tartarus
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,628
๐๐ป 2,169
February 2013
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by tartarus on Apr 8, 2016 13:36:15 GMT 1, petition.parliament.uk/petitions/122946
Petition for a 2016 general election. 33,000 sigs so far!
As those well known payers of tax would say "every little helps"
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tartarus
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,628
๐๐ป 2,169
February 2013
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by tartarus on Apr 8, 2016 13:39:03 GMT 1, And a little something from cassetteboy.
Nobody likes to be watched Dave. Somethings are "private matters"
And a little something from cassetteboy.
Nobody likes to be watched Dave. Somethings are "private matters"
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by searchandrescue on Apr 8, 2016 14:10:33 GMT 1, ...doubt much will happen to ham face, more reading about him and carlton, ken clarke if your interested. Anyone stateside got a handle on the groundswell for bernie? Thanks Bernie has the under 40 and white crowd locked down. HRC gets the older vote + minorities. None of it matters as the Dems use the superdelegate system and HRC has the clear advantage there. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superdelegate thanks dreadnatty, appreciated. When you say "Bernie has the under 40 and white crowd locked down" I understand, but what is that based on, opinion polling?? Asking as we were recently wrong footed in this country by pollsters. Sar
...doubt much will happen to ham face, more reading about him and carlton, ken clarke if your interested. Anyone stateside got a handle on the groundswell for bernie? Thanks Bernie has the under 40 and white crowd locked down. HRC gets the older vote + minorities. None of it matters as the Dems use the superdelegate system and HRC has the clear advantage there. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superdelegatethanks dreadnatty, appreciated. When you say "Bernie has the under 40 and white crowd locked down" I understand, but what is that based on, opinion polling?? Asking as we were recently wrong footed in this country by pollsters. Sar
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dreadnatty
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 5,431
๐๐ป 6,992
February 2013
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by dreadnatty on Apr 8, 2016 16:03:17 GMT 1, Bernie has the under 40 and white crowd locked down. HRC gets the older vote + minorities. None of it matters as the Dems use the superdelegate system and HRC has the clear advantage there. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superdelegatethanks dreadnatty, appreciated. When you say "Bernie has the under 40 and white crowd locked down" I understand, but what is that based on, opinion polling?? Asking as we were recently wrong footed in this country by pollsters. Sar Based on the primary results so far.
Bernie has the under 40 and white crowd locked down. HRC gets the older vote + minorities. None of it matters as the Dems use the superdelegate system and HRC has the clear advantage there. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superdelegatethanks dreadnatty, appreciated. When you say "Bernie has the under 40 and white crowd locked down" I understand, but what is that based on, opinion polling?? Asking as we were recently wrong footed in this country by pollsters. Sar Based on the primary results so far.
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by searchandrescue on Apr 8, 2016 17:27:25 GMT 1, thanks dreadnatty, appreciated. When you say "Bernie has the under 40 and white crowd locked down" I understand, but what is that based on, opinion polling?? Asking as we were recently wrong footed in this country by pollsters. Sar Based on the primary results so far. ..thanks, taken me this long to get a handle on politics in this country!!
thanks dreadnatty, appreciated. When you say "Bernie has the under 40 and white crowd locked down" I understand, but what is that based on, opinion polling?? Asking as we were recently wrong footed in this country by pollsters. Sar Based on the primary results so far. ..thanks, taken me this long to get a handle on politics in this country!!
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Feral Things
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,848
๐๐ป 3,654
January 2012
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by Feral Things on Apr 8, 2016 18:27:54 GMT 1, I know I'm probably in the minority on here being a street art forum and very anti Tory. but I feel the torys have done a good job so far. You're a brave man
Unfortunately, the UK harbours 13 of the world's main tax havens (including Cayman Islands, Jersey, Bermuda and British Virgin Islands) and last year the current Tory government were the main opponents of EU efforts to crackdown on tax havens (story here). There's a petition against tax havens here if anyone wants to sign it.
I would highly recommend watching 'The UK Gold' which will be available again to stream shortly but here's a short clip to whet your appetite:
I know I'm probably in the minority on here being a street art forum and very anti Tory. but I feel the torys have done a good job so far. You're a brave man Unfortunately, the UK harbours 13 of the world's main tax havens (including Cayman Islands, Jersey, Bermuda and British Virgin Islands) and last year the current Tory government were the main opponents of EU efforts to crackdown on tax havens ( story here). There's a petition against tax havens here if anyone wants to sign it. I would highly recommend watching ' The UK Gold' which will be available again to stream shortly but here's a short clip to whet your appetite:
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RoboJ
Artist
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,202
๐๐ป 1,332
July 2015
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by RoboJ on Apr 8, 2016 18:35:33 GMT 1, As I said it's not perfect but I'd rather have my own opinion than follow the crowd . Just playing.
All parties are no where near but I personally feel the torys are the right people to keep our economy on track and at the time of voting that was my priority, I think so far they are doing a good job on that front.
Yes I agree tax havens should be sorted as that isn't morally correct but they were there when labour were around so it's not a Tory specific thing. It's just 1 of many many things that need addressing and it's only as bad as people fraudulently claiming benefits for no reason. I'm just saying if loopholes or opportunities exist I don't know of many people who wouldn't take them. It's not a Tory thing it's a human trait.
As I said it's not perfect but I'd rather have my own opinion than follow the crowd . Just playing. All parties are no where near but I personally feel the torys are the right people to keep our economy on track and at the time of voting that was my priority, I think so far they are doing a good job on that front. Yes I agree tax havens should be sorted as that isn't morally correct but they were there when labour were around so it's not a Tory specific thing. It's just 1 of many many things that need addressing and it's only as bad as people fraudulently claiming benefits for no reason. I'm just saying if loopholes or opportunities exist I don't know of many people who wouldn't take them. It's not a Tory thing it's a human trait.
