pezlow
Junior Member
Posts โข 5,388
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January 2007
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by pezlow on Feb 18, 2008 15:15:58 GMT 1, I a way I agree with James as well. There seem to be a large number of threads on here of artists pedalling pretty standard fare. I don't criticise the artists for doing so but it does mean having to wade through an awful lot of stuff that is of little or no interest.
I can't help felling the commercial aspect of this scene is all getting a little out of hand. ยฃ4k for a Dface collage, ยฃ1k for a Micallef print edition of 400, people queueing for hours at shows just to buy a print to flip (nb I am not saying everyone in the queue is a flipper), the madness of bonhams, the endless talk of value and prices etc etc.
When you add to that the fact that nearly every other contributor to this forum is now an "artist" who wants money for their work there is a huge disconnect between the original ethos of this scene and the way it is now mutating.
I a way I agree with James as well. There seem to be a large number of threads on here of artists pedalling pretty standard fare. I don't criticise the artists for doing so but it does mean having to wade through an awful lot of stuff that is of little or no interest.
I can't help felling the commercial aspect of this scene is all getting a little out of hand. ยฃ4k for a Dface collage, ยฃ1k for a Micallef print edition of 400, people queueing for hours at shows just to buy a print to flip (nb I am not saying everyone in the queue is a flipper), the madness of bonhams, the endless talk of value and prices etc etc.
When you add to that the fact that nearly every other contributor to this forum is now an "artist" who wants money for their work there is a huge disconnect between the original ethos of this scene and the way it is now mutating.
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by finsburyparkranger on Feb 18, 2008 15:16:59 GMT 1, thats bizarre, coming from someone who has installed a peer to peer sales platform.
Is it ?
thats bizarre, coming from someone who has installed a peer to peer sales platform. Is it ?
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Rude Copper
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,050
Likes โข 183
November 2006
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by Rude Copper on Feb 18, 2008 15:27:56 GMT 1, yes, you wouldnt expect someone to juxtapose 'the most exciting social, political and artistic movement for ages' against a 'sales bubble for aging Tories, whilst running a sales forum facillitating the very thing they deride. on a more positive note, nice post pezlow, maybe there is a case for restructuring the forum to cater for the artist self promotion?
yes, you wouldnt expect someone to juxtapose 'the most exciting social, political and artistic movement for ages' against a 'sales bubble for aging Tories, whilst running a sales forum facillitating the very thing they deride. on a more positive note, nice post pezlow, maybe there is a case for restructuring the forum to cater for the artist self promotion?
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by finsburyparkranger on Feb 18, 2008 15:35:25 GMT 1, yes, you wouldnt expect someone to juxtapose 'the most exciting social, political and artistic movement for ages' against a 'sales bubble for aging Tories, whilst running a sales forum facillitating the very thing they deride.
Oh my god, what are you on about now? Who derides what ?
nearly every other contributor to this forum is now an "artist" who wants money for their work there is a huge disconnect between the original ethos of this scene and the way it is now mutating.
Everyone being creative is not a bad thing though pez. We are all artists in our own right. Seeing so many people being creative and contributing to the scene is fantastic and like you I think people should be able to sell there own work on this forum. All I'm calling for is more engaging with the idea's that inspired and motivated banksy's work.
yes, you wouldnt expect someone to juxtapose 'the most exciting social, political and artistic movement for ages' against a 'sales bubble for aging Tories, whilst running a sales forum facillitating the very thing they deride. Oh my god, what are you on about now? Who derides what ? nearly every other contributor to this forum is now an "artist" who wants money for their work there is a huge disconnect between the original ethos of this scene and the way it is now mutating. Everyone being creative is not a bad thing though pez. We are all artists in our own right. Seeing so many people being creative and contributing to the scene is fantastic and like you I think people should be able to sell there own work on this forum. All I'm calling for is more engaging with the idea's that inspired and motivated banksy's work.
