BONGO
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,004
Likes โข 11
February 2007
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by BONGO on Jan 24, 2008 13:02:57 GMT 1, lol g501 that is a mad story....hope they buyer is ok......noth korea...blimey....only about 1,000 westerners visit each year...he's probably in solitary or something and your mate will gt a knock on the door in 20 years...! i have no idea if he was korean or a westerner, i dont know all the details, but north korea isnt the safest place to go ....
BONGO HAS BEEN TO NORTH KOREA
BONGO DID NOT GET SENT TO GULAG
BONGO DID NOT BUY THE PRINT
lol g501 that is a mad story....hope they buyer is ok......noth korea...blimey....only about 1,000 westerners visit each year...he's probably in solitary or something and your mate will gt a knock on the door in 20 years...! i have no idea if he was korean or a westerner, i dont know all the details, but north korea isnt the safest place to go .... BONGO HAS BEEN TO NORTH KOREA BONGO DID NOT GET SENT TO GULAG BONGO DID NOT BUY THE PRINT |
|
|
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by jonpud on Jan 24, 2008 13:07:58 GMT 1, I am only repeating what I was told by the local post Office and then confirmed by the main sorting office at the time! I will look into further and try and get something in writing from the P.O. on this subject and report back! Just seems if they can shirk responsibility in any way then they will!!  I'd certainly be interested to hear what they say.
Will look into it mate and get back to you, I would like some clarity on this as well!!
I am only repeating what I was told by the local post Office and then confirmed by the main sorting office at the time! I will look into further and try and get something in writing from the P.O. on this subject and report back! Just seems if they can shirk responsibility in any way then they will!! I'd certainly be interested to hear what they say. Will look into it mate and get back to you, I would like some clarity on this as well!! |
|
alvington89
New Member
Posts โข 690
Likes โข 227
October 2006
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by alvington89 on Jan 24, 2008 13:13:58 GMT 1, I have to agree and say that the honourable thing to do is to refund him in full without question. Put it down to experience and a lesson learnt.
I have to agree and say that the honourable thing to do is to refund him in full without question. Put it down to experience and a lesson learnt.
|
|
BONGO
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,004
Likes โข 11
February 2007
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by BONGO on Jan 24, 2008 13:17:36 GMT 1, BONGO ONCE SENT OUT A TUBE WITH INSUFFICIENT INSURANCE
THE TUBE NEVER ARRIVED
BONGO KNOWS THAT EVEN IF IT IS INSURED, IT IS THE SELLERS OBLIGATION TO INSTIGATE ANY ROYAL MAIL CLAIM, NOT THE BUYERS
BONGO FELT THAT THE BUYER SHOULD NOT SUFFER AND FULLY REFUNDED HIM, INCLUDING THE FEES IT COST TO PAYPAL THE FUNDS BACK ACROSS
BONGO WOULD LIKE TO THINK THAT IF HE WAS IN SAME POSITION, SELLER WOULD REFUND BONGO AND SORT OUT CLAIM INDEPENDENTLY
BONGO ONCE SENT OUT A TUBE WITH INSUFFICIENT INSURANCE
THE TUBE NEVER ARRIVED
BONGO KNOWS THAT EVEN IF IT IS INSURED, IT IS THE SELLERS OBLIGATION TO INSTIGATE ANY ROYAL MAIL CLAIM, NOT THE BUYERS
BONGO FELT THAT THE BUYER SHOULD NOT SUFFER AND FULLY REFUNDED HIM, INCLUDING THE FEES IT COST TO PAYPAL THE FUNDS BACK ACROSS
BONGO WOULD LIKE TO THINK THAT IF HE WAS IN SAME POSITION, SELLER WOULD REFUND BONGO AND SORT OUT CLAIM INDEPENDENTLY
|
|
hungrig
New Member
Posts โข 173
Likes โข 0
May 2006
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by hungrig on Jan 24, 2008 13:23:23 GMT 1, Does anyone know legally where i stand on this. ยฃ1000+ is a lot of cash to drop when i have lived up to my side of the bargain in sending out the print recorded delivery?