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
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January 1970
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by Deleted on Apr 8, 2016 20:46:26 GMT 1,
Bernie Sanders Predicted Panama Papers Scandal back in 2011
Bernie Sanders Predicted Panama Papers Scandal back in 2011
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rufas
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 70
๐๐ป 71
December 2015
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by rufas on Apr 9, 2016 1:10:30 GMT 1, Dave's money was just resting in his account
Dave's money was just resting in his account
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rufas
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 70
๐๐ป 71
December 2015
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by rufas on Apr 9, 2016 1:21:08 GMT 1, There's 2 things here. Tax dodging/saving and illegal money laundering. I'm not condoning anything but it's very easy for people to point fingers at those in schemes etc to save tax (I am not in one!). I am not aware of a single person that will voluntarily pay as much tax as possible to help fund the state. I know I'm probably in the minority on here being a street art forum and very anti Tory. but I feel the torys have done a good job so far. Yes it's not perfect but i feel in a better position than when we started. When it comes to tax dodging, in the world as I have seen it, it's full of people trying to take advantage of schemes and people to keep/get as much as they can. Whether that's Saving taxes or getting benefits they shouldn't be on. I know lots of people on benefits that have no intention of working to help pay for society and yet they also have the loudest voices when it comes to condemning others. I'm not pointing fingers at all. Just its frustrating as a tax payer. Both extremes want as much as they can get while giving very little in return.
You lost me at 'the tories have done a good job so far'. The people theat tend to say that have not had to suffer from the disability cuts, non-existent mental health services on the NHS, or the cruelty of the bedroom tax. These issues have affected myself and my family and close friends. The situation was better under previous governments. As much as I criticised the lib dems for their broken promises, they held back the tories, we didn't know how lucky we were.
Junior doctors on strike for the first time ever, many of my friends are being driven out of the NHS from overwork and underpay. These are compassionate, caring people not guided by money but are trying to dedicate their lives to helping people.They are sick of rushing between patients, unable to dedicate enough time to each patient, and working all hours under the sun.
My girlfriend is a teacher at a college, teaching young adults, many of which have profound learning difficulties and should be in care. But are instead being forced to take GCSE English to at least a C grade, to do a course they are interested in vocationaly. The college have to take the students because they need the money as they are threatened with closure because government funding. Her boss says it's the worse time for college education in the last 30 years experience. Several of my friends have left or will be leaving teaching shortly due to overwork and government ineptitude. My sister is a social worker, it is a terrible time particularly for adults services.
Short termism left right and centre. I could go on: steel, the handling of the refugees crisis (or bunch of migrants as Dave calls them). Austerity justified with a motto of 'we're all in this together', when the Bullingdon club are in charge. People don't want to be on benefits, that is a total fallacy...those that deserve to be looked after by the state are made to feel like scroungers by the media and the current government
There's 2 things here. Tax dodging/saving and illegal money laundering. I'm not condoning anything but it's very easy for people to point fingers at those in schemes etc to save tax (I am not in one!). I am not aware of a single person that will voluntarily pay as much tax as possible to help fund the state. I know I'm probably in the minority on here being a street art forum and very anti Tory. but I feel the torys have done a good job so far. Yes it's not perfect but i feel in a better position than when we started. When it comes to tax dodging, in the world as I have seen it, it's full of people trying to take advantage of schemes and people to keep/get as much as they can. Whether that's Saving taxes or getting benefits they shouldn't be on. I know lots of people on benefits that have no intention of working to help pay for society and yet they also have the loudest voices when it comes to condemning others. I'm not pointing fingers at all. Just its frustrating as a tax payer. Both extremes want as much as they can get while giving very little in return. You lost me at 'the tories have done a good job so far'. The people theat tend to say that have not had to suffer from the disability cuts, non-existent mental health services on the NHS, or the cruelty of the bedroom tax. These issues have affected myself and my family and close friends. The situation was better under previous governments. As much as I criticised the lib dems for their broken promises, they held back the tories, we didn't know how lucky we were. Junior doctors on strike for the first time ever, many of my friends are being driven out of the NHS from overwork and underpay. These are compassionate, caring people not guided by money but are trying to dedicate their lives to helping people.They are sick of rushing between patients, unable to dedicate enough time to each patient, and working all hours under the sun. My girlfriend is a teacher at a college, teaching young adults, many of which have profound learning difficulties and should be in care. But are instead being forced to take GCSE English to at least a C grade, to do a course they are interested in vocationaly. The college have to take the students because they need the money as they are threatened with closure because government funding. Her boss says it's the worse time for college education in the last 30 years experience. Several of my friends have left or will be leaving teaching shortly due to overwork and government ineptitude. My sister is a social worker, it is a terrible time particularly for adults services. Short termism left right and centre. I could go on: steel, the handling of the refugees crisis (or bunch of migrants as Dave calls them). Austerity justified with a motto of 'we're all in this together', when the Bullingdon club are in charge. People don't want to be on benefits, that is a total fallacy...those that deserve to be looked after by the state are made to feel like scroungers by the media and the current government
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RoboJ
Artist
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,202
๐๐ป 1,332
July 2015
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by RoboJ on Apr 9, 2016 8:56:05 GMT 1, Your right Rufus those things have not effected me and so I can only judge and make decisions based on the world as I have seen it. I agree there are many many areas that should receive more funding, but where is the money going to come from for that? All the issues you mention there, and I agree they are real issues, are all linked to money. To cure the problem I believe you have to cure the fundamental problem of affording it.
Regarding benefits, again I can only give my opinion on the world as I have seen it and I'm sorry but there are so many scroungers who are on benefits because it's better than getting a job, many that claim disability to get around the system. I am sure the majority must be genuine cases however from the people I know, it's infuriating that I go to work to help pay for them to stay at home.
I have no problem with rich people that have earned their money. They have every right to be a high earner if they bring that value to a company. So long as they pay the correct tax. We aren't a communist country after all.
Your right Rufus those things have not effected me and so I can only judge and make decisions based on the world as I have seen it. I agree there are many many areas that should receive more funding, but where is the money going to come from for that? All the issues you mention there, and I agree they are real issues, are all linked to money. To cure the problem I believe you have to cure the fundamental problem of affording it.
Regarding benefits, again I can only give my opinion on the world as I have seen it and I'm sorry but there are so many scroungers who are on benefits because it's better than getting a job, many that claim disability to get around the system. I am sure the majority must be genuine cases however from the people I know, it's infuriating that I go to work to help pay for them to stay at home.
I have no problem with rich people that have earned their money. They have every right to be a high earner if they bring that value to a company. So long as they pay the correct tax. We aren't a communist country after all.
