sham69
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Posts โข 451
Likes โข 1
March 2007
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Tipping Point?, by sham69 on Jul 16, 2008 13:25:45 GMT 1, Anyone care to comment on just where we are in the lifespan of Street Art?
Running a parallel with punk (which is my favourite analogy) it seems to me that we're around the equivalent of 1978-79.
After an initial rush over amazingly innovative/groundbreaking work and shows it seems like there has been a rush of bandwagon jumpers putting out poor derivative work that simply re-hashes the same three chords/stencil variations.
The thing has gone from the underground to tabloid press in the last couple of years. Who will make the grade? What/who will prove instrumental in moving things on to another level.
Is .info the Malcolm McClaren of streetart? What is it's purpose and how can we ensure that it best educates and champions the cause? There have been some massive personalities associated with this forum who have been instrumental in it's development.
What's the crack with the UA awards?
The work that Banksy puts into pushing things forward is immeasurable. So is that of the galleries/promoters who (like independent record labels) are putting on shows that make things happen. We need the personalities, the envelope pushing, the barriers scaling.
It's an exciting ride and I'm interested to see where we'll be in 12/24 months. Just be interested to see where others think we are on the curve. Who'll be left? Who'll break through?
Is anyone taking this shit seriously? Should it be taken seriously? Is it all just an immense daisy chain of poker faces, irony and mind games?
Where are we on that curve top or bottom?
Anyone care to comment on just where we are in the lifespan of Street Art?
Running a parallel with punk (which is my favourite analogy) it seems to me that we're around the equivalent of 1978-79.
After an initial rush over amazingly innovative/groundbreaking work and shows it seems like there has been a rush of bandwagon jumpers putting out poor derivative work that simply re-hashes the same three chords/stencil variations.
The thing has gone from the underground to tabloid press in the last couple of years. Who will make the grade? What/who will prove instrumental in moving things on to another level.
Is .info the Malcolm McClaren of streetart? What is it's purpose and how can we ensure that it best educates and champions the cause? There have been some massive personalities associated with this forum who have been instrumental in it's development.
What's the crack with the UA awards?
The work that Banksy puts into pushing things forward is immeasurable. So is that of the galleries/promoters who (like independent record labels) are putting on shows that make things happen. We need the personalities, the envelope pushing, the barriers scaling.
It's an exciting ride and I'm interested to see where we'll be in 12/24 months. Just be interested to see where others think we are on the curve. Who'll be left? Who'll break through?
Is anyone taking this shit seriously? Should it be taken seriously? Is it all just an immense daisy chain of poker faces, irony and mind games?
Where are we on that curve top or bottom?
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Tipping Point?, by slowmo on Jul 16, 2008 13:51:30 GMT 1, I actually quite like band wagon jumpers, everyone has a good idea at some point, so everyone will eventually create one great piece of street art if they stick at it long enough. The good bits far outweigh the 1000 crap bits you see, so the more the merrier.
I actually quite like band wagon jumpers, everyone has a good idea at some point, so everyone will eventually create one great piece of street art if they stick at it long enough. The good bits far outweigh the 1000 crap bits you see, so the more the merrier.
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Tipping Point?, by pimp on Jul 16, 2008 14:17:37 GMT 1, i was thinking this earlier
in my mind, the cycle is nearly finished...
i was thinking this earlier
in my mind, the cycle is nearly finished...
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Tipping Point?, by manchestermike on Jul 16, 2008 14:21:51 GMT 1, Street art has been around since the beginning of the human race, cave paintings, graffiti in ancient Rome... As long as there are people and streets there will be street art.
Every so often someone will come and push things forward, like Banksy has done, and push things further into the public conciousness. Things die down then pick up, I'm sure as it has always been. It's a wave, not a curve. Like the sea sometimes as calm as a millpond, other times raging storms.
So in answer, where are we in the lifespan of street art? Where are we in the lifespan of the human race?