Be a man about it and send him a refund. That is the right and honourable thing to do. The point is that the buyer paid for, but did not receive, his print.
With respect, you are starting to sound like an insurance company employee looking through the fine print of a contract in the hope of spotting a technicality which can be used to avoid paying out on a claim.
Imagine a gallery trying to use the reasoning of "Look at what it says on our website. We carried out our side of the bargain! We sent out your print. If you didn't receive it, that is not our fault or our problem." Your position as the seller of the print is no different.
Does anyone know legally where i stand on this. ยฃ1000+ is a lot of cash to drop when i have lived up to my side of the bargain in sending out the print recorded delivery? Be a man about it and send him a refund. That is the right and honourable thing to do. The point is that the buyer paid for, but did not receive, his print. With respect, you are starting to sound like an insurance company employee looking through the fine print of a contract in the hope of spotting a technicality which can be used to avoid paying out on a claim. Imagine a gallery trying to use the reasoning of " Look at what it says on our website. We carried out our side of the bargain! We sent out your print. If you didn't receive it, that is not our fault or our problem." Your position as the seller of the print is no different. |
|
Harveyn
Forum Guardian
Full Member
Posts โข 7,726
Likes โข 4,888
July 2007
Staff Member
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by Harveyn on Jan 24, 2008 13:43:27 GMT 1, Just as a side story to this (not really related but its about Ebay and I did not want to start a thread about it).
I sold a brand new leather jacket that I bought from TK Max and never used. It was a cheap sale at ยฃ40 (including delivery) and it cost me money but I had it 6 months and the labels never came off it.
Anyway the buyer paid by Paypal and I posted the goods. A couple of days later I got a message back that all was received in good condition but there was a problem. The jacket was not leather but made from a man made synthetic. I was shocked but to be honest I never looked at the label and just assumed.
I told the guy to return the Jacket and I would refund him in full along with his postage costs and any paypal fees he would incur in me doing so.
The Jacket arrived back yesterday and to my amazement clearly states on the label 100% leather. I contacted the buyer who says he took it for an independent dealer to authenticate it and is claiming that it is a fake. Now I do not know about you but what is the likelihood that TK Max sold me a fake jacket.
Don't know what I will do but out of principle I feel inclined just to make him sweat. He has threatened me with negative feedback and a paypal claim so lets face it he will win.
I have offered him a refund minus my costs (fees and postal) and he is yet to respond.
It is only a small amount of money but the bare cheek of the guy has got my back up.
Just as a side story to this (not really related but its about Ebay and I did not want to start a thread about it).
I sold a brand new leather jacket that I bought from TK Max and never used. It was a cheap sale at ยฃ40 (including delivery) and it cost me money but I had it 6 months and the labels never came off it.
Anyway the buyer paid by Paypal and I posted the goods. A couple of days later I got a message back that all was received in good condition but there was a problem. The jacket was not leather but made from a man made synthetic. I was shocked but to be honest I never looked at the label and just assumed.
I told the guy to return the Jacket and I would refund him in full along with his postage costs and any paypal fees he would incur in me doing so.
The Jacket arrived back yesterday and to my amazement clearly states on the label 100% leather. I contacted the buyer who says he took it for an independent dealer to authenticate it and is claiming that it is a fake. Now I do not know about you but what is the likelihood that TK Max sold me a fake jacket.
Don't know what I will do but out of principle I feel inclined just to make him sweat. He has threatened me with negative feedback and a paypal claim so lets face it he will win.
I have offered him a refund minus my costs (fees and postal) and he is yet to respond.
