Although note you still have to get the funds out of the company

There isn’t a “feel like” option.
Everybody should pay the rightful taxes because it’s the honest, decent and right thing to do.

If you don’t, you are a thief. You are stealing from school lunch vouchers for children, retirees on minimum state pensions, nurses trying to save your worthless life during a pandemic etc etc.
Baseline: you are a scumbag of the worst kind.

Sometimes discussions on here make me feel like puking, really.

If you don’t like your government, change who you vote for, protest, start a movement or a political party, run for office etc etc. You have plenty of options.

Evade your taxes, and you are just a thief and a parasite. That’s very simple dude - if you think hard enough, you’ll get it.

Are you able to post the link for that thread please?  I couldn't seem to find it

Yes but once in a company you can chose when to draw dividends, so you can do this in years where your income is not as high, and you can also pay money straight into a pension scheme (up to £40k per annum) tax free so lots of benefits.

There is also the capital distribution to consider. Entrepreneurs relief is available for disposal of shares in a trading company.

You and your family are, presumably, regular and willing users of roads, hospitals, schools etc.

Like everyone else you, presumably, take for granted that the police, ambulance and fire services are available on demand whenever you happen to need them.

You, again presumably, recognise that a society in which those things didn’t exist would be essentially dysfunctional, and that they need to be paid for, and that therefore somebody has to do the paying.

It’s really that simple.

Yet, for whatever reason, you seem incapable of accepting your responsibility to pay your share. In my book that makes you a bloody idiot.

When you go out with friends, do you duck your round because only an idiot doesn’t try to reduce the amount they spend?

Think about it and enjoy your day. Dude.

I think you may have missed his point albeit it was badly worded.
I believe he should have added “within the bounds of the law”.
Everyone should pay the correct amount of tax after taking in to account all income, allowable expenses, tax reliefs and allowances. That by definition would be the lowest possible tax.

Sorry for the long post, but I wanted to shed some light on remarks that seemed inaccurate.

Just to give you an idea of my background, I am a CPA and tax advisor in Canada and I do a bit of US taxes. However, worldwide tax principles and approaches are pretty similar. I therefore wanted to give you guys my input.

There is usually two types of income in the eyes of the tax man, i.e. passive income and active income, which are both taxed at different rates depending on the situation.

Active income is usually earned through business income (e.g. sales of goods or services), and you can usually deduct expenses related to this income (e.g. cost of the goods/services, rent, travel, commissions, general expenses, etc.), and deductions limitations are not as restrictive than for those related to passive income.

Passive income is usually earned through investment proceeds (e.g. funds, ETF, stocks, bonds, rental income, real estate), which can be broken down into a few types of income all taxed at different rates (i.e. interest, dividends, capital gains, income distribution, etc.). You can also deduct expenses related to passive income, but these deductions are more restrictive and you must prove that these expenses are directly related to your income (e.g. cost basis of the sold investment, commission on sale, transaction fees and other direct expenses, interest paid to earn income, etc.)

Active income is usually taxed at a lower bracket than passive income, with the general exception of capital gains, which are taxed at a lower rate than active business income in most countries. Art investing can be deemed as both. If you hold for a long time, it is therefore passive income and taxed as a capital gain. If you are a flipper or you move a lot of pieces in and out of your portfolio, the tax man can deem your income as active business income. (FYI, same thing applies for day trading vs long-term investing in stocks)

On one hand, if it is deemed active business income you are taxed at a higher rate but you could deduct more expenses in your tax return which can be more beneficial (e.g. home office expenses for storage, cell phone, computer, email servers, etc.). This comes, however, with a higher level of complexity.
On the other hand, if it's deemed a capital gain, you have less deductible expenses, but you pay a lower tax rate on it, and it's much simpler in terms of tax filings.