Street art has been around since the beginning of the human race, cave paintings, graffiti in ancient Rome... As long as there are people and streets there will be street art.
Every so often someone will come and push things forward, like Banksy has done, and push things further into the public conciousness. Things die down then pick up, I'm sure as it has always been. It's a wave, not a curve. Like the sea sometimes as calm as a millpond, other times raging storms.
So in answer, where are we in the lifespan of street art? Where are we in the lifespan of the human race?
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sham69
New Member
Posts โข 451
Likes โข 1
March 2007
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Tipping Point?, by sham69 on Jul 16, 2008 14:31:21 GMT 1, Street art has been around since the beginning of the human race, cave paintings, graffiti in ancient Rome... As long as there are people and streets there will be street art. Every so often someone will come and push things forward, like Banksy has done, and push things further into the public conciousness. Things die down then pick up, I'm sure as it has always been. It's a wave, not a curve. Like the sea sometimes as calm as a millpond, other times raging storms. So in answer, where are we in the lifespan of street art? Where are we in the lifespan of the human race?
Very poetic and I can't disagree.
Question is who and what is going to make/change the course of history?
Is/will street art be the 1st bona fide new art movement of the 21st Century?
Street art has been around since the beginning of the human race, cave paintings, graffiti in ancient Rome... As long as there are people and streets there will be street art. Every so often someone will come and push things forward, like Banksy has done, and push things further into the public conciousness. Things die down then pick up, I'm sure as it has always been. It's a wave, not a curve. Like the sea sometimes as calm as a millpond, other times raging storms. So in answer, where are we in the lifespan of street art? Where are we in the lifespan of the human race? Very poetic and I can't disagree. Question is who and what is going to make/change the course of history? Is/will street art be the 1st bona fide new art movement of the 21st Century? |
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Tipping Point?, by daley on Jul 16, 2008 15:48:24 GMT 1, "Running a parallel with punk (which is my favourite analogy) it seems to me that we're around the equivalent of 1978-79."
I know it sounds corny but I was thinking exactly the same the other day!
As Mike says, graffiti has been around for hundreds of years. I love really old graffiti - and have personally been leaving my 'mark on society'  since about 1984.
So, if urban art was punk then I guess the 80's hip hop stuff was the equivalent to Iggy and the Stooges.
So yes, I'd say we're in about 1979. Roll on the second wave. Crass, Discharge, GBH or UK Subs anyone? 
"Running a parallel with punk (which is my favourite analogy) it seems to me that we're around the equivalent of 1978-79." I know it sounds corny but I was thinking exactly the same the other day! As Mike says, graffiti has been around for hundreds of years. I love really old graffiti - and have personally been leaving my 'mark on society' since about 1984. So, if urban art was punk then I guess the 80's hip hop stuff was the equivalent to Iggy and the Stooges. So yes, I'd say we're in about 1979. Roll on the second wave. Crass, Discharge, GBH or UK Subs anyone? |
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merlindm
New Member
Posts โข 12
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July 2007
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Tipping Point?, by merlindm on Jul 16, 2008 15:56:06 GMT 1, I think the scene has developed quite a way from when it started. - I think theres lots more life in the old dog yet!
I think the scene has developed quite a way from when it started. - I think theres lots more life in the old dog yet!
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Gentle Mental
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,805
Likes โข 850
May 2007
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Tipping Point?, by Gentle Mental on Jul 16, 2008 19:16:26 GMT 1, If it's pop music from the Eighties, I'd say we're now at WHAM!'s "Make It Big" stage.... 84-85, everything super positive, bright white smiles, full head of fluffy golden hair
And everyone's wearing a table cloth around their necks.
In the words of Gary, "Cuz we are GOLD! Always believe in your soul!"
If it's pop music from the Eighties, I'd say we're now at WHAM!'s "Make It Big" stage.... 84-85, everything super positive, bright white smiles, full head of fluffy golden hair
And everyone's wearing a table cloth around their necks.
