rains
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April 2008
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by rains on Apr 17, 2008 10:16:00 GMT 1, I'm hardly what you call an expert, but I've been looking to buy my first Banksy over the past six to eight months, researching prices, observing the secondary market etc.
I've found that recently a lot of prints aren't selling on Ebay; people making very low offers; the 'hype' dying down a bit.
Obviously this is a bit of relief for those of us wanting to come into the market as collectors and fans on this level.
Have those of you who have sold prints, especially Banksies recently, for whatever reason, found them harder to shift - even at lower prices?
I'm hardly what you call an expert, but I've been looking to buy my first Banksy over the past six to eight months, researching prices, observing the secondary market etc.
I've found that recently a lot of prints aren't selling on Ebay; people making very low offers; the 'hype' dying down a bit.
Obviously this is a bit of relief for those of us wanting to come into the market as collectors and fans on this level.
Have those of you who have sold prints, especially Banksies recently, for whatever reason, found them harder to shift - even at lower prices?
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wimpy
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November 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by wimpy on Apr 17, 2008 10:23:04 GMT 1, I know that people are spending money here in the states because it is tax time. 
Before I buy anything this time of year, I need to recover for at least a few weeks while thinking about 1/5th of my earnings getting yanked.
I know that people are spending money here in the states because it is tax time. Before I buy anything this time of year, I need to recover for at least a few weeks while thinking about 1/5th of my earnings getting yanked. |
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kingdomcome
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March 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by kingdomcome on Apr 17, 2008 10:24:32 GMT 1, i havent noticed that to be honest, ebay has sucked the life out of the market though. made touting legal and destroyed charity shops in the process, the fuckers!!
i havent noticed that to be honest, ebay has sucked the life out of the market though. made touting legal and destroyed charity shops in the process, the fuckers!!
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by They call me Stephen on Apr 17, 2008 10:40:06 GMT 1, The ebay market seems to be pretty strong to me at the moment.
If anything the auction houses seem to be far more settled than ebay....some of the prints at Bonhams yesterday went for far less than they would on ebay.
Particular artists' work (micallef for example) is selling for great prices at the moment on ebay but that's because he's out of the public eye, as it were, and not because of a stabling price market
The ebay market seems to be pretty strong to me at the moment.
If anything the auction houses seem to be far more settled than ebay....some of the prints at Bonhams yesterday went for far less than they would on ebay.
Particular artists' work (micallef for example) is selling for great prices at the moment on ebay but that's because he's out of the public eye, as it were, and not because of a stabling price market
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raiden
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April 2008
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by raiden on Apr 17, 2008 13:13:18 GMT 1, 1) The US economy is in the gutter. I'm starting to see the recession hitting the art market - hard. Plus, its affecting all levels at this point with bank collapses and is only expected to get worse.
2) Ebay market still is seeing lingering effects of the fake Banksy / POW scandal. It really has a lot of people jittery still with Ebay Banksy's.
3) It seems to me, although I may be wrong, that the print market is getting a bit flooded at the moment. The number of internet print houses seems to keep increasing, which in turn increases the frequency of releases. (though by all means weigh in on this as I have only really gotten into print collecting in a major way in the last year and a half)
This won't make any fans in this board, but I am starting to fear that the print market is experiencing a collector bubble similar to the American baseball card market in the late 80s, the Beanie Baby craze, and so many other vogue collecting crazes we've seen throughout the years.
Anytime you have this number of flippers and collectors buying with such little regard to 1) aesthetics 2) personal wall space 3) holding long term, you set yourself up for a crash situation. Going off only anecdotal evidence, so many collectors, including myself, have a surplus of art what we purchased based on its perceived value and still isn't up on walls. As the economy gets worse, should prices exhibit downward pressure, many of these collectors I think will sell now while the selling is good with the theory they can buy the same work later at cheaper prices.
4) The art market is exciting right now because of the massive currency fluctuations. Fact is, in the high end art market, art was sold purely to ride out forecasted currency fluctuations. With an increasing perception that they dollar is going to bottom out in the near future, or worse will remain stable in price against the Euro, blue chip art becomes a less valuable commodity. I purchased Nikers (when practically no one cared about Nick Walker) partly under the assumption that not only is it a piece I love, but the dollar would keep slipping, so it would go up for that reason alone. This currency issue has been an overlooked force in a very bullish modern art market.