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Rude Copper
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,050
Likes โข 183
November 2006
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by Rude Copper on Feb 18, 2008 15:39:44 GMT 1, yes, you wouldnt expect someone to juxtapose 'the most exciting social, political and artistic movement for ages' against a 'sales bubble for aging Tories, whilst running a sales forum facillitating the very thing they deride. Oh my god, what are you on about now? Who derides what ? go ask a grown up
yes, you wouldnt expect someone to juxtapose 'the most exciting social, political and artistic movement for ages' against a 'sales bubble for aging Tories, whilst running a sales forum facillitating the very thing they deride. Oh my god, what are you on about now? Who derides what ? go ask a grown up
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by finsburyparkranger on Feb 18, 2008 15:50:27 GMT 1, "Thirty years after it first shook the world, punk is in a museum. A few miles uptown from where Hell and I are sitting, the metropolitan museum of modern art is holding a punk exhibition sponsored by multinational luxury goods brand 'Burberry'. Tourists are studying early British punk clothes - made by now world famous fashion designers such as Viviene Westwood- and listening to a podcast commentary by the world famous sex pistol Jonny Rotten.
Punk is dead
But hell survived, Instead of becoming a parody of his former self, he moved on. He remains on lower east side under the mainstream radar but credible in many other circles, now the successful poet and published writer he always aspired to be . This new attitude, career and his current less threatening hairstyle are all part of a strategy. "The interesting thing is not to remain the same" he muses. To me thats whats boring, I don't really care to see fifty year old people going around in punk leather jackets. "The point is to stay unclassifiable, then they don't own you.".
When the hairstyle lost its meaning, Hell lost the hair style but his statement and the do-it-your-self ideal he promoted effected the world. Today it is a driving force behind a new generation of DIY entrepreneurs who are raising hell once again. Disruptive new DIY technologies are causing unprecedented creative destruction. The history of punk offers us invaluable insight into how this new world works, punk was an angry outburst, a reaction to mass culture but it offered new ideas about how mass culture could be replaced with a more personalized, less centralized world view.
Punk survived in many incarnations musically - it become new wave, influenced hip hop and conceived grunge and the notion of indie bands but more importantly its independent spirit spurred a do it your self revolution. DIY encourages to reject authority and hierarchy, advocating that we can and should produce as much as we consume. Since punk this idea has been quietly changing the very fabric of our economic system, replacing outdated ideas with the twenty first century upgrades of punk capitalism.
Suddenly like at a punk gig, today everyone is getting smashed together in a much more turbulent, concentrated environment that is constantly changing. There are fewer conventional jobs and increasingly complex relationships between those consuming and those producing. And changes in manufacturing means soon all of us could have the means to create literally anything ourselves, from the comfort of our own home with 3D printing.
As we shall see the possibilities of DIY are reaching new heights. Like a room of teenagers with green hair throwing bottles at each other, this new world can look frightening. But once you get it, its obvious its a better place to be. The end of top down mass culture is creating opportunities and freedoms for all.
Hell used the past to create a hairstyle that shaped the perspective of a generation. Generations have since grown up using ingenuity and creativity to do the things punk always promoted: tearing down dominant hegemonies and hierarchies, starting over, and improving the way we operate as a society.
Hell is right. Hair mattered.
Long live punk."
The Pirates Dilemma by Matt Mason p 11.
"Thirty years after it first shook the world, punk is in a museum. A few miles uptown from where Hell and I are sitting, the metropolitan museum of modern art is holding a punk exhibition sponsored by multinational luxury goods brand 'Burberry'. Tourists are studying early British punk clothes - made by now world famous fashion designers such as Viviene Westwood- and listening to a podcast commentary by the world famous sex pistol Jonny Rotten.
Punk is dead
But hell survived, Instead of becoming a parody of his former self, he moved on. He remains on lower east side under the mainstream radar but credible in many other circles, now the successful poet and published writer he always aspired to be . This new attitude, career and his current less threatening hairstyle are all part of a strategy. "The interesting thing is not to remain the same" he muses. To me thats whats boring, I don't really care to see fifty year old people going around in punk leather jackets. "The point is to stay unclassifiable, then they don't own you.".