In the words of Gary, "Cuz we are GOLD! Always believe in your soul!"
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discoduster
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,438
Likes โข 5
January 2007
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Tipping Point?, by discoduster on Jul 16, 2008 19:52:58 GMT 1, I've only ever bought what I like personally so I couldn't care less if it comes crashing to the ground.
I've only ever bought what I like personally so I couldn't care less if it comes crashing to the ground. |
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oneeye
New Member
Posts โข 900
Likes โข 83
July 2007
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Tipping Point?, by oneeye on Jul 16, 2008 20:15:57 GMT 1, We're at the point where The Clash have just recorded London Calling. They've developed a huge buzz in the UK and are getting ready to take the states by storm.
We're at the point where The Clash have just recorded London Calling. They've developed a huge buzz in the UK and are getting ready to take the states by storm.
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Tipping Point?, by onemandown72 on Jul 16, 2008 20:21:23 GMT 1, Surely the point here is not about values crashing, but more about the creative direction that street art will take. When Neate was leaving his work on the streets he didn't create it as a result of the financial state of the art market. If anything a huge crash in value would see artists creating from a purely aesthetic point of view, and also a drop off of chancers trying to cash in.
For me I see street art moving away from stencilling towards a variation on this (maybe more installation work). Whilst the problem of getting work up quickly remains, the stencil is now so ubiquitous that newer artists will appreciate the speed that the stencil allows, but will want to develop into more challlenging and interesting ways to utilise this form.
Surely the point here is not about values crashing, but more about the creative direction that street art will take. When Neate was leaving his work on the streets he didn't create it as a result of the financial state of the art market. If anything a huge crash in value would see artists creating from a purely aesthetic point of view, and also a drop off of chancers trying to cash in.
For me I see street art moving away from stencilling towards a variation on this (maybe more installation work). Whilst the problem of getting work up quickly remains, the stencil is now so ubiquitous that newer artists will appreciate the speed that the stencil allows, but will want to develop into more challlenging and interesting ways to utilise this form.
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Cocteau 101
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,483
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January 2007
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Tipping Point?, by Cocteau 101 on Jul 16, 2008 20:23:03 GMT 1, I agree with the punk parallel as I was around at the time, there was some great stuff and loads of shite (remember fuckin Chelsea) but what punk heralded for awhile was a complete change in attitude and I thought the next phase was the more "artsistic" - Magazine, Joy Division and people forget bands like Ultravox (the John Foxx version) etc. It will be interesting to see who are regarded as the classics from this scene in say 30 years.
I agree with the punk parallel as I was around at the time, there was some great stuff and loads of shite (remember fuckin Chelsea) but what punk heralded for awhile was a complete change in attitude and I thought the next phase was the more "artsistic" - Magazine, Joy Division and people forget bands like Ultravox (the John Foxx version) etc. It will be interesting to see who are regarded as the classics from this scene in say 30 years.
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sham69
New Member
Posts โข 451
Likes โข 1
March 2007
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Tipping Point?, by sham69 on Jul 16, 2008 20:25:54 GMT 1, One thing I am of the opinion of is that those that make the grade will be a select few. Looking back in 10-20 years time I doubt that more than 5 or 6 artists will even be remembered.
One thing I am of the opinion of is that those that make the grade will be a select few. Looking back in 10-20 years time I doubt that more than 5 or 6 artists will even be remembered.
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Cocteau 101
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,483
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January 2007
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Tipping Point?, by Cocteau 101 on Jul 16, 2008 20:27:22 GMT 1, I can't wait for the Postcard Records version of urban art - get those gingham stencils out.
I can't wait for the Postcard Records version of urban art - get those gingham stencils out.
