matbat
New Member
Posts โข 521
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December 2006
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by matbat on Oct 31, 2007 4:35:11 GMT 1, how do you view the link. Ive bought from BLK MKT before and enquired regarding ian F originals but i dont have an email from them.
how do you view the link. Ive bought from BLK MKT before and enquired regarding ian F originals but i dont have an email from them.
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stereoface
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Posts โข 122
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July 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by stereoface on Oct 31, 2007 4:41:11 GMT 1, Wow these are great. I have never seen Ian Francis' work before. How do you get on the list for the next time?
Wow these are great. I have never seen Ian Francis' work before. How do you get on the list for the next time?
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fedjarojnik
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Posts โข 31
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August 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by fedjarojnik on Oct 31, 2007 8:57:52 GMT 1, i can only speak for myself, but i missed out on the first run, and got in touch to see if any originals are still available and/or if any prints are available or could be bought, if they are returned, not paid for etc. this nagging from my side consisted of a number of emails that got me on the list.
this may also be the reason why there were popping back up:
As this is a small edition of only 50 each there is a limit of one (each) per print per person (meaning you can order all 4, but not more than one of each) to allow for as many people as possible to be able to own one.
i can only speak for myself, but i missed out on the first run, and got in touch to see if any originals are still available and/or if any prints are available or could be bought, if they are returned, not paid for etc. this nagging from my side consisted of a number of emails that got me on the list.
this may also be the reason why there were popping back up:
As this is a small edition of only 50 each there is a limit of one (each) per print per person (meaning you can order all 4, but not more than one of each) to allow for as many people as possible to be able to own one.
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by sausageboonwee on Oct 31, 2007 9:07:19 GMT 1, Despite being sent the email, despite being on the waiting list (*with an email confirming so) I received an email saying they didn't know how I'd got the login details (admin error on their part). They have refunded me and it's now the middle of the night in California so have to wait hours to get a response. I must say I am really dissappointed. Does anyone have any experience of Black Market in these situations? I'm hoping they accept their mistake and honour my order. Problem is they are probably all gone now.
Despite being sent the email, despite being on the waiting list (*with an email confirming so) I received an email saying they didn't know how I'd got the login details (admin error on their part). They have refunded me and it's now the middle of the night in California so have to wait hours to get a response. I must say I am really dissappointed. Does anyone have any experience of Black Market in these situations? I'm hoping they accept their mistake and honour my order. Problem is they are probably all gone now.
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by slowmo on Oct 31, 2007 9:52:44 GMT 1, Its an odd one this, very strange, it does not encourage new people to purchase prints? How are you supposed to expand an artists fanbase and indeed reach to new people if new people are not allowed to buy?
The cynic in me feels that they want to create a secondary market on ebay to increase the perceived value, the optimist says that this is a one off as many people tried and failed to get the last set of prints and they are trying to satisfy the original demand.
Its an odd one this, very strange, it does not encourage new people to purchase prints? How are you supposed to expand an artists fanbase and indeed reach to new people if new people are not allowed to buy?
The cynic in me feels that they want to create a secondary market on ebay to increase the perceived value, the optimist says that this is a one off as many people tried and failed to get the last set of prints and they are trying to satisfy the original demand.
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by dave313perry on Oct 31, 2007 9:58:36 GMT 1, I disagree with it to be honest - and puts POW and their ethics up in my estimates
its all abit gentlemans club like for me! Grrrrrr!
I disagree with it to be honest - and puts POW and their ethics up in my estimates
its all abit gentlemans club like for me! Grrrrrr!
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Cocteau 101
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,503
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January 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by Cocteau 101 on Oct 31, 2007 10:09:58 GMT 1, I specifically emailed and spoke to Blk Mkt in August and still didn't get the email.
I specifically emailed and spoke to Blk Mkt in August and still didn't get the email.
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Cocteau 101
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,503
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January 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by Cocteau 101 on Oct 31, 2007 10:16:35 GMT 1, its like that secret gallery thing really, that was mentioned the other day. I kinda like the idea to some degree
Yeh but only if it is managed properly.
its like that secret gallery thing really, that was mentioned the other day. I kinda like the idea to some degree Yeh but only if it is managed properly.
