met
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June 2009
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Art ideas for Kids Room, by met on Jul 1, 2020 2:51:45 GMT 1, Iโve been toying with this for a little while. Itโs super cheap too!! Swipe right to see it in full. http://instagr.am/p/BrMvvCwB1Ru I am also toying with a piece by Bortusk Leer...though you do have to be slightly selective. This probably wouldnโt get approved by the wall police/wife for example.
Given the option, I would go for a cheerful original by Bortusk Leer.
__________
One issue with the Eyesaw giclรฉe is that it's derivative of a recognised style by Sage Vaughn*: kaleidoscope of butterflies in formation; shadowing or fading of the more distant butterflies; plain background in white or off-white; conspicuous use of drips.
Iโve been toying with this for a little while. Itโs super cheap too!! Swipe right to see it in full. http://instagr.am/p/BrMvvCwB1Ru I am also toying with a piece by Bortusk Leer...though you do have to be slightly selective. This probably wouldnโt get approved by the wall police/wife for example. Given the option, I would go for a cheerful original by Bortusk Leer. __________ One issue with the Eyesaw giclรฉe is that it's derivative of a recognised style by Sage Vaughn*: kaleidoscope of butterflies in formation; shadowing or fading of the more distant butterflies; plain background in white or off-white; conspicuous use of drips.
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met
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June 2009
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Art ideas for Kids Room, by met on Jul 1, 2020 1:55:13 GMT 1,
If I spotted this hanging in the baby's room of a colleague, they would promptly soar in my estimation.
If I spotted this hanging in the baby's room of a colleague, they would promptly soar in my estimation.
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met
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June 2009
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Banksy Artwork, VALUATION, by met on Jun 30, 2020 8:58:29 GMT 1, Now that all auctions are pretty much done for the month I have re-calculated everything on www.banksy-value.comThe result is a monthly increase of more than than 7% for June. I feel the low GBP is helping quite a bit also. Hi mate, Great work on the site, very useful bench mark. Quick questions. Do you adjust expert opinion on value each month? Are you able to disclose who provides these numbers? On the auction results do you include ARR and VAT? Thanks again for all your hard work. Thanks! I always try to include VAT and ARR where it is payable.There are two valuation metrics: automatic one is based on latest auction estimate + how many % index has gone up since last sale; and in the expert one I try to correct for outliers in results of that. I manually go through it every month. However I only update it based on factual auction trades and index development. This means that if there is eg a massive jump in short period on private market like right now, some estimates will be on low side until either the print is sold on auction or index is updated gradually. Happy to take peopleโs steer on whether above is a good methodology. My thinking was to keep any hype or claimed sales outside of auction as much out of it as possible, but that has its weakness also. Finally, I recently added a feature to allow for people to list their prints for sale. So far being tested with only a few ones know, but also wondering if there is interest in such place to aggregate prints available for private sale without having to pay big fees eg for Artsy or send them off to a gallery/auction?
Although I've only had a superficial glance at the site, you've done an impressive job. One can only imagine the number of hours that were put in.
__________
Perhaps an unrealistic ask from a workload perspective, but have you considered adding condition details (where available) for each piece sold? Depending on the collector, this aspect is sometimes crucial. [While no longer applicable to Banksy's market, with editioned works on paper at the three-figure level, I'm often willing to pay a high premium (x2 or x3) for those in pristine condition.]
A mechanism giving the user an option to exclude certain works from the search results could also be helpful โ e.g. prints that are in distinctly poor condition, or unaccompanied by a certificate of authenticity from Pest Control Office. This would allow like-for-like comparisons to be made with greater accuracy.
__________
Regarding listed prices, my advice would be to follow the approach taken by high-end auction houses.
When posting results, most will typically list the hammer price plus buyer's premium. Nothing else. And for good reason (see especially point 3 below).
Some advantages of excluding VAT and ARR from sale results:
1. Convenience; less work for you
Opting for the format used by many auction houses would allow you to just copy the sale results directly from their websites, without the need for separate arithmetic. Clearly, the easiest option. [Do note that initial results posted (while a sale is live or in the immediate aftermath) sometimes reflect the hammer price only.]
2. Consistency
Most buyers who follow auction-house sales are very used to the manner in which their results are presented. There is an attractive logic in being consistent with the unambiguous, simple format that collectors are already familiar with.
3. Elimination of unhelpful guesswork, artifice, and ethnocentricity
You mention always trying to include VAT and ARR "where it is payable". How would you find out? Presumably, you're relying on assumptions that could easily be false. The exclusion of VAT and ARR from sale-results figures would reduce the scope for erroneous / misleading data on your site.
3.1 Whether or not VAT is payable is dependent on the jurisdiction of the buyer. And this is information you generally won't be privy to. Quick illustration: With a winning bid at Sotheby's London, a UK- or France-based client would currently be liable to pay VAT on the buyer's premium. However, the same would not apply to a US-based client.
3.2 As for ARR, this is dependent on the location of sale (in some cases, a seller's residence may also be a relevant factor). Remember that the concept of droit the suite / artist's resale right isn't recognised everywhere. See the United States, for example. And when ARR is applicable, a country's laws might provide that liability rests with the seller, not with the buyer. Likewise (and again where applicable), the sliding scale and percentages used for ARR calculations may vary according to the jurisdiction where the sale took place. Uniformity in this respect isn't a luxury you can therefore count on.
__________
Hope the above comments are of assistance. Good luck to you going forward.
Now that all auctions are pretty much done for the month I have re-calculated everything on www.banksy-value.comThe result is a monthly increase of more than than 7% for June. I feel the low GBP is helping quite a bit also. Hi mate, Great work on the site, very useful bench mark. Quick questions. Do you adjust expert opinion on value each month? Are you able to disclose who provides these numbers? On the auction results do you include ARR and VAT? Thanks again for all your hard work. Thanks! I always try to include VAT and ARR where it is payable.There are two valuation metrics: automatic one is based on latest auction estimate + how many % index has gone up since last sale; and in the expert one I try to correct for outliers in results of that. I manually go through it every month. However I only update it based on factual auction trades and index development. This means that if there is eg a massive jump in short period on private market like right now, some estimates will be on low side until either the print is sold on auction or index is updated gradually. Happy to take peopleโs steer on whether above is a good methodology. My thinking was to keep any hype or claimed sales outside of auction as much out of it as possible, but that has its weakness also. Finally, I recently added a feature to allow for people to list their prints for sale. So far being tested with only a few ones know, but also wondering if there is interest in such place to aggregate prints available for private sale without having to pay big fees eg for Artsy or send them off to a gallery/auction? Although I've only had a superficial glance at the site, you've done an impressive job. One can only imagine the number of hours that were put in. __________ Perhaps an unrealistic ask from a workload perspective, but have you considered adding condition details (where available) for each piece sold? Depending on the collector, this aspect is sometimes crucial. [While no longer applicable to Banksy's market, with editioned works on paper at the three-figure level, I'm often willing to pay a high premium (x2 or x3) for those in pristine condition.]A mechanism giving the user an option to exclude certain works from the search results could also be helpful โ e.g. prints that are in distinctly poor condition, or unaccompanied by a certificate of authenticity from Pest Control Office. This would allow like-for-like comparisons to be made with greater accuracy. __________ Regarding listed prices, my advice would be to follow the approach taken by high-end auction houses. When posting results, most will typically list the hammer price plus buyer's premium. Nothing else. And for good reason (see especially point 3 below). Some advantages of excluding VAT and ARR from sale results:1. Convenience; less work for you Opting for the format used by many auction houses would allow you to just copy the sale results directly from their websites, without the need for separate arithmetic. Clearly, the easiest option. [Do note that initial results posted (while a sale is live or in the immediate aftermath) sometimes reflect the hammer price only.]2. ConsistencyMost buyers who follow auction-house sales are very used to the manner in which their results are presented. There is an attractive logic in being consistent with the unambiguous, simple format that collectors are already familiar with. 3. Elimination of unhelpful guesswork, artifice, and ethnocentricityYou mention always trying to include VAT and ARR "where it is payable". How would you find out? Presumably, you're relying on assumptions that could easily be false. The exclusion of VAT and ARR from sale-results figures would reduce the scope for erroneous / misleading data on your site. 3.1 Whether or not VAT is payable is dependent on the jurisdiction of the buyer. And this is information you generally won't be privy to. Quick illustration: With a winning bid at Sotheby's London, a UK- or France-based client would currently be liable to pay VAT on the buyer's premium. However, the same would not apply to a US-based client. 3.2 As for ARR, this is dependent on the location of sale (in some cases, a seller's residence may also be a relevant factor). Remember that the concept of droit the suite / artist's resale right isn't recognised everywhere. See the United States, for example. And when ARR is applicable, a country's laws might provide that liability rests with the seller, not with the buyer. Likewise (and again where applicable), the sliding scale and percentages used for ARR calculations may vary according to the jurisdiction where the sale took place. Uniformity in this respect isn't a luxury you can therefore count on. __________ Hope the above comments are of assistance. Good luck to you going forward.
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met
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June 2009
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Invader books - where to buy, by met on Jun 28, 2020 23:28:37 GMT 1, Iโm looking at selling my London book?! You are the only person who's in a position to answer that question.
Iโm looking at selling my London book?! You are the only person who's in a position to answer that question.