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BONGO
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,004
Likes โข 11
February 2007
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Tipping Point?, by BONGO on Jul 17, 2008 10:07:25 GMT 1, BONGO THNKS THAT THIS GENRE HAS PRETTY MUCH RUN ITS COURSE
THERES WILL BE A HANDFUL OF WORTHLY SURVIVORS, MAYBE NOT EVEN A HANDFUL, BUT MUCH OF THE ARTICLES OF FETISHMENT SO COVETED BY MEMBERS OF THIS BOARD WILL BE FORGOTTEN ABOUT
BONGO THINKS IN THE NOT SO FAR DISTANT THE LIKES OF MANTIS WILL BE AS COLLECTABLE AS A UK SUBS SINGLE AND MORE LIKELY TO BE FOUND IN CHARITY SHOPS, JOSTLING FOR SPACE BETWEEN THE HARRY POTTER BOOKS AND READ ONCE BECKHAM BIOGRAPHIES
BONGO THNKS THAT THIS GENRE HAS PRETTY MUCH RUN ITS COURSE
THERES WILL BE A HANDFUL OF WORTHLY SURVIVORS, MAYBE NOT EVEN A HANDFUL, BUT MUCH OF THE ARTICLES OF FETISHMENT SO COVETED BY MEMBERS OF THIS BOARD WILL BE FORGOTTEN ABOUT
BONGO THINKS IN THE NOT SO FAR DISTANT THE LIKES OF MANTIS WILL BE AS COLLECTABLE AS A UK SUBS SINGLE AND MORE LIKELY TO BE FOUND IN CHARITY SHOPS, JOSTLING FOR SPACE BETWEEN THE HARRY POTTER BOOKS AND READ ONCE BECKHAM BIOGRAPHIES
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Tipping Point?, by pimp on Jul 17, 2008 10:29:26 GMT 1, for once i agree with the third person speaker.
most of this tat will quickly be forgotten and unwanted, forever floating in cyberspace on ebay...
for once i agree with the third person speaker.
most of this tat will quickly be forgotten and unwanted, forever floating in cyberspace on ebay...
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killerkellah
New Member
Posts โข 632
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September 2007
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Tipping Point?, by killerkellah on Jul 17, 2008 10:34:04 GMT 1, Street art has been around since the beginning of the human race, cave paintings, graffiti in ancient Rome... As long as there are people and streets there will be street art. Every so often someone will come and push things forward, like Banksy has done, and push things further into the public conciousness. Things die down then pick up, I'm sure as it has always been. It's a wave, not a curve. Like the sea sometimes as calm as a millpond, other times raging storms. So in answer, where are we in the lifespan of street art? Where are we in the lifespan of the human race?
so did they have streets then in the caveman era?
cut the pretense. what your actually saying is people have always painted and drawn. simple.
Street art has been around since the beginning of the human race, cave paintings, graffiti in ancient Rome... As long as there are people and streets there will be street art. Every so often someone will come and push things forward, like Banksy has done, and push things further into the public conciousness. Things die down then pick up, I'm sure as it has always been. It's a wave, not a curve. Like the sea sometimes as calm as a millpond, other times raging storms. So in answer, where are we in the lifespan of street art? Where are we in the lifespan of the human race? so did they have streets then in the caveman era? cut the pretense. what your actually saying is people have always painted and drawn. simple. |
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top
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,486
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November 2007
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Tipping Point?, by top on Jul 17, 2008 10:37:05 GMT 1, Everything has a cycle, its fair to say that this scene will go full circle and cleanse itself..it's pure conjecture to predict when, but..what the hell!
..hopefully it will be soon so as to remove all garbage artists and galleries whom are solely interested in your money
Everything has a cycle, its fair to say that this scene will go full circle and cleanse itself..it's pure conjecture to predict when, but..what the hell!
..hopefully it will be soon so as to remove all garbage artists and galleries whom are solely interested in your money
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romanywg
Junior Member
Posts โข 4,093
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October 2006
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Tipping Point?, by romanywg on Jul 17, 2008 10:44:17 GMT 1, Is .info the Malcolm McClaren of streetart?