When the hairstyle lost its meaning, Hell lost the hair style but his statement and the do-it-your-self ideal he promoted effected the world. Today it is a driving force behind a new generation of DIY entrepreneurs who are raising hell once again. Disruptive new DIY technologies are causing unprecedented creative destruction. The history of punk offers us invaluable insight into how this new world works, punk was an angry outburst, a reaction to mass culture but it offered new ideas about how mass culture could be replaced with a more personalized, less centralized world view.
Punk survived in many incarnations musically - it become new wave, influenced hip hop and conceived grunge and the notion of indie bands but more importantly its independent spirit spurred a do it your self revolution. DIY encourages to reject authority and hierarchy, advocating that we can and should produce as much as we consume. Since punk this idea has been quietly changing the very fabric of our economic system, replacing outdated ideas with the twenty first century upgrades of punk capitalism.
Suddenly like at a punk gig, today everyone is getting smashed together in a much more turbulent, concentrated environment that is constantly changing. There are fewer conventional jobs and increasingly complex relationships between those consuming and those producing. And changes in manufacturing means soon all of us could have the means to create literally anything ourselves, from the comfort of our own home with 3D printing.
As we shall see the possibilities of DIY are reaching new heights. Like a room of teenagers with green hair throwing bottles at each other, this new world can look frightening. But once you get it, its obvious its a better place to be. The end of top down mass culture is creating opportunities and freedoms for all.
Hell used the past to create a hairstyle that shaped the perspective of a generation. Generations have since grown up using ingenuity and creativity to do the things punk always promoted: tearing down dominant hegemonies and hierarchies, starting over, and improving the way we operate as a society.
Hell is right. Hair mattered.
Long live punk."
The Pirates Dilemma by Matt Mason p 11.
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Rude Copper
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,050
Likes โข 183
November 2006
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by Rude Copper on Feb 18, 2008 16:17:52 GMT 1, i grew up at the tail end of punk, it was without a doubt the most exciting period in music, i've experienced, house came close, but punk wins out. its easy to hang johnny lydon out to dry, as it is people like bowie, but without them, there would be no joy division, no bauhaus, no killing joke, no stiff little fingers, & without them, all the bands they inspired. the one thing i can tell you about that era, is that the diy philosophy the above post embraces, was taken to the limit, for every one relevant band, there were 20 that took mark p's instruction to pick up a guitar & start a band literally, i should know, i think i saw every s**t punk band going!, but theres the thing, you cant cherry pick, if you want to be supportive of a movement, you have to embrace all the substandard that helps you differentiate between good & bad, & it obviously applies to this art movement, who knows, in amongst the next 20 artists to post here, might be the next banksy, the new neate, basquiats heir, who knows? one things for sure, it'll never happen if he gets told to f**k off & stop touting his work.
i grew up at the tail end of punk, it was without a doubt the most exciting period in music, i've experienced, house came close, but punk wins out. its easy to hang johnny lydon out to dry, as it is people like bowie, but without them, there would be no joy division, no bauhaus, no killing joke, no stiff little fingers, & without them, all the bands they inspired. the one thing i can tell you about that era, is that the diy philosophy the above post embraces, was taken to the limit, for every one relevant band, there were 20 that took mark p's instruction to pick up a guitar & start a band literally, i should know, i think i saw every s**t punk band going!, but theres the thing, you cant cherry pick, if you want to be supportive of a movement, you have to embrace all the substandard that helps you differentiate between good & bad, & it obviously applies to this art movement, who knows, in amongst the next 20 artists to post here, might be the next banksy, the new neate, basquiats heir, who knows? one things for sure, it'll never happen if he gets told to f**k off & stop touting his work.