5) Additionally, there is a point where you have to consider Banksy's relative pricing to artist such as Warhol. All prices being equal, I would prefer to have a Banksy over a Warhol, but fact of the matter is that at a certain point, it becomes harder to justify Banksy prices in relation to Warhol prints. (and by the way, I won't make fans on this board by bringing up this point)
Let me say too, I single out Warhol partly because of the Banksy v. Warhol show and because of their somehow parallel status as the art stars of their time.
Currently, I'd argue that their fates and prices are intertwined. There is an imperfect, but nonetheless existant substitution effect between Banksy and Warhol among Generation Y art buyers. A signed and provenance "Love Rat" on Ebay sold for $11.5K USD, well within striking distance of many fairly priced iconic Warhols (let's not even begin to say how damn overpriced Warhol is).
The problem is, Banksy is reaching a price point where speculative price pressures for his prints will be undermined by the substitution effect toward Warhol, Harring, Lichenstein and other artists. Granted, over time, depending on scarcity, Banksy could surpass Warhol, but that's still a bit of a gamble because the supply of Warhol, Lichensteins, Harrings', etc is set thanks to them being dead. (its really amazing that Banksy is so highly priced)
Beyond that, I've noticed that several other graffiti artists are establishing themselves enough to steal some of Banksy's thunder in relation to art market prices, most especially Nick Walker and Blek Le Rat (both of whom have been further launched by hugely successful LA shows and the later of whom is benefiting greatly from his status as a Banksy predecessor and influence).
What I mean by all this gibberish about economics is... Hopefully my broke ass will finally be able to afford a Banksy. 
1) The US economy is in the gutter. I'm starting to see the recession hitting the art market - hard. Plus, its affecting all levels at this point with bank collapses and is only expected to get worse. 2) Ebay market still is seeing lingering effects of the fake Banksy / POW scandal. It really has a lot of people jittery still with Ebay Banksy's. 3) It seems to me, although I may be wrong, that the print market is getting a bit flooded at the moment. The number of internet print houses seems to keep increasing, which in turn increases the frequency of releases. (though by all means weigh in on this as I have only really gotten into print collecting in a major way in the last year and a half) This won't make any fans in this board, but I am starting to fear that the print market is experiencing a collector bubble similar to the American baseball card market in the late 80s, the Beanie Baby craze, and so many other vogue collecting crazes we've seen throughout the years. Anytime you have this number of flippers and collectors buying with such little regard to 1) aesthetics 2) personal wall space 3) holding long term, you set yourself up for a crash situation. Going off only anecdotal evidence, so many collectors, including myself, have a surplus of art what we purchased based on its perceived value and still isn't up on walls. As the economy gets worse, should prices exhibit downward pressure, many of these collectors I think will sell now while the selling is good with the theory they can buy the same work later at cheaper prices. 4) The art market is exciting right now because of the massive currency fluctuations. Fact is, in the high end art market, art was sold purely to ride out forecasted currency fluctuations. With an increasing perception that they dollar is going to bottom out in the near future, or worse will remain stable in price against the Euro, blue chip art becomes a less valuable commodity. I purchased Nikers (when practically no one cared about Nick Walker) partly under the assumption that not only is it a piece I love, but the dollar would keep slipping, so it would go up for that reason alone. This currency issue has been an overlooked force in a very bullish modern art market. 5) Additionally, there is a point where you have to consider Banksy's relative pricing to artist such as Warhol. All prices being equal, I would prefer to have a Banksy over a Warhol, but fact of the matter is that at a certain point, it becomes harder to justify Banksy prices in relation to Warhol prints. (and by the way, I won't make fans on this board by bringing up this point) Let me say too, I single out Warhol partly because of the Banksy v. Warhol show and because of their somehow parallel status as the art stars of their time. Currently, I'd argue that their fates and prices are intertwined. There is an imperfect, but nonetheless existant substitution effect between Banksy and Warhol among Generation Y art buyers. A signed and provenance "Love Rat" on Ebay sold for $11.5K USD, well within striking distance of many fairly priced iconic Warhols (let's not even begin to say how damn overpriced Warhol is). The problem is, Banksy is reaching a price point where speculative price pressures for his prints will be undermined by the substitution effect toward Warhol, Harring, Lichenstein and other artists. Granted, over time, depending on scarcity, Banksy could surpass Warhol, but that's still a bit of a gamble because the supply of Warhol, Lichensteins, Harrings', etc is set thanks to them being dead. (its really amazing that Banksy is so highly priced) Beyond that, I've noticed that several other graffiti artists are establishing themselves enough to steal some of Banksy's thunder in relation to art market prices, most especially Nick Walker and Blek Le Rat (both of whom have been further launched by hugely successful LA shows and the later of whom is benefiting greatly from his status as a Banksy predecessor and influence). What I mean by all this gibberish about economics is... Hopefully my broke ass will finally be able to afford a Banksy. |
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rains
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April 2008
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by rains on Apr 17, 2008 13:39:44 GMT 1, Interesting post Raiden.
