Matt-lock
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Posts โข 921
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June 2007
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by Matt-lock on Dec 19, 2007 19:39:56 GMT 1, I have a question about framing. I thought I knew the answer until it happened to me.
When a print is framed it has to be taped (or spray mounted but who does that anymore) to the mount, correct? At least a little acid free tape along the top to ensure the print does not fall. I was under the impression that with the acid free tape that the print could still be removed unharmed...until I had a print unframed by the framer who originally did it. The tape definitely did not come off cleanly and ripped the back side of the print. I was FURIOUS. Anyway, my framer, who is well respected and has many well known artists as clients for their personal work has told me there really is no way for the acid free tape to come off cleanly. Does this sound right??? I find it hard to believe that once you frame a print it is officially ruined if you ever decide to take out of the frame.
Also, I saw an image of somebody's u/s Trolleys mounted on to white board with the white frame. I thought it looked great but in doing that there has to be some sort of acid free paste or tape. Would it then be ruined if they decide to take out of the frame? Please enlighten me...has anyone unframed prints and not had problems?
Thanks.
I have a question about framing. I thought I knew the answer until it happened to me.
When a print is framed it has to be taped (or spray mounted but who does that anymore) to the mount, correct? At least a little acid free tape along the top to ensure the print does not fall. I was under the impression that with the acid free tape that the print could still be removed unharmed...until I had a print unframed by the framer who originally did it. The tape definitely did not come off cleanly and ripped the back side of the print. I was FURIOUS. Anyway, my framer, who is well respected and has many well known artists as clients for their personal work has told me there really is no way for the acid free tape to come off cleanly. Does this sound right??? I find it hard to believe that once you frame a print it is officially ruined if you ever decide to take out of the frame.
Also, I saw an image of somebody's u/s Trolleys mounted on to white board with the white frame. I thought it looked great but in doing that there has to be some sort of acid free paste or tape. Would it then be ruined if they decide to take out of the frame? Please enlighten me...has anyone unframed prints and not had problems?
Thanks.
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by corblimeylimey on Dec 19, 2007 19:55:51 GMT 1, I had a print removed by my framer from the frame so it could be sold, it was taped in two places on the top edge to the mount using acid free conservation tape, when it was removed the 'marks' were pointed out to me by my framer, they're pretty much non existant (that's what the framer wanted to show me) the tape adhesive should be water soluble.
I had a print removed by my framer from the frame so it could be sold, it was taped in two places on the top edge to the mount using acid free conservation tape, when it was removed the 'marks' were pointed out to me by my framer, they're pretty much non existant (that's what the framer wanted to show me) the tape adhesive should be water soluble.
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Matt-lock
New Member
Posts โข 921
Likes โข 81
June 2007
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by Matt-lock on Dec 19, 2007 20:02:40 GMT 1, I had a print removed by my framer from the frame so it could be sold, it was taped in two places on the top edge to the mount using acid free conservation tape, when it was removed the 'marks' were pointed out to me by my framer, they're pretty much non existant (that's what the framer wanted to show me) the tape adhesive should be water soluble.
Thanks for that. But I'm still wondering why mine got damaged so bad. The tape was water soluble. I wonder if how long the print has been taped and in the frame makes a difference...I'm guessing it might. My print was in the frame for about a year...no more than year and a half.
I had a print removed by my framer from the frame so it could be sold, it was taped in two places on the top edge to the mount using acid free conservation tape, when it was removed the 'marks' were pointed out to me by my framer, they're pretty much non existant (that's what the framer wanted to show me) the tape adhesive should be water soluble. Thanks for that. But I'm still wondering why mine got damaged so bad. The tape was water soluble. I wonder if how long the print has been taped and in the frame makes a difference...I'm guessing it might. My print was in the frame for about a year...no more than year and a half. |
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by corblimeylimey on Dec 19, 2007 20:06:59 GMT 1, What type of damage? any pics?
Mine had been framed for about 9 months max, and although I didn't see the tape I can imagine some paper fibers from the back of the print getting pulled off and sticking to the tape, but not so anyone would notice an adverse effect on the print, which I sold as mint, and had no complaints from the buyer.
What type of damage? any pics?
Mine had been framed for about 9 months max, and although I didn't see the tape I can imagine some paper fibers from the back of the print getting pulled off and sticking to the tape, but not so anyone would notice an adverse effect on the print, which I sold as mint, and had no complaints from the buyer.
