Matt
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,357
๐๐ป 3,449
September 2014
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by Matt on Jul 11, 2019 17:45:44 GMT 1, When you buy a piece from auction you are factoring in the auction fees as part of what you have to pay for that piece of art. That is the price of the art. When you go to say Hang Up gallery and buy a Banksy print that they are selling on consignment you don't separate their consignment fee and say the true value of the print is what the seller is getting back - the price of that piece of art is the total of what you are prepared to pay. If that is ยฃ50k then that is the value of that piece of art NOT the ยฃ40k or whatever the seller receives.
Point in case
Honestly Winter , If I am selling you a print and tell you "Hang Up sold one for 50k so that is the indisputable value", what will you invariably do ?
You will no doubt remind me that Hang Up's price does not fully apply to our peer to peer transaction and offer me something a bit lower.
You might even remind me that the last same print sold for 43K on here, and we will try to agree within those prices.
The "market value of the print" is NOT what one person paid at one auction or one gallery. One transaction is merely an indication / approximation / guideline / comparable.
End of. Defending the opposite makes no rational sense...and we have all bought / sold enough to know it.
I'll put these irrational points of view on value down to too much love of the art or something like that 
When you buy a piece from auction you are factoring in the auction fees as part of what you have to pay for that piece of art. That is the price of the art. When you go to say Hang Up gallery and buy a Banksy print that they are selling on consignment you don't separate their consignment fee and say the true value of the print is what the seller is getting back - the price of that piece of art is the total of what you are prepared to pay. If that is ยฃ50k then that is the value of that piece of art NOT the ยฃ40k or whatever the seller receives. Point in case Honestly Winter , If I am selling you a print and tell you "Hang Up sold one for 50k so that is the indisputable value", what will you invariably do ? You will no doubt remind me that Hang Up's price does not fully apply to our peer to peer transaction and offer me something a bit lower. You might even remind me that the last same print sold for 43K on here, and we will try to agree within those prices. The "market value of the print" is NOT what one person paid at one auction or one gallery. One transaction is merely an indication / approximation / guideline / comparable. End of. Defending the opposite makes no rational sense...and we have all bought / sold enough to know it. I'll put these irrational points of view on value down to too much love of the art or something like that |
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Matt
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,357
๐๐ป 3,449
September 2014
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by Matt on Jul 11, 2019 17:46:23 GMT 1, sorry double post
sorry double post
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nighthawk
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,338
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February 2013
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by nighthawk on Jul 11, 2019 17:58:50 GMT 1, you have to obviously factor in auction fees to the โsoldโ price, as the buyer has to pay them!
Cost on this one from source was $15K (not $12K).
you have to obviously factor in auction fees to the โsoldโ price, as the buyer has to pay them!
Cost on this one from source was $15K (not $12K).
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Winter
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 7,155
๐๐ป 4,461
March 2007
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by Winter on Jul 11, 2019 18:01:31 GMT 1, This bit I am in agreement with - "The "market value of the print" is NOT what one person paid at one auction or one gallery. One transaction is merely an indication / approximation / guideline / comparable."
All I'm saying is that the an actual sale price (inc fees) is what is documented not what the seller receives.
What I choose to do with the information that is recorded and documented is up to me, it IS only a guide and I'll make up my own decision on what I think something is worth with all the information that is out there. I'm also aware that the art world is full of manipulation and that there are people who will pay stupid money for things.
I would like to clarify that Hang Up were only used as an example and it could have been any gallery!
This bit I am in agreement with - "The "market value of the print" is NOT what one person paid at one auction or one gallery. One transaction is merely an indication / approximation / guideline / comparable."
All I'm saying is that the an actual sale price (inc fees) is what is documented not what the seller receives.
What I choose to do with the information that is recorded and documented is up to me, it IS only a guide and I'll make up my own decision on what I think something is worth with all the information that is out there. I'm also aware that the art world is full of manipulation and that there are people who will pay stupid money for things.
I would like to clarify that Hang Up were only used as an example and it could have been any gallery!