The currency fluctuation point though - surely when the dollar starts to recover, won't it drag up prices further as US buyers will get more bang for their banksy buck, as the large majority of banksy works are UK-owned and UK-priced? What in fact we'll see is a shift in transatlantic ownership instead.
I also wonder what effect the rumoured 'no more unsigned' will have. Some suggest it will push up the prices of all prints - signed and unsigned both - however, I liken it to the housing market - which is struggling because of the scarcity of first-time buyers. Much of Banksy's appeal, compared to Warhol for example, is that he has a lot of one-time buyers - people who are happy with owning just one unsigned Banksy print for say 7/800 quid and would never regard themselves as collectors. When these people no longer have a fair entry point, their demand will cease.
Availability is important but not essential, however, the 'aura' of availability is absolutely crucial. People need to know that they're in with a chance of buying something, even when in practice they're not. Take away the low-ball entry point and demand from the mass of buyers dries up.
Which is great for me as I'll finally be able to afford more than one....
Interesting post Raiden.
The currency fluctuation point though - surely when the dollar starts to recover, won't it drag up prices further as US buyers will get more bang for their banksy buck, as the large majority of banksy works are UK-owned and UK-priced? What in fact we'll see is a shift in transatlantic ownership instead.
I also wonder what effect the rumoured 'no more unsigned' will have. Some suggest it will push up the prices of all prints - signed and unsigned both - however, I liken it to the housing market - which is struggling because of the scarcity of first-time buyers. Much of Banksy's appeal, compared to Warhol for example, is that he has a lot of one-time buyers - people who are happy with owning just one unsigned Banksy print for say 7/800 quid and would never regard themselves as collectors. When these people no longer have a fair entry point, their demand will cease.
Availability is important but not essential, however, the 'aura' of availability is absolutely crucial. People need to know that they're in with a chance of buying something, even when in practice they're not. Take away the low-ball entry point and demand from the mass of buyers dries up.
Which is great for me as I'll finally be able to afford more than one....
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leumasdarnley
Junior Member
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May 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by leumasdarnley on Apr 17, 2008 13:47:23 GMT 1, Ups and downs guys before Xmas people thought they might have to burn there Banksy's to keep warm then a hot auction and back to the races. IMO these trends are short term and it seems like the only thing that has happened is the fat has been trimmed prices don't seem low but a little more realistic.
Ups and downs guys before Xmas people thought they might have to burn there Banksy's to keep warm then a hot auction and back to the races. IMO these trends are short term and it seems like the only thing that has happened is the fat has been trimmed prices don't seem low but a little more realistic.
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Bram
Artist
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November 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by Bram on Apr 17, 2008 13:51:53 GMT 1, I have an idea. Lets look at prices of (good) art over the last 400 years and someone then explain why the next 400 years won't be similar. Fluctuations and mini bubbles will always happen but long term prices will hold or increase but only on good art.
Now the question is what is good art. I don't know but I know it isn't a picture of the Mona Lisa mocked up as Marge Simpson.
I have an idea. Lets look at prices of (good) art over the last 400 years and someone then explain why the next 400 years won't be similar. Fluctuations and mini bubbles will always happen but long term prices will hold or increase but only on good art.
Now the question is what is good art. I don't know but I know it isn't a picture of the Mona Lisa mocked up as Marge Simpson.
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leumasdarnley
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May 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by leumasdarnley on Apr 17, 2008 13:57:01 GMT 1, Good point and thats the truth if you buy something you better love it cuz it might only be worth the enjoyment of seeing on your walls. Speculation about values is short sighted I agree with bram... cream will float to the top.
Good point and thats the truth if you buy something you better love it cuz it might only be worth the enjoyment of seeing on your walls. Speculation about values is short sighted I agree with bram... cream will float to the top.
