vytis33
New Member
Posts โข 199
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October 2011
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ADVICE PLEASE, by vytis33 on Jan 4, 2012 16:20:50 GMT 1, Name please.
Name please.
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balibob
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,782
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November 2010
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ADVICE PLEASE, by balibob on Jan 4, 2012 17:18:05 GMT 1, Goolgle...you going to change your name to Sherlock by any chance?
Goolgle...you going to change your name to Sherlock by any chance?
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Baby Dave
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,403
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February 2011
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ADVICE PLEASE, by Baby Dave on Jan 4, 2012 17:53:19 GMT 1,
errr.... i'm Dave. You?
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johnnyh
Junior Member
Posts โข 4,492
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March 2011
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ADVICE PLEASE, by johnnyh on Jan 4, 2012 18:23:11 GMT 1, Actually you do need to trace. Google ale is actually incorrect. The police may visit him to push things along but at this point in time he/she has done nothing wrong in the eyes of the law as long as they had the print.
Advice on face book etc and contacting people is solid though do this as spot on. No crime has been committed here unless you have mega paperwork which I doubt.
You paid deposit and missed the meeting. You paid more. He has gone missing. Note legally he has not stolen your money - you both have not arranged an exchange for the additional money and the print.
He/she could have committed fraud if he did not have the print in the first place. Eg he took a deposit for a good he did not own - difficult to prove fraud though.
If he has sold the print to someone else you will either need him to give deposit back or make a civil case to get it back. He can refute whether returnable or not depending what is in writing if nothing your word against his.
If he still holds the print again either he/she meets to complete or again you will need them to return or take a civil case against.
They did not steal your money you gave it to them did they commit fraud or have they would need to be proven.
Getting contact through here or through the police is a priority but as I say the police may not get involved. Key is to trace this person ASAP.
You may be in for a serious struggle hereto get your funds back due to the fact of the legal status of the agreement. Eg as in most cases here there is no real agreement.
Eg I send you 400 pounds you send me print. As there is no contract there is no legal time limit s etc This highlights the lack of legal security on most of the transactions on here. Eg they are trust based and have no actual real agreement.
Get a link to him/her quick as that is your best hope.
Actually you do need to trace. Google ale is actually incorrect. The police may visit him to push things along but at this point in time he/she has done nothing wrong in the eyes of the law as long as they had the print.
Advice on face book etc and contacting people is solid though do this as spot on. No crime has been committed here unless you have mega paperwork which I doubt.
You paid deposit and missed the meeting. You paid more. He has gone missing. Note legally he has not stolen your money - you both have not arranged an exchange for the additional money and the print.
He/she could have committed fraud if he did not have the print in the first place. Eg he took a deposit for a good he did not own - difficult to prove fraud though.
If he has sold the print to someone else you will either need him to give deposit back or make a civil case to get it back. He can refute whether returnable or not depending what is in writing if nothing your word against his.
If he still holds the print again either he/she meets to complete or again you will need them to return or take a civil case against.
They did not steal your money you gave it to them did they commit fraud or have they would need to be proven.
Getting contact through here or through the police is a priority but as I say the police may not get involved. Key is to trace this person ASAP.
You may be in for a serious struggle hereto get your funds back due to the fact of the legal status of the agreement. Eg as in most cases here there is no real agreement.
Eg I send you 400 pounds you send me print. As there is no contract there is no legal time limit s etc This highlights the lack of legal security on most of the transactions on here. Eg they are trust based and have no actual real agreement.
Get a link to him/her quick as that is your best hope.
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Goooogle Male
New Member
Posts โข 731
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December 2010
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ADVICE PLEASE, by Goooogle Male on Jan 4, 2012 19:01:13 GMT 1, good points here, and possible that this is how police would see it. However, since 2006 fraud by false representation is itself a criminal offence (replacing the offence of obtaining property by deception) so by offering to sell to you and not delivering on that promise (and taking money without returning when requested in a timely fashion) there is a case to answer about whether he ever intended to meet you and exchange. That alone is enough for an initial police investigation.
To combine mine and johnny's points:
Report to police - potentially for no other reason than being able to use this as leverage.
locate him by a method other than email.