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tartarus
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,628
๐๐ป 2,169
February 2013
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by tartarus on Apr 9, 2016 10:52:38 GMT 1, Your right Rufus those things have not effected me and so I can only judge and make decisions based on the world as I have seen it. I agree there are many many areas that should receive more funding, but where is the money going to come from for that? All the issues you mention there, and I agree they are real issues, are all linked to money. To cure the problem I believe you have to cure the fundamental problem of affording it. Regarding benefits, again I can only give my opinion on the world as I have seen it and I'm sorry but there are so many scroungers who are on benefits because it's better than getting a job, many that claim disability to get around the system. I am sure the majority must be genuine cases however from the people I know, it's infuriating that I go to work to help pay for them to stay at home. I have no problem with rich people that have earned their money. They have every right to be a high earner if they bring that value to a company. So long as they pay the correct tax. We aren't a communist country after all.
Wow!! Your first line sums it up real well. I've not been effected, and so screw the rest of you, I'm not worrying about that!!! How Tory to the core of you.
Ignorance to the facts, I'm alright jack, it's those lazy people on benefits. The only thing you forgot is the immigrants and you'd have a full hand of Tory bulls**t propaganda to play with.
Your right Rufus those things have not effected me and so I can only judge and make decisions based on the world as I have seen it. I agree there are many many areas that should receive more funding, but where is the money going to come from for that? All the issues you mention there, and I agree they are real issues, are all linked to money. To cure the problem I believe you have to cure the fundamental problem of affording it. Regarding benefits, again I can only give my opinion on the world as I have seen it and I'm sorry but there are so many scroungers who are on benefits because it's better than getting a job, many that claim disability to get around the system. I am sure the majority must be genuine cases however from the people I know, it's infuriating that I go to work to help pay for them to stay at home. I have no problem with rich people that have earned their money. They have every right to be a high earner if they bring that value to a company. So long as they pay the correct tax. We aren't a communist country after all. Wow!! Your first line sums it up real well. I've not been effected, and so screw the rest of you, I'm not worrying about that!!! How Tory to the core of you. Ignorance to the facts, I'm alright jack, it's those lazy people on benefits. The only thing you forgot is the immigrants and you'd have a full hand of Tory bulls**t propaganda to play with.
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tartarus
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,628
๐๐ป 2,169
February 2013
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by tartarus on Apr 9, 2016 11:06:10 GMT 1,
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RoboJ
Artist
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,202
๐๐ป 1,332
July 2015
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by RoboJ on Apr 9, 2016 11:22:37 GMT 1, Your right Rufus those things have not effected me and so I can only judge and make decisions based on the world as I have seen it. I agree there are many many areas that should receive more funding, but where is the money going to come from for that? All the issues you mention there, and I agree they are real issues, are all linked to money. To cure the problem I believe you have to cure the fundamental problem of affording it. Regarding benefits, again I can only give my opinion on the world as I have seen it and I'm sorry but there are so many scroungers who are on benefits because it's better than getting a job, many that claim disability to get around the system. I am sure the majority must be genuine cases however from the people I know, it's infuriating that I go to work to help pay for them to stay at home. I have no problem with rich people that have earned their money. They have every right to be a high earner if they bring that value to a company. So long as they pay the correct tax. We aren't a communist country after all. Wow!! Your first line sums it up real well. I've not been effected, and so screw the rest of you, I'm not worrying about that!!! How Tory to the core of you. Ignorance to the facts, I'm alright jack, it's those lazy people on benefits. The only thing you forgot is the immigrants and you'd have a full hand of Tory bulls**t propaganda to play with.
Im not a tory but I agree I am ignorant to many of these particular facts. I dont pretend to know all the problems, what they cost, who is effected. Those very particular issues havnt effected me so im not going to claim to be an expert on them. I see the world I live in and make my decisions based on what I personally think is the best thing to do for the country.
I am however aware of many other issues though, those that do effect me and maybe not yourself. I wouldnt expect others to care or have as much knowledge as much as myself about those issues and therefore wouldnt expect people to make decision about their life based on mine.
Your right Rufus those things have not effected me and so I can only judge and make decisions based on the world as I have seen it. I agree there are many many areas that should receive more funding, but where is the money going to come from for that? All the issues you mention there, and I agree they are real issues, are all linked to money. To cure the problem I believe you have to cure the fundamental problem of affording it. Regarding benefits, again I can only give my opinion on the world as I have seen it and I'm sorry but there are so many scroungers who are on benefits because it's better than getting a job, many that claim disability to get around the system. I am sure the majority must be genuine cases however from the people I know, it's infuriating that I go to work to help pay for them to stay at home. I have no problem with rich people that have earned their money. They have every right to be a high earner if they bring that value to a company. So long as they pay the correct tax. We aren't a communist country after all. Wow!! Your first line sums it up real well. I've not been effected, and so screw the rest of you, I'm not worrying about that!!! How Tory to the core of you. Ignorance to the facts, I'm alright jack, it's those lazy people on benefits. The only thing you forgot is the immigrants and you'd have a full hand of Tory bulls**t propaganda to play with. Im not a tory but I agree I am ignorant to many of these particular facts. I dont pretend to know all the problems, what they cost, who is effected. Those very particular issues havnt effected me so im not going to claim to be an expert on them. I see the world I live in and make my decisions based on what I personally think is the best thing to do for the country. I am however aware of many other issues though, those that do effect me and maybe not yourself. I wouldnt expect others to care or have as much knowledge as much as myself about those issues and therefore wouldnt expect people to make decision about their life based on mine.
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by Deleted on Apr 9, 2016 11:24:30 GMT 1, Your right Rufus those things have not effected me and so I can only judge and make decisions based on the world as I have seen it. I agree there are many many areas that should receive more funding, but where is the money going to come from for that? All the issues you mention there, and I agree they are real issues, are all linked to money. To cure the problem I believe you have to cure the fundamental problem of affording it. Regarding benefits, again I can only give my opinion on the world as I have seen it and I'm sorry but there are so many scroungers who are on benefits because it's better than getting a job, many that claim disability to get around the system. I am sure the majority must be genuine cases however from the people I know, it's infuriating that I go to work to help pay for them to stay at home. I have no problem with rich people that have earned their money. They have every right to be a high earner if they bring that value to a company. So long as they pay the correct tax. We aren't a communist country after all.
