Natas
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Natas on Dec 30, 2010 11:53:07 GMT 1, As there’s quite a bit a speculation here’s my view which is purely my view on what may be. Colour ways of 25 – Only a small edition and I’m seeing a lot these getting framed and those that didn’t get one direct may have paid a premium therefore once there in the hands of collectors they are not going to be in a rush to sell at below what they paid. Unlikely to see these at a low price any time soon once all are in the hands of those that they should be in. Grey 100 – More likely to see these crop up in 2011 only time will tell what the secondary market price will be for these but 100 is still a low edition. When coloured trolleys was released they were being flipped for £3-3.7k before ebay was flooded and then once they sold the price went up months later and then tanked recently during the recession. But this was a huge edition! QJ Grey – Unlikely that more than 20% of these will be flipped which is 11 prints max (IMO only). Once there in the hands of collectors and on the walls only the odd one will appear for sale now and again. Price will depend on whose chasing the print at the time.
Just my opinion and I’m not a clairvoyant.
As there’s quite a bit a speculation here’s my view which is purely my view on what may be. Colour ways of 25 – Only a small edition and I’m seeing a lot these getting framed and those that didn’t get one direct may have paid a premium therefore once there in the hands of collectors they are not going to be in a rush to sell at below what they paid. Unlikely to see these at a low price any time soon once all are in the hands of those that they should be in. Grey 100 – More likely to see these crop up in 2011 only time will tell what the secondary market price will be for these but 100 is still a low edition. When coloured trolleys was released they were being flipped for £3-3.7k before ebay was flooded and then once they sold the price went up months later and then tanked recently during the recession. But this was a huge edition! QJ Grey – Unlikely that more than 20% of these will be flipped which is 11 prints max (IMO only). Once there in the hands of collectors and on the walls only the odd one will appear for sale now and again. Price will depend on whose chasing the print at the time.
Just my opinion and I’m not a clairvoyant.
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Warm Gun
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August 2009
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Warm Gun on Dec 30, 2010 11:54:13 GMT 1, "the local eastern european mafia" anything better to come up with mate? I'm sorry but that's s**t, next thing we'll hear is they steal jobs here... Hi I bought few CYW in the last 2 weeks; I have to say that I have deal with only English people, some of them having 3 or 4 CYW0. I did ask: HOW did you manage o get so many Prints? English Men: I was on the queue with my Son, Brother in low and fried from work, my wife couldn’t make it because is in the Hospital having the 2nd baby, so next year I planning to bring hem to queue. JA, JA
Hmmm, I wonder who that was then?
Can't be many forum members who made the que and were expecting a baby so close to christmas. I must say, it does ring a bell.......
"the local eastern european mafia" anything better to come up with mate? I'm sorry but that's s**t, next thing we'll hear is they steal jobs here... Hi I bought few CYW in the last 2 weeks; I have to say that I have deal with only English people, some of them having 3 or 4 CYW0. I did ask: HOW did you manage o get so many Prints? English Men: I was on the queue with my Son, Brother in low and fried from work, my wife couldn’t make it because is in the Hospital having the 2nd baby, so next year I planning to bring hem to queue. JA, JA Hmmm, I wonder who that was then? Can't be many forum members who made the que and were expecting a baby so close to christmas. I must say, it does ring a bell.......
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by whataplumb on Dec 30, 2010 12:00:10 GMT 1, I agree Carl. I am also looking for a yellow and pink CYW. However, they are rare as hens teeth. I have a QJ Grey to swap, but offers from other colours only so far. Last one on ebay went for 3700. Would sell at this price and find one in private sale, but the chances are slim.
I agree Carl. I am also looking for a yellow and pink CYW. However, they are rare as hens teeth. I have a QJ Grey to swap, but offers from other colours only so far. Last one on ebay went for 3700. Would sell at this price and find one in private sale, but the chances are slim.
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Ruggs
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Ruggs on Dec 30, 2010 12:05:11 GMT 1, Hi I bought few CYW in the last 2 weeks; I have to say that I have deal with only English people, some of them having 3 or 4 CYW0. I did ask: HOW did you manage o get so many Prints? English Men: I was on the queue with my Son, Brother in low and fried from work, my wife couldn’t make it because is in the Hospital having the 2nd baby, so next year I planning to bring hem to queue. JA, JA Hmmm, I wonder who that was then? Can't be many forum members who made the que and were expecting a baby so close to christmas. I must say, it does ring a bell.......
I was very close to one family at Commercial Street. Mum, dad, daughter, friends etc, etc. They eventually got theirs at Berwick Street. Reckon they weren't the only ones though.
Hi I bought few CYW in the last 2 weeks; I have to say that I have deal with only English people, some of them having 3 or 4 CYW0. I did ask: HOW did you manage o get so many Prints? English Men: I was on the queue with my Son, Brother in low and fried from work, my wife couldn’t make it because is in the Hospital having the 2nd baby, so next year I planning to bring hem to queue. JA, JA Hmmm, I wonder who that was then? Can't be many forum members who made the que and were expecting a baby so close to christmas. I must say, it does ring a bell....... I was very close to one family at Commercial Street. Mum, dad, daughter, friends etc, etc. They eventually got theirs at Berwick Street. Reckon they weren't the only ones though.