It is only a small amount of money but the bare cheek of the guy has got my back up.
|
|
|
|
BunnyBoiler
New Member
Posts โข 416
Likes โข 0
December 2006
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by BunnyBoiler on Jan 24, 2008 13:57:32 GMT 1, Just as a side story to this (not really related but its about Ebay and I did not want to start a thread about it). I sold a brand new leather jacket that I bought from TK Max and never used. It was a cheap sale at ยฃ40 (including delivery) and it cost me money but I had it 6 months and the labels never came off it. Anyway the buyer paid by Paypal and I posted the goods. A couple of days later I got a message back that all was received in good condition but there was a problem. The jacket was not leather but made from a man made synthetic. I was shocked but to be honest I never looked at the label and just assumed. I told the guy to return the Jacket and I would refund him in full along with his postage costs and any paypal fees he would incur in me doing so. The Jacket arrived back yesterday and to my amazement clearly states on the label 100% leather. I contacted the buyer who says he took it for an independent dealer to authenticate it and is claiming that it is a fake. Now I do not know about you but what is the likelihood that TK Max sold me a fake jacket. Don't know what I will do but out of principle I feel inclined just to make him sweat. He has threatened me with negative feedback and a paypal claim so lets face it he will win. I have offered him a refund minus my costs (fees and postal) and he is yet to respond. It is only a small amount of money but the bare check of the guy has got my back up.
Sounds like he didn't like the Jacket and is making fake excuses. It it says its leather jacket on the label then its not your fault. I am sure paypal will agree. As long as you had "no refunds" ticked in your listing. He shouldn't get back the postage. The price of the Jacket should be refunded now you got it back. You should remind him he could get negative feedback for telling you its fake when the label says its real. I don't like that sort of people! 
Just as a side story to this (not really related but its about Ebay and I did not want to start a thread about it). I sold a brand new leather jacket that I bought from TK Max and never used. It was a cheap sale at ยฃ40 (including delivery) and it cost me money but I had it 6 months and the labels never came off it. Anyway the buyer paid by Paypal and I posted the goods. A couple of days later I got a message back that all was received in good condition but there was a problem. The jacket was not leather but made from a man made synthetic. I was shocked but to be honest I never looked at the label and just assumed. I told the guy to return the Jacket and I would refund him in full along with his postage costs and any paypal fees he would incur in me doing so. The Jacket arrived back yesterday and to my amazement clearly states on the label 100% leather. I contacted the buyer who says he took it for an independent dealer to authenticate it and is claiming that it is a fake. Now I do not know about you but what is the likelihood that TK Max sold me a fake jacket. Don't know what I will do but out of principle I feel inclined just to make him sweat. He has threatened me with negative feedback and a paypal claim so lets face it he will win. I have offered him a refund minus my costs (fees and postal) and he is yet to respond. It is only a small amount of money but the bare check of the guy has got my back up. Sounds like he didn't like the Jacket and is making fake excuses. It it says its leather jacket on the label then its not your fault. I am sure paypal will agree. As long as you had "no refunds" ticked in your listing. He shouldn't get back the postage. The price of the Jacket should be refunded now you got it back. You should remind him he could get negative feedback for telling you its fake when the label says its real. I don't like that sort of people! |
|
moonmorals
New Member
Posts โข 114
Likes โข 0
January 2008
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by moonmorals on Jan 24, 2008 14:40:49 GMT 1, I contacted the buyer who says he took it for an independent dealer to authenticate it and is claiming that it is a fake.
I think you should ask him to show you proof of the assesment and proof of the credentials of his 'independant dealer'.
On the lost print. Whenever you sell on ebay you charge for postage and packing, i prefer to think of it as a delivery cost and make every effort to follow the item until it arrives. You should give a refund.
I contacted the buyer who says he took it for an independent dealer to authenticate it and is claiming that it is a fake.
I think you should ask him to show you proof of the assesment and proof of the credentials of his 'independant dealer'.
On the lost print. Whenever you sell on ebay you charge for postage and packing, i prefer to think of it as a delivery cost and make every effort to follow the item until it arrives. You should give a refund.
|
|
hendrix
New Member
Posts โข 48
Likes โข 0
October 2007
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by hendrix on Jan 24, 2008 15:54:09 GMT 1, Give him the cash back, if it was me and you had my money, I'd be round your house a sawn off shotgun.