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met
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June 2009
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Banksy Welcome Mat, by met on Jun 28, 2020 22:57:26 GMT 1, I don't want to come across as a wankpuffin, especially on a Sunday of all days, but if Love Welcomes has said please be patient, we are making more; and then if you offer up one for sale now (as is your wanking right) and someone with no patience, or perhaps even no desire to help Love Welcomes (there's a lot of arseholes out there) buys it (as is their wanking right), then Love Welcomes only gets one portion of profit from two (at least) customers purchasing mats. And that's not nice. Nor is buying a mat right now for a squillion pounds, instead of waiting and buying one from the charity directly. You want to help the charity as much as possible right? Your need to own something right now, doesn't supersede your desire to help refugee women, right? I think if you were selling these long after Love Welcomes has ceased producing/selling them, or if you were passing your profits onto another charitable cause, then that's a different moral bucket of fish. Or something. Also, if your circumstances changed since you placed your order, I dunno?- maybe found yourself out of work, and you've already sold all your trainers, watches and grandmother or something, I would get the need to sell and make a profit. But, whatever, we all have to live with ourselves, the consequences of our actions, and the opinions of others. Just don't be a dick. Nobody likes a dick. Have you seen one? Awful looking things. That's it. Now call me a wanker and have a lovely day. Iโm only commenting because โwankpuffinโ is now my favourite new expression. I wonder if I can use it in a professional context during tomorrowโs team meeting...
Let's leave this wankpuffinery aside for the time being, and move on to the next item on our agenda.
I don't want to come across as a wankpuffin, especially on a Sunday of all days, but if Love Welcomes has said please be patient, we are making more; and then if you offer up one for sale now (as is your wanking right) and someone with no patience, or perhaps even no desire to help Love Welcomes (there's a lot of arseholes out there) buys it (as is their wanking right), then Love Welcomes only gets one portion of profit from two (at least) customers purchasing mats. And that's not nice. Nor is buying a mat right now for a squillion pounds, instead of waiting and buying one from the charity directly. You want to help the charity as much as possible right? Your need to own something right now, doesn't supersede your desire to help refugee women, right? I think if you were selling these long after Love Welcomes has ceased producing/selling them, or if you were passing your profits onto another charitable cause, then that's a different moral bucket of fish. Or something. Also, if your circumstances changed since you placed your order, I dunno?- maybe found yourself out of work, and you've already sold all your trainers, watches and grandmother or something, I would get the need to sell and make a profit. But, whatever, we all have to live with ourselves, the consequences of our actions, and the opinions of others. Just don't be a dick. Nobody likes a dick. Have you seen one? Awful looking things. That's it. Now call me a wanker and have a lovely day. Iโm only commenting because โwankpuffinโ is now my favourite new expression. I wonder if I can use it in a professional context during tomorrowโs team meeting... Let's leave this wankpuffinery aside for the time being, and move on to the next item on our agenda.
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met
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June 2009
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Banksy Welcome Mat, by met on Jun 28, 2020 9:39:17 GMT 1, God forbid someone makes money selling something. Such a wanky point of view. Yawn. Either buy or don't... You just look a wanker trying to impose some sort of guilt or shame you would feel (for what reason is beyond me, but you do you) on to someone else. Good luck with the sale OP. The refugees got their help already from the sale. What happens beyond that is none of your business. Wanky and a wanker, all within the space of a couple of minutes. I guess I've entirely misjudged the mood of this place. That's disappointing. And for the record, yes I would absolutely be ashamed to be selling to be flipping this. You're probably right that I would assume that other decent humans would feel the same. Good luck OP!
Wouldn't say you've entirely misjudged the mood here. But this is certainly a topic that divides opinion. It comes down to people's scruples. Diversity of position is therefore to be expected.
... there is no gulf so unbridgeable between man and man as a different standard of honour.
There are plenty of forum members who share your discomfort. I happen to be one of them and have no issue with being vocal.
In my view (whether it's using charities, or social enterprises like Love Welcomes that are helping people in dire straights to rebuild their lives), this kind of profiteering is distinct and should be discouraged.
Only Admin would be in a position to ban such immediate resales here. But others are free to express their disapproval if they wish. It even heartens me when they do so. Because every dissenting voice has an impact on the pervasive culture of the forum. An individual will think twice if they sense their actions will be criticised by their peers. And since the issue relates to ethics, the use of shame (or the appeal to morality) as a regulatory tool would seem entirely legitimate.
__________
Of course, profiteering of this nature can also be easily rationalised. That doesn't require much intelligence or imagination. Most of us are familiar with the arguments. To a great extent, they are the same justifications used by ticket touts / scalpers, allowing them to look in the mirror with a trouble-free conscience. Our inner voices can be switched off with very basic mental gymnastics.
It's true as well that many who indulge seem bolder and more dynamic when benefiting from the comfort of full or partial anonymity. If their identities and activities were instead openly exposed (to family members, close friends and contacts, work colleagues, business associates, bosses, and the wider public), such exposure would probably have a noticeable moderating effect.
__________
Thought experiment for immediate resellers of the Love Welcomes mat:
You are introduced to Banksy himself and given the opportunity to chat with him for an entire evening. Knowing about his activism and support for certain causes, how candid would you be about the fact you're immediately reselling a Love Welcomes mat for profit?
[I suspect most might keep this detail to themselves. Why? Because they would be slightly embarrassed (possibly even ashamed) to admit face-to-face that they were flipping an item intended to support and empower female refugees. Embarrassed, why? Because they're conscious of being on ethically dubious ground, plus there's a reasonable chance the artist whose work they admire would look at them with disappointment. And "disappointment" is being kind.]
God forbid someone makes money selling something. Such a wanky point of view. Yawn. Either buy or don't... You just look a wanker trying to impose some sort of guilt or shame you would feel (for what reason is beyond me, but you do you) on to someone else. Good luck with the sale OP. The refugees got their help already from the sale. What happens beyond that is none of your business. Wanky and a wanker, all within the space of a couple of minutes. I guess I've entirely misjudged the mood of this place. That's disappointing. And for the record, yes I would absolutely be ashamed to be selling to be flipping this. You're probably right that I would assume that other decent humans would feel the same. Good luck OP! Wouldn't say you've entirely misjudged the mood here. But this is certainly a topic that divides opinion. It comes down to people's scruples. Diversity of position is therefore to be expected. ... there is no gulf so unbridgeable between man and man as a different standard of honour.There are plenty of forum members who share your discomfort. I happen to be one of them and have no issue with being vocal. In my view (whether it's using charities, or social enterprises like Love Welcomes that are helping people in dire straights to rebuild their lives), this kind of profiteering is distinct and should be discouraged. Only Admin would be in a position to ban such immediate resales here. But others are free to express their disapproval if they wish. It even heartens me when they do so. Because every dissenting voice has an impact on the pervasive culture of the forum. An individual will think twice if they sense their actions will be criticised by their peers. And since the issue relates to ethics, the use of shame (or the appeal to morality) as a regulatory tool would seem entirely legitimate. __________ Of course, profiteering of this nature can also be easily rationalised. That doesn't require much intelligence or imagination. Most of us are familiar with the arguments. To a great extent, they are the same justifications used by ticket touts / scalpers, allowing them to look in the mirror with a trouble-free conscience. Our inner voices can be switched off with very basic mental gymnastics. It's true as well that many who indulge seem bolder and more dynamic when benefiting from the comfort of full or partial anonymity. If their identities and activities were instead openly exposed (to family members, close friends and contacts, work colleagues, business associates, bosses, and the wider public), such exposure would probably have a noticeable moderating effect. __________ Thought experiment for immediate resellers of the Love Welcomes mat:You are introduced to Ban ksy himself and given the opportunity to chat with him for an entire evening. Knowing about his activism and support for certain causes, how candid would you be about the fact you're immediately reselling a Love Welcomes mat for profit? [I suspect most might keep this detail to themselves. Why? Because they would be slightly embarrassed (possibly even ashamed) to admit face-to-face that they were flipping an item intended to support and empower female refugees. Embarrassed, why? Because they're conscious of being on ethically dubious ground, plus there's a reasonable chance the artist whose work they admire would look at them with disappointment. And "disappointment" is being kind.]
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met
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June 2009
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Banksy Golf Sale Print, by met on Jun 28, 2020 4:56:55 GMT 1, Sorry , another genuine thread hijacked by fools . Read some of their comments on other people's threads before you criticise me please . Thank you . There was initial hesitation on my part in continuing to engage here. My main point was already stated, and I'm conscious that prolonged exchanges are often annoyingly repetitive. That, in itself, can be counterproductive. It is always a balancing act, isn't it? One which requires each side to make a judgement call about when it's best to step away โ at least when the goal is to be persuasive.
On this occasion, I felt there was potential benefit in acknowledging and addressing your reply. This also seemed like the most courteous approach.
__________
After reading your reply, I did go through plenty of comments by @brillobox elsewhere, but didn't find anything especially egregious.
Yet what I believe is most relevant is how they commented in this thread. All I see in this thread is humorous posts, which others also found amusing, and which are in no way disparaging to you.
That is why your "Knob" responses stuck out. They came across to me as having been written by someone who (for reasons remaining unclear) got flustered and chose to lash out. It felt like an unpleasant overreaction. The subsequent doubling down, referring to other members here as fools, seemed a little unwarranted as well.
__________
Now, I fully accept that my perception of your mindset could be inaccurate โ maybe miles away from the reality of how you were feeling at the time of writing. Perhaps you were in fact calm rather than agitated, and genuinely believed your responses were measured under the circumstances.
If the situation has indeed been misinterpreted by me, then I'm happy to be corrected. Getting it right is far more important than being right.