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Natas
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June 2007
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Natas on Dec 30, 2010 12:05:37 GMT 1, I agree Carl. I am also looking for a yellow and pink CYW. However, they are rare as hens teeth. I have a QJ Grey to swap, but offers from other colours only so far. Last one on ebay went for 3700. Would sell at this price and find one in private sale, but the chances are slim.
Good luck heres all fingers and toes crossed for you ;D
I agree Carl. I am also looking for a yellow and pink CYW. However, they are rare as hens teeth. I have a QJ Grey to swap, but offers from other colours only so far. Last one on ebay went for 3700. Would sell at this price and find one in private sale, but the chances are slim. Good luck heres all fingers and toes crossed for you ;D
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Ruggs
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Ruggs on Dec 30, 2010 12:06:31 GMT 1, Anyone know if carl1 got one? Ruggs, I did get one and as you can imagine had quite a few offers which was the intention so I could pick the lowest offer vrs location and the quick timeframe. I paid £3850 , I know I could have waited and got one cheaper on ebay but I wanted it for Christmas day and was prepared to pay a bit over the odds to have the deal done within a day due to it being so close to Christmas. And to get people interested within a day and prepared to sell and meet me in London that extra bit of cash insentive worked.
Well done getting your print carl1.
Anyone know if carl1 got one? Ruggs, I did get one and as you can imagine had quite a few offers which was the intention so I could pick the lowest offer vrs location and the quick timeframe. I paid £3850 , I know I could have waited and got one cheaper on ebay but I wanted it for Christmas day and was prepared to pay a bit over the odds to have the deal done within a day due to it being so close to Christmas. And to get people interested within a day and prepared to sell and meet me in London that extra bit of cash insentive worked. Well done getting your print carl1.
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Natas
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June 2007
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Natas on Dec 30, 2010 12:09:34 GMT 1, Hmmm, I wonder who that was then? Can't be many forum members who made the que and were expecting a baby so close to christmas. I must say, it does ring a bell....... I was very close to one family at Commercial Street. Mum, dad, daughter, friends etc, etc. They eventually got theirs at Berwick Street. Reckon they weren't the only ones.
You can't blame people for wanting to make money, they have no interest in the art but have heard that if they all queue up here overnight they can buy a new family car or go on a nice trip to Florida. If I heard that and was not interested in Banksy or art I would be there in a shot and maybe even dig up the grandma as well.
You just need to be one step ahead of them.
Hmmm, I wonder who that was then? Can't be many forum members who made the que and were expecting a baby so close to christmas. I must say, it does ring a bell....... I was very close to one family at Commercial Street. Mum, dad, daughter, friends etc, etc. They eventually got theirs at Berwick Street. Reckon they weren't the only ones. You can't blame people for wanting to make money, they have no interest in the art but have heard that if they all queue up here overnight they can buy a new family car or go on a nice trip to Florida. If I heard that and was not interested in Banksy or art I would be there in a shot and maybe even dig up the grandma as well. You just need to be one step ahead of them.
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Ruggs
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Ruggs on Dec 30, 2010 12:11:39 GMT 1, I agree Carl. I am also looking for a yellow and pink CYW. However, they are rare as hens teeth. I have a QJ Grey to swap, but offers from other colours only so far. Last one on ebay went for 3700. Would sell at this price and find one in private sale, but the chances are slim.
Noticed Artificial Gallery have reserved their hot pink version. Goodness knows how much that one went for!
www.artificialgallery.co.uk/banksy/choose-your-weapon/
I agree Carl. I am also looking for a yellow and pink CYW. However, they are rare as hens teeth. I have a QJ Grey to swap, but offers from other colours only so far. Last one on ebay went for 3700. Would sell at this price and find one in private sale, but the chances are slim. Noticed Artificial Gallery have reserved their hot pink version. Goodness knows how much that one went for! www.artificialgallery.co.uk/banksy/choose-your-weapon/
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Warm Gun
Junior Member
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August 2009
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Warm Gun on Dec 30, 2010 12:16:09 GMT 1, I agree Carl. I am also looking for a yellow and pink CYW. However, they are rare as hens teeth. I have a QJ Grey to swap, but offers from other colours only so far. Last one on ebay went for 3700. Would sell at this price and find one in private sale, but the chances are slim.
You're not looking very hard, four yellow and three pink have 'sold' on the bay.
There is also a queue jumping grey listed for £3500 or best offer on the bay, that's about £350 in fees so if I was a buying one privately I'd be looking to knock that fee off as well.
I agree Carl. I am also looking for a yellow and pink CYW. However, they are rare as hens teeth. I have a QJ Grey to swap, but offers from other colours only so far. Last one on ebay went for 3700. Would sell at this price and find one in private sale, but the chances are slim. You're not looking very hard, four yellow and three pink have 'sold' on the bay. There is also a queue jumping grey listed for £3500 or best offer on the bay, that's about £350 in fees so if I was a buying one privately I'd be looking to knock that fee off as well.
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Warm Gun
Junior Member
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Warm Gun on Dec 30, 2010 12:26:06 GMT 1, Dear POW, I was going to queue last night but decided I couldn't be arsed with what was always going to be an absolute shambles. You are gifting the local eastern european mafia a gilt edged opportunity to make some change. Now they've seen the financial upside that can be made (this year) then it's pretty clear that any future release will be (socially and morally) worse. After all, to some extent, you're dealing with London's criminal underbelly who might view people trafficing into prostitution as an acceptable business practise. Which it's not. The reality is that if you continue to release art which is substantially below market price then this will continue - I personally don't buy the 'any publicity is good publicity' gig and would note that the artist's desire to publicise the cause of Voina is long forgotten. Moan, moan, moan - I love the art but not more than I love the opportunity to make two grand for f**k nothing..... "the local eastern european mafia" anything better to come up with mate? I'm sorry but that's s**t, next thing we'll hear is they steal jobs here...