I have no problems with rich people who mad etheir money honestly and avoid tax by exploiting these loopholes. I do have a problem with these loopholes existing because the rich control the politicians to an extent and media moguls and others like fat middle men importers who get goods clothes made in sweat shops and by child labour to make millions are allowed to make big donations to political parties and influence policy.
The Labour party was no better and sucked up to the mega rich and celebrities.
As for benefits, there are people who only apply for benefits as a last resort and despite being poor have a certain amount of pride and prefer to struggle to support themselves. There are others who make a career of claiming benefits and getting the largest free house possible and refuse to contribute anything to society or the community or country. The culture of benefits as a lifestyle for some who use their free time to commit petty crimes to supplement their benefits needs to be looked at not encouraged.
The Tories just like Labour Liberals Ukip Greens etc lie to the taxpayers. They all have a problem and are against working class low earning tax payers.
All parties have lied about the in or out of europe campaign, and all are funded by outside interestes if not directly, then definately indirectly.
The Tories and others have made a big deal about benefits being paid to people in Uk from EU countries yet Cameron and the Tories have said that if someone who lives in the UK who got married outside the UK in a polygamous marriage and has four wives etc. If it is legal in the country they married in outside the UK then Britain will give benefits for the man and all four spouses.
My view is dump the colonies and welcome the europeans who live and work for a living and who do not claim benefits as a lifestyle choice.
Your right Rufus those things have not effected me and so I can only judge and make decisions based on the world as I have seen it. I agree there are many many areas that should receive more funding, but where is the money going to come from for that? All the issues you mention there, and I agree they are real issues, are all linked to money. To cure the problem I believe you have to cure the fundamental problem of affording it. Regarding benefits, again I can only give my opinion on the world as I have seen it and I'm sorry but there are so many scroungers who are on benefits because it's better than getting a job, many that claim disability to get around the system. I am sure the majority must be genuine cases however from the people I know, it's infuriating that I go to work to help pay for them to stay at home. I have no problem with rich people that have earned their money. They have every right to be a high earner if they bring that value to a company. So long as they pay the correct tax. We aren't a communist country after all. I have no problems with rich people who mad etheir money honestly and avoid tax by exploiting these loopholes. I do have a problem with these loopholes existing because the rich control the politicians to an extent and media moguls and others like fat middle men importers who get goods clothes made in sweat shops and by child labour to make millions are allowed to make big donations to political parties and influence policy. The Labour party was no better and sucked up to the mega rich and celebrities. As for benefits, there are people who only apply for benefits as a last resort and despite being poor have a certain amount of pride and prefer to struggle to support themselves. There are others who make a career of claiming benefits and getting the largest free house possible and refuse to contribute anything to society or the community or country. The culture of benefits as a lifestyle for some who use their free time to commit petty crimes to supplement their benefits needs to be looked at not encouraged. The Tories just like Labour Liberals Ukip Greens etc lie to the taxpayers. They all have a problem and are against working class low earning tax payers. All parties have lied about the in or out of europe campaign, and all are funded by outside interestes if not directly, then definately indirectly. The Tories and others have made a big deal about benefits being paid to people in Uk from EU countries yet Cameron and the Tories have said that if someone who lives in the UK who got married outside the UK in a polygamous marriage and has four wives etc. If it is legal in the country they married in outside the UK then Britain will give benefits for the man and all four spouses. My view is dump the colonies and welcome the europeans who live and work for a living and who do not claim benefits as a lifestyle choice.
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by Deleted on Apr 9, 2016 11:44:11 GMT 1, Some council and social security departments, staff are involved in the fraud also the same in passport and other departments where staff are not vetted properly.
Some council and social security departments, staff are involved in the fraud also the same in passport and other departments where staff are not vetted properly.
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tartarus
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,628
๐๐ป 2,169
February 2013
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by tartarus on Apr 9, 2016 11:48:03 GMT 1, Some council and social security departments, staff are involved in the fraud also the same in passport and other departments where staff are not vetted properly. How do you mean? Just literal fraud in the workplace? i say just! don't mean it like its not important, but in context. I remember reading something years ago, where all the staff in a Job Centre in Bradford i think, were all caught signing on!!
Some council and social security departments, staff are involved in the fraud also the same in passport and other departments where staff are not vetted properly. How do you mean? Just literal fraud in the workplace? i say just! don't mean it like its not important, but in context. I remember reading something years ago, where all the staff in a Job Centre in Bradford i think, were all caught signing on!!
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RoboJ
Artist
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,202
๐๐ป 1,332
July 2015
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by RoboJ on Apr 9, 2016 11:56:30 GMT 1, ย Some council and social security departments, staff are involved in the fraud also the same in passport and other departments where staff are not vetted properly.
Although I don't know all the facts I'm fairly sure there is a reason for the at least some of the difference in numbers. That image is made specifically to provoke a reaction from people. It's not showing all the facts, just the one that helps create the reaction they need. I'm not aware of what's required to investigate benefit fraud but I am aware that for vat inspections it requires one person to visit the companies office for half the day, they go through the vat reports and then that person creates a report. Pretty efficient process that doesn't require lots of people.
ย Some council and social security departments, staff are involved in the fraud also the same in passport and other departments where staff are not vetted properly. Although I don't know all the facts I'm fairly sure there is a reason for the at least some of the difference in numbers. That image is made specifically to provoke a reaction from people. It's not showing all the facts, just the one that helps create the reaction they need. I'm not aware of what's required to investigate benefit fraud but I am aware that for vat inspections it requires one person to visit the companies office for half the day, they go through the vat reports and then that person creates a report. Pretty efficient process that doesn't require lots of people.
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tartarus
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,628
๐๐ป 2,169
February 2013
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by tartarus on Apr 9, 2016 12:30:50 GMT 1, Some council and social security departments, staff are involved in the fraud also the same in passport and other departments where staff are not vetted properly. Although I don't know all the facts I'm fairly sure there is a reason for the at least some of the difference in numbers. That image is made specifically to provoke a reaction from people. It's not showing all the facts, just the one that helps create the reaction they need. I'm not aware of what's required to investigate benefit fraud but I am aware that for vat inspections it requires one person to visit the companies office for half the day, they go through the vat reports and then that person creates a report. Pretty efficient process that doesn't require lots of people. yeah, that'll be it.
what other figures would you want? id say it has kept to the specifics and clearly states the points of necessity.
so far your point is revolving around the fact that you aren't effected by it so it isn't a problem. Thats a pretty insular set of facts to deal with, and pretty much shows a total lack of concern for your fellow man/woman.It also pretty much encapsulates what is wrong with this government. Totally out of touch with real people/the majority, unable to have empathy for others and brimming with self interest.