Make contact (either directly with him or via a 3rd party you locate) via that method.
Make clear you have begun police proceedings. That along is probably enough. Unlikely he'll risk it beyond that.
Use whatever 'embarrasing' leverage you can - contact his friends, family etc. They will hopefully do the job for you.
Exhaust avenues via Police. If they aren't convinced offence has been committed, begin Small claims proceedings for breach of contract (deposit was contract to secure a sale. Sale didn't occur so contract breached and deposit must be returned). No judge would see it any other way.
Also, if you want to have a stronger case to take to police, try to establish the status of the print (did it ever exist in his possession?) and then you'll know what to do.
Presume if you are talking ยฃ1k deposit it's likely to be a banksy. if so, Try Dora to see if she'll confirm you if the name you supply has EVER been registered to that print number (again, not a data protection issue if you supply the name in the context of why it was registered). if not,you have a stronger case of (criminal) fraud as likely he never owned the print he was offering and therefore arguably always had intention to deceive.
gm
Actually you do need to trace. Google ale is actually incorrect. The police may visit him to push things along but at this point in time he/she has done nothing wrong in the eyes of the law as long as they had the print. Advice on face book etc and contacting people is solid though do this as spot on. No crime has been committed here unless you have mega paperwork which I doubt. You paid deposit and missed the meeting. You paid more. He has gone missing. Note legally he has not stolen your money - you both have not arranged an exchange for the additional money and the print. He/she could have committed fraud if he did not have the print in the first place. Eg he took a deposit for a good he did not own - difficult to prove fraud though. If he has sold the print to someone else you will either need him to give deposit back or make a civil case to get it back. He can refute whether returnable or not depending what is in writing if nothing your word against his. If he still holds the print again either he/she meets to complete or again you will need them to return or take a civil case against. They did not steal your money you gave it to them did they commit fraud or have they would need to be proven. Getting contact through here or through the police is a priority but as I say the police may not get involved. Key is to trace this person ASAP. You may be in for a serious struggle hereto get your funds back due to the fact of the legal status of the agreement. Eg as in most cases here there is no real agreement. Eg I send you 400 pounds you send me print. As there is no contract there is no legal time limit s etc This highlights the lack of legal security on most of the transactions on here. Eg they are trust based and have no actual real agreement. Get a link to him/her quick as that is your best hope.
good points here, and possible that this is how police would see it. However, since 2006 fraud by false representation is itself a criminal offence (replacing the offence of obtaining property by deception) so by offering to sell to you and not delivering on that promise (and taking money without returning when requested in a timely fashion) there is a case to answer about whether he ever intended to meet you and exchange. That alone is enough for an initial police investigation. To combine mine and johnny's points: Report to police - potentially for no other reason than being able to use this as leverage. locate him by a method other than email. Make contact (either directly with him or via a 3rd party you locate) via that method. Make clear you have begun police proceedings. That along is probably enough. Unlikely he'll risk it beyond that. Use whatever 'embarrasing' leverage you can - contact his friends, family etc. They will hopefully do the job for you. Exhaust avenues via Police. If they aren't convinced offence has been committed, begin Small claims proceedings for breach of contract (deposit was contract to secure a sale. Sale didn't occur so contract breached and deposit must be returned). No judge would see it any other way. Also, if you want to have a stronger case to take to police, try to establish the status of the print (did it ever exist in his possession?) and then you'll know what to do. Presume if you are talking ยฃ1k deposit it's likely to be a banksy. if so, Try Dora to see if she'll confirm you if the name you supply has EVER been registered to that print number (again, not a data protection issue if you supply the name in the context of why it was registered). if not,you have a stronger case of (criminal) fraud as likely he never owned the print he was offering and therefore arguably always had intention to deceive. gm Actually you do need to trace. Google ale is actually incorrect. The police may visit him to push things along but at this point in time he/she has done nothing wrong in the eyes of the law as long as they had the print. Advice on face book etc and contacting people is solid though do this as spot on. No crime has been committed here unless you have mega paperwork which I doubt. You paid deposit and missed the meeting. You paid more. He has gone missing. Note legally he has not stolen your money - you both have not arranged an exchange for the additional money and the print. He/she could have committed fraud if he did not have the print in the first place. Eg he took a deposit for a good he did not own - difficult to prove fraud though. If he has sold the print to someone else you will either need him to give deposit back or make a civil case to get it back. He can refute whether returnable or not depending what is in writing if nothing your word against his. If he still holds the print again either he/she meets to complete or again you will need them to return or take a civil case against. They did not steal your money you gave it to them did they commit fraud or have they would need to be proven. Getting contact through here or through the police is a priority but as I say the police may not get involved. Key is to trace this person ASAP. You may be in for a serious struggle hereto get your funds back due to the fact of the legal status of the agreement. Eg as in most cases here there is no real agreement. Eg I send you 400 pounds you send me print. As there is no contract there is no legal time limit s etc This highlights the lack of legal security on most of the transactions on here. Eg they are trust based and have no actual real agreement. Get a link to him/her quick as that is your best hope.
