motor
Junior Member
🗨️ 1,839
👍🏻 411
December 2006
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by motor on Oct 17, 2009 16:48:23 GMT 1, Roger that. Thanks
Roger that. Thanks
|
|
RBK
Junior Member
🗨️ 2,925
👍🏻 104
September 2006
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by RBK on Oct 17, 2009 17:09:18 GMT 1, Don't really understand your "NEVER" comment. Better would be that they didn't realize estimates. Plus it's quite possible that these pieces might sell after the auction. Anyway never mind the Faile, for that amount you can buy better quality pieces these days. However I am surprised about that Parla result, as despite the fact that it is from diptych, in terms of a quality it is a strong and quite a big piece by him (nice representative example) IMO. And those estimates were not too high either. "Never sold" is actually perfectly correct. Due to either an intervention or the seller seeing sense, the lot was withdrawn before the sale.
Agreed. 'Never Sold' or 'Withdrawn' is different that 'Bought In'
Don't really understand your "NEVER" comment. Better would be that they didn't realize estimates. Plus it's quite possible that these pieces might sell after the auction. Anyway never mind the Faile, for that amount you can buy better quality pieces these days. However I am surprised about that Parla result, as despite the fact that it is from diptych, in terms of a quality it is a strong and quite a big piece by him (nice representative example) IMO. And those estimates were not too high either. "Never sold" is actually perfectly correct. Due to either an intervention or the seller seeing sense, the lot was withdrawn before the sale. Agreed. 'Never Sold' or 'Withdrawn' is different that 'Bought In'
|
|
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by bobbymeachamjr on Oct 17, 2009 17:45:08 GMT 1, Anyway never mind the Faile, for that amount you can buy better quality pieces these days. However I am surprised about that Parla result, as despite the fact that it is from diptych, in terms of a quality it is a strong and quite a big piece by him (nice representative example) IMO. And those estimates were not too high either.
Not surprised at all, in fact based on recent results for parla (ie top notch 4x6 ft failing to reach $40Kusd) this small piece' estimates were on the high side. Also agree on the faile, mediocre overall and estimates way too high. You can readily get work from these artists (and many other artists) that are either better and/or cheaper.
Anyway never mind the Faile, for that amount you can buy better quality pieces these days. However I am surprised about that Parla result, as despite the fact that it is from diptych, in terms of a quality it is a strong and quite a big piece by him (nice representative example) IMO. And those estimates were not too high either. Not surprised at all, in fact based on recent results for parla (ie top notch 4x6 ft failing to reach $40Kusd) this small piece' estimates were on the high side. Also agree on the faile, mediocre overall and estimates way too high. You can readily get work from these artists (and many other artists) that are either better and/or cheaper.
|
|
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by snausages on Oct 17, 2009 18:57:42 GMT 1, Yeah, I'd would easily buy one of the new wood failes from rubenstein for about the same estimate before I would buy the pink challenger canvas. A shame though for the seller.
And withdrawn or not, not a good sign for Parla that it either failed to meet reserve or that the seller lacked so much confidence that he didn't want it to hit the auction block.
Yeah, I'd would easily buy one of the new wood failes from rubenstein for about the same estimate before I would buy the pink challenger canvas. A shame though for the seller.
And withdrawn or not, not a good sign for Parla that it either failed to meet reserve or that the seller lacked so much confidence that he didn't want it to hit the auction block.
|
|
RBK
Junior Member
🗨️ 2,925
👍🏻 104
September 2006
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by RBK on Oct 17, 2009 20:51:44 GMT 1, And withdrawn or not, not a good sign for Parla that it either failed to meet reserve or that the seller lacked so much confidence that he didn't want it to hit the auction block.
snausages - for someone that works in the art world - you should know it's not necessarily a bad thing for Parla at all. The work didn't even make it to the block, so it didn't "fail to meet reserve." You saying the seller didn't have enough confidence is pure speculation.
I think the fact 1/2 a dyptch was even being offered on the auction block is the much more interesting topic (and questionable move on whomever the seller is). Does anyone know if the gallery owns both the pieces, were they spilt up and sold at the show, owned privately, etc?