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Matt-lock
New Member
Posts โข 921
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June 2007
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by Matt-lock on Dec 19, 2007 20:13:31 GMT 1, Unfortunately, I don't have pics or the print any longer. It was just that like you said...there were paper fibers pulled off in bunches but it looked very bad. It didn't make a difference to the front of the print...once it's reframed you would never know. It just bothered me thinking that any time I frame something and want to sell or take out that this would happen. Thanks again for the help. +1
Unfortunately, I don't have pics or the print any longer. It was just that like you said...there were paper fibers pulled off in bunches but it looked very bad. It didn't make a difference to the front of the print...once it's reframed you would never know. It just bothered me thinking that any time I frame something and want to sell or take out that this would happen. Thanks again for the help. +1
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bonesy
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,387
Likes โข 264
July 2006
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by bonesy on Dec 19, 2007 20:13:55 GMT 1, Never use any "archival" tape.
Use mylar corners and/ or strips, this way nothing is adhered to the print
For floating use Japanese rice paper hinges.
Never use any "archival" tape.
Use mylar corners and/ or strips, this way nothing is adhered to the print
For floating use Japanese rice paper hinges.
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by corblimeylimey on Dec 19, 2007 20:18:10 GMT 1, I think misterframeman should post some info here, I'll try to get hold of him via PM.
I think misterframeman should post some info here, I'll try to get hold of him via PM.
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lee100
New Member
Posts โข 233
Likes โข 114
April 2007
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by lee100 on Dec 19, 2007 20:31:54 GMT 1, My Framer said it had to be taped to the mount, think ill be using Mr Framerman in future.
My Framer said it had to be taped to the mount, think ill be using Mr Framerman in future.
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by corblimeylimey on Dec 19, 2007 20:36:33 GMT 1, My Framer said it had to be taped to the mount, think ill be using Mr Framerman in future.
Same here, and for all I know misterframeman does the same, that's why I've PMd him to ask if he can give some advice and opinion on this thread.
My Framer said it had to be taped to the mount, think ill be using Mr Framerman in future. Same here, and for all I know misterframeman does the same, that's why I've PMd him to ask if he can give some advice and opinion on this thread. |
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sm
New Member
Posts โข 385
Likes โข 78
December 2007
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by sm on Dec 19, 2007 20:39:08 GMT 1, I also could use some framing advise. Just bought my first print, an Insect from SG. Can anyone recommend a good framer in central or north west London. I know I could google but would rather know that someone here has used them and trusts them. Can't wait to get it on the wall it's very sexy.
I also could use some framing advise. Just bought my first print, an Insect from SG. Can anyone recommend a good framer in central or north west London. I know I could google but would rather know that someone here has used them and trusts them. Can't wait to get it on the wall it's very sexy.
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loucastel
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,551
Likes โข 53
October 2007
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by loucastel on Dec 19, 2007 22:44:45 GMT 1, I had the unfortunate tasks of taking one of my peter Blake's out of its frame only to find it had been stuck with two pieces of tape to the top edge, the only way I removed it was with a kettle of boiling water and a sharp knife and a lot of patience, kept putting the knife in the water to heat it up and VERY carefully sliding it between the print and the board,which seemed to melt the adheshive,eventually came free with no marks whtever to the print.
I had the unfortunate tasks of taking one of my peter Blake's out of its frame only to find it had been stuck with two pieces of tape to the top edge, the only way I removed it was with a kettle of boiling water and a sharp knife and a lot of patience, kept putting the knife in the water to heat it up and VERY carefully sliding it between the print and the board,which seemed to melt the adheshive,eventually came free with no marks whtever to the print.
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by corblimeylimey on Dec 19, 2007 22:54:57 GMT 1, I had the unfortunate tasks of taking one of my peter Blake's out of its frame only to find it had been stuck with two pieces of tape to the top edge, the only way I removed it was with a kettle of boiling water and a sharp knife and a lot of patience, kept putting the knife in the water to heat it up and VERY carefully sliding it between the print and the board,which seemed to melt the adheshive,eventually came free with no marks whtever to the print.
I'm pretty sure that 'sticking' the print to the mount board on the top edge with 2 or 3 bits of tape is pretty standard, float mounting will use more, probably 4 - 6 evenly spaced on the back of the print.