That actually ties up with the very point I was trying to make about @brillobox's posts in this thread:
If it remains possible and reasonable to view those posts as merely attempts at humour, then it is also overly defensive to assume negative intent being directed towards you.
__________
I hope the above musings will be deemed balanced and not unfair.
Sorry , another genuine thread hijacked by fools . Read some of their comments on other people's threads before you criticise me please . Thank you . There was initial hesitation on my part in continuing to engage here. My main point was already stated, and I'm conscious that prolonged exchanges are often annoyingly repetitive. That, in itself, can be counterproductive. It is always a balancing act, isn't it? One which requires each side to make a judgement call about when it's best to step away โ at least when the goal is to be persuasive. On this occasion, I felt there was potential benefit in acknowledging and addressing your reply. This also seemed like the most courteous approach. __________ After reading your reply, I did go through plenty of comments by @brillobox elsewhere, but didn't find anything especially egregious. Yet what I believe is most relevant is how they commented in this thread. All I see in this thread is humorous posts, which others also found amusing, and which are in no way disparaging to you. That is why your "Knob" responses stuck out. They came across to me as having been written by someone who (for reasons remaining unclear) got flustered and chose to lash out. It felt like an unpleasant overreaction. The subsequent doubling down, referring to other members here as fools, seemed a little unwarranted as well. __________ Now, I fully accept that my perception of your mindset could be inaccurate โ maybe miles away from the reality of how you were feeling at the time of writing. Perhaps you were in fact calm rather than agitated, and genuinely believed your responses were measured under the circumstances. If the situation has indeed been misinterpreted by me, then I'm happy to be corrected. Getting it right is far more important than being right. That actually ties up with the very point I was trying to make about @brillobox's posts in this thread: If it remains possible and reasonable to view those posts as merely attempts at humour, then it is also overly defensive to assume negative intent being directed towards you.__________ I hope the above musings will be deemed balanced and not unfair.
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met
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Banksy Golf Sale Print, by met on Jun 27, 2020 1:09:48 GMT 1, What if the print has a Matt burn , how much does that affect the value please ? Thanks. Matt burn? Ugh! Nobody will touch that until LV90210 has declared it โhot hotโ or โnot hotโ May LV90210 look kindly on you. Knob
He has spoken kindly on you. Please use the attached certificate when making any sale. If you sell through any of the major auction houses, they WILL require this. If at some point the piece changes ownership, please contact me directly and for a small fee we can change the owner of the certificate. Knob
Unfortunate responses to a bit of lighthearted humour.
The issue has been raised before* about communications in writing: A reader doesn't hear the vocal inflections of the other person. Nor can they see their body language or facial expression. It increases the likelihood of both their words and intended tone being misinterpreted.
We've all seen cases where an online joke or gentle ribbing is mistaken for a serious comment, especially by those who are defensive in temperament โ where a situation escalates unnecessarily, from nothing.
And since each of us is aware of the risk, my suggestion is that we all be generous in spirit. By giving others the benefit of the doubt whenever there is any ambiguity about their motivation or intent.
__________
In this particular case, I picked up zero criticism of you.
If anything, @brillobox was satirising another member โ a bore whose contribution to the forum mostly consists of crass, self-interested harping about rising Banksy prices. Those posts are uninsightful, tedious and (worst of all) as predictable as clockwork.
__________
But even if someone had been critical of you, the elegant response is arguably to laugh it off.
To the extent possible, I myself try to emulate the splendid unfazed approach of H.R., when a projectile (probably a beer can or bottle) was thrown at his head. See below at 0:14.
Bad Brains - Pay To Cum (Live at CBGB, NYC, 1979) - uploaded by DaisyPumpkin23
What if the print has a Matt burn , how much does that affect the value please ? Thanks. Matt burn? Ugh! Nobody will touch that until LV90210 has declared it โhot hotโ or โnot hotโ May LV90210 look kindly on you. Knob He has spoken kindly on you. Please use the attached certificate when making any sale. If you sell through any of the major auction houses, they WILL require this. If at some point the piece changes ownership, please contact me directly and for a small fee we can change the owner of the certificate. Knob Unfortunate responses to a bit of lighthearted humour. The issue has been raised before * about communications in writing: A reader doesn't hear the vocal inflections of the other person. Nor can they see their body language or facial expression. It increases the likelihood of both their words and intended tone being misinterpreted. We've all seen cases where an online joke or gentle ribbing is mistaken for a serious comment, especially by those who are defensive in temperament โ where a situation escalates unnecessarily, from nothing. And since each of us is aware of the risk, my suggestion is that we all be generous in spirit. By giving others the benefit of the doubt whenever there is any ambiguity about their motivation or intent. __________ In this particular case, I picked up zero criticism of you. If anything, @brillobox was satirising another member โ a bore whose contribution to the forum mostly consists of crass, self-interested harping about rising Ban ksy prices. Those posts are uninsightful, tedious and (worst of all) as predictable as clockwork. __________ But even if someone had been critical of you, the elegant response is arguably to laugh it off. To the extent possible, I myself try to emulate the splendid unfazed approach of H.R., when a projectile (probably a beer can or bottle) was thrown at his head. See below at 0:14. Bad Brains - Pay To Cum (Live at CBGB, NYC, 1979)- uploaded by DaisyPumpkin23
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met
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June 2009
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JBOY ๐ฌ๐ง Print Release โข Art For Sale, by met on Jun 25, 2020 0:03:45 GMT 1, Maggie Gyllenhaal! That's it! Thanks, Met. Finally, I can rest. After three and a half years, you deserve a rest.
Maggie Gyllenhaal! That's it! Thanks, Met. Finally, I can rest. After three and a half years, you deserve a rest.
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met
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June 2009
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JBOY ๐ฌ๐ง Print Release โข Art For Sale, by met on Jun 24, 2020 23:56:38 GMT 1, New Pejac - you can start F5'ing
Who's the actress that looks like?Argh! It's on the tip of my brain.
?
This seems like a game worth playing.
I immediately thought of the model Penelope Tree. See the exceptional image below by a favourite photographer of mine, Richard Avedon:
For actresses, my top-three guesses are Olivia Colman, Samantha Morton and Maggie Gyllenhaal:
Alternatively, depending on the specific features of Pejac's mime that we're focusing on (e.g. the slightly wide-set eyes, sadness of the eyes, prominent cheekbones, or thinnish lips), there are certain resemblances to Shelley Duvall, Uma Thurman, Saoirse Ronan, Greta Gerwig, Clรฉmence Poรฉsie, Toni Collette and Emily Watson.
Sorry for the scattergun approach, which I accept is inelegant.
New Pejac - you can start F5'ing Who's the actress that looks like?Argh! It's on the tip of my brain. ? This seems like a game worth playing. I immediately thought of the model Penelope Tree. See the exceptional image below by a favourite photographer of mine, Richard Avedon: For actresses, my top-three guesses are Olivia Colman, Samantha Morton and Maggie Gyllenhaal: Alternatively, depending on the specific features of Pejac's mime that we're focusing on (e.g. the slightly wide-set eyes, sadness of the eyes, prominent cheekbones, or thinnish lips), there are certain resemblances to Shelley Duvall, Uma Thurman, Saoirse Ronan, Greta Gerwig, Clรฉmence Poรฉsie, Toni Collette and Emily Watson. Sorry for the scattergun approach, which I accept is inelegant.
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met
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June 2009
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Hepworth Flash Sale , by met on Jun 23, 2020 21:35:57 GMT 1, I think the Martin Creed Work No. 2874 is great even at ยฃ500 - that's the price I paid! The web-page quote from Martin Creed is rather good:
I like broccoli. It's my favourite vegetable. I eat broccoli every day. I like prints made from broccoli because they look like pictures of trees, and I like trees. But I don't know what colours I like, so I thought I could try a mixture of different colours.
Is that broccoli?? This appeals to the vegan in me. We're in a constant and high-stakes quest for nutrients, so can spot veg anywhere. I love it. It is indeed broccolo. He also did a load of original brocolli prints on canvas. I love the sheer cheek of this print and it's very much this artist's style (this is the artist who chewed gum and stuck it on the wall as a sculpture in his Turner Prize-winning show). Colourful too.
Martin Creed: What's the point of it? at Hayward Gallery, London was my second-favourite exhibition of 2014. Great fun, as well as being an ambitious show. [For me, it was topped only by Henri Matisse: The Cut-Outs at Tate Modern.]
If you were able to attend, you may recall Work No. 1000 (2009โ10), consisting of 1000 prints of cross-sections of broccoli. They were in various paints on card, each measuring 18 x 18 cm:
crackmagazine.net/article/long-reads/martin-creed-at-the-hayward-gallery
I think the Martin Creed Work No. 2874 is great even at ยฃ500 - that's the price I paid! The web-page quote from Martin Creed is rather good: I like broccoli. It's my favourite vegetable. I eat broccoli every day. I like prints made from broccoli because they look like pictures of trees, and I like trees. But I don't know what colours I like, so I thought I could try a mixture of different colours.Is that broccoli?? This appeals to the vegan in me. We're in a constant and high-stakes quest for nutrients, so can spot veg anywhere. I love it. It is indeed broccolo. He also did a load of original brocolli prints on canvas. I love the sheer cheek of this print and it's very much this artist's style (this is the artist who chewed gum and stuck it on the wall as a sculpture in his Turner Prize-winning show). Colourful too. Martin Creed: What's the point of it? at Hayward Gallery, London was my second-favourite exhibition of 2014. Great fun, as well as being an ambitious show. [For me, it was topped only by Henri Matisse: The Cut-Outs at Tate Modern.]If you were able to attend, you may recall Work No. 1000 (2009โ10), consisting of 1000 prints of cross-sections of broccoli. They were in various paints on card, each measuring 18 x 18 cm: crackmagazine.net/article/long-reads/martin-creed-at-the-hayward-gallery
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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Successful Cover Songs, by met on Jun 23, 2020 15:38:14 GMT 1, What a lovely way to burn.