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funyoung
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February 2008
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by funyoung on Apr 17, 2008 14:04:26 GMT 1, I have an idea. Lets look at prices of (good) art over the last 400 years and someone then explain why the next 400 years won't be similar. Fluctuations and mini bubbles will always happen but long term prices will hold or increase but only on good art. Now the question is what is good art. I don't know but I know it isn't a picture of the Mona Lisa mocked up as Marge Simpson.
This is very interesting and I agree. But some of Warhol's work is pretty poor (IMO) too. We all have off-days. That work still holds value, though doesn't shoot up like other pieces. So, even the poorest work in an artists repertoire can see an appreciation in value over time. You have to judge an artist by his/her whole body of work rather than single pieces.
Doesn't answer the question of 'what is good art' of course.
I have an idea. Lets look at prices of (good) art over the last 400 years and someone then explain why the next 400 years won't be similar. Fluctuations and mini bubbles will always happen but long term prices will hold or increase but only on good art. Now the question is what is good art. I don't know but I know it isn't a picture of the Mona Lisa mocked up as Marge Simpson. This is very interesting and I agree. But some of Warhol's work is pretty poor (IMO) too. We all have off-days. That work still holds value, though doesn't shoot up like other pieces. So, even the poorest work in an artists repertoire can see an appreciation in value over time. You have to judge an artist by his/her whole body of work rather than single pieces. Doesn't answer the question of 'what is good art' of course. |
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thinkbank
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March 2008
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by thinkbank on Apr 17, 2008 14:18:57 GMT 1, I have an idea. Lets look at prices of (good) art over the last 400 years and someone then explain why the next 400 years won't be similar. Fluctuations and mini bubbles will always happen but long term prices will hold or increase but only on good art. Now the question is what is good art. I don't know but I know it isn't a picture of the Mona Lisa mocked up as Marge Simpson. This is very interesting and I agree. But some of Warhol's work is pretty poor (IMO) too. We all have off-days. That work still holds value, though doesn't shoot up like other pieces. So, even the poorest work in an artists repertoire can see an appreciation in value over time. You have to judge an artist by his/her whole body of work rather than single pieces. Doesn't answer the question of 'what is good art' of course.
Warhol was different. He was iconic in the his own right and he was a pioneer.
You could say Banksy is similar because he has created a buzz about who he is or might be.
I dont think you can say that about other artists, theyre decent, hardworking everyday kind of guys.
I cant see theyre work holding as much value over time - not all of it anyway.
I have an idea. Lets look at prices of (good) art over the last 400 years and someone then explain why the next 400 years won't be similar. Fluctuations and mini bubbles will always happen but long term prices will hold or increase but only on good art. Now the question is what is good art. I don't know but I know it isn't a picture of the Mona Lisa mocked up as Marge Simpson. This is very interesting and I agree. But some of Warhol's work is pretty poor (IMO) too. We all have off-days. That work still holds value, though doesn't shoot up like other pieces. So, even the poorest work in an artists repertoire can see an appreciation in value over time. You have to judge an artist by his/her whole body of work rather than single pieces. Doesn't answer the question of 'what is good art' of course. Warhol was different. He was iconic in the his own right and he was a pioneer. You could say Banksy is similar because he has created a buzz about who he is or might be. I dont think you can say that about other artists, theyre decent, hardworking everyday kind of guys. I cant see theyre work holding as much value over time - not all of it anyway. |
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otomi
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July 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by otomi on Apr 17, 2008 19:09:24 GMT 1, 4000 pounds for a walker print i don't think it is settling it might move away from banksy a bit at the moment
4000 pounds for a walker print i don't think it is settling it might move away from banksy a bit at the moment
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robotoil
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April 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by robotoil on Apr 18, 2008 2:44:08 GMT 1, Bram, I couldn't agree more about the Simpsons/Mona thought.
Thinkbank, "You could say Banksy is similar because he has created a buzz about who he is or might be." At some point in the future either Banksy will be outed for real or no one will care about who he is. The art must stand on its own at that point. What do you think will happen then?
Otomi, I think you are correct. At some point you have to widen your horizons and your tastes change. Other artists creep into the picture.
Bram, I couldn't agree more about the Simpsons/Mona thought.
Thinkbank, "You could say Banksy is similar because he has created a buzz about who he is or might be." At some point in the future either Banksy will be outed for real or no one will care about who he is. The art must stand on its own at that point. What do you think will happen then?