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johnnyh
Junior Member
Posts โข 4,492
Likes โข 2,102
March 2011
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ADVICE PLEASE, by johnnyh on Jan 4, 2012 19:06:18 GMT 1, Quite right mate on all points good advice.
Quite right mate on all points good advice.
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
Likes โข
January 1970
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ADVICE PLEASE, by Deleted on Jan 4, 2012 19:27:55 GMT 1, I truly hope this gets sorted and great advice from gm and johnny. Remind me never to upset you two though
I truly hope this gets sorted and great advice from gm and johnny. Remind me never to upset you two though
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dantefires
New Member
Posts โข 429
Likes โข 33
January 2009
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ADVICE PLEASE, by dantefires on Jan 17, 2012 16:59:53 GMT 1, Firstly, a very big thanks to all those posting and sending PMs re this matter, nice to know there are some good guys on here...
So as I have not heard a peep out of the member, I shall name and shame...
The member is Worlddomination from Shropshire and the item I was supposed to be buying was a little piece called Radar Rat, some of you may have heard of this print . Here's the thread re the sale.
urbanartassociation.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=ebaychat&thread=87571&page=1#864458
Can I post his real name? According to his profile, he has not logged on since November, but thats not to say he is still not on the forum.
I have spoken to relevant authorities re the matter who are following this up.
I have also been on 192 and have obtained his address, so will be sending a letter accordingly. If still nothing, I will have to make my own visit.
Thanks to all again, you know who you are...
Firstly, a very big thanks to all those posting and sending PMs re this matter, nice to know there are some good guys on here... So as I have not heard a peep out of the member, I shall name and shame... The member is Worlddomination from Shropshire and the item I was supposed to be buying was a little piece called Radar Rat, some of you may have heard of this print . Here's the thread re the sale. urbanartassociation.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=ebaychat&thread=87571&page=1#864458Can I post his real name? According to his profile, he has not logged on since November, but thats not to say he is still not on the forum. I have spoken to relevant authorities re the matter who are following this up. I have also been on 192 and have obtained his address, so will be sending a letter accordingly. If still nothing, I will have to make my own visit. Thanks to all again, you know who you are...
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johnnyh
Junior Member
Posts โข 4,492
Likes โข 2,102
March 2011
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ADVICE PLEASE, by johnnyh on Jan 17, 2012 17:04:04 GMT 1, Shit that is really pricey fraud. The very best on this one
Shit that is really pricey fraud. The very best on this one
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
Likes โข
January 1970
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ADVICE PLEASE, by Deleted on Jan 17, 2012 17:10:27 GMT 1, Blimey I remember that thread, the first post has been edited though. I do hope you get it sorted. cnh
Blimey I remember that thread, the first post has been edited though. I do hope you get it sorted. cnh
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ADVICE PLEASE, by manty on Jan 17, 2012 17:25:22 GMT 1, Thats shocked me that has
I am sure he is quite well known on here, had a lovely Neate OG for sale a while back, and has had some other nice bits for sale over the years
Hope its not as it seems, and that it gets resolved quickly
Thats shocked me that has
I am sure he is quite well known on here, had a lovely Neate OG for sale a while back, and has had some other nice bits for sale over the years
Hope its not as it seems, and that it gets resolved quickly
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Harveyn
Forum Guardian
Full Member
Posts โข 7,726
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July 2007
Staff Member
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ADVICE PLEASE, by Harveyn on Jan 17, 2012 17:28:36 GMT 1, Have to agree Manty that he has been on here a while and looked to have sold a number of quality works. Never dealt with him but hopefully others can contacted you with details and feedback of their experiences to help get this matter resolved.