I wouldn't say they steal jobs but if you go to any building site in London at this very moment 75% of the tradesmen working there are polish. Make of that what you will.
Dear POW, I was going to queue last night but decided I couldn't be arsed with what was always going to be an absolute shambles. You are gifting the local eastern european mafia a gilt edged opportunity to make some change. Now they've seen the financial upside that can be made (this year) then it's pretty clear that any future release will be (socially and morally) worse. After all, to some extent, you're dealing with London's criminal underbelly who might view people trafficing into prostitution as an acceptable business practise. Which it's not. The reality is that if you continue to release art which is substantially below market price then this will continue - I personally don't buy the 'any publicity is good publicity' gig and would note that the artist's desire to publicise the cause of Voina is long forgotten. Moan, moan, moan - I love the art but not more than I love the opportunity to make two grand for f**k nothing..... "the local eastern european mafia" anything better to come up with mate? I'm sorry but that's s**t, next thing we'll hear is they steal jobs here... I wouldn't say they steal jobs but if you go to any building site in London at this very moment 75% of the tradesmen working there are polish. Make of that what you will.
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Natas
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June 2007
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Natas on Dec 30, 2010 12:31:24 GMT 1, Will the other 25% be Hungarians come January??
Will the other 25% be Hungarians come January??
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by colinfishwick on Dec 30, 2010 12:43:47 GMT 1, I wouldn't say they steal jobs but if you go to any building site in London at this very moment 75% of the tradesmen working there are polish. Make of that what you will.
i'm sorry but this simply isn't true, you need to be qualified to the relevant standard to be able to work on most UK sites, you also need to CSCS registered and have all your health and safety tests up to date.
if there are tradesman from within the EU who have all this then they are entitled to work here, if they don't then the people contracting them could face fine, prosecution or both.
it is a myth that polish builders or indeed any foreign labour from within the EU is a threat to our workers, to perpetuate this in ignorance is not only lazy but quite offensive in fact.
I wouldn't say they steal jobs but if you go to any building site in London at this very moment 75% of the tradesmen working there are polish. Make of that what you will. i'm sorry but this simply isn't true, you need to be qualified to the relevant standard to be able to work on most UK sites, you also need to CSCS registered and have all your health and safety tests up to date. if there are tradesman from within the EU who have all this then they are entitled to work here, if they don't then the people contracting them could face fine, prosecution or both. it is a myth that polish builders or indeed any foreign labour from within the EU is a threat to our workers, to perpetuate this in ignorance is not only lazy but quite offensive in fact.
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by colinfishwick on Dec 30, 2010 12:52:49 GMT 1, As there’s quite a bit a speculation here’s my view which is purely my view on what may be. Colour ways of 25 – Only a small edition and I’m seeing a lot these getting framed and those that didn’t get one direct may have paid a premium therefore once there in the hands of collectors they are not going to be in a rush to sell at below what they paid. Unlikely to see these at a low price any time soon once all are in the hands of those that they should be in. Grey 100 – More likely to see these crop up in 2011 only time will tell what the secondary market price will be for these but 100 is still a low edition. When coloured trolleys was released they were being flipped for £3-3.7k before ebay was flooded and then once they sold the price went up months later and then tanked recently during the recession. But this was a huge edition! QJ Grey – Unlikely that more than 20% of these will be flipped which is 11 prints max (IMO only). Once there in the hands of collectors and on the walls only the odd one will appear for sale now and again. Price will depend on whose chasing the print at the time. Just my opinion and I’m not a clairvoyant.
my reckoning is that a lot of galleries will look to buy up what they can at relatively cheap prices (£2.5-3K) and just sit on them to give the impression that they're rare and mostly in the hands of collectors, by doing so when they drip feed their supply they hope there will be a scramble and prices will jump massively.
i think they are only in the market for the 25 editions though but will still deal in the others i just don't think they'll stockpile them.
the possible snags for them are a serious change in the financial climate and back in to recession. interest rate rises might also force a few people to re-evaluate their collections and look to cash in, if this happens wholesale then watch values dip.
whatever way you look at it the editions are tiny, Kate and the soup cans are the only real comparable prints to CYW so expect to see a similar, relative, turnover/availability/premium attached.