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pezlow
Junior Member
Posts โข 5,388
Likes โข 254
January 2007
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by pezlow on Feb 18, 2008 16:18:26 GMT 1, fpr I don't disagree that people should be applauded for creating work - and there is a section of this forum where people can post their own work etc. Someone like Reados, for example, has been posting his own stencils on there for some time for people to comment on. That's great.
What I am tiring of, however, is the constant promotion of some artists, often by themselves alone, where it seems that almost every contribution they make is a sales pitch for their work.
fpr I don't disagree that people should be applauded for creating work - and there is a section of this forum where people can post their own work etc. Someone like Reados, for example, has been posting his own stencils on there for some time for people to comment on. That's great.
What I am tiring of, however, is the constant promotion of some artists, often by themselves alone, where it seems that almost every contribution they make is a sales pitch for their work.
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by finsburyparkranger on Feb 18, 2008 16:30:38 GMT 1, There's more than the next banksy up for grabs here, there's a new world dynamic on the table, saying that it may never happen if those that support it get told to ...
There's more than the next banksy up for grabs here, there's a new world dynamic on the table, saying that it may never happen if those that support it get told to ...
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Rude Copper
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,050
Likes โข 183
November 2006
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by Rude Copper on Feb 18, 2008 16:31:54 GMT 1, fpr I don't disagree that people should be applauded for creating work - and there is a section of this forum where people can post their own work etc. Someone like Reados, for example, has been posting his own stencils on there for some time for people to comment on. That's great. What I am tiring of, however, is the constant promotion of some artists, often by themselves alone, where it seems that almost every contribution they make is a sales pitch for their work.
pez, perhaps the ideal solution would be for you to return to moderating the forum again?
fpr I don't disagree that people should be applauded for creating work - and there is a section of this forum where people can post their own work etc. Someone like Reados, for example, has been posting his own stencils on there for some time for people to comment on. That's great. What I am tiring of, however, is the constant promotion of some artists, often by themselves alone, where it seems that almost every contribution they make is a sales pitch for their work. pez, perhaps the ideal solution would be for you to return to moderating the forum again?
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uac
New Member
Posts โข 123
Likes โข 0
February 2008
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by uac on Feb 18, 2008 16:34:43 GMT 1, We dont complain when the artist /s have some merit.
I suppose the rough comes with the smooth:)
We dont complain when the artist /s have some merit.
I suppose the rough comes with the smooth:)
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shower
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,543
Likes โข 23
September 2007
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by shower on Feb 18, 2008 16:43:22 GMT 1, i like the artists on here, for example i am a member of jef aerosols forum but rarely visit so when he posts on here it keeps me updated with his stuff! and i like that! fuck all these extra forums for new artists with no members at all, whats the point in that?! i come on here check the top two forum sections and maybe sometimes the peoples gallery section and thats it! if i wanna read i read and if i dont i will ignore the thread - simple! its a forum which requires threads of all different types not just ones based on one artist, or based of knitting, or lawn bowls - mix it all up, live a little!
i like the artists on here, for example i am a member of jef aerosols forum but rarely visit so when he posts on here it keeps me updated with his stuff! and i like that! fuck all these extra forums for new artists with no members at all, whats the point in that?! i come on here check the top two forum sections and maybe sometimes the peoples gallery section and thats it! if i wanna read i read and if i dont i will ignore the thread - simple! its a forum which requires threads of all different types not just ones based on one artist, or based of knitting, or lawn bowls - mix it all up, live a little!
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uac
New Member
Posts โข 123
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February 2008
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by uac on Feb 18, 2008 16:48:21 GMT 1, lol your right, nice one shower
lol your right, nice one shower
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misteraitch
Artist
New Member
Posts โข 354
Likes โข 1
January 2007
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by misteraitch on Feb 18, 2008 16:59:16 GMT 1, As someone that doesn't often post...