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by campfire headphase on Jul 12, 2019 1:34:00 GMT 1, Where can I get one for 20K?
you canโt. The last person who got one just paid 26-27 at auction.
Where can I get one for 20K? you canโt. The last person who got one just paid 26-27 at auction. |
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by campfire headphase on Jul 12, 2019 1:35:48 GMT 1, When you buy a piece from auction you are factoring in the auction fees as part of what you have to pay for that piece of art. That is the price of the art. When you go to say Hang Up gallery and buy a Banksy print that they are selling on consignment you don't separate their consignment fee and say the true value of the print is what the seller is getting back - the price of that piece of art is the total of what you are prepared to pay. If that is ยฃ50k then that is the value of that piece of art NOT the ยฃ40k or whatever the seller receives.
This.
When you buy a piece from auction you are factoring in the auction fees as part of what you have to pay for that piece of art. That is the price of the art. When you go to say Hang Up gallery and buy a Banksy print that they are selling on consignment you don't separate their consignment fee and say the true value of the print is what the seller is getting back - the price of that piece of art is the total of what you are prepared to pay. If that is ยฃ50k then that is the value of that piece of art NOT the ยฃ40k or whatever the seller receives. This. |
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19818914
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,337
๐๐ป 1,029
October 2018
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by 19818914 on Jul 12, 2019 2:36:09 GMT 1, ๐<โ- This.
๐<โ- This.
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The Observer
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 317
๐๐ป 183
February 2017
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by The Observer on Jul 12, 2019 3:32:05 GMT 1, What would Adam Smith say?
What would Adam Smith say?
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jp
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 431
๐๐ป 503
September 2006
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by jp on Jul 12, 2019 5:03:19 GMT 1, I think the value is what the buyer paid not what the seller received. The sites that have data of auction sales are shown as hammer plus buyers fees - this is the figure that is referenced not the amount someone got for the piece. The initial release price of these was $12k I believe.
Personally, I would like to see the hammer price, buyers fees, and sellers fees listed, in the interest of complete transparency. This is important, since some auction sites don't have sellers fees at all, and in the case of rare or iconic pieces, sellers fees can be reduced or waived entirely.
I completely agree with the sentiment that 1 auction result does not indicate the value of a print. It's just a guide. For me, price is only 1/3 of the equation anyway, the others being condition (and if I trust the condition report), and risk. Risk includes location, reputation of the seller, and logistics (packing, shipping, carrier, insurance etc)
I think the value is what the buyer paid not what the seller received. The sites that have data of auction sales are shown as hammer plus buyers fees - this is the figure that is referenced not the amount someone got for the piece. The initial release price of these was $12k I believe. This is not completely accurate. *SOME* art databases, like artnet, list the final price including buyers fees, while others, like artprice, list the hammer price. Personally, I would like to see the hammer price, buyers fees, and sellers fees listed, in the interest of complete transparency. This is important, since some auction sites don't have sellers fees at all, and in the case of rare or iconic pieces, sellers fees can be reduced or waived entirely. I completely agree with the sentiment that 1 auction result does not indicate the value of a print. It's just a guide. For me, price is only 1/3 of the equation anyway, the others being condition (and if I trust the condition report), and risk. Risk includes location, reputation of the seller, and logistics (packing, shipping, carrier, insurance etc) |
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.dappy
Full Member
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December 2010
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by .dappy on Jul 12, 2019 13:17:33 GMT 1, ... I think a lot of people are getting confused between the cost of something and the value of something ...
... I think a lot of people are getting confused between the cost of something and the value of something ...
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cnrdvln
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,404
๐๐ป 1,489
February 2017
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by cnrdvln on Aug 15, 2019 18:25:07 GMT 1, Some big ticket items here.....