As there’s quite a bit a speculation here’s my view which is purely my view on what may be. Colour ways of 25 – Only a small edition and I’m seeing a lot these getting framed and those that didn’t get one direct may have paid a premium therefore once there in the hands of collectors they are not going to be in a rush to sell at below what they paid. Unlikely to see these at a low price any time soon once all are in the hands of those that they should be in. Grey 100 – More likely to see these crop up in 2011 only time will tell what the secondary market price will be for these but 100 is still a low edition. When coloured trolleys was released they were being flipped for £3-3.7k before ebay was flooded and then once they sold the price went up months later and then tanked recently during the recession. But this was a huge edition! QJ Grey – Unlikely that more than 20% of these will be flipped which is 11 prints max (IMO only). Once there in the hands of collectors and on the walls only the odd one will appear for sale now and again. Price will depend on whose chasing the print at the time. Just my opinion and I’m not a clairvoyant. my reckoning is that a lot of galleries will look to buy up what they can at relatively cheap prices (£2.5-3K) and just sit on them to give the impression that they're rare and mostly in the hands of collectors, by doing so when they drip feed their supply they hope there will be a scramble and prices will jump massively. i think they are only in the market for the 25 editions though but will still deal in the others i just don't think they'll stockpile them. the possible snags for them are a serious change in the financial climate and back in to recession. interest rate rises might also force a few people to re-evaluate their collections and look to cash in, if this happens wholesale then watch values dip. whatever way you look at it the editions are tiny, Kate and the soup cans are the only real comparable prints to CYW so expect to see a similar, relative, turnover/availability/premium attached.
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Natas
New Member
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June 2007
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Natas on Dec 30, 2010 13:07:51 GMT 1, As there’s quite a bit a speculation here’s my view which is purely my view on what may be. Colour ways of 25 – Only a small edition and I’m seeing a lot these getting framed and those that didn’t get one direct may have paid a premium therefore once there in the hands of collectors they are not going to be in a rush to sell at below what they paid. Unlikely to see these at a low price any time soon once all are in the hands of those that they should be in. Grey 100 – More likely to see these crop up in 2011 only time will tell what the secondary market price will be for these but 100 is still a low edition. When coloured trolleys was released they were being flipped for £3-3.7k before ebay was flooded and then once they sold the price went up months later and then tanked recently during the recession. But this was a huge edition! QJ Grey – Unlikely that more than 20% of these will be flipped which is 11 prints max (IMO only). Once there in the hands of collectors and on the walls only the odd one will appear for sale now and again. Price will depend on whose chasing the print at the time. Just my opinion and I’m not a clairvoyant. my reckoning is that a lot of galleries will look to buy up what they can at relatively cheap prices (£2.5-3K) and just sit on them to give the impression that they're rare and mostly in the hands of collectors, by doing so when they drip feed their supply they hope there will be a scramble and prices will jump massively. i think they are only in the market for the 25 editions though but will still deal in the others i just don't think they'll stockpile them. the possible snags for them are a serious change in the financial climate and back in to recession. interest rate rises might also force a few people to re-evaluate their collections and look to cash in, if this happens wholesale then watch values dip. whatever way you look at it the editions are tiny, Kate and the soup cans are the only real comparable prints to CYW so expect to see a similar, relative, turnover/availability/premium attached.
Agree the cheapest way to get /xx instead of /xxx or /xxxx on the bottom of your print.
As there’s quite a bit a speculation here’s my view which is purely my view on what may be. Colour ways of 25 – Only a small edition and I’m seeing a lot these getting framed and those that didn’t get one direct may have paid a premium therefore once there in the hands of collectors they are not going to be in a rush to sell at below what they paid. Unlikely to see these at a low price any time soon once all are in the hands of those that they should be in. Grey 100 – More likely to see these crop up in 2011 only time will tell what the secondary market price will be for these but 100 is still a low edition. When coloured trolleys was released they were being flipped for £3-3.7k before ebay was flooded and then once they sold the price went up months later and then tanked recently during the recession. But this was a huge edition! QJ Grey – Unlikely that more than 20% of these will be flipped which is 11 prints max (IMO only). Once there in the hands of collectors and on the walls only the odd one will appear for sale now and again. Price will depend on whose chasing the print at the time. Just my opinion and I’m not a clairvoyant. my reckoning is that a lot of galleries will look to buy up what they can at relatively cheap prices (£2.5-3K) and just sit on them to give the impression that they're rare and mostly in the hands of collectors, by doing so when they drip feed their supply they hope there will be a scramble and prices will jump massively. i think they are only in the market for the 25 editions though but will still deal in the others i just don't think they'll stockpile them. the possible snags for them are a serious change in the financial climate and back in to recession. interest rate rises might also force a few people to re-evaluate their collections and look to cash in, if this happens wholesale then watch values dip. whatever way you look at it the editions are tiny, Kate and the soup cans are the only real comparable prints to CYW so expect to see a similar, relative, turnover/availability/premium attached. Agree the cheapest way to get /xx instead of /xxx or /xxxx on the bottom of your print.
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bigtlt
Junior Member
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July 2009
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by bigtlt on Dec 30, 2010 15:51:51 GMT 1, I wouldn't say they steal jobs but if you go to any building site in London at this very moment 75% of the tradesmen working there are polish. Make of that what you will. i'm sorry but this simply isn't true, you need to be qualified to the relevant standard to be able to work on most UK sites, you also need to CSCS registered and have all your health and safety tests up to date. if there are tradesman from within the EU who have all this then they are entitled to work here, if they don't then the people contracting them could face fine, prosecution or both. it is a myth that polish builders or indeed any foreign labour from within the EU is a threat to our workers, to perpetuate this in ignorance is not only lazy but quite offensive in fact.
I work as a builder, and the majority of workers on site now are from the EU.
To deny that workers coming from the EU is a threat is moronic, they are coming and accepting wages of much less than British workers, forcing us out of the jobs. (would you be happy to take a paycut from a job you'd been doing 15/20 years)
The amount of jobs I have had to finish off because the unacceptable work some Polish builders have done is unbelievable... I have priced for jobs leaving next to no profit, just so I have a weekly wage coming in, only to have foreign builders put in prices 40% below. A few weeks/months later you have the same customers ringing back asking you to put this work right.