Some council and social security departments, staff are involved in the fraud also the same in passport and other departments where staff are not vetted properly. Although I don't know all the facts I'm fairly sure there is a reason for the at least some of the difference in numbers. That image is made specifically to provoke a reaction from people. It's not showing all the facts, just the one that helps create the reaction they need. I'm not aware of what's required to investigate benefit fraud but I am aware that for vat inspections it requires one person to visit the companies office for half the day, they go through the vat reports and then that person creates a report. Pretty efficient process that doesn't require lots of people. yeah, that'll be it. what other figures would you want? id say it has kept to the specifics and clearly states the points of necessity. so far your point is revolving around the fact that you aren't effected by it so it isn't a problem. Thats a pretty insular set of facts to deal with, and pretty much shows a total lack of concern for your fellow man/woman.It also pretty much encapsulates what is wrong with this government. Totally out of touch with real people/the majority, unable to have empathy for others and brimming with self interest.
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rufas
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 70
๐๐ป 71
December 2015
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by rufas on Apr 9, 2016 12:37:49 GMT 1, I think the word 'scrounger' gets banded about too much in the media and by government, to the point that anyone claiming benefits is seen as seen under scrutiny. People who I used to work with in my previous community job, people who had been in benefits all their lives seemed to be outraged about benefit 'cheats', because that is all they hear. The amount of money owed by corporation tax avoidance and offshore 'legal' trust pales in comparison, but is not talked about because it serves to benefit Murdoch, etc. The fit for work test have caused so much distress to the most vulnerable in society, for example my girlfriend's mum has MS, some days you can be mobile, others you cannot move. Mental health problems do not always have an obvious outward 'symptoms', the brain is such a complex organ that it is difficult to diagnose by doctors, let alone the DWP
www.theguardian.com/society/2015/nov/16/fit-for-work-tests-serious-toll-mental-health-work-capability.
I think the word 'scrounger' gets banded about too much in the media and by government, to the point that anyone claiming benefits is seen as seen under scrutiny. People who I used to work with in my previous community job, people who had been in benefits all their lives seemed to be outraged about benefit 'cheats', because that is all they hear. The amount of money owed by corporation tax avoidance and offshore 'legal' trust pales in comparison, but is not talked about because it serves to benefit Murdoch, etc. The fit for work test have caused so much distress to the most vulnerable in society, for example my girlfriend's mum has MS, some days you can be mobile, others you cannot move. Mental health problems do not always have an obvious outward 'symptoms', the brain is such a complex organ that it is difficult to diagnose by doctors, let alone the DWP www.theguardian.com/society/2015/nov/16/fit-for-work-tests-serious-toll-mental-health-work-capability.
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RoboJ
Artist
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,202
๐๐ป 1,332
July 2015
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by RoboJ on Apr 9, 2016 12:43:50 GMT 1, Although I don't know all the facts I'm fairly sure there is a reason for the at least some of the difference in numbers. That image is made specifically to provoke a reaction from people. It's not showing all the facts, just the one that helps create the reaction they need. I'm not aware of what's required to investigate benefit fraud but I am aware that for vat inspections it requires one person to visit the companies office for half the day, they go through the vat reports and then that person creates a report. Pretty efficient process that doesn't require lots of people. yeah, that'll be it. what other figures would you want? id say it has kept to the specifics and clearly states the points of necessity. so far your point is revolving around the fact that you aren't effected by it so it isn't a problem. Thats a pretty insular set of facts to deal with, and pretty much shows a total lack of concern for your fellow man.It also pretty much encapsulates what is wrong with this government. Totally out of touch with real people/the majority, unable to have empathy for others and brimming with self interest. The issue is governments & organisations that have an objective create stats like this to back their particular cause, its propoganda & all sides do it. I am merely stating this clearly doesnt give all the information. Unless you know the full story, whats involved in processing both investigations your just accepting what your being spoon fed. Its just like the EU vote. How anybody can make an educated decision I do not know. All the information out there has some form of twist on it to back a specific side. Lots of it completely contradictory.
As I mentioned I have issues, issues that arnt mine but that i see in society and those are the things that are important to me and what I feel is important to the country. Im not going to go into them because I dont expect you to care what I think. I am not a tory through and through. I work a lot with charities and fund raising and I am seeing what your saying from your point of view as well as my own. Hence I dont make personal remarks about you and I will only criticise myself.
Although I don't know all the facts I'm fairly sure there is a reason for the at least some of the difference in numbers. That image is made specifically to provoke a reaction from people. It's not showing all the facts, just the one that helps create the reaction they need. I'm not aware of what's required to investigate benefit fraud but I am aware that for vat inspections it requires one person to visit the companies office for half the day, they go through the vat reports and then that person creates a report. Pretty efficient process that doesn't require lots of people. yeah, that'll be it. what other figures would you want? id say it has kept to the specifics and clearly states the points of necessity. so far your point is revolving around the fact that you aren't effected by it so it isn't a problem. Thats a pretty insular set of facts to deal with, and pretty much shows a total lack of concern for your fellow man.It also pretty much encapsulates what is wrong with this government. Totally out of touch with real people/the majority, unable to have empathy for others and brimming with self interest. The issue is governments & organisations that have an objective create stats like this to back their particular cause, its propoganda & all sides do it. I am merely stating this clearly doesnt give all the information. Unless you know the full story, whats involved in processing both investigations your just accepting what your being spoon fed. Its just like the EU vote. How anybody can make an educated decision I do not know. All the information out there has some form of twist on it to back a specific side. Lots of it completely contradictory. As I mentioned I have issues, issues that arnt mine but that i see in society and those are the things that are important to me and what I feel is important to the country. Im not going to go into them because I dont expect you to care what I think. I am not a tory through and through. I work a lot with charities and fund raising and I am seeing what your saying from your point of view as well as my own. Hence I dont make personal remarks about you and I will only criticise myself.
