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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by corblimeylimey on May 31, 2007 18:22:36 GMT 1, A lot of upward action on the price of signed prints over the last 4 months some moving up three or four fold others doubling and some increasing by 'only' 40-50%.
Not much (if any) action on the unsigned though, what's everyones opinions on this?
I remember saying a few months ago that the unsigned would increase too, specially when the signed go waaaay out of reach of the many who want a Banksy, why no increase yet? any thoughts on why not and when any increase will/may happen?
A lot of upward action on the price of signed prints over the last 4 months some moving up three or four fold others doubling and some increasing by 'only' 40-50%.
Not much (if any) action on the unsigned though, what's everyones opinions on this?
I remember saying a few months ago that the unsigned would increase too, specially when the signed go waaaay out of reach of the many who want a Banksy, why no increase yet? any thoughts on why not and when any increase will/may happen?
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by streetgirl on May 31, 2007 18:31:45 GMT 1, Hopefully after I purchase the two I have set my sights on...
Hopefully after I purchase the two I have set my sights on...
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Catwoman
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by Catwoman on May 31, 2007 18:34:03 GMT 1, ...yes - basically too many people have too much knowledge so there's not been enough time for prices to filter down to the joe bloggs (similar to house prices but not as bad when you get gazumped) before some canny banksy forum user snaps it up - when 'we' (in the royal sense, because i once drove past buckingham palace on the way to a club) start chasing unsigned pieces, the market will rise...we are the market! ( i stole that off someone else's post earlier but can't remember who)
...yes - basically too many people have too much knowledge so there's not been enough time for prices to filter down to the joe bloggs (similar to house prices but not as bad when you get gazumped) before some canny banksy forum user snaps it up - when 'we' (in the royal sense, because i once drove past buckingham palace on the way to a club) start chasing unsigned pieces, the market will rise...we are the market! ( i stole that off someone else's post earlier but can't remember who)
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stuey09
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by stuey09 on May 31, 2007 18:58:39 GMT 1, A lot of upward action on the price of signed prints over the last 4 months some moving up three or four fold others doubling and some increasing by 'only' 40-50%. Not much (if any) action on the unsigned though, what's everyones opinions on this?
I think the fact that the unsigned are not moving as much tends to suggest that an awful lot of Banksy's are being bought for investment purposes rather than purely to have the image. Lets be honest, if it was purely for the art then the unsigned would go first for economic reasons.
Incidently, this isn't a criticism of those who want the picture as well as the investment. But for the speculators that are snapping them up for profit I have different feelings
A lot of upward action on the price of signed prints over the last 4 months some moving up three or four fold others doubling and some increasing by 'only' 40-50%. Not much (if any) action on the unsigned though, what's everyones opinions on this? I think the fact that the unsigned are not moving as much tends to suggest that an awful lot of Banksy's are being bought for investment purposes rather than purely to have the image. Lets be honest, if it was purely for the art then the unsigned would go first for economic reasons. Incidently, this isn't a criticism of those who want the picture as well as the investment. But for the speculators that are snapping them up for profit I have different feelings
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by sausageboonwee on May 31, 2007 19:05:18 GMT 1, I sold four unsigned for one signed. In time I will buy some unsigned to replace them as the prices will probably stay quite level unlike the signed.
I sold four unsigned for one signed. In time I will buy some unsigned to replace them as the prices will probably stay quite level unlike the signed.
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by siddhartha on May 31, 2007 19:26:59 GMT 1, i buy with the intention of hanging on the walls. i prefer unsigned as theyre typically much, much cheaper - have to balance art collecting with other hobbies (watch collecting)
i buy with the intention of hanging on the walls. i prefer unsigned as theyre typically much, much cheaper - have to balance art collecting with other hobbies (watch collecting)
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by finsburyparkranger on May 31, 2007 20:51:09 GMT 1, Its all a bit silly the whole art market if you think about it. Banksy has some of his best art on his web site for free which when framed look amazing but so many people are not interested unless its a limited edition. The only reason why a limited edition print is sexier is because you have something thats rare. Its a bit twisted like buying diamonds. Saying that, there is one good rational reason why people want something rare and thats because it will probably hold its price and maybe make a few bob one day. Hence being cheaper than a cheap copy. In my opinion if you are going to go down this road you may as well go the full hog and spend your cash in the way that makes this concept as fruitful as possible and get a signed print. The main reason why I think Banksy's signature is very important is because I, like many others, love the idea that this modern day robin hood character has actually touched the print and added a little personal artistic touch to it by signing it. Its my opinion that Banky's signature will actually become loads more important than other artists signatures because of the nature of his legend. The fun of Banksy exists partly in his secrecy and anonymity and because of this anything that anyone can directly attribute to his existence during his period of disguise will increasingly be worth more than an unsigned print. For me Its the difference between an arrow certified as being owned by Robin hood compared to an arrow with his blood, fingerprints and DNA on it.