The other question was in terms of acquiring art in a corporation instead of buying it personally. Please note that the same principles mentioned above are applicable even in a corporation. You can have active and passive income. The main benefits of acquiring art in a corporation are the following:

- If the cash in the corporation has not been taxed at a personal level yet, you have a bigger buying power since there were no personal taxes paid.
- In a lot of countries, in order to fuel the local art market, you can deduct amortization (capital cost allowance) on art. If you buy art in a corporation that has an active business income (e.g. consulting), you could deduct a portion of your art portfolio towards your profit in order to minimize your corporate income taxes at the end of the year. In Canada, you can only do so with Canadian art, art from other countries cannot be deducted unfortunately.
- If you are already taxed at the highest bracket at the personal level, there could be a benefit of investing through a corporation because corporate income tax rates are usually lower than the highest personal income tax rate, in order to fuel the economy. However, this comes with an administrative burden, i.e. costs for accounting, tax, legal, etc.

In terms of what to declare or not to the tax man, one should understand that in all developed countries, there is a financial markets regulator body, that also extends its arm to fight tax evasion and money laundering activities. One of the process to do so is the KYC process (Know your Customer). You should be comfortable with the process if you ever invested in cryptocurrency in the past, but in short, a lot of companies need to complete a documentation process on all its customers and suppliers, so that in case of an audit from the regulatory arm or the tax man, they have a file on every person with whom they did business with. For example, you can't buy a watch (e.g. Rolex) with more than $10K in cash Canada, or else the jeweller needs to ask for your government ID, and will have to file a report with the tax authorities, in which case you are logged somewhere, and you may get audited. The same goes if you want to sell a watch and want to be paid in cash, something will be logged with your name somewhere in the government's files.
Another example of this is if you deposit more than $10K in a personal account, your financial institution, in their fight against money laundering, will need to provide the same report to the tax authorities, i.e. you will once again be logged somewhere. You may not get audited in the first few years, but do you really want to gamble on this? In most developed countries, the tax authorities have 7 years to audit you, so you can end up paying a huge tax bill, plus interest and penalties.

In conclusion, to quote Benjamin Franklin:

"Our new Constitution is now established, and has an appearance that promises permanency; but in this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death and taxes."
— Benjamin Franklin, in a letter to Jean-Baptiste Le Roy, 1789

So pay your dues and your taxes, or else you are surfing on borrowed time. Feel free to reach out if you have any questions. Cheers guys!


Disclaimer: this is not intended to be regarded as advice on tax and accounting. Please consult a local specialist before making any decision with regards to your unique situation.

Yes theoretically all transfers above £9999.99 are logged with HMRC for money laundering Or something along those lines

So they’d want it four instalments to avoid that... theoretically speaking.

if a member sells for £35k and paid £1000 for it then he is liable for CGT over whatever his allowance is. I think at present its £11k in UK so the CGT liability is on 35-1-11= £23k. He should ensute his next tax return addresses this even if he was paid in cash and no digital trail of the transaction.

I am no expert but I think the cap allowance is spread over the time you have had it?  

So example

say cap allowance is £10k PA per person, thats £20 PA per couple


If bought in 2010 for £1k

sold in 2020 for £100k and you have not used up any allowance then you shouldn't have tax to pay


Major fucking disclaimer, this is possibly complete bollocks.

Correct me and make it right someone

Everyone, including children, has an annual CGT exemption, of £12,300 in the 2020-21 tax year in the UK. Gains realised within that amount incur no tax. Gains over the annual exemption are charged at 10% or 20% depending on your other income (but profits made on second homes or property investments are not and are liable to CGT of either 18% or 28%, depending on your other income).

It’s all explained (kind of) clearly here (for the UK): www.gov.uk/browse/tax/capital-gains

And if you buy/sell on the forum you’d rather report your CG, since I know for a fact that many of us do declare and pay taxes on art CG (but some don’t, and ask you to pay in bitcoins etc - avoid them like the plague, since they self declare their dishonesty, hence you can’t trust them).