brun, by Poster Bob on Jun 13, 2020 11:31:08 GMT 1, Having bought prints with UV burn I will give you the same advice I was given. You can lessen UV burn due to a mat by floating the print and placing it in an area with low light for a long period of time and hope for the best.
Having bought prints with UV burn I will give you the same advice I was given. You can lessen UV burn due to a mat by floating the print and placing it in an area with low light for a long period of time and hope for the best.
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1st Design
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 154
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August 2011
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Help.. Mat brun, by 1st Design on Jun 13, 2020 11:49:36 GMT 1, I find the solution to upload pictures, thanks:)
I find the solution to upload pictures, thanks:)
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LJCal
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,980
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December 2019
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Help.. Mat brun, by LJCal on Jun 13, 2020 13:13:45 GMT 1, That looks like he has bleached the rest of the print.
That looks like he has bleached the rest of the print.
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Help.. Mat brun, by concrete jungle on Jun 13, 2020 13:34:46 GMT 1, Sadly as others have said mat burn is almost impossible to reverse. I've bought couple of placard rats in the past with the issue - both originally framed by Art Republic. Might be the the paper used is particularly prone to uv damage, and early AR framing was sketchy at best. Ended up getting them nicely reframed with the burn matted out again - I can live with that, but I know it does affect the overall value of the prints. Have to say it does look like your conservator has tried to use some sort of bleaching agent, with mixed results. I'd always want to find out conservator is intending to do prior to the work being carried out - been stung before by some heavy handed attempts to remove water damage etc - sensible to always ask for refs, or examples of previous similar jobs.....
Sadly as others have said mat burn is almost impossible to reverse. I've bought couple of placard rats in the past with the issue - both originally framed by Art Republic. Might be the the paper used is particularly prone to uv damage, and early AR framing was sketchy at best. Ended up getting them nicely reframed with the burn matted out again - I can live with that, but I know it does affect the overall value of the prints. Have to say it does look like your conservator has tried to use some sort of bleaching agent, with mixed results. I'd always want to find out conservator is intending to do prior to the work being carried out - been stung before by some heavy handed attempts to remove water damage etc - sensible to always ask for refs, or examples of previous similar jobs.....
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trapnel1
New Member
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September 2008
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Help.. Mat brun, by trapnel1 on Jun 13, 2020 13:45:31 GMT 1, Are there not two separate possible problems here:
Mat burn, which would be due to acidic damage from the mat...
Or
UV fading / discolouration of the exposed part of the print.
Do you know which was involved? (or could be a little of both....)
Are there not two separate possible problems here:
Mat burn, which would be due to acidic damage from the mat...
Or
UV fading / discolouration of the exposed part of the print.
Do you know which was involved? (or could be a little of both....)
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1st Design
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 154
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August 2011
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Help.. Mat brun, by 1st Design on Jun 13, 2020 14:26:46 GMT 1, thanks for all the interest, I appreciate that:)
As I remember when we separated the prints from frame 3 months ago there was only some very light mat burns. I think the "situation" with the darker mat burns area is the same as 3 months ago only very light visible, and the new "situation is these white/light area like flames is visible but only in bright daylight and the print laying flat. I think the first "situation" with the mat line with at darker area has come because of non UV protection, but I can be wrong..
It sound like main theory is that the conservator have tried to bleached out mat burn, this is also my theory tight now. Is this bleached method better or worse if it has taken a little af the darker area?
Do you guys think it is a big deal or just another "banksy nerd there only want a mint condition print"?
thanks for all the interest, I appreciate that:)
As I remember when we separated the prints from frame 3 months ago there was only some very light mat burns. I think the "situation" with the darker mat burns area is the same as 3 months ago only very light visible, and the new "situation is these white/light area like flames is visible but only in bright daylight and the print laying flat. I think the first "situation" with the mat line with at darker area has come because of non UV protection, but I can be wrong..
It sound like main theory is that the conservator have tried to bleached out mat burn, this is also my theory tight now. Is this bleached method better or worse if it has taken a little af the darker area?
Do you guys think it is a big deal or just another "banksy nerd there only want a mint condition print"?
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1st Design
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 154
๐๐ป 62
August 2011
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Help.. Mat brun, by 1st Design on Jun 13, 2020 14:28:05 GMT 1, Are there not two separate possible problems here: Mat burn, which would be due to acidic damage from the mat... Or UV fading / discolouration of the exposed part of the print. Do you know which was involved? (or could be a little of both....)