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by dave313perry on Oct 31, 2007 10:17:32 GMT 1, I just thinbk its abit eliteist - roumers that its only for people who are on the list for an original, or who have enquired???
seems abit strange and wont go down well with the masses
I just thinbk its abit eliteist - roumers that its only for people who are on the list for an original, or who have enquired???
seems abit strange and wont go down well with the masses
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fedjarojnik
New Member
Posts โข 31
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August 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by fedjarojnik on Oct 31, 2007 10:17:38 GMT 1, i disagree to a point. there are so many flippers and people speculating on prints, i think its nice that those who have expressed a genuine interest to get his work get to be notified first as there are only 200 prints being released.
i disagree to a point. there are so many flippers and people speculating on prints, i think its nice that those who have expressed a genuine interest to get his work get to be notified first as there are only 200 prints being released.
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pezlow
Junior Member
Posts โข 5,388
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January 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by pezlow on Oct 31, 2007 10:21:19 GMT 1, I think this scene is in danger of becoming as elitist as the contemporary art market we all deride. These secret sales only encourage the participation of an in crowd which is the detriment of the majority. It may be a reaction against flippers but it is not, in my opinion, the right reaction.
The only way to sell prints democratically is to do as POW did with trolleys by releasing them on the site and sending an email to everyone on their mailing list. Nobody gets a secret "heads up" and nobody is at an advantage over others.
This is the fairest way and although it does mean that some collectors (including myself) will miss out it is the only way of doing it to ensure the long term viability of this scene.
In saying all this I appreciate that by advocating this I will personally miss out and I am more often than not privy to the secret sales etc. But that does not make it right.
I think this scene is in danger of becoming as elitist as the contemporary art market we all deride. These secret sales only encourage the participation of an in crowd which is the detriment of the majority. It may be a reaction against flippers but it is not, in my opinion, the right reaction.
The only way to sell prints democratically is to do as POW did with trolleys by releasing them on the site and sending an email to everyone on their mailing list. Nobody gets a secret "heads up" and nobody is at an advantage over others.
This is the fairest way and although it does mean that some collectors (including myself) will miss out it is the only way of doing it to ensure the long term viability of this scene.
In saying all this I appreciate that by advocating this I will personally miss out and I am more often than not privy to the secret sales etc. But that does not make it right.
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Cocteau 101
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,503
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January 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by Cocteau 101 on Oct 31, 2007 10:21:34 GMT 1, Yeh if that's the case why didn't I get an email. Not specifically saying just me but it shows that this can be handled incorrectly. I have three of the UK RP prints and have just bought a set of the first Blk Mkt prints on the secondary market. No one can say that I have not shown a genuine interest or love of IF's work. Flippers can easliy express an interest, this may be playing into there hands even more.
Yeh if that's the case why didn't I get an email. Not specifically saying just me but it shows that this can be handled incorrectly. I have three of the UK RP prints and have just bought a set of the first Blk Mkt prints on the secondary market. No one can say that I have not shown a genuine interest or love of IF's work. Flippers can easliy express an interest, this may be playing into there hands even more.
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by dave313perry on Oct 31, 2007 10:24:11 GMT 1, I think this scene is in danger of becoming as elitist as the contemporary art market we all deride. These secret sales only encourage the participation of an in crowd which is the detriment of the majority. It may be a reaction against flippers but it is not, in my opinion, the right reaction. The only way to sell prints democratically is to do as POW did with trolleys by releasing them on the site and sending an email to everyone on their mailing list. Nobody gets a secret "heads up" and nobody is at an advantage over others. This is the fairest way and although it does mean that some collectors (including myself) will miss out it is the only way of doing it to ensure the long term viability of this scene. In saying all this I appreciate that by advocating this I will personally miss out and I am more often than not privy to the secret sales etc. But that does not make it right.
absolutley spot on my friend!! im quite prepared to miss out on the majoirity of prints if they are available to the majority and not an elite minority.
The idea of prints afterall is to make a cheaper alternative to the original?
I think this scene is in danger of becoming as elitist as the contemporary art market we all deride. These secret sales only encourage the participation of an in crowd which is the detriment of the majority. It may be a reaction against flippers but it is not, in my opinion, the right reaction. The only way to sell prints democratically is to do as POW did with trolleys by releasing them on the site and sending an email to everyone on their mailing list. Nobody gets a secret "heads up" and nobody is at an advantage over others. This is the fairest way and although it does mean that some collectors (including myself) will miss out it is the only way of doing it to ensure the long term viability of this scene. In saying all this I appreciate that by advocating this I will personally miss out and I am more often than not privy to the secret sales etc. But that does not make it right. absolutley spot on my friend!! im quite prepared to miss out on the majoirity of prints if they are available to the majority and not an elite minority. The idea of prints afterall is to make a cheaper alternative to the original?