Otomi, I think you are correct. At some point you have to widen your horizons and your tastes change. Other artists creep into the picture.
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Francis
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September 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by Francis on Apr 18, 2008 7:27:17 GMT 1, It is because people are saying Banksy is a scam!
It is because people are saying Banksy is a scam!
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by snakes on Apr 18, 2008 9:14:02 GMT 1, It is because people are saying Banksy is a scam!
Pardon?
It is because people are saying Banksy is a scam! Pardon? |
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seidbereit
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November 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by seidbereit on Apr 18, 2008 9:21:21 GMT 1, ^^ what snakes said.
Who's been saying banksy is a scam, francis?
^^ what snakes said.
Who's been saying banksy is a scam, francis?
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by daz205 on Apr 18, 2008 18:13:51 GMT 1, i do believe that NW`s recent boom has only been due to the moona selling for 60k at auction without that his prices would not be where they are today, this in turn has made alot of people alot of money
could the auction sale have been rigged by 2 buyers + 1 seller to provoke this and inturn make them alot more money from other NW pieces?
i do believe that NW`s recent boom has only been due to the moona selling for 60k at auction without that his prices would not be where they are today, this in turn has made alot of people alot of money
could the auction sale have been rigged by 2 buyers + 1 seller to provoke this and inturn make them alot more money from other NW pieces?
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motor
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December 2006
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by motor on Apr 18, 2008 18:25:32 GMT 1, i do believe that NW`s recent boom has only been due to the moona selling for 60k at auction without that his prices would not be where they are today, this in turn has made alot of people alot of money could the auction sale have been rigged by 2 buyers + 1 seller to provoke this and inturn make them alot more money from other NW pieces?
Looking at the recent NW show pieces I have to say that he has improved a lot but I totally agree with your comment above Daz.
Don't get me wrong I see quality but the prices are IMO extra-ordinate for not so established artist in the art world (although he has been around for a while but that's the other thing).
Hats off to whoever is doing NW PR. That's how it should be done-that's for sure.
i do believe that NW`s recent boom has only been due to the moona selling for 60k at auction without that his prices would not be where they are today, this in turn has made alot of people alot of money could the auction sale have been rigged by 2 buyers + 1 seller to provoke this and inturn make them alot more money from other NW pieces? Looking at the recent NW show pieces I have to say that he has improved a lot but I totally agree with your comment above Daz. Don't get me wrong I see quality but the prices are IMO extra-ordinate for not so established artist in the art world (although he has been around for a while but that's the other thing). Hats off to whoever is doing NW PR. That's how it should be done-that's for sure. |
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Bram
Artist
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November 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by Bram on Apr 18, 2008 18:32:22 GMT 1, i do believe that NW`s recent boom has only been due to the moona selling for 60k at auction without that his prices would not be where they are today, this in turn has made alot of people alot of money could the auction sale have been rigged by 2 buyers + 1 seller to provoke this and inturn make them alot more money from other NW pieces?
The story goes the buyer thought it was by Banksy 
Take at look at number 9 in the Mirrors top banksy's.
www.mirror.co.uk/news/topstories/2008/04/17/pictures-banksy-s-latest-graffiti-art-and-his-greatest-hits-89520-20386122/
Also, is it possible to have just one thread on this forum without some mentioning bloody nick bloody walker.
i do believe that NW`s recent boom has only been due to the moona selling for 60k at auction without that his prices would not be where they are today, this in turn has made alot of people alot of money could the auction sale have been rigged by 2 buyers + 1 seller to provoke this and inturn make them alot more money from other NW pieces? The story goes the buyer thought it was by Banksy Take at look at number 9 in the Mirrors top banksy's. www.mirror.co.uk/news/topstories/2008/04/17/pictures-banksy-s-latest-graffiti-art-and-his-greatest-hits-89520-20386122/Also, is it possible to have just one thread on this forum without some mentioning bloody nick bloody walker. |
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daisy
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December 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by daisy on Apr 18, 2008 19:59:37 GMT 1, Nick Who?
Nick Who?
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funyoung
Junior Member
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February 2008
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by funyoung on Apr 19, 2008 10:53:36 GMT 1,
And the underbidder. Who did he think it was by?
I don't believe anyone spends ยฃ50k without reading the catalogue or listening to the auctioneer first. Nice rumour though.