Are there not two separate possible problems here: Mat burn, which would be due to acidic damage from the mat... Or UV fading / discolouration of the exposed part of the print. Do you know which was involved? (or could be a little of both....) I think it is mostly UV fading.. |
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JL Broooks
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February 2017
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Help.. Mat brun, by JL Broooks on Jun 13, 2020 14:35:20 GMT 1, To follow-up on the poster above:
1. If itโs UV fading your problem is not the mat, but that the glass type used for framing does not protect well enough against light. Hence the part of the print disposed to light has faded (meaning the part that was under the mat is the true color of the print). Can be checked vs other similar prints wrt color.
2. For me that looks more like mat bleed, i.e. that the mat was not acid free and has bled into the paper discoloring it. Can be checked if you still have pieces of the old mat available.
The โbleachโ marks do look strange - maybe check with other similar prints if they have the same to see if this was a production thing? Anyone here having this print and the same problem?
To follow-up on the poster above:
1. If itโs UV fading your problem is not the mat, but that the glass type used for framing does not protect well enough against light. Hence the part of the print disposed to light has faded (meaning the part that was under the mat is the true color of the print). Can be checked vs other similar prints wrt color.
2. For me that looks more like mat bleed, i.e. that the mat was not acid free and has bled into the paper discoloring it. Can be checked if you still have pieces of the old mat available.
The โbleachโ marks do look strange - maybe check with other similar prints if they have the same to see if this was a production thing? Anyone here having this print and the same problem?
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1st Design
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 154
๐๐ป 62
August 2011
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Help.. Mat brun, by 1st Design on Jun 13, 2020 21:36:50 GMT 1, To follow-up on the poster above: 1. If itโs UV fading your problem is not the mat, but that the glass type used for framing does not protect well enough against light. Hence the part of the print disposed to light has faded (meaning the part that was under the mat is the true color of the print). Can be checked vs other similar prints wrt color. 2. For me that looks more like mat bleed, i.e. that the mat was not acid free and has bled into the paper discoloring it. Can be checked if you still have pieces of the old mat available. The โbleachโ marks do look strange - maybe check with other similar prints if they have the same to see if this was a production thing? Anyone here having this print and the same problem?
Thanks for the info. I Think you are right in the UV fading, there have only been Used โnormalโ with the Old framing, this is also one of the reasons I upgrade the new framing with TruVu Optium Museums Acryl.
Can mat bleed make some โwhite/lighterโ areas? The frameman told me he understand from the consevator that the light white areas allways have been there (original) so it Can Maybe be the reason?
To follow-up on the poster above: 1. If itโs UV fading your problem is not the mat, but that the glass type used for framing does not protect well enough against light. Hence the part of the print disposed to light has faded (meaning the part that was under the mat is the true color of the print). Can be checked vs other similar prints wrt color. 2. For me that looks more like mat bleed, i.e. that the mat was not acid free and has bled into the paper discoloring it. Can be checked if you still have pieces of the old mat available. The โbleachโ marks do look strange - maybe check with other similar prints if they have the same to see if this was a production thing? Anyone here having this print and the same problem? Thanks for the info. I Think you are right in the UV fading, there have only been Used โnormalโ with the Old framing, this is also one of the reasons I upgrade the new framing with TruVu Optium Museums Acryl. Can mat bleed make some โwhite/lighterโ areas? The frameman told me he understand from the consevator that the light white areas allways have been there (original) so it Can Maybe be the reason? |
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1st Design
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 154
๐๐ป 62
August 2011
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Help.. Mat brun, by 1st Design on Jun 13, 2020 21:37:41 GMT 1, To follow-up on the poster above: 1. If itโs UV fading your problem is not the mat, but that the glass type used for framing does not protect well enough against light. Hence the part of the print disposed to light has faded (meaning the part that was under the mat is the true color of the print). Can be checked vs other similar prints wrt color. 2. For me that looks more like mat bleed, i.e. that the mat was not acid free and has bled into the paper discoloring it. Can be checked if you still have pieces of the old mat available. The โbleachโ marks do look strange - maybe check with other similar prints if they have the same to see if this was a production thing? Anyone here having this print and the same problem? Thanks for the info. I Think you are right in the UV fading, there have only been Used โnormalโ with the Old framing, this is also one of the reasons I upgrade the new framing with TruVu Optium Museums Acryl. Can mat bleed make some โwhite/lighterโ areas? The frameman told me he understand from the consevator that the light white areas allways have been there (original) so it Can Maybe be the reason?