Its all a bit silly the whole art market if you think about it. Banksy has some of his best art on his web site for free which when framed look amazing but so many people are not interested unless its a limited edition. The only reason why a limited edition print is sexier is because you have something thats rare. Its a bit twisted like buying diamonds. Saying that, there is one good rational reason why people want something rare and thats because it will probably hold its price and maybe make a few bob one day. Hence being cheaper than a cheap copy. In my opinion if you are going to go down this road you may as well go the full hog and spend your cash in the way that makes this concept as fruitful as possible and get a signed print. The main reason why I think Banksy's signature is very important is because I, like many others, love the idea that this modern day robin hood character has actually touched the print and added a little personal artistic touch to it by signing it. Its my opinion that Banky's signature will actually become loads more important than other artists signatures because of the nature of his legend. The fun of Banksy exists partly in his secrecy and anonymity and because of this anything that anyone can directly attribute to his existence during his period of disguise will increasingly be worth more than an unsigned print. For me Its the difference between an arrow certified as being owned by Robin hood compared to an arrow with his blood, fingerprints and DNA on it.
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by snakes on May 31, 2007 20:58:50 GMT 1, I just wish that banksy would produce some unlimited prints (trolleys, happy choppers etc (in my dreams i know) ) in the same sort of quality as the screen printed ones as opposed to the litho type poster (soup cans). I am not so bothered about the exclusivity side of things and especially the cost side, i just like pretty colours and nice pictures on my walls!
I just wish that banksy would produce some unlimited prints (trolleys, happy choppers etc (in my dreams i know) ) in the same sort of quality as the screen printed ones as opposed to the litho type poster (soup cans). I am not so bothered about the exclusivity side of things and especially the cost side, i just like pretty colours and nice pictures on my walls!
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by Daniel Silk on May 31, 2007 21:10:40 GMT 1, I sold four unsigned for one signed. In time I will buy some unsigned to replace them as the prices will probably stay quite level unlike the signed.
Yeah, I think many people dont have the wall space to hang every piece so people are selling unsigned and getting signed ones. But if the signed pieces keep on going up like they are at the moment the unsigned pieces are gonna become more sought after ;D
I sold four unsigned for one signed. In time I will buy some unsigned to replace them as the prices will probably stay quite level unlike the signed. Yeah, I think many people dont have the wall space to hang every piece so people are selling unsigned and getting signed ones. But if the signed pieces keep on going up like they are at the moment the unsigned pieces are gonna become more sought after ;D
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jam
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by jam on May 31, 2007 21:13:12 GMT 1, It would be nice to see POW do some releases like these guys:
www.duck-artshop.com/acatalog/The_Assistant.html - See James Cauty!
a 3 day release ensures most people who are on a mailing list or want a print will know about its release, and the run is unlimited for those days only. I would think POW would sell a ton of Banksys this way and the people who want them for the quality & image would all have a chance.
It would be nice to see POW do some releases like these guys: www.duck-artshop.com/acatalog/The_Assistant.html - See James Cauty! a 3 day release ensures most people who are on a mailing list or want a print will know about its release, and the run is unlimited for those days only. I would think POW would sell a ton of Banksys this way and the people who want them for the quality & image would all have a chance.
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bond
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by bond on May 31, 2007 21:28:31 GMT 1, hi - i have been giving this some thought recently too after seeing the prices of signed rise and rise . A couple of months ago you could get a signed grannies / applause / reaper for about £ 2.5 k . Now they are nearer £ 4 k +.
i think that there will be a time soon when the unsigned start to climb too as the signed prints become ever more unobtainable to mere mortals.
in the case of the recent prints from grannies i would'nt expect to see much in the way of price rises from around the £ 500 mark until yr end maybe as SURELY by then all the LA prints would be released .
It does amaze me that Mary for example never goes for much more than £500 - £ 600 though, v underated in my opinion.
I reckon Napalm and flying copper are a sign of the prices other unsigned works will go for soon.
The bubble won't burst, there are too many people hooked now. It's a hobby , it's a religion , it's a passion and we all feel part of something amazing . It's great to be around at this time. If there is ever a blip and prices fall off then those of us who missed out first time round will be waiting to take up the slack and this will give rise to another upturn.