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savilerogue
New Member
Posts โข 326
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August 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by savilerogue on Oct 31, 2007 10:37:31 GMT 1, This is a bizarre method.
I think all that they have acheived ultimately is firstly the alienation of a few genuine buyers; and secondly drawing attention to to selling only to 'insiders' - so any 'flippers' will just sign up to the mailing list straight away in time for the next release....
This is a bizarre method.
I think all that they have acheived ultimately is firstly the alienation of a few genuine buyers; and secondly drawing attention to to selling only to 'insiders' - so any 'flippers' will just sign up to the mailing list straight away in time for the next release....
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neutral
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Posts โข 744
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February 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by neutral on Oct 31, 2007 10:43:05 GMT 1, Talking about flippers, "again", most people are buying and are reselling down the line anyway so who cares. Only few will not, see the past month release Micallef GIWTBB as an example... or maybe swap is conveniently not "flipping"... POW are not a gallery but a publishing house. If BLKM have done that they have their reasons of doing so, maybe to satisfy people that could not get an original at the last show and were further down the line ? Would that not be a nice customer care then ? If you are fortunate to be on that list great if not still great on my end, I wont lose sleep over it. Rant over.
Talking about flippers, "again", most people are buying and are reselling down the line anyway so who cares. Only few will not, see the past month release Micallef GIWTBB as an example... or maybe swap is conveniently not "flipping"... POW are not a gallery but a publishing house. If BLKM have done that they have their reasons of doing so, maybe to satisfy people that could not get an original at the last show and were further down the line ? Would that not be a nice customer care then ? If you are fortunate to be on that list great if not still great on my end, I wont lose sleep over it. Rant over.
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
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January 1970
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by Deleted on Oct 31, 2007 10:52:45 GMT 1, there is no simple solution to this releasing of prints. i was lucky enough to get a set of these prints. IMO the fairest way to do it would be to send an email to eveyone who has previously bought prints from you in the past(any artist) and give them an hour or two, then send an email to everyone else on the mailing list. I can only imagine how frustrating it must be to miss out prints when you are already signed up for the general mailing list. I signed up with the print house that released the last Choe print and heard nothing. the first i knew that it had been released was when people were saying on here "wow that was quick"without even mentioing the name of the artist. it does seem at times like an exclusive club and thats very nice when "your in", but when your not it hurts.
there is no simple solution to this releasing of prints. i was lucky enough to get a set of these prints. IMO the fairest way to do it would be to send an email to eveyone who has previously bought prints from you in the past(any artist) and give them an hour or two, then send an email to everyone else on the mailing list. I can only imagine how frustrating it must be to miss out prints when you are already signed up for the general mailing list. I signed up with the print house that released the last Choe print and heard nothing. the first i knew that it had been released was when people were saying on here "wow that was quick"without even mentioing the name of the artist. it does seem at times like an exclusive club and thats very nice when "your in", but when your not it hurts.
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njr911
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,377
Likes โข 414
April 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by njr911 on Oct 31, 2007 10:55:24 GMT 1, I got the mail and still missed the print and I REALLY wanted an Aya since the show
If anyone has one and has overspent on Banksy PM me PLEASE!!!
Choes and Mic GIWTBB available for trade if that helps
I got the mail and still missed the print and I REALLY wanted an Aya since the show If anyone has one and has overspent on Banksy PM me PLEASE!!! Choes and Mic GIWTBB available for trade if that helps
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shavemysoul
New Member
Posts โข 537
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July 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by shavemysoul on Oct 31, 2007 10:58:13 GMT 1, Talking about flippers, "again", most people are buying and are reselling down the line anyway so who cares. Only few will not, see the past month release Micallef GIWTBB as an example... or maybe swap is conveniently not "flipping"... POW are not a gallery but a publishing house. If BLKM have done that they have their reasons of doing so, maybe to satisfy people that could not get an original at the last show and were further down the line ? Would that not be a nice customer care then ? If you are fortunate to be on that list great if not still great on my end, I wont lose sleep over it. Rant over.
I second that. I think BMG's reasons were wholly good intentions... they were offering prints to people who they couldn't provide originals for at the last show. It wasn't intended to alienate others who weren't on the list, but because Ian's becoming so popular, there'll always be upset fans... nature of the beast of this industry unfortunately.