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RoboJ
Artist
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,202
๐๐ป 1,332
July 2015
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by RoboJ on Apr 9, 2016 12:45:12 GMT 1, I think the word 'scrounger' gets banded about too much in the media and by government, to the point that anyone claiming benefits is seen as seen under scrutiny. People who I used to work with in my previous community job, people who had been in benefits all their lives seemed to be outraged about benefit 'cheats', because that is all they hear. The amount of money owed by corporation tax avoidance and offshore 'legal' trust pales in comparison, but is not talked about because it serves to benefit Murdoch, etc. The fit for work test have caused so much distress to the most vulnerable in society, for example if you have conditions like MS, some days you can be mobile, others you cannot move. Mental health problems do not always have an obvious outward 'symptoms', the brain is such a complex organ that it is difficult to diagnose by doctors, let alone the DWP www.theguardian.com/society/2015/nov/16/fit-for-work-tests-serious-toll-mental-health-work-capability. totally agree
I think the word 'scrounger' gets banded about too much in the media and by government, to the point that anyone claiming benefits is seen as seen under scrutiny. People who I used to work with in my previous community job, people who had been in benefits all their lives seemed to be outraged about benefit 'cheats', because that is all they hear. The amount of money owed by corporation tax avoidance and offshore 'legal' trust pales in comparison, but is not talked about because it serves to benefit Murdoch, etc. The fit for work test have caused so much distress to the most vulnerable in society, for example if you have conditions like MS, some days you can be mobile, others you cannot move. Mental health problems do not always have an obvious outward 'symptoms', the brain is such a complex organ that it is difficult to diagnose by doctors, let alone the DWP www.theguardian.com/society/2015/nov/16/fit-for-work-tests-serious-toll-mental-health-work-capability. totally agree
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rufas
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 70
๐๐ป 71
December 2015
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by rufas on Apr 9, 2016 12:55:05 GMT 1, The NHS and the welfare state are what makes Britain great. The tories are dismantling it piece by piece for profit, to fill short term goals. It can't be economically viable to employ agency staff on the NHS. Just as it can't be viable to keep people on medication all their lives for conditions such a depression, but the pharmaceutical industry makes a fair buck
I'm sick of going to my GP for help for my longstanding depression and anxiety, only to be told to go to A&E or what six months for services, which I was most recently told that " by then you may not feel you need them". I'm so lucky to have support from family and friends but I know so many that don't. It is a shocking statistic that the biggest killer of men under 50 in this country is suicide. Im going to have to do something about it myself as their is little or no support avaliable. Hoping to set up my own charity and drop in centre this year, got a lot of reading and learning to do but it will be an adventure!
I was delighted to see that Corbyn appointed the first ever Secretary for Mental Health in his first shadow cabinet. It is a silent issue affecting millions and needs to be openly discussed with the public and in parliament. More work needs to be done but we are starting to get somewhere,possibly.
The NHS and the welfare state are what makes Britain great. The tories are dismantling it piece by piece for profit, to fill short term goals. It can't be economically viable to employ agency staff on the NHS. Just as it can't be viable to keep people on medication all their lives for conditions such a depression, but the pharmaceutical industry makes a fair buck
I'm sick of going to my GP for help for my longstanding depression and anxiety, only to be told to go to A&E or what six months for services, which I was most recently told that " by then you may not feel you need them". I'm so lucky to have support from family and friends but I know so many that don't. It is a shocking statistic that the biggest killer of men under 50 in this country is suicide. Im going to have to do something about it myself as their is little or no support avaliable. Hoping to set up my own charity and drop in centre this year, got a lot of reading and learning to do but it will be an adventure!
I was delighted to see that Corbyn appointed the first ever Secretary for Mental Health in his first shadow cabinet. It is a silent issue affecting millions and needs to be openly discussed with the public and in parliament. More work needs to be done but we are starting to get somewhere,possibly.
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rufas
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 70
๐๐ป 71
December 2015
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by rufas on Apr 9, 2016 12:59:33 GMT 1, The fitness for work tests were brought in by Blair, so I'm not completely biased, I think all government should be held to account for failing their constituents. Just hope the promises that corbyn has set out are achievable even if he ever becomes prime minister (which many think is unlikely), you have seen from the Obama administration that change is hard to achieve when long standing opinions of those that really control the power for change seem to perpetuate, or in the UK the house of commons and Lords, and many like to keep the status quo.
The fitness for work tests were brought in by Blair, so I'm not completely biased, I think all government should be held to account for failing their constituents. Just hope the promises that corbyn has set out are achievable even if he ever becomes prime minister (which many think is unlikely), you have seen from the Obama administration that change is hard to achieve when long standing opinions of those that really control the power for change seem to perpetuate, or in the UK the house of commons and Lords, and many like to keep the status quo.
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tartarus
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,628
๐๐ป 2,169
February 2013
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by tartarus on Apr 9, 2016 13:23:27 GMT 1, yeah, that'll be it. what other figures would you want? id say it has kept to the specifics and clearly states the points of necessity. so far your point is revolving around the fact that you aren't effected by it so it isn't a problem. Thats a pretty insular set of facts to deal with, and pretty much shows a total lack of concern for your fellow man.It also pretty much encapsulates what is wrong with this government. Totally out of touch with real people/the majority, unable to have empathy for others and brimming with self interest. The issue is governments & organisations that have an objective create stats like this to back their particular cause, its propoganda & all sides do it. I am merely stating this clearly doesnt give all the information. Unless you know the full story, whats involved in processing both investigations your just accepting what your being spoon fed. Its just like the EU vote. How anybody can make an educated decision I do not know. All the information out there has some form of twist on it to back a specific side. Lots of it completely contradictory. As I mentioned I have issues, issues that arnt mine but that i see in society and those are the things that are important to me and what I feel is important to the country. Im not going to go into them because I dont expect you to care what I think. I am not a tory through and through. I work a lot with charities and fund raising and I am seeing what your saying from your point of view as well as my own. Hence I dont make personal remarks about you and I will only criticise myself. You state pretty clearly that you don't see much issue with the way they have run the country. Mainly because the problems havnt effected you!! how do you step away from that? its tory rhetoric to the max. Maybe you see it as a personal attack, but i see it as me representing what i perceive as your view, and the reasoning for it. which i have to say, i perceive as an I'm alright Jack attitude. Im challenging your point based on the fact i would like to live in a fair system, not the crippling one we have where the few are ok, so since they are in charge, the world doesn't need change! My appooigies for being more interested in the well being of the many rather than the few!!