It's a great time to buy some of the more recent unsigned prints. You can't really lose if your doing so for the love of the work . If they appreciate in value in the future obviously it's a bonus.
hi - i have been giving this some thought recently too after seeing the prices of signed rise and rise . A couple of months ago you could get a signed grannies / applause / reaper for about £ 2.5 k . Now they are nearer £ 4 k +.
i think that there will be a time soon when the unsigned start to climb too as the signed prints become ever more unobtainable to mere mortals.
in the case of the recent prints from grannies i would'nt expect to see much in the way of price rises from around the £ 500 mark until yr end maybe as SURELY by then all the LA prints would be released .
It does amaze me that Mary for example never goes for much more than £500 - £ 600 though, v underated in my opinion.
I reckon Napalm and flying copper are a sign of the prices other unsigned works will go for soon.
The bubble won't burst, there are too many people hooked now. It's a hobby , it's a religion , it's a passion and we all feel part of something amazing . It's great to be around at this time. If there is ever a blip and prices fall off then those of us who missed out first time round will be waiting to take up the slack and this will give rise to another upturn.
It's a great time to buy some of the more recent unsigned prints. You can't really lose if your doing so for the love of the work . If they appreciate in value in the future obviously it's a bonus.
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by corblimeylimey on May 31, 2007 21:45:50 GMT 1, For me signed have been out of reach since I realised you could buy Banksy prints, even £500 is a lot of money for 1 piece IMO. In fact £500 is the most I've ever spent, a few at £300ish and most at £70 or under. My only chance of getting a Banksy signed is perhaps on release but I've had no luck so far.
I'm really surprised the increase in demand from the ever growing fan base hasn't pushed up the unsigned yet, (beyond they were 6 months ago) they seem to have stopped at what may be a temporary ceiling.
I'm not really bothered about the value as all 4 unsigned that I have are worth a fair bit more than I paid for them ranging from +50% for J&J to double for Applause and Grannies with Flag being worth 4x. It's just interesting that in the last 6 months there's been no movement while signed (in some cases) have tripled or quadrupled.
For me signed have been out of reach since I realised you could buy Banksy prints, even £500 is a lot of money for 1 piece IMO. In fact £500 is the most I've ever spent, a few at £300ish and most at £70 or under. My only chance of getting a Banksy signed is perhaps on release but I've had no luck so far.
I'm really surprised the increase in demand from the ever growing fan base hasn't pushed up the unsigned yet, (beyond they were 6 months ago) they seem to have stopped at what may be a temporary ceiling.
I'm not really bothered about the value as all 4 unsigned that I have are worth a fair bit more than I paid for them ranging from +50% for J&J to double for Applause and Grannies with Flag being worth 4x. It's just interesting that in the last 6 months there's been no movement while signed (in some cases) have tripled or quadrupled.
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noodle
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by noodle on May 31, 2007 22:37:55 GMT 1, For me signed have been out of reach since I realised you could buy Banksy prints, even £500 is a lot of money for 1 piece IMO. In fact £500 is the most I've ever spent, a few at £300ish and most at £70 or under. My only chance of getting a Banksy signed is perhaps on release but I've had no luck so far. I'm really surprised the increase in demand from the ever growing fan base hasn't pushed up the unsigned yet, (beyond they were 6 months ago) they seem to have stopped at what may be a temporary ceiling. I'm not really bothered about the value as all 4 unsigned that I have are worth a fair bit more than I paid for them ranging from +50% for J&J to double for Applause and Grannies with Flag being worth 4x. It's just interesting that in the last 6 months there's been no movement while signed (in some cases) have tripled or quadrupled.