Talking about flippers, "again", most people are buying and are reselling down the line anyway so who cares. Only few will not, see the past month release Micallef GIWTBB as an example... or maybe swap is conveniently not "flipping"... POW are not a gallery but a publishing house. If BLKM have done that they have their reasons of doing so, maybe to satisfy people that could not get an original at the last show and were further down the line ? Would that not be a nice customer care then ? If you are fortunate to be on that list great if not still great on my end, I wont lose sleep over it. Rant over. I second that. I think BMG's reasons were wholly good intentions... they were offering prints to people who they couldn't provide originals for at the last show. It wasn't intended to alienate others who weren't on the list, but because Ian's becoming so popular, there'll always be upset fans... nature of the beast of this industry unfortunately.
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Gentle Mental
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,826
Likes โข 863
May 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by Gentle Mental on Oct 31, 2007 11:11:47 GMT 1, I believe it's for the fans. Pure and simple.
.... not elitists (elites buy originals)... not professional scalping flippers with multiple terminals and credit cards and software and teams of tech geeks, that refresh every bladdy pixel away from my add to basket butttttonnnn.... arrrrggggggggg...
I believe it's for the fans. Pure and simple.
.... not elitists (elites buy originals)... not professional scalping flippers with multiple terminals and credit cards and software and teams of tech geeks, that refresh every bladdy pixel away from my add to basket butttttonnnn.... arrrrggggggggg...
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by carlito on Oct 31, 2007 11:11:49 GMT 1, guys if you were on the list and missed out i wouldn't give up hope I think a few went to ppl not on the list and I'm pretty sure they'll get refunded and will made availabe again - possibly worth contacting BMG to confirm?
guys if you were on the list and missed out i wouldn't give up hope I think a few went to ppl not on the list and I'm pretty sure they'll get refunded and will made availabe again - possibly worth contacting BMG to confirm?
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artyfarty
New Member
Posts โข 121
Likes โข 1
March 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by artyfarty on Oct 31, 2007 11:25:03 GMT 1, It's simple. Audrey Kawasaki is releasing a print the Saturdau for a period of an hour. Whoever wants one will buy one in that period and the number of buyers will then determine the edition number. It's a great idea. Otherwise, just do open editions. The vast majority of flipping will end immediately and we can put the art on the walls and stop banging on about fucking dollars and pounds.
It's simple. Audrey Kawasaki is releasing a print the Saturdau for a period of an hour. Whoever wants one will buy one in that period and the number of buyers will then determine the edition number. It's a great idea. Otherwise, just do open editions. The vast majority of flipping will end immediately and we can put the art on the walls and stop banging on about fucking dollars and pounds.
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spencerlee
New Member
Posts โข 853
Likes โข 27
May 2006
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by spencerlee on Oct 31, 2007 11:32:47 GMT 1, Lovely prints. Well done to anyone who got one.
Lovely prints. Well done to anyone who got one.
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jipsy
New Member
Posts โข 326
Likes โข 35
July 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by jipsy on Oct 31, 2007 11:41:19 GMT 1, Couldn't agree more, they really are quite stunning. I missed on the previous release as well. Obviously not meant to be.
Well done to those that did get them.
Couldn't agree more, they really are quite stunning. I missed on the previous release as well. Obviously not meant to be.
Well done to those that did get them.
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jam
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,629
Likes โข 31
November 2006
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by jam on Oct 31, 2007 12:20:13 GMT 1, I think these are the best ones... I know when I was looking at the original canvases I thought they were the stars of the show, looks like others felt the same way as they were made into prints!
Two People Lose Track of Where They Are - 33 x 23 inches
Two People Spend the Day in the Snow - 31.5 x 23 inches
I think these are the best ones... I know when I was looking at the original canvases I thought they were the stars of the show, looks like others felt the same way as they were made into prints! Two People Lose Track of Where They Are - 33 x 23 inches Two People Spend the Day in the Snow - 31.5 x 23 inches
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by absyrd on Oct 31, 2007 13:36:13 GMT 1, Its an odd one this, very strange, it does not encourage new people to purchase prints? How are you supposed to expand an artists fanbase and indeed reach to new people if new people are not allowed to buy? The cynic in me feels that they want to create a secondary market on ebay to increase the perceived value, the optimist says that this is a one off as many people tried and failed to get the last set of prints and they are trying to satisfy the original demand.
They are selling to people who originally had interest and didn't get anything from the show. I see that as very anti-flipper.
Its an odd one this, very strange, it does not encourage new people to purchase prints? How are you supposed to expand an artists fanbase and indeed reach to new people if new people are not allowed to buy? The cynic in me feels that they want to create a secondary market on ebay to increase the perceived value, the optimist says that this is a one off as many people tried and failed to get the last set of prints and they are trying to satisfy the original demand. They are selling to people who originally had interest and didn't get anything from the show. I see that as very anti-flipper.