And the underbidder. Who did he think it was by? I don't believe anyone spends ยฃ50k without reading the catalogue or listening to the auctioneer first. Nice rumour though. |
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by cashman on Apr 19, 2008 11:03:56 GMT 1, And the underbidder. Who did he think it was by? I don't believe anyone spends ยฃ50k without reading the catalogue or listening to the auctioneer first. Nice rumour though.
you would if you had more money than sense
And the underbidder. Who did he think it was by? I don't believe anyone spends ยฃ50k without reading the catalogue or listening to the auctioneer first. Nice rumour though. you would if you had more money than sense |
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thinkbank
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March 2008
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by thinkbank on Apr 19, 2008 14:52:36 GMT 1, Bram, I couldn't agree more about the Simpsons/Mona thought. Thinkbank, "You could say Banksy is similar because he has created a buzz about who he is or might be." At some point in the future either Banksy will be outed for real or no one will care about who he is. The art must stand on its own at that point. What do you think will happen then? Otomi, I think you are correct. At some point you have to widen your horizons and your tastes change. Other artists creep into the picture.
hi mate, only just seen your message.
I think Banksys work will stand the test of time, well most of it anyway. I dont think Banksy will be outed if anyone wanted to do that - they probably will have by now.
People wont stop caring about who he is because its only thru the art we know him.
Bram, I couldn't agree more about the Simpsons/Mona thought. Thinkbank, "You could say Banksy is similar because he has created a buzz about who he is or might be." At some point in the future either Banksy will be outed for real or no one will care about who he is. The art must stand on its own at that point. What do you think will happen then? Otomi, I think you are correct. At some point you have to widen your horizons and your tastes change. Other artists creep into the picture. hi mate, only just seen your message. I think Banksys work will stand the test of time, well most of it anyway. I dont think Banksy will be outed if anyone wanted to do that - they probably will have by now. People wont stop caring about who he is because its only thru the art we know him. |
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funyoung
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,040
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February 2008
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by funyoung on Apr 19, 2008 15:08:25 GMT 1, And the underbidder. Who did he think it was by? I don't believe anyone spends ยฃ50k without reading the catalogue or listening to the auctioneer first. Nice rumour though. you would if you had more money than sense
Someone walked in from the street and spent ยฃ50k on something they knew nothing about?
Hmmm.
Bit hard to swallow that one.
You didn't answer the bit about the underbidder. He too had 'more money than sense'? ยฃ49k of it?
People rarely do have 'more money than sense' when you get up to these prices. You don't get rich by haemorrhaging money like that. Exceptions (usually lottery winners) are few and far between, making the chance of having two in the room together even rarer.
And the underbidder. Who did he think it was by? I don't believe anyone spends ยฃ50k without reading the catalogue or listening to the auctioneer first. Nice rumour though. you would if you had more money than sense Someone walked in from the street and spent ยฃ50k on something they knew nothing about? Hmmm. Bit hard to swallow that one. You didn't answer the bit about the underbidder. He too had 'more money than sense'? ยฃ49k of it? People rarely do have 'more money than sense' when you get up to these prices. You don't get rich by haemorrhaging money like that. Exceptions (usually lottery winners) are few and far between, making the chance of having two in the room together even rarer. |
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by bankruptcreative on Apr 19, 2008 19:34:13 GMT 1, It is possible for an auctioneer to take bids "off the wall" although I don't know how common this is in the art market, so it might not be used at all in these kind of auctions.
Apparently in general auction terms though, this is fairly common and is legal (for instance in property auctions).
It is possible for an auctioneer to take bids "off the wall" although I don't know how common this is in the art market, so it might not be used at all in these kind of auctions.
Apparently in general auction terms though, this is fairly common and is legal (for instance in property auctions).
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by bankruptcreative on Apr 20, 2008 17:28:31 GMT 1, Personally I think a lot of the stuff that has gone up in price sharply has been overbought, as with a lot of stocks and other "assets" people have bought into without consideration over the last few years.
I think that the flippers and speculators will come unstuck whatever they have bought over the next few months, and things will settle down a little in the market.
I also think some of the poorer artists will either step up their game or disappear over the next couple of years, and that long term this will be a good thing for the market in general, and encourage better work.
After all, how many of us who have made considered purchases really care what happens in terms of short term price fluctuations? Personally I have only bought things I loved, and that I felt stood out. I would not be bothered if they went down in price, because I bought it out of a personal attachment.