That's the funniest thing I've ever read. Steve Lazarides is Malcolm McClaren. .info is Sounds, WK is the NME.
I've often used the analogy of Punk with this movement and I would say we have just peaked with the first wave, Banksy is outed, the Pistols break up. Looking forward to Wire, Joy Division and the second Wave to come through.
Is .info the Malcolm McClaren of streetart?
That's the funniest thing I've ever read. Steve Lazarides is Malcolm McClaren. .info is Sounds, WK is the NME.
I've often used the analogy of Punk with this movement and I would say we have just peaked with the first wave, Banksy is outed, the Pistols break up. Looking forward to Wire, Joy Division and the second Wave to come through.
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killerkellah
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Posts โข 632
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September 2007
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Tipping Point?, by killerkellah on Jul 17, 2008 10:46:05 GMT 1, the problem with this genre is that it has become driven by money (not art)- some artists, galleries (can I say that), buyers, all looking to make a quick buck. the genre is flooded with poor work and crazy prices.
this has been precipitated by new found ways of selling ie the internet, destroying the old shop front method of selling art & effectively turning anyone interested, into an art dealer.
many people think this genre is just a trend and you should make your money and run before the fad fades away. its this attitude thats slowly killing it - though of course there will be those who buck the trend.
the problem with this genre is that it has become driven by money (not art)- some artists, galleries (can I say that), buyers, all looking to make a quick buck. the genre is flooded with poor work and crazy prices.
this has been precipitated by new found ways of selling ie the internet, destroying the old shop front method of selling art & effectively turning anyone interested, into an art dealer.
many people think this genre is just a trend and you should make your money and run before the fad fades away. its this attitude thats slowly killing it - though of course there will be those who buck the trend.
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brun
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Posts โข 879
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December 2007
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Tipping Point?, by brun on Jul 17, 2008 10:46:57 GMT 1, the scene is no doubt at its peak , with laz inc having two galleries and a print shop and endless online "galleries" flipping (hope i dont get banned) POW prints .......some already disappearing (LSG) and many struggling to stay in the red . poor LA imposters and faile on the side of the tate !
people outing banksy in the daily mail  ?
bring on the new wave , and the 808 drum machine !
the scene is no doubt at its peak , with laz inc having two galleries and a print shop and endless online "galleries" flipping (hope i dont get banned) POW prints .......some already disappearing (LSG) and many struggling to stay in the red . poor LA imposters and faile on the side of the tate ! people outing banksy in the daily mail ? bring on the new wave , and the 808 drum machine ! |
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dotdot
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,647
Likes โข 1,027
December 2006
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Tipping Point?, by dotdot on Jul 17, 2008 10:47:33 GMT 1, Mike i see your point - but don't think that's sham's point. (where is Jimmy Pursey NOW?)
Bongo - as ever - thoughtful
Overall it's a "phenomenon" - and as such they always only
last a finite timeframe.
I remember just after i joined there was thread about boatmissers - remember that ? Subject at the time being 'has everyone now missed the boat ?' (now that prices were skyrocketing..)
Of course at that time not everyone had quite discovered
Neate - Mic had just had his show at Laz and Banksy recovering
from LA.(prints anyone ?)
Punk is certainly an anology of note as it could be argued
that Laz etc are providing a modern interpretation of McLaren
from the Pistols era - but generally there's only so much he can do...
D does it - as does Mike at BRP - what's that ? well try to manage
a situation which is evolving (ok perhaps not so much in D's case ).
Has it peaked ? - reckon it has - the CC will see to that.
Does it matter ? - not a jot - people will continue to have idea and spark debate and laughter hopefully in equal measures.
Some galleries will no doubt go to the wall however.
And many artists will fall by the way side - but as has been discussed already --- if you buy what you like and can afford you ...
have nothing to worry about.
Who here has a large Punk collection vinyl ? coloured ? picture disks yeah i know perhaps not so many...