I think the above post by FPR hits the nail on the head with his references to the Punk ethic and the DIY mentality. The whole stencil scene has generated a host of artists (or people with photoshop and a stanley knife - whichever you prefer) but that's no bad thing.
Sure, as an aspiring artist I'll come on here and self-promote whenever I've got a new release, but I'll also contribute to a thread whenever I feel it is wothy of participation. Although that said, worthwhile threads are few and far between these days. and that's probably down to the fact that too much emphasis is put on whether a piece of art is worth investing in as opposed to whether it aesthetically pleasing to the eye.
Personally, I'd much rather have a forum full of people saying 'I got off my arse and had a go - look at what I've just produced' as opposed to a bunch of people going 'How much do you think I'll make?'
As someone that doesn't often post... I think the above post by FPR hits the nail on the head with his references to the Punk ethic and the DIY mentality. The whole stencil scene has generated a host of artists (or people with photoshop and a stanley knife - whichever you prefer) but that's no bad thing. Sure, as an aspiring artist I'll come on here and self-promote whenever I've got a new release, but I'll also contribute to a thread whenever I feel it is wothy of participation. Although that said, worthwhile threads are few and far between these days. and that's probably down to the fact that too much emphasis is put on whether a piece of art is worth investing in as opposed to whether it aesthetically pleasing to the eye. Personally, I'd much rather have a forum full of people saying 'I got off my arse and had a go - look at what I've just produced' as opposed to a bunch of people going 'How much do you think I'll make?'
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colonelkurtz
New Member
Posts โข 284
Likes โข 1
January 2008
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by colonelkurtz on Feb 18, 2008 17:05:19 GMT 1, Interesting that a debate on the ethos of art has been started by the creation of art itself (and trying to sell it!)
Interesting that a debate on the ethos of art has been started by the creation of art itself (and trying to sell it!)
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Rude Copper
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,050
Likes โข 183
November 2006
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by Rude Copper on Feb 18, 2008 17:06:00 GMT 1, There's more than the next banksy up for grabs here, there's a new world dynamic on the table, saying that it may never happen if those that support it try to ridicule with a comment like Oh my god, what are you on about now?
There's more than the next banksy up for grabs here, there's a new world dynamic on the table, saying that it may never happen if those that support it try to ridicule with a comment like Oh my god, what are you on about now?
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Gurn
New Member
Posts โข 894
Likes โข 904
August 2007
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by Gurn on Feb 18, 2008 17:47:06 GMT 1, Crikey james you've gone and stirred up another hornets nest here.My opinion is that there are some artists(Jef,Rourke are the first to spring to mind but there are others)that IMO have the correct balance between what they give and what they receive from this Banksy/URBAN ART board.However,there are also others that not only want to run before they can walk but apparently want us to tell them how to do it.Whilst I despair of the latter I wouldn't say that they shouldn't post.Once again freedom is what it's all about.It's just like TV,If you don't like it swap channel,don't sit there whinging,it's boring.
Crikey james you've gone and stirred up another hornets nest here.My opinion is that there are some artists(Jef,Rourke are the first to spring to mind but there are others)that IMO have the correct balance between what they give and what they receive from this Banksy/URBAN ART board.However,there are also others that not only want to run before they can walk but apparently want us to tell them how to do it.Whilst I despair of the latter I wouldn't say that they shouldn't post.Once again freedom is what it's all about.It's just like TV,If you don't like it swap channel,don't sit there whinging,it's boring.
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by jonpud on Feb 18, 2008 17:57:29 GMT 1, All pretty good points of view on this thread, can't find anything that I particularly disagree with!!
Nice to be objective without being aggressive!
All pretty good points of view on this thread, can't find anything that I particularly disagree with!! Nice to be objective without being aggressive!
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jed100375
New Member
Posts โข 333
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January 2008
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by jed100375 on Feb 18, 2008 17:58:19 GMT 1, PM sent to James at 9.51 after his negative comments on my thread letting people know how the art they purchased was coming along........