Check out also the excellent Jack Sperling, using the drums like congas:
Peggy Lee - Fever (released in 1958, but this performance from the Something Special series, broadcast in 1967) - uploaded by Gareth Miller
An inspired mashup by Mark Vidler, a.k.a. Go Home Productions:
Peggy Lee vs Iggy Pop - Passenger Fever (Go Home Productions, 2007) - uploaded by Eric Bochene
The remarkable original version:
Little Willie John - Fever (1956) - uploaded by Music Legends Book
What a lovely way to burn.
Check out also the excellent Jack Sperling, using the drums like congas:
Peggy Lee - Fever (released in 1958, but this performance from the Something Special series, broadcast in 1967) - uploaded by Gareth Miller
An inspired mashup by Mark Vidler, a.k.a. Go Home Productions:
Peggy Lee vs Iggy Pop - Passenger Fever (Go Home Productions, 2007) - uploaded by Eric Bochene
The remarkable original version:
Little Willie John - Fever (1956) - uploaded by Music Legends Book
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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The Connor Brothers ๐ฌ๐ง Mike Snelle & James Golding, by met on Jun 23, 2020 14:55:25 GMT 1, Selling my Connor Brothers print which I bought directly from Maddox Gallery in Feb 19 It has been kept protected + flat but it is unframed Collection ideally from London Pls PM me with any offers Thank you I Can Resist Everything Except Temptation, 2019 Pigment Print With Silkscreen Varnish Edition of 50 130 x 80cm Unframed
THE CONNOR BROTHERS RECIPE
1. Steal somebody else's artwork. [Victor Olson, 1961]
2. Steal somebody else's quote. [Lady Wildemere's Fan]
3. Mix with a dash of Photoshop.
4. Presto and voilร !
Now print off endless copies, sign as your own, and sell to the ignorant or undiscerning.
Selling my Connor Brothers print which I bought directly from Maddox Gallery in Feb 19 It has been kept protected + flat but it is unframed Collection ideally from London Pls PM me with any offers Thank you I Can Resist Everything Except Temptation, 2019 Pigment Print With Silkscreen Varnish Edition of 50 130 x 80cm Unframed THE CONNOR BROTHERS RECIPE1. Steal somebody else's artwork. [Victor Olson, 1961]2. Steal somebody else's quote. [Lady Wildemere's Fan]3. Mix with a dash of Photoshop.4. Presto and voilร !Now print off endless copies, sign as your own, and sell to the ignorant or undiscerning.
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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Dran โข Art Thief, by met on Jun 23, 2020 12:34:58 GMT 1, -SCAM ALERT-Whilst browsing Artsy I just discovered that a "gallery" Arts Limited has without my consent listed my print for sale, even using my personal photo! ๐ณ At no point have I knowingly had contact with this company or agreed to consign/sell through them. Please see below for Artsy screenshot, link to the Artsy listing and Arts Limited website. www.artsy.net/artwork/dran-dran-art-theifwww.arts-limited.com It's ok to misrepresent and attempt to carry out fraud on Artsy, see below for their response ๐๐๐ Thank you for reaching out to Artsy and for sharing your concerns about "DRAN 'ART THEIF'" (2011). Kindly note that Artsy is not involved in the internal operations of our gallery partners. As a next step, will you please reach out to Arts Limited directly with your questions about this work? You may contact them via email at info@arts-limited.com. Please let us know if they do not respond or if you would like us to facilitate a direct connection and we're happy to help. Kind regards, Artsy Support Team
In my view, it probably isn't a scam or fraud. But it's certainly underhanded, deceitful behaviour. Arguably a form of undisclosed dropshipping:
(i) Arts Limited manages to secure a sale of your artwork for ยฃ1,995 and is in receipt of the cash;
(ii) Arts Limited then purchases the artwork from you for ยฃ1,250 or less, and perhaps even gets you to post directly to the end buyer; and
(iii) Arts Limited pockets the difference of ยฃ745+.
This is the kind of sleazy dishonesty that businesses like Guy Hepner Gallery are well-known for โ including among other galleries from whom Hepner "borrows" images of art those galleries have for sale (typically without their knowledge or express consent). To illustrate, one recent example is what occurred with the set of Invader prints owned by Elephants and Castles:
urbanartassociation.com/thread/163126/invader-aladdin-sane-full-mint
A couple of options for you:
1. Pick up the phone, give Arts Limited a call, and see what the person at the other end of the line has to say. Tel: 020 8115 3753
2. Do nothing and let Arts Limited try to sell the artwork in their unprofessional way. You may end up with your current asking price of ยฃ1,250 more quickly.
__________
... I don't even believe that Arts Limited is a limited company, unless ALtd is a 'trading name' ... ... based in St John's Wood, London but no address ... Could this be the โgalleryโ in question? Name seems to match up with the listed postcode on their website. Full address in company overview: beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/03756627
Which postcode did you use when searching?
S.H. Arts Limited is highly unlikely to be the business behind Arts Limited. The former is owned by Sophie Hicks, a reputable architect (and mother of Edie Campbell). She really doesn't come across as the type of person who would stoop to the level that Arts Limited has.
-SCAM ALERT-Whilst browsing Artsy I just discovered that a "gallery" Arts Limited has without my consent listed my print for sale, even using my personal photo! ๐ณ At no point have I knowingly had contact with this company or agreed to consign/sell through them. Please see below for Artsy screenshot, link to the Artsy listing and Arts Limited website. www.artsy.net/artwork/dran-dran-art-theifwww.arts-limited.com It's ok to misrepresent and attempt to carry out fraud on Artsy, see below for their response ๐๐๐ Thank you for reaching out to Artsy and for sharing your concerns about "DRAN 'ART THEIF'" (2011). Kindly note that Artsy is not involved in the internal operations of our gallery partners. As a next step, will you please reach out to Arts Limited directly with your questions about this work? You may contact them via email at info@arts-limited.com. Please let us know if they do not respond or if you would like us to facilitate a direct connection and we're happy to help. Kind regards, Artsy Support Team In my view, it probably isn't a scam or fraud. But it's certainly underhanded, deceitful behaviour. Arguably a form of undisclosed dropshipping: (i) Arts Limited manages to secure a sale of your artwork for ยฃ1,995 and is in receipt of the cash; (ii) Arts Limited then purchases the artwork from you for ยฃ1,250 or less, and perhaps even gets you to post directly to the end buyer; and (iii) Arts Limited pockets the difference of ยฃ745+. This is the kind of sleazy dishonesty that businesses like Guy Hepner Gallery are well-known for โ including among other galleries from whom Hepner "borrows" images of art those galleries have for sale (typically without their knowledge or express consent). To illustrate, one recent example is what occurred with the set of Invader prints owned by Elephants and Castles: urbanartassociation.com/thread/163126/invader-aladdin-sane-full-mintA couple of options for you:1. Pick up the phone, give Arts Limited a call, and see what the person at the other end of the line has to say. Tel: 020 8115 3753 2. Do nothing and let Arts Limited try to sell the artwork in their unprofessional way. You may end up with your current asking price of ยฃ1,250 more quickly. __________ ... I don't even believe that Arts Limited is a limited company, unless ALtd is a 'trading name' ... ... based in St John's Wood, London but no address ... Could this be the โgalleryโ in question? Name seems to match up with the listed postcode on their website. Full address in company overview: beta.companieshouse.gov.uk/company/03756627Which postcode did you use when searching? S.H. Arts Limited is highly unlikely to be the business behind Arts Limited. The former is owned by Sophie Hicks, a reputable architect (and mother of Edie Campbell). She really doesn't come across as the type of person who would stoop to the level that Arts Limited has.
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
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June 2009
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Share your favorite Black/Minority Artist , by met on Jun 6, 2020 20:42:30 GMT 1, Viewing artists through the narrow prism of identity politics; judging and classifying and segregating them according to immutable characteristics like race, ethnicity, gender, sexual orientation... There, in my view, lies the path to regression. The path leading away from progress. Away from the dream King had for his four little children. It is worth asking ourselves if we would ever utter out loud, without embarrassment, a statement along the lines of, "[x] is a very good black artist." And in their presence, query whether we'd say to them (at least as a compliment), "You are my favourite black artist."If the answers are no, then perhaps the actual premise of this thread should be reconsidered, notwithstanding any underlying good intentions. Sorry, as a mixed race person, i feel that identity should not be marginalized , diluted, or overlooked. Go pound sand
Since I'm trying to avoid multiple discussions in parallel, forgive me for just quoting your post, cest.
Had to Google the expression "Go pound sand" to find out what it meant. So there are educational benefits to this forum. What this emphasises is the fact none of us ever ceases to be a student. Nor should we.
No substantive issue with your opinion; it seems reasonable enough to me.
[By way of aside, I do however believe this opinion is undermined when you qualify it by reference to your background. Arguments are sound and persuasive. Or they are not. The identity of a holder (along with their ethnicity, sex, sexual orientation, etc.) is irrelevant to the strength of their arguments.