This obviously isn't the case with all foreign workers, but when there are those out there putting in these ridiculous prices for work, it is forcing proper tradesmens prices down and homeowners at risk.
So to say it is lazy and offensive to say they are a threat, you are so far off the mark you are deluded
I wouldn't say they steal jobs but if you go to any building site in London at this very moment 75% of the tradesmen working there are polish. Make of that what you will. i'm sorry but this simply isn't true, you need to be qualified to the relevant standard to be able to work on most UK sites, you also need to CSCS registered and have all your health and safety tests up to date. if there are tradesman from within the EU who have all this then they are entitled to work here, if they don't then the people contracting them could face fine, prosecution or both. it is a myth that polish builders or indeed any foreign labour from within the EU is a threat to our workers, to perpetuate this in ignorance is not only lazy but quite offensive in fact. I work as a builder, and the majority of workers on site now are from the EU. To deny that workers coming from the EU is a threat is moronic, they are coming and accepting wages of much less than British workers, forcing us out of the jobs. (would you be happy to take a paycut from a job you'd been doing 15/20 years) The amount of jobs I have had to finish off because the unacceptable work some Polish builders have done is unbelievable... I have priced for jobs leaving next to no profit, just so I have a weekly wage coming in, only to have foreign builders put in prices 40% below. A few weeks/months later you have the same customers ringing back asking you to put this work right. This obviously isn't the case with all foreign workers, but when there are those out there putting in these ridiculous prices for work, it is forcing proper tradesmens prices down and homeowners at risk. So to say it is lazy and offensive to say they are a threat, you are so far off the mark you are deluded
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by des77 on Dec 30, 2010 16:00:51 GMT 1, Our tradesman went to germany in the 80'/90's for a better wage and we also flood countrys like australia with cheap labour... personally I see no difference.
Our tradesman went to germany in the 80'/90's for a better wage and we also flood countrys like australia with cheap labour... personally I see no difference.
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Warm Gun
Junior Member
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August 2009
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Warm Gun on Dec 30, 2010 16:29:10 GMT 1, I wouldn't say they steal jobs but if you go to any building site in London at this very moment 75% of the tradesmen working there are polish. Make of that what you will. i'm sorry but this simply isn't true, you need to be qualified to the relevant standard to be able to work on most UK sites, you also need to CSCS registered and have all your health and safety tests up to date. if there are tradesman from within the EU who have all this then they are entitled to work here, if they don't then the people contracting them could face fine, prosecution or both. it is a myth that polish builders or indeed any foreign labour from within the EU is a threat to our workers, to perpetuate this in ignorance is not only lazy but quite offensive in fact.
I think you need to stick your hard hat on and have a wonder around London's building sites. I've been a qualified electrician for 6 years now and see these things from the inside. It now takes three to four years and a fair bit of money to get a city and guilds qualification in electrical installation. Even with that you wouldn't be recognised as an electrician with the governing body until you obtain an NVQ (at least a year and a further £800...sometimes up £2000) add to that the yearly changes in the regulations and the subsequent exams we all need to take to keep up to date (£250 a pop) coupled with building regulations, part p, health and safety etc etc...that's a lot of qualifications just to get onto a site.
I have no idea whatsoever how foreign electricians are able to work on our sites when they don't have these stringent UK only qualifications, and believe me, they do not have them. I'm fully qualified but don't have the NVQ. The NVQ wasn't relevant when I qualified but the governing body back dated their own rules and now you won't be recognised as being qualified until you pay the £800 to take the course. Due to my qualifications and experience I'd actually find it pretty hard to get a job in London because no agency wants to pay the going rate for an electrician (ironically set by the governing body mentioned before). They want cheap labour which often equates to foreign labour which means standards aren't met as relevant qualifications aren't held. Company's and agencies don't care.
It's dead out there for electricians unless you're Polish. Off the top of my head I know 20 electricians who are out of work and unable to find work in that trade despite all the work that is currently being done in London. One particular chap I know has signed up with thirty or so agencies and has had one call in the last four months. Dead as a dodo until it go's belly up and they they'll be calling out for us lads to go in and fix everything that blew up when the power was switched on.
This is the sole reason why Wembly stadium went tits up. 70-80% foriegn work force....all the electrics had to be redone, by properly qualified electrictions. the sewage system also leaked like a sieve and had to be re-done.