'' Hi James I posted because it was a follow up from my previous thread here and thought i owed it to people to let them know what was happening. No one really looks at the other forums. Does it really offend you that much??!! ''
Looks like a split at the moment!!
PM sent to James at 9.51 after his negative comments on my thread letting people know how the art they purchased was coming along........
'' Hi James I posted because it was a follow up from my previous thread here and thought i owed it to people to let them know what was happening. No one really looks at the other forums. Does it really offend you that much??!! ''
Looks like a split at the moment!!
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scavos
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,929
Likes โข 101
June 2007
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by scavos on Feb 18, 2008 18:04:23 GMT 1, Variety is the spice of life.
Variety is the spice of life.
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Martin Whatson
Artist
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,285
Likes โข 7
May 2007
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by Martin Whatson on Feb 18, 2008 18:10:21 GMT 1, Do I need to remind people that this section of the forum is called "Banksy & Urban Art Chat Board"!! I would say that this justifies to post your own artwork for comments, but I also have to agree that when we have a Sales & Swaps thread where people sell everything. Could it be a good solution that all sale topics are moved to that section? This section has been filled up with both gallerys and artists lately and other great discussions have passed by unnoticed. But then again, discussions about exhibitions, new street pieces, website updates (not galleries of course) or other relevant news is suitable here!? Could that be a good solution?
XXX LOVE
Do I need to remind people that this section of the forum is called "Banksy & Urban Art Chat Board"!! I would say that this justifies to post your own artwork for comments, but I also have to agree that when we have a Sales & Swaps thread where people sell everything. Could it be a good solution that all sale topics are moved to that section? This section has been filled up with both gallerys and artists lately and other great discussions have passed by unnoticed. But then again, discussions about exhibitions, new street pieces, website updates (not galleries of course) or other relevant news is suitable here!? Could that be a good solution?
XXX LOVE
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by finsburyparkranger on Feb 18, 2008 18:49:33 GMT 1, Oh my god, what are you on about now?
Cheer up, Cameron might get in next.
Oh my god, what are you on about now? Cheer up, Cameron might get in next.
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carl
Blank Rank
Posts โข 0
Likes โข 1
September 2011
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by carl on Feb 18, 2008 19:00:33 GMT 1, I like the irony in this being one of the most interesting threads for a while.
I like the irony in this being one of the most interesting threads for a while.
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jamesreeve5
Blank Rank
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September 2012
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by jamesreeve5 on Feb 18, 2008 19:20:52 GMT 1, PM sent back to Jed100375:
"I still disagree with people putting their own art to sell on the main forum, the same way I would disagree with someone listing their ebay auction on the main forum. With that being said, I will reiterate the fact that I have nothing against you personally, I just disagree with what you have been doing on the forum lately.
Also, the post was also to stir up debate, which is what it has done!"
It seems like the opinion is split, but it is also good to see some of the older members seeing where I am coming from. I am not indicating that we need to stop discussion on all artists, but it is the use of this board as a self-promotion tool that I am sick of. There is a reason why artists like Swoon, Judith Supine, Anthony Lister and others aren't members of this forum yet we still discuss them regularly: they posted stuff on the streets the old fashioned way! I don't particularly like the work of Cartain, but I never complained at his posts because it was all on the street and I respected that. I see a real lack of "I found/did this on the streets and took a picture of it" mentality on this forum lately. It has instead been replaced by a "look at this piece I whipped up in my garage after work and now I am going to sell it to you" kind of atmosphere. It was said that punk has a do-it-yourself mentality, well so does Amish quilt-making. I just wonder how "punk" some of the new, self-promoting artists on this forum really are.
PM sent back to Jed100375:
"I still disagree with people putting their own art to sell on the main forum, the same way I would disagree with someone listing their ebay auction on the main forum. With that being said, I will reiterate the fact that I have nothing against you personally, I just disagree with what you have been doing on the forum lately.
Also, the post was also to stir up debate, which is what it has done!"