It so happens I'm a hybrid myself (as no doubt will be the case with many others here). But that isn't something to be raised by me to bolster my views. Because it simply isn't germane. What a reader or listener should say is, "Yes, that point was well-made" or "No, that point was unconvincing; it was poorly thought-through". One truly hopes they will avoid a comment like, "Yes, well-said, for a mixed-race person."
Logic and reasoning are simply not race issues. So any implication that they can be is unhelpful. It's a corruption that hinders rational debate instead of promoting it.]
Regarding this opinion, fair enough if people may want to celebrate their identities. The two of us don't disagree here.
Indeed, people can also celebrate their sub-identities. And their sub-sub-identities. The categories, the boxes, the pigeonholes โ all of these can be subdivided and broken down continuously, until we finally get to each unique person on earth. Dr. King was mentioned in my previous post. And this is precisely what he was referring to when (in Washington, D.C. on 28 August 1963) he shared his hopes for the future, including this one:
I have a dream my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character. I have a dream today!
King was certainly not marginalising, diluting, or overlooking identity. On the contrary, he was taking that notion to its righteous conclusion. That people be judged as individuals. And of course judged equally, according to the same standards.
__________
Now, when it comes to artists who've earned their stripes in the art world, on what bases should their work be assessed?
Moreover, according to what criteria would the artists themselves wish and expect their work to be appraised?
A number of possible criteria come to my mind โ like talent, technical skill, innovativeness. But the segregation of these professionals according to their race is an approach that feels backward.
__________
I'll pose my earlier question once again.
Take a specific example. In the presence of, say, Jean-Michel Basquait, would it ever have entered the mind of anyone here to tell him, "Sir, you are a very good black / mixed-race artist."?
Members who have informed themselves, including by watching interview footage of Basquiat, know what kind of response this would have elicited from him. The artist heavily resented being patronised, and being judged by standards different to those of his peers, for reason of his skin colour alone. It was a rather benign yet thoroughly offensive racism. "He's done well, that young (black) man. Good for him."
__________
A few more examples, purely for emphasis. Query how many of us would be comfortable saying (or even witnessing another person say) the following:
- "Mr deGrasse-Tyson, you are an excellent black astrophysicist."
- "Mr Freeman, great performance in The Shawshank Redemption! It may interest you to know that you're my favourite black actor."
- [When alive] "Mr Cochran, your oratory skills are most impressive. In fact, congratulations, because you are Number 1 on the list I've compiled of capable black attorneys."
I do take issue with comments of this nature and their underlying mindset. Because they frankly seem racist to me. More importantly (at least when well-intentioned), I believe they risk being counterproductive โ i.e. ultimately harmful to the causes they are presumably meant to support.
Nonetheless, I'm also well aware that opinions on these matters vary greatly.
The fact other people may hold positions different to my own doesn't offend me in the slightest. Nor do I consider this a reason to respond to them in a manner that isn't conducive to open dialogue. In an already highly-polarised society, the ongoing and courteous exchange of competing viewpoints is far more important to me than trading insults or petty point-scoring.
Viewing artists through the narrow prism of identity politics; judging and classifying and segregating them according to immutable characteristics like race, ethnicity, gender, sexual orientation... There, in my view, lies the path to regression. The path leading away from progress. Away from the dream King had for his four little children. It is worth asking ourselves if we would ever utter out loud, without embarrassment, a statement along the lines of, "[x] is a very good black artist." And in their presence, query whether we'd say to them (at least as a compliment), "You are my favourite black artist."If the answers are no, then perhaps the actual premise of this thread should be reconsidered, notwithstanding any underlying good intentions. Sorry, as a mixed race person, i feel that identity should not be marginalized , diluted, or overlooked. Go pound sand Since I'm trying to avoid multiple discussions in parallel, forgive me for just quoting your post, cest. Had to Google the expression "Go pound sand" to find out what it meant. So there are educational benefits to this forum. What this emphasises is the fact none of us ever ceases to be a student. Nor should we. No substantive issue with your opinion; it seems reasonable enough to me. [By way of aside, I do however believe this opinion is undermined when you qualify it by reference to your background. Arguments are sound and persuasive. Or they are not. The identity of a holder (along with their ethnicity, sex, sexual orientation, etc.) is irrelevant to the strength of their arguments. It so happens I'm a hybrid myself (as no doubt will be the case with many others here). But that isn't something to be raised by me to bolster my views. Because it simply isn't germane. What a reader or listener should say is, "Yes, that point was well-made" or "No, that point was unconvincing; it was poorly thought-through". One truly hopes they will avoid a comment like, "Yes, well-said, for a mixed-race person." Logic and reasoning are simply not race issues. So any implication that they can be is unhelpful. It's a corruption that hinders rational debate instead of promoting it.]Regarding this opinion, fair enough if people may want to celebrate their identities. The two of us don't disagree here. Indeed, people can also celebrate their sub-identities. And their sub-sub-identities. The categories, the boxes, the pigeonholes โ all of these can be subdivided and broken down continuously, until we finally get to each unique person on earth. Dr. King was mentioned in my previous post. And this is precisely what he was referring to when (in Washington, D.C. on 28 August 1963) he shared his hopes for the future, including this one: I have a dream my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character. I have a dream today!King was certainly not marginalising, diluting, or overlooking identity. On the contrary, he was taking that notion to its righteous conclusion. That people be judged as individuals. And of course judged equally, according to the same standards. __________ Now, when it comes to artists who've earned their stripes in the art world, on what bases should their work be assessed? Moreover, according to what criteria would the artists themselves wish and expect their work to be appraised? A number of possible criteria come to my mind โ like talent, technical skill, innovativeness. But the segregation of these professionals according to their race is an approach that feels backward. __________ I'll po se my earlier question once again. Take a specific example. In the presence of, say, Jean-Michel Basquait, would it ever have entered the mind of anyone here to tell him, "Sir, you are a very good black / mixed-race artist."? Members who have informed themselves, including by watching interview footage of Bas quiat, know what kind of response this would have elicited from him. The artist heavily resented being patronised, and being judged by standards different to those of his peers, for reason of his skin colour alone. It was a rather benign yet thoroughly offensive racism. "He's done well, that young (black) man. Good for him."__________ A few more examples, purely for emphasis. Query how many of us would be comfortable saying (or even witnessing another person say) the following: - "Mr deGrasse-Tyson, you are an excellent black astrophysicist."- "Mr Freeman, great performance in The Shawshank Redemption! It may interest you to know that you're my favourite black actor." - [When alive] "Mr Cochran, your oratory skills are most impressive. In fact, congratulations, because you are Number 1 on the list I've compiled of capable black attorneys." I do take issue with comments of this nature and their underlying mindset. Because they frankly seem racist to me. More importantly (at least when well-intentioned), I believe they risk being counterproductive โ i.e. ultimately harmful to the causes they are presumably meant to support. Nonetheless, I'm also well aware that opinions on these matters vary greatly. The fact other people may hold positions different to my own doesn't offend me in the slightest. Nor do I consider this a reason to respond to them in a manner that isn't conducive to open dialogue. In an already highly-polarised society, the ongoing and courteous exchange of competing viewpoints is far more important to me than trading insults or petty point-scoring.
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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Share your favorite Black/Minority Artist , by met on Jun 6, 2020 3:26:34 GMT 1, Viewing artists through the narrow prism of identity politics; judging and classifying and segregating them according to immutable characteristics like race, ethnicity, gender, sexual orientation... There, in my view, lies the path to regression. The path leading away from progress. Away from the dream King had for his four little children.
It is worth asking ourselves if we would ever utter out loud, without embarrassment, a statement along the lines of, "[x] is a very good black artist." And in their presence, query whether we'd say to them (at least as a compliment), "You are my favourite black artist."
If the answers are no, then perhaps the actual premise of this thread should be reconsidered, notwithstanding any underlying good intentions.
Viewing artists through the narrow prism of identity politics; judging and classifying and segregating them according to immutable characteristics like race, ethnicity, gender, sexual orientation... There, in my view, lies the path to regression. The path leading away from progress. Away from the dream King had for his four little children.
It is worth asking ourselves if we would ever utter out loud, without embarrassment, a statement along the lines of, "[x] is a very good black artist." And in their presence, query whether we'd say to them (at least as a compliment), "You are my favourite black artist."
If the answers are no, then perhaps the actual premise of this thread should be reconsidered, notwithstanding any underlying good intentions.
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
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June 2009
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Banksy Print, Canvas, WANTED, by met on Jun 5, 2020 7:33:56 GMT 1, From the thread, Banksy: what would you do?*:
Hi, I am new to Banksy and would like to buy a genuine print however do not know where to buy one and what price to pay. Any help would be much apprecaited Nick __________
Wanted Banksy Original POW print Can anybody advise me on how to tell a genuine POW print with back stamps Also looking to buy a genuine Banksy POW print quite like the Rude Policeman or similiar Please PM me
My hope is almost that you are playacting and feigning obliviousness.
But if that is not the case, then I'll admit being rather terrified by the level of ignorance you've demonstrated (in just two posts) regarding Banksy's commercial work and his market. Especially given your keenness to buy a print right now.
__________
If I were dishonest by nature, you would be my ideal target. The perfect mark. I'd be especially amiable and charming โ further ingratiating myself through the knowledge I would generously share, my faux helpfulness, and a non-pushy sales pitch. All with a view to eventually ripping you off. And doing so with deftness. To such an extent that you'd actually believe I had done you a favour and thank me for it.