Thats shocked me that has I am sure he is quite well known on here, had a lovely Neate OG for sale a while back, and has had some other nice bits for sale over the years Hope its not as it seems, and that it gets resolved quickly
Have to agree Manty that he has been on here a while and looked to have sold a number of quality works. Never dealt with him but hopefully others can contacted you with details and feedback of their experiences to help get this matter resolved. Thats shocked me that has I am sure he is quite well known on here, had a lovely Neate OG for sale a while back, and has had some other nice bits for sale over the years Hope its not as it seems, and that it gets resolved quickly
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Trevorm
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,160
Likes โข 763
August 2010
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ADVICE PLEASE, by Trevorm on Jan 17, 2012 17:32:52 GMT 1, ^ Shocked me too - I keep coming back to this - can't believe that there's somebody on here that would do this.
'Back in the day' I used to know an amateur debt collector who was referred to as 'Hairy Bill'. Sounds like a job for old HB (probably no longer with us tho')
^ Shocked me too - I keep coming back to this - can't believe that there's somebody on here that would do this.
'Back in the day' I used to know an amateur debt collector who was referred to as 'Hairy Bill'. Sounds like a job for old HB (probably no longer with us tho')
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dantefires
New Member
Posts โข 429
Likes โข 33
January 2009
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ADVICE PLEASE, by dantefires on Jan 17, 2012 17:42:52 GMT 1, Likewise, I recognised his name, avatar etc and thought he was cool to deal with, however, not a peep...
After some digging around, would appear the gentleman in question is a Director of a property company, which looks like is or about to go down the swanny...
Yeah, I know someone like that Trevor and actually quite tempted to get him involved, he owes me one, thats if is still alive or not doing time...
Likewise, I recognised his name, avatar etc and thought he was cool to deal with, however, not a peep...
After some digging around, would appear the gentleman in question is a Director of a property company, which looks like is or about to go down the swanny...
Yeah, I know someone like that Trevor and actually quite tempted to get him involved, he owes me one, thats if is still alive or not doing time...
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dantefires
New Member
Posts โข 429
Likes โข 33
January 2009
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ADVICE PLEASE, by dantefires on Jan 17, 2012 17:44:29 GMT 1, Oh and on ebay he goes by safecrackers...
Oh and on ebay he goes by safecrackers...
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ADVICE PLEASE, by rottenredrooster on Jan 17, 2012 17:53:02 GMT 1, If I had his address and it was my money, I'd kneecap the c**t and that's just for starters (family et al).
If I had his address and it was my money, I'd kneecap the c**t and that's just for starters (family et al).
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ADVICE PLEASE, by manty on Jan 17, 2012 17:56:33 GMT 1, I would pick up the phone, call the person, and try and resolve before I knee capped someone and found myself in jail
But we are all a little different I guess
If I had his address and it was my money, I'd kneecap the c**t and that's just for starters (family et al).
I would pick up the phone, call the person, and try and resolve before I knee capped someone and found myself in jail But we are all a little different I guess If I had his address and it was my money, I'd kneecap the c**t and that's just for starters (family et al).
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ADVICE PLEASE, by searchandrescue on Jan 17, 2012 17:57:02 GMT 1, nice to see a balanced approach!!!!
nice to see a balanced approach!!!!
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ADVICE PLEASE, by hunter007 on Jan 17, 2012 18:02:41 GMT 1, When i first joined Worlddomination fingered me
When i first joined Worlddomination fingered me
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ADVICE PLEASE, by rperry on Jan 17, 2012 18:04:13 GMT 1, ^^ Ouch.
^^ Ouch.