I had the unfortunate tasks of taking one of my peter Blake's out of its frame only to find it had been stuck with two pieces of tape to the top edge, the only way I removed it was with a kettle of boiling water and a sharp knife and a lot of patience, kept putting the knife in the water to heat it up and VERY carefully sliding it between the print and the board,which seemed to melt the adheshive,eventually came free with no marks whtever to the print. I'm pretty sure that 'sticking' the print to the mount board on the top edge with 2 or 3 bits of tape is pretty standard, float mounting will use more, probably 4 - 6 evenly spaced on the back of the print. |
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loucastel
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,551
Likes โข 53
October 2007
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by loucastel on Dec 19, 2007 22:57:20 GMT 1, I realise that, I was just saying how I managed to get it off with no damage.
I realise that, I was just saying how I managed to get it off with no damage.
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by corblimeylimey on Dec 19, 2007 23:04:29 GMT 1, I realise that, I was just saying how I managed to get it off with no damage.
;D yeah, O.K. I realise that too ;D
I realise that, I was just saying how I managed to get it off with no damage. ;D yeah, O.K. I realise that too ;D |
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by graeme501 on Dec 20, 2007 0:52:39 GMT 1, i had taped my morons with "acid free conservation" tape
when i took it off it just ripped the back, the front of the print was fine tho, since i was just reframing and not selling no harm done, i just had a wee laugh, i try not 2 get worked up about these things
i had taped my morons with "acid free conservation" tape
when i took it off it just ripped the back, the front of the print was fine tho, since i was just reframing and not selling no harm done, i just had a wee laugh, i try not 2 get worked up about these things
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Matt-lock
New Member
Posts โข 921
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June 2007
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by Matt-lock on Dec 20, 2007 0:59:57 GMT 1, I think how well the tape comes off might also have to do with what kind of paper the prints are actually printed on. Certain types of paper may be more forgiving than others when pulling off tape
I think how well the tape comes off might also have to do with what kind of paper the prints are actually printed on. Certain types of paper may be more forgiving than others when pulling off tape
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Harveyn
Forum Guardian
Full Member
Posts โข 7,726
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July 2007
Staff Member
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by Harveyn on Dec 20, 2007 1:10:03 GMT 1, For float mounting I use Filmoplast P90 which is acid free and water soluble for removal. It is impregnated with a calcium to counter the effects of acid. The idea being if you use hinge joints that if you ever have to remove the print from the mount you lift in the direction that ensures the tape comes away from the mount and stays on the print. You then remove the tape with a slightly damp cloth (i.e. the tape is water soluble).
Framers always try to use a P80 tape or stronger which has very mild acidic qualities but gives a better fix than P90. I always insist on using P90 even if I have to take the print back to solve any adhesion issues.
I would add that a very slight mark on the back of a print from acid free tape would not bother me.
I also try to buy originals on canvas rather than prints so I do not have to worry about these type of things. Don't start me on ultra violet light....... ;D ;D
For float mounting I use Filmoplast P90 which is acid free and water soluble for removal. It is impregnated with a calcium to counter the effects of acid. The idea being if you use hinge joints that if you ever have to remove the print from the mount you lift in the direction that ensures the tape comes away from the mount and stays on the print. You then remove the tape with a slightly damp cloth (i.e. the tape is water soluble).
Framers always try to use a P80 tape or stronger which has very mild acidic qualities but gives a better fix than P90. I always insist on using P90 even if I have to take the print back to solve any adhesion issues.
I would add that a very slight mark on the back of a print from acid free tape would not bother me.
I also try to buy originals on canvas rather than prints so I do not have to worry about these type of things. Don't start me on ultra violet light....... ;D ;D
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bonesy
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,387
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July 2006
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by bonesy on Dec 20, 2007 1:24:30 GMT 1, 
Mylar corners. They gotta have these in England too. Its a plastic pocket for the corners so nothing is stuck to the print. I couldnt imagine putting any type of adhesive on a $X,XXX print.
Mylar corners. They gotta have these in England too. Its a plastic pocket for the corners so nothing is stuck to the print. I couldnt imagine putting any type of adhesive on a $X,XXX print. |
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Matt-lock
New Member
Posts โข 921
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June 2007
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by Matt-lock on Dec 20, 2007 1:43:15 GMT 1, Mylar corners. They gotta have these in England too. Its a plastic pocket for the corners so nothing is stuck to the print. I couldnt imagine putting any type of adhesive on a $X,XXX print.