And withdrawn or not, not a good sign for Parla that it either failed to meet reserve or that the seller lacked so much confidence that he didn't want it to hit the auction block. snausages - for someone that works in the art world - you should know it's not necessarily a bad thing for Parla at all. The work didn't even make it to the block, so it didn't "fail to meet reserve." You saying the seller didn't have enough confidence is pure speculation. I think the fact 1/2 a dyptch was even being offered on the auction block is the much more interesting topic (and questionable move on whomever the seller is). Does anyone know if the gallery owns both the pieces, were they spilt up and sold at the show, owned privately, etc?
|
|
RBK
Junior Member
🗨️ 2,925
👍🏻 104
September 2006
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by RBK on Oct 17, 2009 22:11:44 GMT 1, And no I don't own a Parla original - just an appreciator of his art.
And no I don't own a Parla original - just an appreciator of his art.
|
|
|
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by snausages on Oct 18, 2009 1:04:52 GMT 1, Uh yeah, but after the poor auction showings by him and this sense of a controlling presence around his market I just put 2 and 2 together, but yes of course it's speculation. So spin it however you want, I don't care. Nor do I care if the painting is split up, it happens.
Nice to see rationalization come to the art world, looked through results at Christies and PdP and many lots sold for very fair prices — just reinforces how ridiculous (not just Parla's) but all urban artist prices were. Many paintings (comparable and larger) by artists with much longer resume's than Parla sold for less than the estimate on his painting. Again yes of course buy what you like, but in the opinion of - someone that works in the art world - I think this shows prices are still too high in these parts.
Uh yeah, but after the poor auction showings by him and this sense of a controlling presence around his market I just put 2 and 2 together, but yes of course it's speculation. So spin it however you want, I don't care. Nor do I care if the painting is split up, it happens.
Nice to see rationalization come to the art world, looked through results at Christies and PdP and many lots sold for very fair prices — just reinforces how ridiculous (not just Parla's) but all urban artist prices were. Many paintings (comparable and larger) by artists with much longer resume's than Parla sold for less than the estimate on his painting. Again yes of course buy what you like, but in the opinion of - someone that works in the art world - I think this shows prices are still too high in these parts.
|
|
lee3
New Member
🗨️ 832
👍🏻 1,290
November 2009
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by lee3 on Oct 18, 2009 17:52:48 GMT 1, >>>And withdrawn or not, not a good sign for Parla that it either failed to meet reserve or that the seller lacked so much confidence that he didn't want it to hit the auction block.<<<
There are a million reasons why something gets withdrawn. It's possible since we're all speculating that Parla or his handlers forced the withdrawal of the lot by not issuing 2 COA's for both canvases (if this was truly a diptych). They could well have been upset to see half a diptych in the sale, contacted the house and said we don't approve nor will we issue more than 1 COA for that diptych in which case the house would withdraw the lot. I only point this out because if we're going to jump to conclusions without any facts, it's silly to state "that this is not a good sign" when it could have been withdrawn for any number of reasons.
>>>And withdrawn or not, not a good sign for Parla that it either failed to meet reserve or that the seller lacked so much confidence that he didn't want it to hit the auction block.<<<
There are a million reasons why something gets withdrawn. It's possible since we're all speculating that Parla or his handlers forced the withdrawal of the lot by not issuing 2 COA's for both canvases (if this was truly a diptych). They could well have been upset to see half a diptych in the sale, contacted the house and said we don't approve nor will we issue more than 1 COA for that diptych in which case the house would withdraw the lot. I only point this out because if we're going to jump to conclusions without any facts, it's silly to state "that this is not a good sign" when it could have been withdrawn for any number of reasons.
|
|
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by snausages on Oct 18, 2009 19:09:23 GMT 1, Already stated it's speculation lee, but my 'not good' comment stemmed from the idea that many people have been predicting & waiting for a Parla auction record breakthrough and for whatever reasons, it failed to happen yet again. But on the flip side it probably is good that this got yanked and didn't set the mark for another buy-in.
And about the split up of the diptych, whatever, it's not a historic masterpiece, it's just a work by a minor contemporary artist.
Already stated it's speculation lee, but my 'not good' comment stemmed from the idea that many people have been predicting & waiting for a Parla auction record breakthrough and for whatever reasons, it failed to happen yet again. But on the flip side it probably is good that this got yanked and didn't set the mark for another buy-in.