It seems like the opinion is split, but it is also good to see some of the older members seeing where I am coming from. I am not indicating that we need to stop discussion on all artists, but it is the use of this board as a self-promotion tool that I am sick of. There is a reason why artists like Swoon, Judith Supine, Anthony Lister and others aren't members of this forum yet we still discuss them regularly: they posted stuff on the streets the old fashioned way! I don't particularly like the work of Cartain, but I never complained at his posts because it was all on the street and I respected that. I see a real lack of "I found/did this on the streets and took a picture of it" mentality on this forum lately. It has instead been replaced by a "look at this piece I whipped up in my garage after work and now I am going to sell it to you" kind of atmosphere. It was said that punk has a do-it-yourself mentality, well so does Amish quilt-making. I just wonder how "punk" some of the new, self-promoting artists on this forum really are.
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BK83
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,604
Likes โข 10
October 2006
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by BK83 on Feb 18, 2008 19:25:09 GMT 1, I a way I agree with James as well. There seem to be a large number of threads on here of artists pedalling pretty standard fare. I don't criticise the artists for doing so but it does mean having to wade through an awful lot of stuff that is of little or no interest. I can't help felling the commercial aspect of this scene is all getting a little out of hand. ยฃ4k for a Dface collage, ยฃ1k for a Micallef print edition of 400, people queueing for hours at shows just to buy a print to flip (nb I am not saying everyone in the queue is a flipper), the madness of bonhams, the endless talk of value and prices etc etc. When you add to that the fact that nearly every other contributor to this forum is now an "artist" who wants money for their work there is a huge disconnect between the original ethos of this scene and the way it is now mutating.
Ditto.Articulated perfectly.
I a way I agree with James as well. There seem to be a large number of threads on here of artists pedalling pretty standard fare. I don't criticise the artists for doing so but it does mean having to wade through an awful lot of stuff that is of little or no interest. I can't help felling the commercial aspect of this scene is all getting a little out of hand. ยฃ4k for a Dface collage, ยฃ1k for a Micallef print edition of 400, people queueing for hours at shows just to buy a print to flip (nb I am not saying everyone in the queue is a flipper), the madness of bonhams, the endless talk of value and prices etc etc. When you add to that the fact that nearly every other contributor to this forum is now an "artist" who wants money for their work there is a huge disconnect between the original ethos of this scene and the way it is now mutating. Ditto.Articulated perfectly.
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loucastel
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,551
Likes โข 53
October 2007
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by loucastel on Feb 18, 2008 19:27:37 GMT 1, I dont understand, what do you mean by the wider world ? I didn't think you would. Street art does not exist only in a sales bubble for aging Tories. Its attached to the most exciting social, political and artistic movement for ages. Discussing that a bit might be nice. I think you should practice what you preach, perhaps a lot less auction saboteur, It's a shame we cant all be socialist hardliners.
I dont understand, what do you mean by the wider world ? I didn't think you would. Street art does not exist only in a sales bubble for aging Tories. Its attached to the most exciting social, political and artistic movement for ages. Discussing that a bit might be nice. I think you should practice what you preach, perhaps a lot less auction saboteur, It's a shame we cant all be socialist hardliners.
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CHAMB
Artist
New Member
Posts โข 190
Likes โข 3
December 2006
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by CHAMB on Feb 18, 2008 19:32:46 GMT 1, I've used the main forum to post stuff for a few weeks, It's been moved to the "Your Artwork" section which makes sense.
Some of the stuff I've put up, or have seen from others is Crap, some is good, But I enjoy seeing stuff and ideas and people having the energy to actually make the work.
I've used the main forum to post stuff for a few weeks, It's been moved to the "Your Artwork" section which makes sense.
Some of the stuff I've put up, or have seen from others is Crap, some is good, But I enjoy seeing stuff and ideas and people having the energy to actually make the work.