I use the mylar corners when shipping things but wouldn't they show up if you used them when framing? Thanks for the pic.
Mylar corners. They gotta have these in England too. Its a plastic pocket for the corners so nothing is stuck to the print. I couldnt imagine putting any type of adhesive on a $X,XXX print. I use the mylar corners when shipping things but wouldn't they show up if you used them when framing? Thanks for the pic. |
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bonesy
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,387
Likes โข 264
July 2006
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by bonesy on Dec 20, 2007 2:01:57 GMT 1, The matte usually covers a small portion of the print edge and the mylar corner, unless you're floating the print.
The matte usually covers a small portion of the print edge and the mylar corner, unless you're floating the print.
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wimpy
New Member
Posts โข 412
Likes โข 1
November 2007
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by wimpy on Dec 20, 2007 10:00:12 GMT 1, Mylar corners. They gotta have these in England too. Its a plastic pocket for the corners so nothing is stuck to the print. I couldnt imagine putting any type of adhesive on a $X,XXX print. I use the mylar corners when shipping things but wouldn't they show up if you used them when framing? Thanks for the pic.
Some of the corners are cut in the front at a 90 degree angle so they don't show. Some are just 45 degrees and show a bit. Either way, you can barely see them and only if you are looking for them. The same companies also make straight mylar pieces that you can just put on the bottom, top, and sides around the print. The only damage you do is to the backing board when you peel those off. You probably won't find these in the framing section of an art store chain, but look in photo sections as they are usually called "Photo-Mounting" tools.
Mylar corners. They gotta have these in England too. Its a plastic pocket for the corners so nothing is stuck to the print. I couldnt imagine putting any type of adhesive on a $X,XXX print. I use the mylar corners when shipping things but wouldn't they show up if you used them when framing? Thanks for the pic. Some of the corners are cut in the front at a 90 degree angle so they don't show. Some are just 45 degrees and show a bit. Either way, you can barely see them and only if you are looking for them. The same companies also make straight mylar pieces that you can just put on the bottom, top, and sides around the print. The only damage you do is to the backing board when you peel those off. You probably won't find these in the framing section of an art store chain, but look in photo sections as they are usually called "Photo-Mounting" tools. |
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by daz205 on Dec 20, 2007 10:23:40 GMT 1, all my prints are mounted with envelope corners sim to the above pic, never had any problems removing a print from its frame
all my prints are mounted with envelope corners sim to the above pic, never had any problems removing a print from its frame
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by Mister Frame Man on Dec 20, 2007 11:10:59 GMT 1, I think misterframeman should post some info here, I'll try to get hold of him via PM.
Its Dale here. Misterframeman's G.C.F framer. Let me try and help you all out a bit. A top quality framing job, using Conservation, or Museum standard water adhesive tape should only have approx 1/4" of the tape adhered to the top of the print. Its the safest way to succesfully hang prints of all sizes and paper weights. To remove the tape without causing damage to the back of the print it needs to be carefully moistened to re-activated the adhesive, using distilled water. This can then be removed carefully and with patience and will come off leaving no significant marks, (if any) on the print. If framing a sensitive piece, such as light delicate paper then i have to reccomend using Japenese Hinging Tissue. 
I think misterframeman should post some info here, I'll try to get hold of him via PM. Its Dale here. Misterframeman's G.C.F framer. Let me try and help you all out a bit. A top quality framing job, using Conservation, or Museum standard water adhesive tape should only have approx 1/4" of the tape adhered to the top of the print. Its the safest way to succesfully hang prints of all sizes and paper weights. To remove the tape without causing damage to the back of the print it needs to be carefully moistened to re-activated the adhesive, using distilled water. This can then be removed carefully and with patience and will come off leaving no significant marks, (if any) on the print. If framing a sensitive piece, such as light delicate paper then i have to reccomend using Japenese Hinging Tissue. |
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Is Acid Free Tape Bulls**t? Question About Framing, by bored with screen names on Dec 20, 2007 17:51:32 GMT 1, Thanks for all the discussion. I think I'll need to have a talk with my framer when I take my Trolleys and S&S in!
Thanks for all the discussion. I think I'll need to have a talk with my framer when I take my Trolleys and S&S in!
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