I just watched dodgy dave, He said the will publish the information the goes into his tax return. He very very nearly said he would publish his tax return, but he very carefully pulled himself back in and changed to "the information" . That pretty much shows he is still playing the dodgy card, you could read the pain in his face as he realised what he had said.
yeah, that'll be it. what other figures would you want? id say it has kept to the specifics and clearly states the points of necessity. so far your point is revolving around the fact that you aren't effected by it so it isn't a problem. Thats a pretty insular set of facts to deal with, and pretty much shows a total lack of concern for your fellow man.It also pretty much encapsulates what is wrong with this government. Totally out of touch with real people/the majority, unable to have empathy for others and brimming with self interest. The issue is governments & organisations that have an objective create stats like this to back their particular cause, its propoganda & all sides do it. I am merely stating this clearly doesnt give all the information. Unless you know the full story, whats involved in processing both investigations your just accepting what your being spoon fed. Its just like the EU vote. How anybody can make an educated decision I do not know. All the information out there has some form of twist on it to back a specific side. Lots of it completely contradictory. As I mentioned I have issues, issues that arnt mine but that i see in society and those are the things that are important to me and what I feel is important to the country. Im not going to go into them because I dont expect you to care what I think. I am not a tory through and through. I work a lot with charities and fund raising and I am seeing what your saying from your point of view as well as my own. Hence I dont make personal remarks about you and I will only criticise myself. You state pretty clearly that you don't see much issue with the way they have run the country. Mainly because the problems havnt effected you!! how do you step away from that? its tory rhetoric to the max. Maybe you see it as a personal attack, but i see it as me representing what i perceive as your view, and the reasoning for it. which i have to say, i perceive as an I'm alright Jack attitude. Im challenging your point based on the fact i would like to live in a fair system, not the crippling one we have where the few are ok, so since they are in charge, the world doesn't need change! My appooigies for being more interested in the well being of the many rather than the few!! I just watched dodgy dave, He said the will publish the information the goes into his tax return. He very very nearly said he would publish his tax return, but he very carefully pulled himself back in and changed to "the information" . That pretty much shows he is still playing the dodgy card, you could read the pain in his face as he realised what he had said.
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RoboJ
Artist
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,202
๐๐ป 1,332
July 2015
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by RoboJ on Apr 9, 2016 13:40:43 GMT 1, The issue is governments & organisations that have an objective create stats like this to back their particular cause, its propoganda & all sides do it. I am merely stating this clearly doesnt give all the information. Unless you know the full story, whats involved in processing both investigations your just accepting what your being spoon fed. Its just like the EU vote. How anybody can make an educated decision I do not know. All the information out there has some form of twist on it to back a specific side. Lots of it completely contradictory. As I mentioned I have issues, issues that arnt mine but that i see in society and those are the things that are important to me and what I feel is important to the country. Im not going to go into them because I dont expect you to care what I think. I am not a tory through and through. I work a lot with charities and fund raising and I am seeing what your saying from your point of view as well as my own. Hence I dont make personal remarks about you and I will only criticise myself. You state pretty clearly that you don't see much issue with the way they have run the country. Mainly because the problems havnt effected you!! how do you step away from that? its tory rhetoric to the max. Maybe you see it as a personal attack, but i see it as me representing what i perceive as your view, and the reasoning for it. which i have to say, i perceive as an I'm alright Jack attitude. Im challenging your point based on the fact i would like to live in a fair system, not the crippling one we have where the few are ok, so since they are in charge, the world doesn't need change! My appooigies for being more interested in the well being of the many rather than the few!! I just watched dodgy dave, He said the will publish the information the goes into his tax return. He very very nearly said he would publish his tax return, but he very carefully pulled himself back in and changed to "the information" . That pretty much shows he is still playing the dodgy card, you could read the pain in his face as he realised what he had said.ย
Again I state that I feel the government have done a good job tackling the economy. I can't tell you what has and what hasn't been cut or who is effected but I do have a fundamental belief that if you get ยฃ10 in you can't continue spending ยฃ12. There will be a colapse as has happened. Everyone is going to feel the cuts, yes some more than others but fundamentally every one is having to take it to try and get the basics correct. Is it the best way, I don't know, but it's easy to condem with the benefit of hindsight.
When it comes to the mega rich such as bankers and footballers, they get paid what they are worth to the company. Do I think footballers get paid too much l? Absofriginloutly but the clubs who pay their wages wouldn't say so. That's because they bring in more value. As do bankers and every single person paid to do what they do. It would be much better if footballers were on 30k and the excess better used to fund the NHS but the reality is if one club doesn't pay them the next one will.... Unless we turn to communism of course.
The issue is governments & organisations that have an objective create stats like this to back their particular cause, its propoganda & all sides do it. I am merely stating this clearly doesnt give all the information. Unless you know the full story, whats involved in processing both investigations your just accepting what your being spoon fed. Its just like the EU vote. How anybody can make an educated decision I do not know. All the information out there has some form of twist on it to back a specific side. Lots of it completely contradictory. As I mentioned I have issues, issues that arnt mine but that i see in society and those are the things that are important to me and what I feel is important to the country. Im not going to go into them because I dont expect you to care what I think. I am not a tory through and through. I work a lot with charities and fund raising and I am seeing what your saying from your point of view as well as my own. Hence I dont make personal remarks about you and I will only criticise myself. You state pretty clearly that you don't see much issue with the way they have run the country. Mainly because the problems havnt effected you!! how do you step away from that? its tory rhetoric to the max. Maybe you see it as a personal attack, but i see it as me representing what i perceive as your view, and the reasoning for it. which i have to say, i perceive as an I'm alright Jack attitude. Im challenging your point based on the fact i would like to live in a fair system, not the crippling one we have where the few are ok, so since they are in charge, the world doesn't need change! My appooigies for being more interested in the well being of the many rather than the few!! I just watched dodgy dave, He said the will publish the information the goes into his tax return. He very very nearly said he would publish his tax return, but he very carefully pulled himself back in and changed to "the information" . That pretty much shows he is still playing the dodgy card, you could read the pain in his face as he realised what he had said.ย Again I state that I feel the government have done a good job tackling the economy. I can't tell you what has and what hasn't been cut or who is effected but I do have a fundamental belief that if you get ยฃ10 in you can't continue spending ยฃ12. There will be a colapse as has happened. Everyone is going to feel the cuts, yes some more than others but fundamentally every one is having to take it to try and get the basics correct. Is it the best way, I don't know, but it's easy to condem with the benefit of hindsight. When it comes to the mega rich such as bankers and footballers, they get paid what they are worth to the company. Do I think footballers get paid too much l? Absofriginloutly but the clubs who pay their wages wouldn't say so. That's because they bring in more value. As do bankers and every single person paid to do what they do. It would be much better if footballers were on 30k and the excess better used to fund the NHS but the reality is if one club doesn't pay them the next one will.... Unless we turn to communism of course.