And about the split up of the diptych, whatever, it's not a historic masterpiece, it's just a work by a minor contemporary artist.
|
|
lee3
New Member
🗨️ 832
👍🏻 1,290
November 2009
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by lee3 on Oct 18, 2009 20:03:43 GMT 1, >>>And about the split up of the diptych, whatever, it's not a historic masterpiece, it's just a work by a minor contemporary artist.<<<
There are plenty of artists and foundations that have no problem with splitting up multiple canvas works and there are plenty that do. IMO, there certainly is no rule of standard in that regard. I don't collect Parla, so please don't confuse me as someone trying to defend any position here but my honest opinion is that this composition would have sold with that estimate. However, speculating or drawing any conclusions as to why it was withdrawn doesn't seem fair to the seller or the collectors from my vantage point. I see it as a non event personally.
>>>And about the split up of the diptych, whatever, it's not a historic masterpiece, it's just a work by a minor contemporary artist.<<<
There are plenty of artists and foundations that have no problem with splitting up multiple canvas works and there are plenty that do. IMO, there certainly is no rule of standard in that regard. I don't collect Parla, so please don't confuse me as someone trying to defend any position here but my honest opinion is that this composition would have sold with that estimate. However, speculating or drawing any conclusions as to why it was withdrawn doesn't seem fair to the seller or the collectors from my vantage point. I see it as a non event personally.
|
|
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by bobbymeachamjr on Oct 18, 2009 20:18:46 GMT 1, Imo, most likely scenario was simply that the piece wasn't going to meet the estimates, and that another auction failing to sell would only contribute further to a continuing downward valuation for the artist. His recent auction results would support this: top notch 4x6 ft failed to reach $40Kusd (who knows how far below 40?). The artist had previously priced his 4x6 ft vs 3x4 ft at a pricing scale of 2 to 1. Not sure his cv supports even these revised levels. One thing for sure, it was bsolutely absurd how at one point he was discussed (price wise) in the ballpark of somebody such as Kehinde Wiley.
Imo, most likely scenario was simply that the piece wasn't going to meet the estimates, and that another auction failing to sell would only contribute further to a continuing downward valuation for the artist. His recent auction results would support this: top notch 4x6 ft failed to reach $40Kusd (who knows how far below 40?). The artist had previously priced his 4x6 ft vs 3x4 ft at a pricing scale of 2 to 1. Not sure his cv supports even these revised levels. One thing for sure, it was bsolutely absurd how at one point he was discussed (price wise) in the ballpark of somebody such as Kehinde Wiley.
|
|
Cocteau 101
Junior Member
🗨️ 3,508
👍🏻 1,227
January 2007
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by Cocteau 101 on Oct 18, 2009 20:32:37 GMT 1, As a result of this debacle if anyone wants to sell that Hackney Canal piece cheap let me know.
What the fuck is PART of a diptych doing for sale. Additionally piss poor management of previously sold pieces but as everyone knows I'm a big Parla fan and supporter but some of the things over the last couple of months have dismayed me. I still rate his work very highly but even I'm getting the feeling that supporters have been manipulated a little bit by some of these shenanigins. Hopefully his credibility remains intact and more careful placement is achieved going forward.
As a result of this debacle if anyone wants to sell that Hackney Canal piece cheap let me know.
What the fuck is PART of a diptych doing for sale. Additionally piss poor management of previously sold pieces but as everyone knows I'm a big Parla fan and supporter but some of the things over the last couple of months have dismayed me. I still rate his work very highly but even I'm getting the feeling that supporters have been manipulated a little bit by some of these shenanigins. Hopefully his credibility remains intact and more careful placement is achieved going forward.
|
|
Harveyn
Full Member
🗨️ 7,743
👍🏻 4,899
July 2007
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by Harveyn on Oct 18, 2009 20:46:48 GMT 1, Joe if you ever get too dismayed I will take that beauty off your hands.
Joe if you ever get too dismayed I will take that beauty off your hands.
|
|
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by bobbymeachamjr on Oct 18, 2009 20:54:03 GMT 1, Well said Cocteau. I think the draw of quick/easy money have led many scrambling to make moves that can be considered dubious. It became a sort of hustling. From Laz bidding up Faile works at auction, to galleries (artist representation?) believing they can "print" money, all too easy for some...
Well said Cocteau. I think the draw of quick/easy money have led many scrambling to make moves that can be considered dubious. It became a sort of hustling. From Laz bidding up Faile works at auction, to galleries (artist representation?) believing they can "print" money, all too easy for some...
|
|
|
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by snausages on Oct 18, 2009 21:39:40 GMT 1, I don't collect Parla, so please don't confuse me as someone trying to defend any position here but my honest opinion is that this composition would have sold with that estimate Don't see it as a big issue either, just some banter on the internet...