Totally agree CBL Respect from this dude+++
For me signed have been out of reach since I realised you could buy Banksy prints, even £500 is a lot of money for 1 piece IMO. In fact £500 is the most I've ever spent, a few at £300ish and most at £70 or under. My only chance of getting a Banksy signed is perhaps on release but I've had no luck so far. I'm really surprised the increase in demand from the ever growing fan base hasn't pushed up the unsigned yet, (beyond they were 6 months ago) they seem to have stopped at what may be a temporary ceiling. I'm not really bothered about the value as all 4 unsigned that I have are worth a fair bit more than I paid for them ranging from +50% for J&J to double for Applause and Grannies with Flag being worth 4x. It's just interesting that in the last 6 months there's been no movement while signed (in some cases) have tripled or quadrupled. Totally agree CBL Respect from this dude+++
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by wezzley on Jun 1, 2007 0:08:57 GMT 1, quite right about the sigs parkranger
quite right about the sigs parkranger
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Catwoman
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by Catwoman on Jun 1, 2007 9:05:26 GMT 1, ...and Ive thought some more about it too - the unsigned are only as good as the prov that comes with it, and given that they are so easy to copy (some of the talent in this forum alone on the Banksy rip-off thread) you may as well hold fire and wait for the signed to come up...though totally agree they are not affordable anymore
...and Ive thought some more about it too - the unsigned are only as good as the prov that comes with it, and given that they are so easy to copy (some of the talent in this forum alone on the Banksy rip-off thread) you may as well hold fire and wait for the signed to come up...though totally agree they are not affordable anymore
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Montubu7
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by Montubu7 on Jun 1, 2007 9:12:45 GMT 1, ...and Ive thought some more about it too - the unsigned are only as good as the prov that comes with it, and given that they are so easy to copy (some of the talent in this forum alone on the Banksy rip-off thread) you may as well hold fire and wait for the signed to come up...though totally agree they are not affordable anymore
Not really sure what you mean by that post. Surely signed are also only as good as the provenance also??
...and Ive thought some more about it too - the unsigned are only as good as the prov that comes with it, and given that they are so easy to copy (some of the talent in this forum alone on the Banksy rip-off thread) you may as well hold fire and wait for the signed to come up...though totally agree they are not affordable anymore Not really sure what you mean by that post. Surely signed are also only as good as the provenance also??
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by dave313perry on Jun 1, 2007 9:17:32 GMT 1, you definatly cant rely purely on a signature for provenance!! especially when its reasonably simple.
you definatly cant rely purely on a signature for provenance!! especially when its reasonably simple.
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pezlow
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by pezlow on Jun 1, 2007 9:18:50 GMT 1, I think the reason that unsigned haven't been rising in price is that the regular artworld is now buying Banksy, regular collectors etc. In that world an unsigned print is really not much better than a poster.
I strongly suspect that nearly all the demand for unsigned comes from the likes of us - people who love the work but can't afford signed, and not from the regular artworld.
For that reason I am not convinced that unsigned will ever explode in price like signed, but they should still rise slowly over time as the pieces we have become rarer and rarer.
I think the reason that unsigned haven't been rising in price is that the regular artworld is now buying Banksy, regular collectors etc. In that world an unsigned print is really not much better than a poster.
I strongly suspect that nearly all the demand for unsigned comes from the likes of us - people who love the work but can't afford signed, and not from the regular artworld.
For that reason I am not convinced that unsigned will ever explode in price like signed, but they should still rise slowly over time as the pieces we have become rarer and rarer.
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by dave313perry on Jun 1, 2007 9:25:06 GMT 1, I tend to agree with you perry, i cant see unsigned rocketing in value as they will never be of much interest to investors. and most galleries only carry signed and originals. all the unsigned left to us!!!
I tend to agree with you perry, i cant see unsigned rocketing in value as they will never be of much interest to investors. and most galleries only carry signed and originals. all the unsigned left to us!!!
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by corblimeylimey on Jun 1, 2007 11:16:20 GMT 1, But the unsigned have risen from £40 -£70 odd pounds originally to the current £500 -£1500, even the LA series sold for £200 - £300 are now going for £500 - £600, I just find in odd that they've risen so much but then to stop.
But the unsigned have risen from £40 -£70 odd pounds originally to the current £500 -£1500, even the LA series sold for £200 - £300 are now going for £500 - £600, I just find in odd that they've risen so much but then to stop.
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Catwoman
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by Catwoman on Jun 1, 2007 11:26:05 GMT 1, ...i think the unsigneds are just one step too easy to fake
...i think the unsigneds are just one step too easy to fake
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by arcam on Jun 1, 2007 12:22:45 GMT 1, It's just interesting that in the last 6 months there's been no movement while signed (in some cases) have tripled or quadrupled. Can you see it continuing? I can't help be feel it's a false value people are paying for signed pieces, as they are just caught up in the moment. I can't see it lasting, I'm not expert, far from it, it is just my gut feeling.
It's just interesting that in the last 6 months there's been no movement while signed (in some cases) have tripled or quadrupled. Can you see it continuing? I can't help be feel it's a false value people are paying for signed pieces, as they are just caught up in the moment. I can't see it lasting, I'm not expert, far from it, it is just my gut feeling.
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by Daniel Silk on Jun 1, 2007 12:34:01 GMT 1, ...i think the unsigneds are just one step too easy to fake
I think I feel happier buying an unsigned piece maself, If someone goes to the effort of making a fake print they might as well sign it and triple the value.