Give him the cash back, if it was me and you had my money, I'd be round your house a sawn off shotgun.
|
|
bencotton
New Member
Posts โข 19
Likes โข 0
November 2006
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by bencotton on Jan 24, 2008 15:58:54 GMT 1, Thanks for your advice guys. A nightmare situation!
Thanks for your advice guys. A nightmare situation!
|
|
funster
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,256
Likes โข 0
October 2006
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by funster on Jan 24, 2008 16:16:00 GMT 1, Give him the cash back, if it was me and you had my money, I'd be round your house a sawn off shotgun.
Reminder : Don't sell anything to Hendrix and use Royal Mail 
Give him the cash back, if it was me and you had my money, I'd be round your house a sawn off shotgun. Reminder : Don't sell anything to Hendrix and use Royal Mail |
|
|
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by paulypaul on Jan 24, 2008 16:30:28 GMT 1, Just as a side story to this (not really related but its about Ebay and I did not want to start a thread about it). I sold a brand new leather jacket that I bought from TK Max and never used. It was a cheap sale at ยฃ40 (including delivery) and it cost me money but I had it 6 months and the labels never came off it. Anyway the buyer paid by Paypal and I posted the goods. A couple of days later I got a message back that all was received in good condition but there was a problem. The jacket was not leather but made from a man made synthetic. I was shocked but to be honest I never looked at the label and just assumed. I told the guy to return the Jacket and I would refund him in full along with his postage costs and any paypal fees he would incur in me doing so. The Jacket arrived back yesterday and to my amazement clearly states on the label 100% leather. I contacted the buyer who says he took it for an independent dealer to authenticate it and is claiming that it is a fake. Now I do not know about you but what is the likelihood that TK Max sold me a fake jacket. Don't know what I will do but out of principle I feel inclined just to make him sweat. He has threatened me with negative feedback and a paypal claim so lets face it he will win. I have offered him a refund minus my costs (fees and postal) and he is yet to respond. It is only a small amount of money but the bare check of the guy has got my back up.
Tell him to fuck off - then take it back to TK Maxx - theire returns policy is bang on - if it's tagged they'll let you exchange for something else. My g/f took back a leather jacket I'd bought in there, no tags, no receipt with the immortal line 'I think my boyfriend had been sniffing glue to think he would look good in this. Do you mind if I change it?'
Just as a side story to this (not really related but its about Ebay and I did not want to start a thread about it). I sold a brand new leather jacket that I bought from TK Max and never used. It was a cheap sale at ยฃ40 (including delivery) and it cost me money but I had it 6 months and the labels never came off it. Anyway the buyer paid by Paypal and I posted the goods. A couple of days later I got a message back that all was received in good condition but there was a problem. The jacket was not leather but made from a man made synthetic. I was shocked but to be honest I never looked at the label and just assumed. I told the guy to return the Jacket and I would refund him in full along with his postage costs and any paypal fees he would incur in me doing so. The Jacket arrived back yesterday and to my amazement clearly states on the label 100% leather. I contacted the buyer who says he took it for an independent dealer to authenticate it and is claiming that it is a fake. Now I do not know about you but what is the likelihood that TK Max sold me a fake jacket. Don't know what I will do but out of principle I feel inclined just to make him sweat. He has threatened me with negative feedback and a paypal claim so lets face it he will win. I have offered him a refund minus my costs (fees and postal) and he is yet to respond. It is only a small amount of money but the bare check of the guy has got my back up. Tell him to fuck off - then take it back to TK Maxx - theire returns policy is bang on - if it's tagged they'll let you exchange for something else. My g/f took back a leather jacket I'd bought in there, no tags, no receipt with the immortal line 'I think my boyfriend had been sniffing glue to think he would look good in this. Do you mind if I change it?' |
|
bert
New Member
Posts โข 674
Likes โข 14
August 2007
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by bert on Jan 24, 2008 20:30:56 GMT 1, bencotton - hard lesson to learn, but refunding is the honourable thing if Royal Mail confirm that it definitely wasn't delivered (wonder if the postie left it by the door and buyer is an opportunist...but impossible to know).