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ADVICE PLEASE, by hunter007 on Jan 17, 2012 18:07:35 GMT 1,
scary times
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dantefires
New Member
Posts โข 429
Likes โข 33
January 2009
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ADVICE PLEASE, by dantefires on Jan 17, 2012 18:12:15 GMT 1, The internet is a wonderful thing...I managed to get his mobile of some website and having argued with him for the past 20 mins has offered to pay me back half ie 500 of what he owes me...of course I refused this..It would appear he has not been reading any of my emails and the prints is now sold...I have told him to think about it before I proceed any further..
The internet is a wonderful thing...I managed to get his mobile of some website and having argued with him for the past 20 mins has offered to pay me back half ie 500 of what he owes me...of course I refused this..It would appear he has not been reading any of my emails and the prints is now sold...I have told him to think about it before I proceed any further..
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ADVICE PLEASE, by hunter007 on Jan 17, 2012 18:14:38 GMT 1, The internet is a wonderful thing...I managed to get his mobile of some website and having argued with him for the past 20 mins has offered to pay me back half ie 500 of what he owes me...of course I refused this..It would appear he has not been reading any of my emails and the prints is now sold...I have told him to think about it before I proceed any further..
cheek of the fucker to offer you only half, how can he even think this is a fair deal sounds like he might have mental issues of some sort. Id get his mobile number all over facebook and like,, put his number out there...
The internet is a wonderful thing...I managed to get his mobile of some website and having argued with him for the past 20 mins has offered to pay me back half ie 500 of what he owes me...of course I refused this..It would appear he has not been reading any of my emails and the prints is now sold...I have told him to think about it before I proceed any further.. cheek of the fucker to offer you only half, how can he even think this is a fair deal sounds like he might have mental issues of some sort. Id get his mobile number all over facebook and like,, put his number out there...
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bullet
Blank Rank
Posts โข 0
Likes โข 16
January 2013
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ADVICE PLEASE, by bullet on Jan 17, 2012 18:37:02 GMT 1, just a postcode, but i suppose i can some search since i have name as well...not sure what benefit it is other than turning up there myself...or sending the heavy boys round There may be a good reason hes not around, personally i went off to thailand end of november to get away from the banksy hooraahhh was meant to stay 10 days and stayed 4 weeks :-) with not much Internet time... Again good luck with it mate, keep us posted...
You went to thailand to get away from the Banksy 'hooraahhh'?
Just turn off your PC ffs.
just a postcode, but i suppose i can some search since i have name as well...not sure what benefit it is other than turning up there myself...or sending the heavy boys round There may be a good reason hes not around, personally i went off to thailand end of november to get away from the banksy hooraahhh was meant to stay 10 days and stayed 4 weeks :-) with not much Internet time... Again good luck with it mate, keep us posted... You went to thailand to get away from the Banksy 'hooraahhh'? Just turn off your PC ffs.
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redfred
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,293
Likes โข 53
May 2006
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ADVICE PLEASE, by redfred on Jan 17, 2012 18:37:58 GMT 1, Cheeky bugger!! I am aware of a good forum member who bought a RR just before Xmas, I wonder if it was from this seller as these dont come up often!
Cheeky bugger!! I am aware of a good forum member who bought a RR just before Xmas, I wonder if it was from this seller as these dont come up often!
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Harveyn
Forum Guardian
Full Member
Posts โข 7,726
Likes โข 4,889
July 2007
Staff Member
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ADVICE PLEASE, by Harveyn on Jan 18, 2012 0:10:36 GMT 1, So what justification has he given you for only returning 50% of your deposit or his silence?
Do you know what number the RR was?
The internet is a wonderful thing...I managed to get his mobile of some website and having argued with him for the past 20 mins has offered to pay me back half ie 500 of what he owes me...of course I refused this..It would appear he has not been reading any of my emails and the prints is now sold...I have told him to think about it before I proceed any further..
So what justification has he given you for only returning 50% of your deposit or his silence? Do you know what number the RR was? The internet is a wonderful thing...I managed to get his mobile of some website and having argued with him for the past 20 mins has offered to pay me back half ie 500 of what he owes me...of course I refused this..It would appear he has not been reading any of my emails and the prints is now sold...I have told him to think about it before I proceed any further..
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