But why do you think it would meet the estimate? I doubt it based on recent results for Parla as bobby pointed out and because as I mentioned realized prices on saturday for many artists with much better pedigrees than Parla were lackluster and sometimes less than his estimate even for larger works. Why would someone pay more for Parla?
I don't collect Parla, so please don't confuse me as someone trying to defend any position here but my honest opinion is that this composition would have sold with that estimate Don't see it as a big issue either, just some banter on the internet... But why do you think it would meet the estimate? I doubt it based on recent results for Parla as bobby pointed out and because as I mentioned realized prices on saturday for many artists with much better pedigrees than Parla were lackluster and sometimes less than his estimate even for larger works. Why would someone pay more for Parla?
|
|
RBK
Junior Member
🗨️ 2,925
👍🏻 104
September 2006
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by RBK on Oct 18, 2009 21:45:37 GMT 1, Joe if you ever get too dismayed I will take that beauty off your hands.
Get in line Harveyn
Joe if you ever get too dismayed I will take that beauty off your hands. Get in line Harveyn
|
|
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by rosstierney on Oct 27, 2009 12:47:36 GMT 1, "Between 2005 and 2007 I started a new series of paintings titled, Memory Documents. In these works I combined several styles of painting.
One of the paintings that came out of this series was to focus on an abstract story evoked through the line of my calligraphic style; the painting is titled: Writer's Line, Painters' History, and is a diptych work in which the painterly gestures and its title links both pieces as one through my history and its thematic-philosophical intent.
The first part of the painting ⎯ "Writer's Line" ⎯ refers to the lineage of calligraphy from which I have roots in. The art and culture that has been labeled "Graffiti art" by the media is known from within the culture as Writing. Artist Phase 2, one of its earliest innovators referred to the art as "Style Writing or Aerosol Art," and was quoted saying that, "To call what we do graffiti is to call a comet a meteorite."
Practitioners of this art, like myself, call each other Writers; therefore, the first part of the title to my painting, "Writer's Line," represents the culture at large and explains the significance of how the first part of the title works together with the second part of the title, "Painters' History" and its connection to art history.
I was compelled to write about this painting and its meaning as recently my studio has received many e-mails asking about the artwork because the second part of the diptych, "Painters' History" turned up without notice at one of the world's most prestigious auction houses. After the auction house received notice from my galleries, it recognized the truth about the missing part and removed the half of the diptych from the recent contemporary art sales."
Writer's Line, Painters' History ( diptych ) each panel 3 x 3 feet ( 3 x 6 feet ) © 2009, José Parlá, All Rights Reserved. Artist Rights Society.
"Between 2005 and 2007 I started a new series of paintings titled, Memory Documents. In these works I combined several styles of painting. One of the paintings that came out of this series was to focus on an abstract story evoked through the line of my calligraphic style; the painting is titled: Writer's Line, Painters' History, and is a diptych work in which the painterly gestures and its title links both pieces as one through my history and its thematic-philosophical intent. The first part of the painting ⎯ "Writer's Line" ⎯ refers to the lineage of calligraphy from which I have roots in. The art and culture that has been labeled "Graffiti art" by the media is known from within the culture as Writing. Artist Phase 2, one of its earliest innovators referred to the art as "Style Writing or Aerosol Art," and was quoted saying that, "To call what we do graffiti is to call a comet a meteorite." Practitioners of this art, like myself, call each other Writers; therefore, the first part of the title to my painting, "Writer's Line," represents the culture at large and explains the significance of how the first part of the title works together with the second part of the title, "Painters' History" and its connection to art history. I was compelled to write about this painting and its meaning as recently my studio has received many e-mails asking about the artwork because the second part of the diptych, "Painters' History" turned up without notice at one of the world's most prestigious auction houses. After the auction house received notice from my galleries, it recognized the truth about the missing part and removed the half of the diptych from the recent contemporary art sales." Writer's Line, Painters' History ( diptych ) each panel 3 x 3 feet ( 3 x 6 feet ) © 2009, José Parlá, All Rights Reserved. Artist Rights Society.
|
|
lee3
New Member
🗨️ 832
👍🏻 1,290
November 2009
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by lee3 on Oct 27, 2009 17:23:46 GMT 1, Interesting read Ross, thanks. I thought that may in fact be the reason it was withdrawn- ie. Parla's team stating that it was a dyptich and would not sanction the sale of either one individually. Someone's got some explaining to do with a bit of egg on their face.