Might be worth keeping your eyes out on ebay - if a lightfingered so and so pinched it and puts it up to sell, you could spot the same edition number (might be worth alerting the place you bought it from too, in case they get a provenance enquiry).
bencotton - hard lesson to learn, but refunding is the honourable thing if Royal Mail confirm that it definitely wasn't delivered (wonder if the postie left it by the door and buyer is an opportunist...but impossible to know).
Might be worth keeping your eyes out on ebay - if a lightfingered so and so pinched it and puts it up to sell, you could spot the same edition number (might be worth alerting the place you bought it from too, in case they get a provenance enquiry).
|
|
christoffero
New Member
Posts โข 130
Likes โข 30
September 2007
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by christoffero on Jan 24, 2008 20:56:27 GMT 1, A very difficult situation in which you can easily see both sides. I have had several prints sent to me by normal mail or recorded only when I have paid enough postage for special delivery and have wondered each time why the sender risks it and if they would pay me back if the worst happened.
I sent a print last year which got damaged. I had insured the print and had wrapped it as per their instructions but they simply would not pay out and I had little sympathy from the post watchdog either. I did of course pay the buyer his money back.
Another thing is they will only pay out if you can also prove the value of the print. How can you do that if it's disappeared? It's not practical to have every piece of art valued before you ship it.
I have been put in touch with an insurance company who can apparently insure all of your art whether it is being sent to you or by you. In this case you need only send the print by ordinary signed for mail and it is covered by the policy. The company then insure your house also and the total comes to no more than your normal household insurance.
If you have a monster collection then this is beneficial as it costs loads to add the collection on to normal house insurance. Also, you have peace of mind with all buys and sales and don't need to keep adding and taking prints individually from your policy as you buy and sell them. I'm looking into it so will get complete details but wondered if any other members have such a thing?
A very difficult situation in which you can easily see both sides. I have had several prints sent to me by normal mail or recorded only when I have paid enough postage for special delivery and have wondered each time why the sender risks it and if they would pay me back if the worst happened.
I sent a print last year which got damaged. I had insured the print and had wrapped it as per their instructions but they simply would not pay out and I had little sympathy from the post watchdog either. I did of course pay the buyer his money back.
Another thing is they will only pay out if you can also prove the value of the print. How can you do that if it's disappeared? It's not practical to have every piece of art valued before you ship it.
I have been put in touch with an insurance company who can apparently insure all of your art whether it is being sent to you or by you. In this case you need only send the print by ordinary signed for mail and it is covered by the policy. The company then insure your house also and the total comes to no more than your normal household insurance.
If you have a monster collection then this is beneficial as it costs loads to add the collection on to normal house insurance. Also, you have peace of mind with all buys and sales and don't need to keep adding and taking prints individually from your policy as you buy and sell them. I'm looking into it so will get complete details but wondered if any other members have such a thing?
|
|
|
|
Michael Jacob
Artist
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,049
Likes โข 29
October 2006
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by Michael Jacob on Jan 24, 2008 21:05:48 GMT 1, Sorry about the mishap, but I believe the only answer is to pay them their money. Never send anything without insurance unless youre will to cover it. Like someone mentioned earlier, POW has it made. The have many overs in a print run. If one gets damaged or lost, they just give you another one. Unfortunately, what you had was valuable. I believe in paying in forward!!!! Hopefully your print will turn up and things will work out.
Look at it from the buyers point of view. What if you bought something like a new TV. What if you called to only find out it was shipped weeks earlier and is now lost. Would you think you should pay anything for it? I dont think so. If youre the buyer, you expect the product to be in your hand to complete the transaction. You wouldnt even want to pay half, you would want a full refund.
Good luck.