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tartarus
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,628
๐๐ป 2,169
February 2013
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by tartarus on Apr 9, 2016 14:05:33 GMT 1, You state pretty clearly that you don't see much issue with the way they have run the country. Mainly because the problems havnt effected you!! how do you step away from that? its tory rhetoric to the max. Maybe you see it as a personal attack, but i see it as me representing what i perceive as your view, and the reasoning for it. which i have to say, i perceive as an I'm alright Jack attitude. Im challenging your point based on the fact i would like to live in a fair system, not the crippling one we have where the few are ok, so since they are in charge, the world doesn't need change! My appooigies for being more interested in the well being of the many rather than the few!! I just watched dodgy dave, He said the will publish the information the goes into his tax return. He very very nearly said he would publish his tax return, but he very carefully pulled himself back in and changed to "the information" . That pretty much shows he is still playing the dodgy card, you could read the pain in his face as he realised what he had said. Again I state that I feel the government have done a good job tackling the economy. I can't tell you what has and what hasn't been cut or who is effected but I do have a fundamental belief that if you get ยฃ10 in you can't continue spending ยฃ12. There will be a colapse as has happened. Everyone is going to feel the cuts, yes some more than others but fundamentally every one is having to take it to try and get the basics correct. Is it the best way, I don't know, but it's easy to condem with the benefit of hindsight. When it comes to the mega rich such as bankers and footballers, they get paid what they are worth to the company. Do I think footballers get paid too much l? Absofriginloutly but the clubs who pay their wages wouldn't say so. That's because they bring in more value. As do bankers and every single person paid to do what they do. It would be much better if footballers were on 30k and the excess better used to fund the NHS but the reality is if one club doesn't pay them the next one will.... Unless we turn to communism of course. Great job, borrowed more money than any chancellor ever, sold more public assets than any chancellor ever, has a higher national debt than any chancellor ever.
NHS fucked/ sold off/intentionally underfunded, steel (was to be left for dead, but thats now too risky so its all hands on deck), Schools all being sold out of state control (sorry by sold i mean given away!), tax avoidance is rampant and it seems lauded as its technically legal, spiralling costs everywhere, unaffordable houses, record homelessness, huge amounts of public sector workers headed for mass strike action in a desperate attempt to save the services they know we need and blatant mass manipulation and even the hiding of statistics that would expose the shameful results of their economic practices. i could give you more examples if needed.
Im hoping you will point out their successes, or at least an insight into how you think they have done a good job.
But as you say, your not really paying attention, more lip service. While claiming I have been spoon fed.
You state pretty clearly that you don't see much issue with the way they have run the country. Mainly because the problems havnt effected you!! how do you step away from that? its tory rhetoric to the max. Maybe you see it as a personal attack, but i see it as me representing what i perceive as your view, and the reasoning for it. which i have to say, i perceive as an I'm alright Jack attitude. Im challenging your point based on the fact i would like to live in a fair system, not the crippling one we have where the few are ok, so since they are in charge, the world doesn't need change! My appooigies for being more interested in the well being of the many rather than the few!! I just watched dodgy dave, He said the will publish the information the goes into his tax return. He very very nearly said he would publish his tax return, but he very carefully pulled himself back in and changed to "the information" . That pretty much shows he is still playing the dodgy card, you could read the pain in his face as he realised what he had said. Again I state that I feel the government have done a good job tackling the economy. I can't tell you what has and what hasn't been cut or who is effected but I do have a fundamental belief that if you get ยฃ10 in you can't continue spending ยฃ12. There will be a colapse as has happened. Everyone is going to feel the cuts, yes some more than others but fundamentally every one is having to take it to try and get the basics correct. Is it the best way, I don't know, but it's easy to condem with the benefit of hindsight. When it comes to the mega rich such as bankers and footballers, they get paid what they are worth to the company. Do I think footballers get paid too much l? Absofriginloutly but the clubs who pay their wages wouldn't say so. That's because they bring in more value. As do bankers and every single person paid to do what they do. It would be much better if footballers were on 30k and the excess better used to fund the NHS but the reality is if one club doesn't pay them the next one will.... Unless we turn to communism of course. Great job, borrowed more money than any chancellor ever, sold more public assets than any chancellor ever, has a higher national debt than any chancellor ever. NHS fucked/ sold off/intentionally underfunded, steel (was to be left for dead, but thats now too risky so its all hands on deck), Schools all being sold out of state control (sorry by sold i mean given away!), tax avoidance is rampant and it seems lauded as its technically legal, spiralling costs everywhere, unaffordable houses, record homelessness, huge amounts of public sector workers headed for mass strike action in a desperate attempt to save the services they know we need and blatant mass manipulation and even the hiding of statistics that would expose the shameful results of their economic practices. i could give you more examples if needed. Im hoping you will point out their successes, or at least an insight into how you think they have done a good job. But as you say, your not really paying attention, more lip service. While claiming I have been spoon fed.
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tartarus
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,628
๐๐ป 2,169
February 2013
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Breaking news - Panama papers, by tartarus on Apr 9, 2016 14:09:16 GMT 1, petition.parliament.uk/petitions/122946
Petition for a 2016 election, now at 88,000 sigs almost 55,000 in 24 hours.
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