โNormalโ glass
To follow-up on the poster above: 1. If itโs UV fading your problem is not the mat, but that the glass type used for framing does not protect well enough against light. Hence the part of the print disposed to light has faded (meaning the part that was under the mat is the true color of the print). Can be checked vs other similar prints wrt color. 2. For me that looks more like mat bleed, i.e. that the mat was not acid free and has bled into the paper discoloring it. Can be checked if you still have pieces of the old mat available. The โbleachโ marks do look strange - maybe check with other similar prints if they have the same to see if this was a production thing? Anyone here having this print and the same problem? Thanks for the info. I Think you are right in the UV fading, there have only been Used โnormalโ with the Old framing, this is also one of the reasons I upgrade the new framing with TruVu Optium Museums Acryl. Can mat bleed make some โwhite/lighterโ areas? The frameman told me he understand from the consevator that the light white areas allways have been there (original) so it Can Maybe be the reason? โNormalโ glass |
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JL Broooks
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 568
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February 2017
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Help.. Mat brun, by JL Broooks on Jun 13, 2020 22:01:03 GMT 1, No - the white areas cannot come from the mat bleed. They were there either originally, or theyโre a result of the restoration process of your conservator. Or some other external impact, but not the mat itself.
No - the white areas cannot come from the mat bleed. They were there either originally, or theyโre a result of the restoration process of your conservator. Or some other external impact, but not the mat itself.
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1st Design
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 154
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August 2011
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Help.. Mat brun, by 1st Design on Jun 14, 2020 8:54:40 GMT 1, Thanks for all the PMโs the prints are not for sale..
Thanks for all the PMโs the prints are not for sale..
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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Help.. Mat brun, by Deleted on Jun 14, 2020 11:31:36 GMT 1, Hereโs a rat of mine - Matt burned but reframed as I think itโs all part of the story. Should even out over the years Iโve been told also..
Hereโs a rat of mine - Matt burned but reframed as I think itโs all part of the story. Should even out over the years Iโve been told also.. |
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lv90210
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,030
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January 2018
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Help.. Mat brun, by lv90210 on Jun 14, 2020 11:41:26 GMT 1, Hereโs a rat of mine - Matt burned but reframed as I think itโs all part of the story. Should even out over the years Iโve been told also..
Looks great.
Hereโs a rat of mine - Matt burned but reframed as I think itโs all part of the story. Should even out over the years Iโve been told also.. Looks great. |
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drip
Junior Member
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February 2015
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Help.. Mat brun, by drip on Jun 14, 2020 11:59:21 GMT 1, Hereโs a rat of mine - Matt burned but reframed as I think itโs all part of the story. Should even out over the years Iโve been told also..
I've always wondered that. Whether you could use one form of damage to reduce the impact of another form of damage. Could you use UV light to fade the mat burn? Or would it just increase the yellowing? Anyone know?
Yours looks smashing though, and I agree that the imperfections are part of the print's history. It's had a life. It's having a life. I know we all want the absolute mintiest of minty-mint for our money, but these are paper items (a very fragile material), produced in a time when Banksy prints weren't exactly the mortgage-winning artworks they are today. They all have a story, they are all, without exception, going to degrade and get worse over time. Like us. Enjoy what you have.
Hereโs a rat of mine - Matt burned but reframed as I think itโs all part of the story. Should even out over the years Iโve been told also.. I've always wondered that. Whether you could use one form of damage to reduce the impact of another form of damage. Could you use UV light to fade the mat burn? Or would it just increase the yellowing? Anyone know? Yours looks smashing though, and I agree that the imperfections are part of the print's history. It's had a life. It's having a life. I know we all want the absolute mintiest of minty-mint for our money, but these are paper items (a very fragile material), produced in a time when Banksy prints weren't exactly the mortgage-winning artworks they are today. They all have a story, they are all, without exception, going to degrade and get worse over time. Like us. Enjoy what you have. |
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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Help.. Mat brun, by Deleted on Jun 14, 2020 13:26:25 GMT 1, Hereโs a rat of mine - Matt burned but reframed as I think itโs all part of the story. Should even out over the years Iโve been told also..
How much are these going for now?
Pretty out of touch with pricing - hard to keep a track nowadays.