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by finsburyparkranger on Feb 18, 2008 19:53:48 GMT 1, I didn't think you would. Street art does not exist only in a sales bubble for aging Tories. Its attached to the most exciting social, political and artistic movement for ages. Discussing that a bit might be nice. I think you should practice what you preach, perhaps a lot less auction saboteur, It's a shame we cant all be socialist hardliners.
Excellent ! an arch tory in our midst. Ok firstly when did i say anything about hardline socialism? I just read you a piece promoting 'punk capatalism' didn't I? Also how can you possibly argue that creating saboteur contradicts the desire to see this community return to the founding principles of the street art movement (Rebellion, DIY and Altruism).
Come on, please tell.
Actually don't, I can see what you're trying do, again and its boring. Just because someone is industrious doesn't mean they share the same tired and wrong world view as yours.
Artists can 'tout' of course but hopefully some of them have engaged in the history of the genre of that which they are trying to further. We're going through an exciting period of history. Technology is changing the power dynamics all around us whilst a new movement is driving the direction of that change. The pirate ship is now one of the most powerful ships on the sea. Its the bit (Removed) boys and girls who represent the biggest threat to the dictatorship in China, not the Yanky's and in my opinion a Banksy forum should be engaged in these thoughts as much as they are with buying and selling, if not more. The fact that everyone is becoming an artist is an indictment that there is very exciting change a foot. Quicker the creatives that are now spearheading this change are aware of their history, quicker they and their art can really make sense of the present. To do this, some time needs to be given to not just buying and selling.
I didn't think you would. Street art does not exist only in a sales bubble for aging Tories. Its attached to the most exciting social, political and artistic movement for ages. Discussing that a bit might be nice. I think you should practice what you preach, perhaps a lot less auction saboteur, It's a shame we cant all be socialist hardliners. Excellent ! an arch tory in our midst. Ok firstly when did i say anything about hardline socialism? I just read you a piece promoting 'punk capatalism' didn't I? Also how can you possibly argue that creating saboteur contradicts the desire to see this community return to the founding principles of the street art movement (Rebellion, DIY and Altruism). Come on, please tell. Actually don't, I can see what you're trying do, again and its boring. Just because someone is industrious doesn't mean they share the same tired and wrong world view as yours. Artists can 'tout' of course but hopefully some of them have engaged in the history of the genre of that which they are trying to further. We're going through an exciting period of history. Technology is changing the power dynamics all around us whilst a new movement is driving the direction of that change. The pirate ship is now one of the most powerful ships on the sea. Its the bit (Removed) boys and girls who represent the biggest threat to the dictatorship in China, not the Yanky's and in my opinion a Banksy forum should be engaged in these thoughts as much as they are with buying and selling, if not more. The fact that everyone is becoming an artist is an indictment that there is very exciting change a foot. Quicker the creatives that are now spearheading this change are aware of their history, quicker they and their art can really make sense of the present. To do this, some time needs to be given to not just buying and selling.
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Gurn
New Member
Posts โข 894
Likes โข 904
August 2007
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by Gurn on Feb 18, 2008 20:36:02 GMT 1, james wrote:-" I don't particularly like the work of Cartain, but I never complained at his posts because it was all on the street and I respected that. I see a real lack of "I found/did this on the streets and took a picture of it" mentality on this forum lately". Sorry james,couldn't resist this.I really did find this and take a pic this week ;D
james wrote:-" I don't particularly like the work of Cartain, but I never complained at his posts because it was all on the street and I respected that. I see a real lack of "I found/did this on the streets and took a picture of it" mentality on this forum lately". Sorry james,couldn't resist this.I really did find this and take a pic this week ;D
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Silky, is this Forum a Flea Market?, by daley on Feb 19, 2008 11:06:14 GMT 1, Urban art is the new punk indeed. Banksy is the Sex Pistols but who's the Clash? ;D And more importantly who is Cr@ss?
Urban art is the new punk indeed. Banksy is the Sex Pistols but who's the Clash? ;D And more importantly who is Cr@ss?
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