Sorry about the mishap, but I believe the only answer is to pay them their money. Never send anything without insurance unless youre will to cover it. Like someone mentioned earlier, POW has it made. The have many overs in a print run. If one gets damaged or lost, they just give you another one. Unfortunately, what you had was valuable. I believe in paying in forward!!!! Hopefully your print will turn up and things will work out.
Look at it from the buyers point of view. What if you bought something like a new TV. What if you called to only find out it was shipped weeks earlier and is now lost. Would you think you should pay anything for it? I dont think so. If youre the buyer, you expect the product to be in your hand to complete the transaction. You wouldnt even want to pay half, you would want a full refund.
Good luck.
|
|
|
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by johnnyrubadub on Jan 24, 2008 21:06:21 GMT 1, A very difficult situation in which you can easily see both sides. I have had several prints sent to me by normal mail or recorded only when I have paid enough postage for special delivery and have wondered each time why the sender risks it and if they would pay me back if the worst happened. I sent a print last year which got damaged. I had insured the print and had wrapped it as per their instructions but they simply would not pay out and I had little sympathy from the post watchdog either. I did of course pay the buyer his money back. Another thing is they will only pay out if you can also prove the value of the print. How can you do that if it's disappeared? It's not practical to have every piece of art valued before you ship it. I have been put in touch with an insurance company who can apparently insure all of your art whether it is being sent to you or by you. In this case you need only send the print by ordinary signed for mail and it is covered by the policy. The company then insure your house also and the total comes to no more than your normal household insurance. If you have a monster collection then this is beneficial as it costs loads to add the collection on to normal house insurance. Also, you have peace of mind with all buys and sales and don't need to keep adding and taking prints individually from your policy as you buy and sell them. I'm looking into it so will get complete details but wondered if any other members have such a thing?
So would you need to get your prints valued first, then submit the details to your insurance company of the name of the print and the true value then they would be added to your over all house contents insurance pollicy?
A very difficult situation in which you can easily see both sides. I have had several prints sent to me by normal mail or recorded only when I have paid enough postage for special delivery and have wondered each time why the sender risks it and if they would pay me back if the worst happened. I sent a print last year which got damaged. I had insured the print and had wrapped it as per their instructions but they simply would not pay out and I had little sympathy from the post watchdog either. I did of course pay the buyer his money back. Another thing is they will only pay out if you can also prove the value of the print. How can you do that if it's disappeared? It's not practical to have every piece of art valued before you ship it. I have been put in touch with an insurance company who can apparently insure all of your art whether it is being sent to you or by you. In this case you need only send the print by ordinary signed for mail and it is covered by the policy. The company then insure your house also and the total comes to no more than your normal household insurance. If you have a monster collection then this is beneficial as it costs loads to add the collection on to normal house insurance. Also, you have peace of mind with all buys and sales and don't need to keep adding and taking prints individually from your policy as you buy and sell them. I'm looking into it so will get complete details but wondered if any other members have such a thing? So would you need to get your prints valued first, then submit the details to your insurance company of the name of the print and the true value then they would be added to your over all house contents insurance pollicy? |
|
christoffero
New Member
Posts โข 130
Likes โข 30
September 2007
|
Royal Mail Nightmare, by christoffero on Jan 25, 2008 9:37:51 GMT 1, Not entirely sure so don't quote me but if I am understanding correctly its more like a blanket cover which wouldnt necessarily need changing unless you added major amounts to the collection. Obviously provenance and valuations need to be kept somewhere safe but if I'm reading it right there is not necessarily a need for a detailed inventory or updates to be sent to the insurer after each sale or purchase. I'll get on to them and get facts instead of assuming though to be sure.
Not entirely sure so don't quote me but if I am understanding correctly its more like a blanket cover which wouldnt necessarily need changing unless you added major amounts to the collection. Obviously provenance and valuations need to be kept somewhere safe but if I'm reading it right there is not necessarily a need for a detailed inventory or updates to be sent to the insurer after each sale or purchase. I'll get on to them and get facts instead of assuming though to be sure.
|
|