As I have said before - an email from POW is not a worthwhile piece of provenance! they would be so easy to fake, so they really are not worth worrying about.
...i think the unsigneds are just one step too easy to fake I think I feel happier buying an unsigned piece maself, If someone goes to the effort of making a fake print they might as well sign it and triple the value. As I have said before - an email from POW is not a worthwhile piece of provenance! they would be so easy to fake, so they really are not worth worrying about.
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by arcam on Jun 1, 2007 12:37:42 GMT 1, ...i think the unsigneds are just one step too easy to fake I think I feel happier buying an unsigned piece maself, If someone goes to the effort of making a fake print they might as well sign it and triple the value. As I have said before - an email from POW is not a worthwhile piece of provenance! they would be so easy to fake, so they really are not worth worrying about. Did they used to send written letters of provenance? I have to admit I was expecting one with my Morons.
...i think the unsigneds are just one step too easy to fake I think I feel happier buying an unsigned piece maself, If someone goes to the effort of making a fake print they might as well sign it and triple the value. As I have said before - an email from POW is not a worthwhile piece of provenance! they would be so easy to fake, so they really are not worth worrying about. Did they used to send written letters of provenance? I have to admit I was expecting one with my Morons.
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Dellboyy
Artist
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by Dellboyy on Jun 1, 2007 13:41:55 GMT 1, Nope, POW have never sent an actual letter, the only proof they send is the email receipt with the print number on... and the addition of the print number is only a recent thing!
Nope, POW have never sent an actual letter, the only proof they send is the email receipt with the print number on... and the addition of the print number is only a recent thing!
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by corblimeylimey on Jun 1, 2007 13:54:25 GMT 1, You may be able to fake an email from POW but all it needs is a phone call to them to check it's accuracy.
I really don't think it's the risk of fakes that are keeping the price down.
You may be able to fake an email from POW but all it needs is a phone call to them to check it's accuracy.
I really don't think it's the risk of fakes that are keeping the price down.
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by carlito on Jun 1, 2007 14:01:42 GMT 1, I coming to the damning realisation that the only way i'll ever own a Banksy is to go the unsigned root (unless I finally get lucky on a mental pow release day) and I'm (pretty) cool with that when alls said and done I want a banksy I can cherish
I coming to the damning realisation that the only way i'll ever own a Banksy is to go the unsigned root (unless I finally get lucky on a mental pow release day) and I'm (pretty) cool with that when alls said and done I want a banksy I can cherish
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njr911
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by njr911 on Jun 1, 2007 14:06:14 GMT 1, balance art collecting with other hobbies (watch collecting)
You share two very expensive hobbies with me. Though a nice vintage Rolex Sub is now cheaper than most signed Banksy's ! And I don't think the watch market will ever crash like the Banksy one might. Far too well established
balance art collecting with other hobbies (watch collecting) You share two very expensive hobbies with me. Though a nice vintage Rolex Sub is now cheaper than most signed Banksy's ! And I don't think the watch market will ever crash like the Banksy one might. Far too well established
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by corblimeylimey on Jun 1, 2007 14:11:39 GMT 1, I coming to the damning realisation that the only way i'll ever own a Banksy is to go the unsigned root (unless I finally get lucky on a mental pow release day) and I'm (pretty) cool with that when alls said and done I want a banksy I can cherish
Now't wrong with unsigned IMO that's all I've got, the image on the wall is exactly the same, just the investment value will be held back, but then again how many unsigned can you get for the price of one signed, 8 maybe.
I coming to the damning realisation that the only way i'll ever own a Banksy is to go the unsigned root (unless I finally get lucky on a mental pow release day) and I'm (pretty) cool with that when alls said and done I want a banksy I can cherish Now't wrong with unsigned IMO that's all I've got, the image on the wall is exactly the same, just the investment value will be held back, but then again how many unsigned can you get for the price of one signed, 8 maybe.
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Signed & Unsigned Prices, by dmandpenfold on Jun 1, 2007 14:15:37 GMT 1, I reckon Bonds on the right track, unsigned will probably hold around the 450-600 mark for now depending on the print and there maybe a change once all the LA prints are done with and there is no further waiting on the remaining prints.
Let's revisit this in 6 months and see what's happened...
I reckon Bonds on the right track, unsigned will probably hold around the 450-600 mark for now depending on the print and there maybe a change once all the LA prints are done with and there is no further waiting on the remaining prints.
Let's revisit this in 6 months and see what's happened...
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