I wouldn't say they steal jobs but if you go to any building site in London at this very moment 75% of the tradesmen working there are polish. Make of that what you will. i'm sorry but this simply isn't true, you need to be qualified to the relevant standard to be able to work on most UK sites, you also need to CSCS registered and have all your health and safety tests up to date. if there are tradesman from within the EU who have all this then they are entitled to work here, if they don't then the people contracting them could face fine, prosecution or both. it is a myth that polish builders or indeed any foreign labour from within the EU is a threat to our workers, to perpetuate this in ignorance is not only lazy but quite offensive in fact. I think you need to stick your hard hat on and have a wonder around London's building sites. I've been a qualified electrician for 6 years now and see these things from the inside. It now takes three to four years and a fair bit of money to get a city and guilds qualification in electrical installation. Even with that you wouldn't be recognised as an electrician with the governing body until you obtain an NVQ (at least a year and a further £800...sometimes up £2000) add to that the yearly changes in the regulations and the subsequent exams we all need to take to keep up to date (£250 a pop) coupled with building regulations, part p, health and safety etc etc...that's a lot of qualifications just to get onto a site. I have no idea whatsoever how foreign electricians are able to work on our sites when they don't have these stringent UK only qualifications, and believe me, they do not have them. I'm fully qualified but don't have the NVQ. The NVQ wasn't relevant when I qualified but the governing body back dated their own rules and now you won't be recognised as being qualified until you pay the £800 to take the course. Due to my qualifications and experience I'd actually find it pretty hard to get a job in London because no agency wants to pay the going rate for an electrician (ironically set by the governing body mentioned before). They want cheap labour which often equates to foreign labour which means standards aren't met as relevant qualifications aren't held. Company's and agencies don't care. It's dead out there for electricians unless you're Polish. Off the top of my head I know 20 electricians who are out of work and unable to find work in that trade despite all the work that is currently being done in London. One particular chap I know has signed up with thirty or so agencies and has had one call in the last four months. Dead as a dodo until it go's belly up and they they'll be calling out for us lads to go in and fix everything that blew up when the power was switched on. This is the sole reason why Wembly stadium went tits up. 70-80% foriegn work force....all the electrics had to be redone, by properly qualified electrictions. the sewage system also leaked like a sieve and had to be re-done.
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redfred
Junior Member
🗨️ 1,293
👍🏻 53
May 2006
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by redfred on Dec 30, 2010 16:38:22 GMT 1, You pay peanuts and you get monkeys has never been truer. For a long time now the bean counters(accountants) have been running the big jobs instead of Engineers, this is now coming home to roost.
You pay peanuts and you get monkeys has never been truer. For a long time now the bean counters(accountants) have been running the big jobs instead of Engineers, this is now coming home to roost.
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by howlinhooker on Dec 30, 2010 18:06:44 GMT 1, shame warmgun ....that we dont look after are own qualified tradsman ........1 day it will backfire big time i m o ............like you say wembley stadium what a mess !!!!! but now i know where to come to get some good (cheap) electrics done
shame warmgun ....that we dont look after are own qualified tradsman ........1 day it will backfire big time i m o ............like you say wembley stadium what a mess !!!!! but now i know where to come to get some good (cheap) electrics done
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bullet
Blank Rank
🗨️ 0
👍🏻 16
January 2013
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by bullet on Dec 30, 2010 18:16:47 GMT 1, shame warmgun ....that we dont look after are own qualified tradsman ........1 day it will backfire big time i m o ............like you say wembley stadium what a mess !!!!! but now i know where to come to get some good (cheap) electrics done
A polish guy did our electrics, never had a problem with any sort of p w r c t s
shame warmgun ....that we dont look after are own qualified tradsman ........1 day it will backfire big time i m o ............like you say wembley stadium what a mess !!!!! but now i know where to come to get some good (cheap) electrics done A polish guy did our electrics, never had a problem with any sort of p w r c t s
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by colinfishwick on Dec 30, 2010 18:24:12 GMT 1, I work as a builder, and the majority of workers on site now are from the EU. To deny that workers coming from the EU is a threat is moronic, they are coming and accepting wages of much less than British workers, forcing us out of the jobs. (would you be happy to take a paycut from a job you'd been doing 15/20 years) The amount of jobs I have had to finish off because the unacceptable work some Polish builders have done is unbelievable... I have priced for jobs leaving next to no profit, just so I have a weekly wage coming in, only to have foreign builders put in prices 40% below. A few weeks/months later you have the same customers ringing back asking you to put this work right. This obviously isn't the case with all foreign workers, but when there are those out there putting in these ridiculous prices for work, it is forcing proper tradesmens prices down and homeowners at risk. So to say it is lazy and offensive to say they are a threat, you are so far off the mark you are deluded
with respect i'm not deluded, i've worked in the building trade for 15 years, i've seen wages quadruple in that time period and the standard of work diminish ten fold - and that is from English/British workmen!!
it used to be the case that you couldn't get a decent plumber or sparky, therefore prices went through the roof, now that we are seeing a correction in wages and prices accordingly people like yourself are crying because you don't earn three times the national average - or more even - these days.
if you're good at what you do then you will always get work, my firm has been flat out this year. yes, margins are down significantly but we're still able to pick and choose what we do and have been taking on extra labour in 2010 not laying blokes off.
if a customer/client get good a good tradesman with top notch testimonials at a decent price then they will, if they fail to take due diligence at the point of instructing a contractor then they will end up in the shit state you describe - but please, whatever you do, don't make out us British are any better than those from the EU that are coming over. Bricklayers in particular in this country are shocking, i'm a roof slater/tiler and i can lay bricks better than 90% of the brickies that go before me.
it might be a different story in the north west, i don't purport to be an expert in your area but here in the south east i'd welcome anyone from any country that has got a bit of go in them - so many blokes on site these days haven't got a days work in them IMHO.