Interesting read Ross, thanks. I thought that may in fact be the reason it was withdrawn- ie. Parla's team stating that it was a dyptich and would not sanction the sale of either one individually. Someone's got some explaining to do with a bit of egg on their face.
|
|
Francis
Junior Member
🗨️ 2,571
👍🏻 137
September 2007
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by Francis on Oct 27, 2009 20:50:53 GMT 1, this, as well as numerous recent dubiousness, doesn't instill a lot of confidence in the artist or his management
this, as well as numerous recent dubiousness, doesn't instill a lot of confidence in the artist or his management
|
|
jB
Junior Member
🗨️ 4,681
👍🏻 997
June 2007
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by jB on Oct 27, 2009 21:26:51 GMT 1, this, as well as numerous recent dubiousness, doesn't instill a lot of confidence in the artist or his management
You kidding? - I think this was handled very well. If the piece was designed as a diptych, then the two would obviously need to be shown together. Where is the loss of confidence in the artist or management?
this, as well as numerous recent dubiousness, doesn't instill a lot of confidence in the artist or his management You kidding? - I think this was handled very well. If the piece was designed as a diptych, then the two would obviously need to be shown together. Where is the loss of confidence in the artist or management?
|
|
Francis
Junior Member
🗨️ 2,571
👍🏻 137
September 2007
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by Francis on Oct 27, 2009 21:55:51 GMT 1, this, as well as numerous recent dubiousness, doesn't instill a lot of confidence in the artist or his management You kidding? - I think this was handled very well. If the piece was designed as a diptych, then the two would obviously need to be shown together. Where is the loss of confidence in the artist or management?
hey man, i'm tired of you following me everywhere mocking me and undermining my credibility by asking if i am joking. have a little respect for others.
the piece was put into the auction most likely by the gallery that exhibited the work. there's a small chance that it was put into auction by the person that purchased the work. in any case, whoever had the work decided they wanted to put half of a diptych into an auction. either those who represented the artist put it in there or someone they decided to sell the work did...not good either way.
As demonstrated by the super rapidly escalating gallery prices, they that simply want the work to go to those willing to pay the most money and now those buyers are making an escape because the work is quickly devaluing faster than they can take delivery of the pieces. parla has proven to be another quick buck gimmick of the month.
this, as well as numerous recent dubiousness, doesn't instill a lot of confidence in the artist or his management You kidding? - I think this was handled very well. If the piece was designed as a diptych, then the two would obviously need to be shown together. Where is the loss of confidence in the artist or management? hey man, i'm tired of you following me everywhere mocking me and undermining my credibility by asking if i am joking. have a little respect for others. the piece was put into the auction most likely by the gallery that exhibited the work. there's a small chance that it was put into auction by the person that purchased the work. in any case, whoever had the work decided they wanted to put half of a diptych into an auction. either those who represented the artist put it in there or someone they decided to sell the work did...not good either way. As demonstrated by the super rapidly escalating gallery prices, they that simply want the work to go to those willing to pay the most money and now those buyers are making an escape because the work is quickly devaluing faster than they can take delivery of the pieces. parla has proven to be another quick buck gimmick of the month.
|
|
jB
Junior Member
🗨️ 4,681
👍🏻 997
June 2007
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by jB on Oct 27, 2009 22:16:35 GMT 1, Francis you have PM
Francis you have PM
|
|
|
oneeye
New Member
🗨️ 900
👍🏻 83
July 2007
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by oneeye on Oct 27, 2009 22:36:13 GMT 1, I was told that it was that shady gallery from Italy who was responsible for this mishap. Jose stepped in and handled the situation swiftly. I don't think you'll be seeing them doing any Parla shows in the near future.
I was told that it was that shady gallery from Italy who was responsible for this mishap. Jose stepped in and handled the situation swiftly. I don't think you'll be seeing them doing any Parla shows in the near future.
|
|
|
Best place to sell a Parla, by snausages on Oct 27, 2009 22:55:57 GMT 1, >I don't think you'll be seeing them doing any Parla shows in the near future. I'm sure the gallery realized that when they consigned it.
So does this all mean the gallery already sold half the painting to some chump and tried to auction off the rest?
>I don't think you'll be seeing them doing any Parla shows in the near future. I'm sure the gallery realized that when they consigned it.
So does this all mean the gallery already sold half the painting to some chump and tried to auction off the rest?
|
|