I've written a short article on this:
Art Price Crash?
bankruptculture.com/artpricecrash
Other related article have appeared in the news which might be of general interest (sorry if any of this has already been posted):
Corporate Giants take a shine to contemporary art
www.reuters.com/article/inDepthNews/idUSL1081346020080417?pageNumber=1&virtualBrandChannel=0
Amid art boom, dealers brace for a bust
money.cnn.com/2008/04/15/smbusiness/singing_in_rain_art.fsb/index.htm?section=money_latest
Is the art boom over?
money.cnn.com/video/#/video/news/2008/04/04/news.harlow.art.market.cnnmoney
Whatever happens in the future I think that the last few years have been extremely interesting, we have had the privelege of living through a great period in art history, paritcularly those of us in East London who have been surrounded by the changing urban landscape and visual chatter.
Personally I think we are reaching the end of an era, things are going to change, but the scene will live on.
Personally I think a lot of the stuff that has gone up in price sharply has been overbought, as with a lot of stocks and other "assets" people have bought into without consideration over the last few years. I think that the flippers and speculators will come unstuck whatever they have bought over the next few months, and things will settle down a little in the market. I also think some of the poorer artists will either step up their game or disappear over the next couple of years, and that long term this will be a good thing for the market in general, and encourage better work. After all, how many of us who have made considered purchases really care what happens in terms of short term price fluctuations? Personally I have only bought things I loved, and that I felt stood out. I would not be bothered if they went down in price, because I bought it out of a personal attachment. I've written a short article on this: Art Price Crash? bankruptculture.com/artpricecrashOther related article have appeared in the news which might be of general interest (sorry if any of this has already been posted): Corporate Giants take a shine to contemporary art www.reuters.com/article/inDepthNews/idUSL1081346020080417?pageNumber=1&virtualBrandChannel=0Amid art boom, dealers brace for a bust money.cnn.com/2008/04/15/smbusiness/singing_in_rain_art.fsb/index.htm?section=money_latestIs the art boom over? money.cnn.com/video/#/video/news/2008/04/04/news.harlow.art.market.cnnmoneyWhatever happens in the future I think that the last few years have been extremely interesting, we have had the privelege of living through a great period in art history, paritcularly those of us in East London who have been surrounded by the changing urban landscape and visual chatter. Personally I think we are reaching the end of an era, things are going to change, but the scene will live on. |
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by manchestermike on Apr 20, 2008 17:31:37 GMT 1, Disagree about the end of an era... I think we're just at the start of one...
Disagree about the end of an era... I think we're just at the start of one...
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Winter
Junior Member
Posts โข 7,139
Likes โข 4,444
March 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by Winter on Apr 20, 2008 17:36:07 GMT 1, I do think there is a lot of rubbish going for big amounts of money. Anything apart from Banksy, Faile or Neate is treading on thin ice, oh and Dan Baldwin!
I do think there is a lot of rubbish going for big amounts of money. Anything apart from Banksy, Faile or Neate is treading on thin ice, oh and Dan Baldwin!
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hlarmy
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,199
Likes โข 64
November 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by hlarmy on Apr 20, 2008 17:42:24 GMT 1, I agree Winter, considering some of the prices we've been seeing recently, Neate's prints look especially well priced.
I think (and hope) we'll be seeing a lot more prints from NW's Vandal series, including NY, Sydney, Tokyo. Where this is good (as I love each one of them), I think that prices are unsustainable at the current levels. On the other hand, AN will not be releasing any more prints and they are very limited as it is. Need I say anything about Banksy, I think not 
I agree Winter, considering some of the prices we've been seeing recently, Neate's prints look especially well priced. I think (and hope) we'll be seeing a lot more prints from NW's Vandal series, including NY, Sydney, Tokyo. Where this is good (as I love each one of them), I think that prices are unsustainable at the current levels. On the other hand, AN will not be releasing any more prints and they are very limited as it is. Need I say anything about Banksy, I think not |
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Photoxtc
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,495
Likes โข 189
July 2007
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Is the E-bay market settling a bit?, by Photoxtc on Apr 20, 2008 18:20:39 GMT 1, Disagree about the end of an era... I think we're just at the start of one...
I'm with you on this one MM, just the tip so far...
Disagree about the end of an era... I think we're just at the start of one... I'm with you on this one MM, just the tip so far... |
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