I work as a builder, and the majority of workers on site now are from the EU. To deny that workers coming from the EU is a threat is moronic, they are coming and accepting wages of much less than British workers, forcing us out of the jobs. (would you be happy to take a paycut from a job you'd been doing 15/20 years) The amount of jobs I have had to finish off because the unacceptable work some Polish builders have done is unbelievable... I have priced for jobs leaving next to no profit, just so I have a weekly wage coming in, only to have foreign builders put in prices 40% below. A few weeks/months later you have the same customers ringing back asking you to put this work right. This obviously isn't the case with all foreign workers, but when there are those out there putting in these ridiculous prices for work, it is forcing proper tradesmens prices down and homeowners at risk. So to say it is lazy and offensive to say they are a threat, you are so far off the mark you are deluded with respect i'm not deluded, i've worked in the building trade for 15 years, i've seen wages quadruple in that time period and the standard of work diminish ten fold - and that is from English/British workmen!! it used to be the case that you couldn't get a decent plumber or sparky, therefore prices went through the roof, now that we are seeing a correction in wages and prices accordingly people like yourself are crying because you don't earn three times the national average - or more even - these days. if you're good at what you do then you will always get work, my firm has been flat out this year. yes, margins are down significantly but we're still able to pick and choose what we do and have been taking on extra labour in 2010 not laying blokes off. if a customer/client get good a good tradesman with top notch testimonials at a decent price then they will, if they fail to take due diligence at the point of instructing a contractor then they will end up in the shit state you describe - but please, whatever you do, don't make out us British are any better than those from the EU that are coming over. Bricklayers in particular in this country are shocking, i'm a roof slater/tiler and i can lay bricks better than 90% of the brickies that go before me. it might be a different story in the north west, i don't purport to be an expert in your area but here in the south east i'd welcome anyone from any country that has got a bit of go in them - so many blokes on site these days haven't got a days work in them IMHO.
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by colinfishwick on Dec 30, 2010 18:32:03 GMT 1, I think you need to stick your hard hat on and have a wonder around London's building sites. I've been a qualified electrician for 6 years now and see these things from the inside. It now takes three to four years and a fair bit of money to get a city and guilds qualification in electrical installation. Even with that you wouldn't be recognised as an electrician with the governing body until you obtain an NVQ (at least a year and a further £800...sometimes up £2000) add to that the yearly changes in the regulations and the subsequent exams we all need to take to keep up to date (£250 a pop) coupled with building regulations, part p, health and safety etc etc...that's a lot of qualifications just to get onto a site. I have no idea whatsoever how foreign electricians are able to work on our sites when they don't have these stringent UK only qualifications, and believe me, they do not have them. I'm fully qualified but don't have the NVQ. The NVQ wasn't relevant when I qualified but the governing body back dated their own rules and now you won't be recognised as being qualified until you pay the £800 to take the course. Due to my qualifications and experience I'd actually find it pretty hard to get a job in London because no agency wants to pay the going rate for an electrician (ironically set by the governing body mentioned before). They want cheap labour which often equates to foreign labour which means standards aren't met as relevant qualifications aren't held. Company's and agencies don't care. It's dead out there for electricians unless you're Polish. Off the top of my head I know 20 electricians who are out of work and unable to find work in that trade despite all the work that is currently being done in London. One particular chap I know has signed up with thirty or so agencies and has had one call in the last four months. Dead as a dodo until it go's belly up and they they'll be calling out for us lads to go in and fix everything that blew up when the power was switched on. This is the sole reason why Wembly stadium went tits up. 70-80% foriegn work force....all the electrics had to be redone, by properly qualified electrictions. the sewage system also leaked like a sieve and had to be re-done.
i don't want to patronise you in any way Warmgun and i genuinely feel for anyone struggling to find work but you would have started out as a spark when prices and wages were at their peak. i know of a good half dozen blokes who got headhunted to do the Jubilee Line extension about 10 years ago or so, they were earning good money for the time circa £40K a year and were offered two years work for £120K a year!! things went mental through the late 90's early 2000's, in terms of prices and inflated wages - many of the sparkys i know in Kent are still earning £55K+ a year and that is as an employee on the cards.
times are hard by comparison but historically the money is still good, the cream rises to the top eventually so keep working hard, be reliable and the best at what you do and the rest will take care of itself. if nothing else, a flooded labour market will discourage people from taking up a trade and in a generations time there will be another shortfall and you lot will clean up again, until then get your head down and get on with it i say, stop moaning about competition - it exists in every free market on the planet.
I think you need to stick your hard hat on and have a wonder around London's building sites. I've been a qualified electrician for 6 years now and see these things from the inside. It now takes three to four years and a fair bit of money to get a city and guilds qualification in electrical installation. Even with that you wouldn't be recognised as an electrician with the governing body until you obtain an NVQ (at least a year and a further £800...sometimes up £2000) add to that the yearly changes in the regulations and the subsequent exams we all need to take to keep up to date (£250 a pop) coupled with building regulations, part p, health and safety etc etc...that's a lot of qualifications just to get onto a site. I have no idea whatsoever how foreign electricians are able to work on our sites when they don't have these stringent UK only qualifications, and believe me, they do not have them. I'm fully qualified but don't have the NVQ. The NVQ wasn't relevant when I qualified but the governing body back dated their own rules and now you won't be recognised as being qualified until you pay the £800 to take the course. Due to my qualifications and experience I'd actually find it pretty hard to get a job in London because no agency wants to pay the going rate for an electrician (ironically set by the governing body mentioned before). They want cheap labour which often equates to foreign labour which means standards aren't met as relevant qualifications aren't held. Company's and agencies don't care. It's dead out there for electricians unless you're Polish. Off the top of my head I know 20 electricians who are out of work and unable to find work in that trade despite all the work that is currently being done in London. One particular chap I know has signed up with thirty or so agencies and has had one call in the last four months. Dead as a dodo until it go's belly up and they they'll be calling out for us lads to go in and fix everything that blew up when the power was switched on. This is the sole reason why Wembly stadium went tits up. 70-80% foriegn work force....all the electrics had to be redone, by properly qualified electrictions. the sewage system also leaked like a sieve and had to be re-done. i don't want to patronise you in any way Warmgun and i genuinely feel for anyone struggling to find work but you would have started out as a spark when prices and wages were at their peak. i know of a good half dozen blokes who got headhunted to do the Jubilee Line extension about 10 years ago or so, they were earning good money for the time circa £40K a year and were offered two years work for £120K a year!! things went mental through the late 90's early 2000's, in terms of prices and inflated wages - many of the sparkys i know in Kent are still earning £55K+ a year and that is as an employee on the cards. times are hard by comparison but historically the money is still good, the cream rises to the top eventually so keep working hard, be reliable and the best at what you do and the rest will take care of itself. if nothing else, a flooded labour market will discourage people from taking up a trade and in a generations time there will be another shortfall and you lot will clean up again, until then get your head down and get on with it i say, stop moaning about competition - it exists in every free market on the planet.