__________
The point here is that you are in a bad position to contemplate a Banksy purchase.
To be blunt, at present you lack sufficient knowledge, which will leave you vulnerable to poor decision-making. You don't even seem fully aware of the risks. Whether these relate to the number of counterfeits in circulation, provenance considerations that should be borne in mind, possible condition issues (including those hidden by framing), the identity of businesses and individuals most likely to charge extortionate pricing, along with all of the other potential pitfalls that accompany high-value art acquisitions.
I would strongly recommend that you hold back on buying a Banksy print โ for at least three months, if not half a year.
Spend that time being proactive in educating yourself about the artist's commercial print releases (titles, years, mediums, dimensions, edition sizes, etc.) and about Pest Control Office.
Research the identities and reputations of secondary dealers and auction houses that sell Banksys. Ask for price lists and study past auction results to better understand the market for each print. Read condition reports. See as many of the works as you can in person. Inspect them up-close at venues that are currently open.
Inform yourself of the basics, including about: (i) various printing techniques (e.g. screenprinting, giclรฉe, offset lithography); (ii) different paper and ink types, and their characteristics; (iii) framing styles, techniques and materials; (iv) art conservation; and (v) damage to works on paper (e.g. UV-light damage, mat burn, skinning, adhesive residue).
Learn what to look for and what questions to ask when it comes to authenticity, provenance, and condition. Train your eye until you can confidently spot many fake Banksys just by looking at jpeg images online.
Remember that impatience can easily lead to costly mistakes.
Good luck. You have a fair way to go, but the journey is also a large part of the fun.
From the thread, Banksy: what would you do?*: Hi, I am new to Banksy and would like to buy a genuine print however do not know where to buy one and what price to pay. Any help would be much apprecaited Nick __________ Wanted Banksy Original POW print Can anybody advise me on how to tell a genuine POW print with back stamps Also looking to buy a genuine Banksy POW print quite like the Rude Policeman or similiar Please PM me My hope is almost that you are playacting and feigning obliviousness. But if that is not the case, then I'll admit being rather terrified by the level of ignorance you've demonstrated (in just two posts) regarding Ban ksy's commercial work and his market. Especially given your keenness to buy a print right now. __________ If I were dishonest by nature, you would be my ideal target. The perfect mark. I'd be especially amiable and charming โ further ingratiating myself through the knowledge I would generously share, my faux helpfulness, and a non-pushy sales pitch. All with a view to eventually ripping you off. And doing so with deftness. To such an extent that you'd actually believe I had done you a favour and thank me for it. __________ The point here is that you are in a bad position to contemplate a Ban ksy purchase. To be blunt, at present you lack sufficient knowledge, which will leave you vulnerable to poor decision-making. You don't even seem fully aware of the risks. Whether these relate to the number of counterfeits in circulation, provenance considerations that should be borne in mind, possible condition issues (including those hidden by framing), the identity of businesses and individuals most likely to charge extortionate pricing, along with all of the other potential pitfalls that accompany high-value art acquisitions. I would strongly recommend that you hold back on buying a Banksy print โ for at least three months, if not half a year. Spend that time being proactive in educating yourself about the artist's commercial print releases (titles, years, mediums, dimensions, edition sizes, etc.) and about Pest Control Office. Research the identities and reputations of secondary dealers and auction houses that sell Ban ksys. Ask for price lists and study past auction results to better understand the market for each print. Read condition reports. See as many of the works as you can in person. Inspect them up-close at venues that are currently open. Inform yourself of the basics, including about: (i) various printing techniques (e.g. screenprinting, giclรฉe, offset lithography); (ii) different paper and ink types, and their characteristics; (iii) framing styles, techniques and materials; (iv) art conservation; and (v) damage to works on paper (e.g. UV-light damage, mat burn, skinning, adhesive residue). Learn what to look for and what questions to ask when it comes to authenticity, provenance, and condition. Train your eye until you can confidently spot many fake Ban ksys just by looking at jpeg images online. Remember that impatience can easily lead to costly mistakes. Good luck. You have a fair way to go, but the journey is also a large part of the fun.
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met
Junior Member
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June 2009
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5/30/20 Los Angeles, California, by met on Jun 2, 2020 21:31:47 GMT 1, If I had to self-isolate at your place, the first thing I'd do is open all the windows and encourage everyone to change their diet.
If I had to self-isolate at your place, the first thing I'd do is open all the windows and encourage everyone to change their diet.
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
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June 2009
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3D Robert Del Naja print โProtectionโ NHS, by met on Jun 2, 2020 17:57:17 GMT 1, Absolutely.
But at the same time, when purporting to raise money for a charitable cause, full transparency is the only correct way to proceed.
Frankly, no other way is ethically acceptable. There should never be any ambiguity, scope for dodginess, or even room for suspicion that the charity banner is possibly being abused โ as is the case when unhelpfully vague references are made, like "All profits will go to [x]".
So this is less a comment about what Robert Del Naja is doing right, than about what others are doing poorly.
Absolutely. But at the same time, when purporting to raise money for a charitable cause, full transparency is the only correct way to proceed. Frankly, no other way is ethically acceptable. There should never be any ambiguity, scope for dodginess, or even room for suspicion that the charity banner is possibly being abused โ as is the case when unhelpfully vague references are made, like "All profits will go to [x]". So this is less a comment about what Robert Del Na ja is doing right, than about what others are doing poorly.
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
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June 2009
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Dran โข Art Thief, by met on Jun 2, 2020 17:12:50 GMT 1, For sale is my Dran Art Thief, purchased directly from POW. Year 2011 Screen Print on 300 GSM archival paper Signed and numbered by the artist Size 36.5 x 37 cms Edition 50 London based. Due to frame would prefer socially distanced meet up. ยฃ1650 ono Serious enquires only please ๐
Me like. Do you know if the de-framed picture in the background references a real painting? I recall seeing an edition of this one with Van Gogh's sunflowers. Don't recognise the image here. Regardless, it's a great piece. GLWS!
On this occasion, I suspect the de-framed piece doesn't refer to a specific painting or artist. It may just represent an anonymous abstract painting.
As a speculative stretch, one could try making the case that it references the work of Hermann Nitsch.
For sale is my Dran Art Thief, purchased directly from POW. Year 2011 Screen Print on 300 GSM archival paper Signed and numbered by the artist Size 36.5 x 37 cms Edition 50 London based. Due to frame would prefer socially distanced meet up. ยฃ1650 ono Serious enquires only please ๐ Me like. Do you know if the de-framed picture in the background references a real painting? I recall seeing an edition of this one with Van Gogh's sunflowers. Don't recognise the image here. Regardless, it's a great piece. GLWS! On this occasion, I suspect the de-framed piece doesn't refer to a specific painting or artist. It may just represent an anonymous abstract painting. As a speculative stretch, one could try making the case that it references the work of Hermann Nitsch.
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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Legit or Fake Banksy Stop and Search, by met on May 23, 2020 10:41:58 GMT 1, Hi, i have been offered a Banksy Artist Proof Stop and Search. The number I have been offered is Roman I, like you can see at the photos. What is your opinion, for me it looks like fake. Nice Saturday for everybody.
Does it come with a COA from Pest Control? No and the story he is telling around this is also crazy, but Iโm interested in your opinion, what do you think, legit, good fake, worse fake etc. maybe it also helps others to be more carefully before spending there money for works without CoA.
Use your common sense. fake as hell I also say, that it is fake, but I think it is ok to ask for other opinions and thoughts.
Curious as the circumstances of being offered this print I have been interested in a Beuys he is selling in Germany and recently he offered me the, that he has an Banksy Artist Proof and that he is not very firm with Banksy ( I pretended to be totally unknown about Banksy ) and than he starrest cooking his story, that he bought this from a worker of PoW during his stay in London etc because the guy needs cash etc. because he wasnโt paid at the end by PoW. Of course a crazy story, unbelievable but I just thought, I will share this with the community and asking about opinion.
now you should share with him that he can no longer blow smoke rings up your backside. Iโm just thinking, how to do it, to leave this also with a profit ๐
1. The piece you've been offered is a counterfeit Banksy print. Here is just one of the red flags:
Detail of the counterfeit
Detail of a Stop and Search print by Banksy
2. The seller is clearly a fraudster. The backstory they gave you discounts the possibility that they genuinely believe the print to be authentic.
3. Given points 1 and 2 above, please could you provide details of the seller โ e.g. (as applicable) their name, website, email address, forum username, and/or eBay ID.
This will let forum members know who to watch out for, reducing their risk of getting scammed by the same seller.
[An additional benefit of disclosing such information is that it will offer reassurance that you yourself are posting here in good faith.]
Hi, i have been offered a Banksy Artist Proof Stop and Search. The number I have been offered is Roman I, like you can see at the photos. What is your opinion, for me it looks like fake. Nice Saturday for everybody. Does it come with a COA from Pest Control? No and the story he is telling around this is also crazy, but Iโm interested in your opinion, what do you think, legit, good fake, worse fake etc. maybe it also helps others to be more carefully before spending there money for works without CoA. Use your common sense. fake as hell I also say, that it is fake, but I think it is ok to ask for other opinions and thoughts. Curious as the circumstances of being offered this print I have been interested in a Beuys he is selling in Germany and recently he offered me the, that he has an Banksy Artist Proof and that he is not very firm with Banksy ( I pretended to be totally unknown about Banksy ) and than he starrest cooking his story, that he bought this from a worker of PoW during his stay in London etc because the guy needs cash etc. because he wasnโt paid at the end by PoW. Of course a crazy story, unbelievable but I just thought, I will share this with the community and asking about opinion. now you should share with him that he can no longer blow smoke rings up your backside. Iโm just thinking, how to do it, to leave this also with a profit ๐ 1. The piece you've been offered is a counterfeit Banksy print. Here is just one of the red flags: Detail of the counterfeitDetail of a Stop and Search print by Banksy2. The seller is clearly a fraudster. The backstory they gave you discounts the possibility that they genuinely believe the print to be authentic. 3. Given points 1 and 2 above, please could you provide details of the seller โ e.g. (as applicable) their name, website, email address, forum username, and/or eB ay ID. This will let forum members know who to watch out for, reducing their risk of getting scammed by the same seller. [An additional benefit of disclosing such information is that it will offer reassurance that you yourself are posting here in good faith.]