Hereโs a rat of mine - Matt burned but reframed as I think itโs all part of the story. Should even out over the years Iโve been told also.. How much are these going for now? Pretty out of touch with pricing - hard to keep a track nowadays. |
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1st Design
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 154
๐๐ป 62
August 2011
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Help.. Mat brun, by 1st Design on Jun 14, 2020 16:24:22 GMT 1, Hereโs a rat of mine - Matt burned but reframed as I think itโs all part of the story. Should even out over the years Iโve been told also.. I've always wondered that. Whether you could use one form of damage to reduce the impact of another form of damage. Could you use UV light to fade the mat burn? Or would it just increase the yellowing? Anyone know? Yours looks smashing though, and I agree that the imperfections are part of the print's history. It's had a life. It's having a life. I know we all want the absolute mintiest of minty-mint for our money, but these are paper items (a very fragile material), produced in a time when Banksy prints weren't exactly the mortgage-winning artworks they are today. They all have a story, they are all, without exception, going to degrade and get worse over time. Like us. Enjoy what you have.
Do you Think it is more โdamageโ with the white area?
Hereโs a rat of mine - Matt burned but reframed as I think itโs all part of the story. Should even out over the years Iโve been told also.. I've always wondered that. Whether you could use one form of damage to reduce the impact of another form of damage. Could you use UV light to fade the mat burn? Or would it just increase the yellowing? Anyone know? Yours looks smashing though, and I agree that the imperfections are part of the print's history. It's had a life. It's having a life. I know we all want the absolute mintiest of minty-mint for our money, but these are paper items (a very fragile material), produced in a time when Banksy prints weren't exactly the mortgage-winning artworks they are today. They all have a story, they are all, without exception, going to degrade and get worse over time. Like us. Enjoy what you have. Do you Think it is more โdamageโ with the white area? |
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drip
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,419
๐๐ป 5,064
February 2015
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Help.. Mat brun, by drip on Jun 14, 2020 17:03:28 GMT 1, I've always wondered that. Whether you could use one form of damage to reduce the impact of another form of damage. Could you use UV light to fade the mat burn? Or would it just increase the yellowing? Anyone know? Yours looks smashing though, and I agree that the imperfections are part of the print's history. It's had a life. It's having a life. I know we all want the absolute mintiest of minty-mint for our money, but these are paper items (a very fragile material), produced in a time when Banksy prints weren't exactly the mortgage-winning artworks they are today. They all have a story, they are all, without exception, going to degrade and get worse over time. Like us. Enjoy what you have. Do you Think it is more โdamageโ with the white area?
I've always wondered that. Whether you could use one form of damage to reduce the impact of another form of damage. Could you use UV light to fade the mat burn? Or would it just increase the yellowing? Anyone know? Yours looks smashing though, and I agree that the imperfections are part of the print's history. It's had a life. It's having a life. I know we all want the absolute mintiest of minty-mint for our money, but these are paper items (a very fragile material), produced in a time when Banksy prints weren't exactly the mortgage-winning artworks they are today. They all have a story, they are all, without exception, going to degrade and get worse over time. Like us. Enjoy what you have. Do you Think it is more โdamageโ with the white area? I'm sorry, but I don't know. |
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1st Design
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 154
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August 2011
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Help.. Mat brun, by 1st Design on Jun 15, 2020 14:55:24 GMT 1, Do you Think it is more โdamageโ with the white area? I'm sorry, but I don't know. 
Do you Think it is more โdamageโ with the white area? I'm sorry, but I don't know. Thanks, I also think it is difficult to made the right answer. I have not paid the conservator yet and I am awaiting his return maybe he can fix it?? |
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vyrsace
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 108
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June 2020
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Help.. Mat brun, by vyrsace on Jun 18, 2020 15:16:42 GMT 1, Hereโs a rat of mine - Matt burned but reframed as I think itโs all part of the story. Should even out over the years Iโve been told also.. How much are these going for now? Pretty out of touch with pricing - hard to keep a track nowadays.
Got to love a guy who buys art for vanity and not appreciation of expression. LOL How much is freedom of speech going for nowadays? LOL
Hereโs a rat of mine - Matt burned but reframed as I think itโs all part of the story. Should even out over the years Iโve been told also.. How much are these going for now? Pretty out of touch with pricing - hard to keep a track nowadays. Got to love a guy who buys art for vanity and not appreciation of expression. LOL How much is freedom of speech going for nowadays? LOL |
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