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by stevieray101 on Jan 4, 2011 17:55:28 GMT 1, just had a look for completed listing on ebay - the prints sold for under £3k were all greys.
the coloured ones are still fetching a premium, but they might be shill bids.
does any one else think that the high prices are due to the idiot that posted first on ebay and asked for £10k for his print? monkey see, monkey do.
just had a look for completed listing on ebay - the prints sold for under £3k were all greys.
the coloured ones are still fetching a premium, but they might be shill bids.
does any one else think that the high prices are due to the idiot that posted first on ebay and asked for £10k for his print? monkey see, monkey do.
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Nico
New Member
🗨️ 590
👍🏻 32
July 2009
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Nico on Jan 4, 2011 19:54:44 GMT 1, just had a look for completed listing on ebay - the prints sold for under £3k were all greys. the coloured ones are still fetching a premium, but they might be shill bids. does any one else think that the high prices are due to the idiot that posted first on ebay and asked for £10k for his print? monkey see, monkey do.
I don't think so.
Everyone who knows Banksy prints (u usually do when you are ready to spend 3k) and Ebay, is aware that some idiots will always try to sell 3-4 times the real market value. Doesn't ever determine market value!
IMO anyway..
just had a look for completed listing on ebay - the prints sold for under £3k were all greys. the coloured ones are still fetching a premium, but they might be shill bids. does any one else think that the high prices are due to the idiot that posted first on ebay and asked for £10k for his print? monkey see, monkey do. I don't think so. Everyone who knows Banksy prints (u usually do when you are ready to spend 3k) and Ebay, is aware that some idiots will always try to sell 3-4 times the real market value. Doesn't ever determine market value! IMO anyway..
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by colinfishwick on Jan 4, 2011 20:27:52 GMT 1, i'd say it's more to do with the low ed. no's and people's assumption that if last year's NBG goes for say £2.5k? then CYW must be more, i'm not sure that's a fair assumption as there are more CYW's than NBG's in total but it's a little like comparing apples to oranges and markets will ultimately determine a fair price.
so the greys are going under £3k now?
i'd say it's more to do with the low ed. no's and people's assumption that if last year's NBG goes for say £2.5k? then CYW must be more, i'm not sure that's a fair assumption as there are more CYW's than NBG's in total but it's a little like comparing apples to oranges and markets will ultimately determine a fair price.
so the greys are going under £3k now?
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Warm Gun
Junior Member
🗨️ 4,646
👍🏻 1,130
August 2009
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by Warm Gun on Jan 4, 2011 21:04:54 GMT 1, No idea what that above post means but yeah, a few greys have gone for under £3k
No idea what that above post means but yeah, a few greys have gone for under £3k
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by rottenredrooster on Jan 4, 2011 21:10:00 GMT 1, No idea what that above post means but yeah, a few greys have gone for under £3k
Do you know if any queue jumping gone for under 3K?
No idea what that above post means but yeah, a few greys have gone for under £3k Do you know if any queue jumping gone for under 3K?
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by truetiger on Jan 4, 2011 21:12:55 GMT 1, Some greys have gone under 2800 wether its edition of 58 or 100 i dont know
Some greys have gone under 2800 wether its edition of 58 or 100 i dont know
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by rottenredrooster on Jan 4, 2011 21:13:14 GMT 1, No idea what that above post means but yeah, a few greys have gone for under £3k Do you know if any queue jumping gone for under 3K?
Ignore: just saw the above post with the prices
No idea what that above post means but yeah, a few greys have gone for under £3k Do you know if any queue jumping gone for under 3K? Ignore: just saw the above post with the prices
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Banksy • Choose Your Weapon, GREY Queue Jumping, by colinfishwick on Jan 4, 2011 22:26:08 GMT 1, No idea what that above post means but yeah, a few greys have gone for under £3k
lol! - just thinking the same thing...
i think that's a good sign, the grey was my favourite out of the lot but i wouldn't swap my slate now for any of them!!
No idea what that above post means but yeah, a few greys have gone for under £3k lol! - just thinking the same thing... i think that's a good sign, the grey was my favourite out of the lot but i wouldn't swap my slate now for any of them!!
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