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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Adam Pendleton ๐บ๐ธ New Print Release โข Exhibition News, by met on May 22, 2020 8:25:45 GMT 1, Anyone familiar with Adam Pendleton? New print of his coming from Pace Gallery in June. While I don't collect or closely follow Adam Pendleton, many of his DIY-style techniques are very appealing to me. And for impact, it is often hard to beat the use of monochrome on a grand scale.
Since a visual taster may be helpful to some members, below are snapshots of Adam Pendleton: Our Ideas at Pace Gallery, London. These were taken by me in October 2018.
In terms of curatorial-hanging choices, that exhibition was one of the most impressive I've witnessed (albeit largely-enhanced by Pace's Mayfair venue).
Shows like these are a great reminder that there really is no substitute to seeing art in person. Online viewing experiences are flaccid by comparison.
Anyone familiar with Adam Pendleton? New print of his coming from Pace Gallery in June. While I don't collect or closely follow Adam Pendleton, many of his DIY-style techniques are very appealing to me. And for impact, it is often hard to beat the use of monochrome on a grand scale. Since a visual taster may be helpful to some members, below are snapshots of Adam Pendleton: Our Ideas at Pace Gallery, London. These were taken by me in October 2018. In terms of curatorial-hanging choices, that exhibition was one of the most impressive I've witnessed (albeit largely-enhanced by Pace's Mayfair venue). Shows like these are a great reminder that there really is no substitute to seeing art in person. Online viewing experiences are flaccid by comparison.
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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Paul Insect Artwork, VALUATION, by met on May 21, 2020 16:12:27 GMT 1, [...] 3.How Now Clown Mao (Gold Hair), 2011 Eight-colour hand-pulled screenprint on 300 gsm Somerset off-white velvet Edition of 15 Signed, dated and numbered Blindstamped by the publisher, Pictures On Walls Dimensions: 84 x 71 cm[A framed copy of this one was consigned to Chiswick Auctions for its Ur ban Art sale on 20 June 2018 (Lot 477; Estimate ยฃ5,500โยฃ6,500) *, though it may have been bought in. [...] I saw the gold one go on a Norwegian site for around 7500 KR which at the time (only 5months ago) is roughly 800 usd. 6500 seems ridiculous
Thank you very much for the information.
NOK 7,500 for one of the editions of 15 feels low to me, especially when compared to the higher prices recently achieved with the regular edition of 80.
Would you have a link to this Norwegian site?
I wouldn't mind checking whether that sale was at auction (perhaps flying under the radar), or for a fixed price through a dealer or private collector. It would also be good to see if any condition issues were mentioned in the relevant listing.
[...] 3.How Now Clown Mao (Gold Hair), 2011 Eight-colour hand-pulled screenprint on 300 gsm Somerset off-white velvet Edition of 15 Signed, dated and numbered Blindstamped by the publisher, Pictures On Walls Dimensions: 84 x 71 cm[A framed copy of this one was consigned to Chiswick Auctions for its Ur ban Art sale on 20 June 2018 (Lot 477; Estimate ยฃ5,500โยฃ6,500) *, though it may have been bought in. [...] I saw the gold one go on a Norwegian site for around 7500 KR which at the time (only 5months ago) is roughly 800 usd. 6500 seems ridiculous Thank you very much for the information. NOK 7,500 for one of the editions of 15 feels low to me, especially when compared to the higher prices recently achieved with the regular edition of 80. Would you have a link to this Norwegian site? I wouldn't mind checking whether that sale was at auction (perhaps flying under the radar), or for a fixed price through a dealer or private collector. It would also be good to see if any condition issues were mentioned in the relevant listing.
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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Gary Hume ๐ฌ๐ง Print Release โข Show News โข Art For Sale, by met on May 21, 2020 15:05:46 GMT 1, The measurements seems ill described It says 1.8 meters high. But also says 6โ I expect that they meant 6โ But that is supposition. And oh how they danced The little children of Stonehenge Beneath the haunted moon For fear that daybreak might come too soon
The measurements seems ill described It says 1.8 meters high. But also says 6โ I expect that they meant 6โ But that is supposition. And oh how they danced The little children of Stonehenge Beneath the haunted moon For fear that daybreak might come too soon
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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Paul Insect Artwork, VALUATION, by met on May 21, 2020 10:16:51 GMT 1, What is the going rate for the three variants of โHow now clown mao?โ Original version, gold hair, and green hair. I DONโT OWN ANY OF THESE! They donโt come up often so it is hard to pin down a going rate for these.
Doesn't look like wakeskater received much feedback, so I'll give this a shot as well.
In case members are aware of recently completed public or private sales for any of the Paul Insect editions below, I would be most grateful to learn about the pricing achieved.
Likewise if anyone has information about prices currently being asked by sellers. Or, conversely, offer levels being made by buyers.
Many thanks for your time.
1.
How Now Clown Mao, 2011 Eight-colour hand-pulled screenprint on 300 gsm Somerset off-white velvet Edition of 80 Signed, dated and numbered Blindstamped by the publisher, Pictures On Walls Dimensions: 84 x 71 cm
[I am aware of the sale thread started by South Bound on 13 December 2019* (US $2,200 + PayPal & shipping) โ along with Paddle8 auctions that closed on 26 September 2019 (US $2,250 hammer + BP & shipping) and 20 November 2019 (US $2,500 hammer + BP & shipping).]
2.
How Now Clown Mao (Green Hair), 2011 Eight-colour hand-pulled screenprint on 300 gsm Somerset off-white velvet Edition of 15 Signed, dated and numbered Blindstamped by the publisher, Pictures On Walls Dimensions: 84 x 71 cm
3.
How Now Clown Mao (Gold Hair), 2011 Eight-colour hand-pulled screenprint on 300 gsm Somerset off-white velvet Edition of 15 Signed, dated and numbered Blindstamped by the publisher, Pictures On Walls Dimensions: 84 x 71 cm
[A framed copy of this one was consigned to Chiswick Auctions for its Urban Art sale on 20 June 2018 (Lot 477; Estimate ยฃ5,500โยฃ6,500)*, though it may have been bought in.
Earlier this month, Unica did refer to a recent sale of theirs*. Provided they are comfortable disclosing the ballpark sale figure, I'd be very happy to hear it.]
4.
X-Ray Spex Blue Aluminium, 2008 Seven-colour hand-pulled screenprint on 2.5 mm aluminium sheet Edition of 10 Signed, dated and numbered by the artist on verso Dimensions: 80 x 50 cm Released by Lazarides
What is the going rate for the three variants of โHow now clown mao?โ Original version, gold hair, and green hair. I DONโT OWN ANY OF THESE! They donโt come up often so it is hard to pin down a going rate for these. Doesn't look like wakeskater received much feedback, so I'll give this a shot as well. In case members are aware of recently completed public or private sales for any of the Paul Insect editions below, I would be most grateful to learn about the pricing achieved. Likewise if anyone has information about prices currently being asked by sellers. Or, conversely, offer levels being made by buyers. Many thanks for your time. 1.How Now Clown Mao, 2011 Eight-colour hand-pulled screenprint on 300 gsm Somerset off-white velvet Edition of 80 Signed, dated and numbered Blindstamped by the publisher, Pictures On Walls Dimensions: 84 x 71 cm[I am aware of the sale thread started by South Bound on 13 December 2019 * (US $2,200 + PayPal & shipping) โ along with Paddle8 auctions that closed on 26 September 2019 (US $2,250 hammer + BP & shipping) and 20 November 2019 (US $2,500 hammer + BP & shipping).] 2.How Now Clown Mao (Green Hair), 2011 Eight-colour hand-pulled screenprint on 300 gsm Somerset off-white velvet Edition of 15 Signed, dated and numbered Blindstamped by the publisher, Pictures On Walls Dimensions: 84 x 71 cm3.How Now Clown Mao (Gold Hair), 2011 Eight-colour hand-pulled screenprint on 300 gsm Somerset off-white velvet Edition of 15 Signed, dated and numbered Blindstamped by the publisher, Pictures On Walls Dimensions: 84 x 71 cm[A framed copy of this one was consigned to Chiswick Auctions for its Ur ban Art sale on 20 June 2018 (Lot 477; Estimate ยฃ5,500โยฃ6,500) *, though it may have been bought in. Earlier this month, Unica did refer to a recent sale of theirs *. Provided they are comfortable disclosing the ballpark sale figure, I'd be very happy to hear it.] 4.X-Ray Spex Blue Aluminium, 2008 Seven-colour hand-pulled screenprint on 2.5 mm aluminium sheet Edition of 10 Signed, dated and numbered by the artist on verso Dimensions: 80 x 50 cm Released by Lazarides
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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Mrs Banksy, by met on May 20, 2020 15:27:43 GMT 1, Met, blah, blah, blah...... enough already. You are like a broken record. You have shown your TRUE COLOURS. I feel sorry for you. I wish you well, hope you get over your personal demons. Please stop attacking me. Please stop being a BULLY. Hug somebody..... Have a nice life, be happy, enjoy art. Respect your fellow forum members and perhaps your world will become a better place. Good luck to you.