How many members here ? ok think about it.... funny eh ?
./
Mike i see your point - but don't think that's sham's point. (where is Jimmy Pursey NOW?) Bongo - as ever - thoughtful Overall it's a "phenomenon" - and as such they always only last a finite timeframe. I remember just after i joined there was thread about boatmissers - remember that ? Subject at the time being 'has everyone now missed the boat ?' (now that prices were skyrocketing..) Of course at that time not everyone had quite discovered Neate - Mic had just had his show at Laz and Banksy recovering from LA.(prints anyone ?) Punk is certainly an anology of note as it could be argued that Laz etc are providing a modern interpretation of McLaren from the Pistols era - but generally there's only so much he can do... D does it - as does Mike at BRP - what's that ? well try to manage a situation which is evolving (ok perhaps not so much in D's case ). Has it peaked ? - reckon it has - the CC will see to that. Does it matter ? - not a jot - people will continue to have idea and spark debate and laughter hopefully in equal measures. Some galleries will no doubt go to the wall however. And many artists will fall by the way side - but as has been discussed already --- if you buy what you like and can afford you ... have nothing to worry about. Who here has a large Punk collection vinyl ? coloured ? picture disks yeah i know perhaps not so many... How many members here ? ok think about it.... funny eh ? ./ |
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Prescription Art
Art Gallery
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,141
Likes โข 1,205
November 2007
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Tipping Point?, by Prescription Art on Jul 17, 2008 11:03:20 GMT 1, I get a bit tired of people constantly saying that the 'scene' is dying & we're all doomed.
As far as I can tell, people are still painting on walls, and I still see something outstanding every single day.
I get a bit tired of people constantly saying that the 'scene' is dying & we're all doomed.
As far as I can tell, people are still painting on walls, and I still see something outstanding every single day.
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Tipping Point?, by icky on Jul 17, 2008 11:07:08 GMT 1,
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carbon
New Member
Posts โข 89
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March 2008
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Tipping Point?, by carbon on Jul 17, 2008 11:13:36 GMT 1,
Punks still alive today, its just not on top of the pops anymore.
Theyl allways be an art market.
Punks still alive today, its just not on top of the pops anymore.
Theyl allways be an art market.
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killerkellah
New Member
Posts โข 632
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September 2007
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Tipping Point?, by killerkellah on Jul 17, 2008 11:17:34 GMT 1, wow. you are amazing.
wow. you are amazing.
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dotdot
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,647
Likes โข 1,027
December 2006
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Tipping Point?, by dotdot on Jul 17, 2008 11:31:27 GMT 1,
I knew there'd be ONE
excellent.
I knew there'd be ONE excellent. |
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mike hunt
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Posts โข 456
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December 2006
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Tipping Point?, by mike hunt on Jul 17, 2008 11:50:48 GMT 1, What a depressing thread. Can I just add that we're all going to die as well. On the plus side Romanywg has cemented his place in history as king of the geeks! There's a guy downstairs from me who has an even bigger collection - of wine bottles - which he proudly displays in his front window (all empty of course).
What a depressing thread. Can I just add that we're all going to die as well. On the plus side Romanywg has cemented his place in history as king of the geeks! There's a guy downstairs from me who has an even bigger collection - of wine bottles - which he proudly displays in his front window (all empty of course).
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Tipping Point?, by Daniel Silk on Jul 17, 2008 11:59:32 GMT 1, I get a bit tired of people constantly saying that the 'scene' is dying & we're all doomed. As far as I can tell, people are still painting on walls, and I still see something outstanding every single day.
Me too!
Its like some people are actually fight for the downfall  whats all that about? 
I get a bit tired of people constantly saying that the 'scene' is dying & we're all doomed. As far as I can tell, people are still painting on walls, and I still see something outstanding every single day. Me too! Its like some people are actually fight for the downfall whats all that about? |
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since about 1984.
whats all that about? 