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dotdot
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,651
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December 2006
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by dotdot on Oct 31, 2007 13:48:49 GMT 1, Its an odd one this, very strange, it does not encourage new people to purchase prints? How are you supposed to expand an artists fanbase and indeed reach to new people if new people are not allowed to buy? The cynic in me feels that they want to create a secondary market on ebay to increase the perceived value, the optimist says that this is a one off as many people tried and failed to get the last set of prints and they are trying to satisfy the original demand. They are selling to people who originally had interest and didn't get anything from the show. I see that as very anti-flipper.
What you see and what others see is like everything - open to interpretaion.
What they actually did was to sell prints to only a certain select collection of people.
They could do it - they did do it - and am sure they'll do it again.
The people who bought - will they sell and make a mockery of BLKMKT ? - well time will tell.
As for those who missed out - well you can't ask them the same question can you ... ?
Red Propeller didn't, if my memory serves me right, behave in the same manner - perhaps they did this to increase the guys fanbase.
..
Its an odd one this, very strange, it does not encourage new people to purchase prints? How are you supposed to expand an artists fanbase and indeed reach to new people if new people are not allowed to buy? The cynic in me feels that they want to create a secondary market on ebay to increase the perceived value, the optimist says that this is a one off as many people tried and failed to get the last set of prints and they are trying to satisfy the original demand. They are selling to people who originally had interest and didn't get anything from the show. I see that as very anti-flipper. What you see and what others see is like everything - open to interpretaion. What they actually did was to sell prints to only a certain select collection of people. They could do it - they did do it - and am sure they'll do it again. The people who bought - will they sell and make a mockery of BLKMKT ? - well time will tell. As for those who missed out - well you can't ask them the same question can you ... ? Red Propeller didn't, if my memory serves me right, behave in the same manner - perhaps they did this to increase the guys fanbase. ..
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fedjarojnik
New Member
Posts โข 31
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August 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by fedjarojnik on Oct 31, 2007 13:56:04 GMT 1, look, at the end of the day i am sure jana and blackmarket and ian if he is involved are best able to judge who got on the list and i also think their intention was honourable. until i received the email i didnt know i was on the list! so to be absolutely clear as far as i am aware there is nowhere where you just sign up to be on the waiting list. I expressed an interest to purchase from blackmarket and in a business sense i was a potential future customer/prospect who they contacted first when the new limited prints became available knowing the demand will far outstrip the demand. trying to stay as objective as possible i dont think there is anything wrong with that at all - its just taking care of of potential serious customers who had got in touch. i dont know how better they could have handled that in terms of selection and you cannot seriously expect them to consider what you did or bought at red propeller...
especially looking at last micallef release where the number of micallef ebay auctions went from about 20 to over 150 overnight on the day the prints went on sale at LAZ!
look, at the end of the day i am sure jana and blackmarket and ian if he is involved are best able to judge who got on the list and i also think their intention was honourable. until i received the email i didnt know i was on the list! so to be absolutely clear as far as i am aware there is nowhere where you just sign up to be on the waiting list. I expressed an interest to purchase from blackmarket and in a business sense i was a potential future customer/prospect who they contacted first when the new limited prints became available knowing the demand will far outstrip the demand. trying to stay as objective as possible i dont think there is anything wrong with that at all - its just taking care of of potential serious customers who had got in touch. i dont know how better they could have handled that in terms of selection and you cannot seriously expect them to consider what you did or bought at red propeller...
especially looking at last micallef release where the number of micallef ebay auctions went from about 20 to over 150 overnight on the day the prints went on sale at LAZ!
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reatecvol4
New Member
Posts โข 103
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May 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by reatecvol4 on Oct 31, 2007 14:28:49 GMT 1, i also think their intention was honourable
Yeah! I agree.
Worthless explanation Aya Ueto is a very cute Japanese actress. Maria Ozawa is a Japanes sexy porn star.
i also think their intention was honourable
Yeah! I agree.
Worthless explanation Aya Ueto is a very cute Japanese actress. Maria Ozawa is a Japanes sexy porn star.
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stereoface
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Posts โข 122
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July 2007
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by stereoface on Oct 31, 2007 14:37:31 GMT 1, Just for frame of reference. how much were these prints?
Just for frame of reference. how much were these prints?
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4 NEW IAN FRANCIS PRINTS ON BLK MARKET NOW, by absyrd on Oct 31, 2007 14:38:50 GMT 1, $700 + 50-180 for shipping depending on your location.
$700 + 50-180 for shipping depending on your location.
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