From the very beginning, shy, I've been straightforward in expressing my concern about comments you made, and why they were objectionable. I also tried to be evenhanded when posting.
In response, you resorted to victim-playing โ which (at least to my mind) came across as further evidence of dishonesty. And when challenged on your accusations about being "bullied" or "abused", you simply ducked the question*.
This evasiveness is unfortunate but perhaps not surprising. For me, it sadly confirms you are wanting in candour, that you lack integrity.
__________
What is ironic is that the foundation of our exchanges is a point you've just made yourself โ about respecting one's fellow forum members.
I would encourage you to embrace those words and behave accordingly. Here's what it might entail: 1. Abstain from treating more-informed members like fools.
2. Abstain from exploiting the ignorance and inexperience of less-informed members. Try not to deceive them, mislead them, or give them false hope.
Seems simple enough.
__________
For everyone's sake, I suggest we now leave things there and go our separate merry ways.
Toodle pip.
Met, blah, blah, blah...... enough already. You are like a broken record. You have shown your TRUE COLOURS. I feel sorry for you. I wish you well, hope you get over your personal demons. Please stop attacking me. Please stop being a BULLY. Hug somebody..... Have a nice life, be happy, enjoy art. Respect your fellow forum members and perhaps your world will become a better place. Good luck to you. From the very beginning, shy, I've been straightforward in expressing my concern about comments you made, and why they were objectionable. I also tried to be evenhanded when posting. In response, you resorted to victim-playing โ which (at least to my mind) came across as further evidence of dishonesty. And when challenged on your accusations about being "bullied" or "abused", you simply ducked the question *. This evasiveness is unfortunate but perhaps not surprising. For me, it sadly confirms you are wanting in candour, that you lack integrity. __________ What is ironic is that the foundation of our exchanges is a point you've just made yourself โ about respecting one's fellow forum members. I would encourage you to embrace those words and behave accordingly. Here's what it might entail: 1. Abstain from treating more-informed members like fools. 2. Abstain from exploiting the ignorance and inexperience of less-informed members. Try not to deceive them, mislead them, or give them false hope. Seems simple enough. __________ For everyone's sake, I suggest we now leave things there and go our separate merry ways. Toodle pip.
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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Mrs Banksy, by met on May 20, 2020 6:21:51 GMT 1, I have to agree with Dive Jedi A thread should be able to have both positive and negative views (strengths / perceived weaknesses) on a particular artist. They are opinions after all, you can ignore those you don't agree with. Whilst I may not always agree with Met's posts, in this instance, if he/she feels that there is something disingenuous, then they should have every right to post their view. I don't think done particularly disrespectfully... Pootle Please Read MET's posts about me He doesn't know me, he disagrees with my opinions or posts. Which is fine, but don't resort to BULLYING other members. Now imagine he inserted your name instead of mine, how would you feel? I doubt that you or any other person would be happy or enjoy such bullying and cowardly keyboard attacks. Met is wrong, and he is a BULLY. He didn't offer an opinion he LOWERED HIMSELF to name calling. He used the word DISHONEST.... which ironically is what he ACTUALLY became. People that get kicks out of putting down and disrespecting others have their own problems and issues And when someone takes out their real world frustrations and anger on others that crosses the border and is not cool.
Is your repetition of the word "bully" a genuine attempt at presenting an argument, or just a bid to distract other forum members?
If I steal a purse and someone calls out, "Thief!", there are different options available to me. One is to shift everybody's attention towards my accuser. I can hop around hysterically, point in their direction and scream, "Pervert! That guy tried to touch my pee-pee!"
Donald Trump uses this kind of diversionary tactic frequently. And effectively*. He will typically redirect accusations back at his accusers*. There's even an acronym for it: DARVO (Deny, Attack, and Reverse Victim and Offender).
__________
That said, I'm open to giving you the benefit of the doubt as to your motivation for throwing around words like "bully", "wicked", "vile" and "abuse".
As a recap, what I did earlier was state my belief that the original posts I quoted by you* were disingenuous. I also confirmed this kind of deceitfulness on the forum is regrettable because of the negative influence it can have. Moreover, the reasoning and evidence underpinning my belief (i.e. the bases upon which I concluded you were being dishonest) were openly stated โ so that members could challenge me if they felt my conclusions were unfair or otherwise flawed.
For clarity, I'd be interested to learn which specific part of the above amounted to bullying in your eyes. And (if different) which specific part was abusive.
Was it the opinion itself? Or was it one of the reasons I gave which backed up and supported my opinion?
I have to agree with Dive Jedi A thread should be able to have both positive and negative views (strengths / perceived weaknesses) on a particular artist. They are opinions after all, you can ignore those you don't agree with. Whilst I may not always agree with Met's posts, in this instance, if he/she feels that there is something disingenuous, then they should have every right to post their view. I don't think done particularly disrespectfully... Pootle Please Read MET's posts about me He doesn't know me, he disagrees with my opinions or posts. Which is fine, but don't resort to BULLYING other members. Now imagine he inserted your name instead of mine, how would you feel? I doubt that you or any other person would be happy or enjoy such bullying and cowardly keyboard attacks. Met is wrong, and he is a BULLY. He didn't offer an opinion he LOWERED HIMSELF to name calling. He used the word DISHONEST.... which ironically is what he ACTUALLY became. People that get kicks out of putting down and disrespecting others have their own problems and issues And when someone takes out their real world frustrations and anger on others that crosses the border and is not cool. Is your repetition of the word "bully" a genuine attempt at presenting an argument, or just a bid to distract other forum members? If I steal a purse and someone calls out, "Thief!", there are different options available to me. One is to shift everybody's attention towards my accuser. I can hop around hysterically, point in their direction and scream, "Pervert! That guy tried to touch my pee-pee!"Donald Trump uses this kind of diversionary tactic frequently. And effectively *. He will typically redirect accusations back at his accusers *. There's even an acronym for it: DARVO (Deny, Attack, and Reverse Victim and Offender). __________ That said, I'm open to giving you the benefit of the doubt as to your motivation for throwing around words like "bully", "wicked", "vile" and "abuse". As a recap, what I did earlier was state my belief that the original posts I quoted by you * were disingenuous. I also confirmed this kind of deceitfulness on the forum is regrettable because of the negative influence it can have. Moreover, the reasoning and evidence underpinning my belief (i.e. the bases upon which I concluded you were being dishonest) were openly stated โ so that members could challenge me if they felt my conclusions were unfair or otherwise flawed. For clarity, I'd be interested to learn which specific part of the above amounted to bullying in your eyes. And (if different) which specific part was abusive. Was it the opinion itself? Or was it one of the reasons I gave which backed up and supported my opinion?
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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Mrs Banksy, by met on May 20, 2020 5:37:38 GMT 1, Met, can you please stop attacking me? You don't know me and you are wrong. Your post is out of line. You show no respect whatsoever for me and you should straight forward apologize. Your profile picture is accurate. You like punching people in the face with your wicked words. Shame on you. You are a bully. Your post is wicked and vile. Your abuse has no place on this forum or any forum. The only person you need to judge is yourself. Be kind to others and you may lead a happier life.
Met, can you please stop attacking me? You don't know me and you are wrong. Your post is out of line. You show no respect whatsoever for me and you should straight forward apologize. Your profile picture is accurate. You like punching people in the face with your wicked words. Shame on you. You are a bully. Your post is wicked and vile. Your abuse has no place on this forum or any forum. The only person you need to judge is yourself. Be kind to others and you may lead a happier life.
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met
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,693
Likes โข 6,333
June 2009
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What Music are you listening to at the moment ?, by met on May 19, 2020 7:14:53 GMT 1, Siouxsie at the Albert Hall with Robert Smith on guitar. What a gig that was. I saw them with Smith too. Fabulous. Gig started with Stravinsky, until they kicked off with Israel (or it might have been Helter Skelter) Yes thatโs right! Think it was Helter Skelter. Brilliant stuff. And Smith was the only guitarist who could fill McGeochโs shoes.
From online searches, it looks like there were two concerts by Siouxsie & the Banshees at the Royal Albert Hall during this period:
(i) 30 September 1983, the opening song apparently being Halloween; and
(ii) 1 October 1983, the opening song apparently being Israel.
Sources:
Gigs by Siouxsie & the Banshees at RAH www.godsandalcoves.com/bands/siouxsie-and-the-banshees/gigs/item/1983-9-30/london-royal-albert-hall/6516/
30 September 1983 setlist www.setlist.fm/setlist/siouxsie-and-the-banshees/1983/royal-albert-hall-london-england-6bd476a6.html
1 October 1983 setlist www.setlist.fm/setlist/siouxsie-and-the-banshees/1983/royal-albert-hall-london-england-7bd476a4.html
Details of the Nocturne tour and live album en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nocturne_(Siouxsie_and_the_Banshees_album)
"The music heard at the introduction of "Israel" is an excerpt from The Rite of Spring, composed in 1913 by Igor Stravinsky."
EDIT: Found this video on the Dailymotion site. Worth it just for the crowd shots at the introduction:
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