We're heating things up with Summer Editions, a diverse selection of popular prints by the most sought-after artists on the market. This sale features Modern and contemporary works, including pieces by Alex Katz, Yves Klein, Marcel Duchamp, KAWS, Jeff Koons, Bridget Riley, John Baldessari, Yayoi Kusama, and many more. Browse the sale below, and be sure to place your bids now through 28.
www.artnet.com/auctions/summer-editions-0819/
Some big ticket items here..... We're heating things up with Summer Editions, a diverse selection of popular prints by the most sought-after artists on the market. This sale features Modern and contemporary works, including pieces by Alex Katz, Yves Klein, Marcel Duchamp, KAWS, Jeff Koons, Bridget Riley, John Baldessari, Yayoi Kusama, and many more. Browse the sale below, and be sure to place your bids now through 28. www.artnet.com/auctions/summer-editions-0819/ |
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pr.yu
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 496
๐๐ป 633
June 2017
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by pr.yu on Aug 15, 2019 18:39:43 GMT 1, Didn't even take the Cai Guo-Qiang out of the box.
Didn't even take the Cai Guo-Qiang out of the box.
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cnrdvln
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,404
๐๐ป 1,489
February 2017
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by cnrdvln on Aug 15, 2019 18:46:01 GMT 1, big numbers on Kaws... biggest for artnet to date?
big numbers on Kaws... biggest for artnet to date?
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by ticklesmepink on Sept 19, 2019 16:46:20 GMT 1, 
Just thought forum would be interested in this one. Some really good stuff.
Just thought forum would be interested in this one. Some really good stuff. |
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silvermyn
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,612
๐๐ป 781
April 2008
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by silvermyn on Sept 20, 2019 9:05:44 GMT 1, What's the AIP DN marking?
Is the 'I' a slash? Artist Proof - Duplicate Number?
I'd say so althought it isn't clear. I would have thought the COA would clarify the intented mark.
The lettering appears to have been added after the print was numbered, judging by the pencil impressions.
What's the AIP DN marking?
Is the 'I' a slash? Artist Proof - Duplicate Number?
I'd say so althought it isn't clear. I would have thought the COA would clarify the intented mark.
The lettering appears to have been added after the print was numbered, judging by the pencil impressions.
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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irl1
Full Member
๐จ๏ธ 9,274
๐๐ป 9,381
December 2017
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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dueuomo
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 639
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January 2014
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by dueuomo on Apr 9, 2020 18:04:13 GMT 1, Did they pull the CND?
Did they pull the CND?
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Poster Bob
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 5,891
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September 2013
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by Poster Bob on Apr 9, 2020 18:07:03 GMT 1, Why would you say that?
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Unica
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,076
๐๐ป 1,232
November 2013
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by Unica on Apr 9, 2020 20:45:05 GMT 1, Nice Result for the unsigned GWB and the other Banksy pieces. Jonas Woods did well and the KAWS YSKIK.
Nice Result for the unsigned GWB and the other Banksy pieces. Jonas Woods did well and the KAWS YSKIK.
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fusion0001
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 146
๐๐ป 415
November 2019
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by fusion0001 on Apr 9, 2020 21:18:35 GMT 1, Could someone post here results on the Banksy pieces? Thanks!
Could someone post here results on the Banksy pieces? Thanks!
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Deleted
๐จ๏ธ 0
๐๐ป
January 1970
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by Deleted on Apr 9, 2020 21:28:58 GMT 1, Banksy
Love Rat
Winning Bid
24,000 USD
End Date
Apr 9, 2020
Banksy
Girl with Balloon
Winning Bid
90,000 USD
End Date
Apr 9, 2020
Banksy
Choose Your Weapon (Cool Grey)
Winning Bid
42,000 USD
End Date
Apr 9, 2020
Banksy
CND Soldiers
Winning Bid
15,000 USD
End Date
Apr 9, 2020
Have to add 20% comm on top.
Fusion, youโre a legend.
Banksy
Love Rat
Winning Bid
24,000 USD
End Date
Apr 9, 2020
Banksy
Girl with Balloon
Winning Bid
90,000 USD
End Date
Apr 9, 2020
Banksy
Choose Your Weapon (Cool Grey)
Winning Bid
42,000 USD
End Date
Apr 9, 2020
Banksy
CND Soldiers
Winning Bid
15,000 USD
End Date
Apr 9, 2020
Have to add 20% comm on top.
Fusion, youโre a legend.
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by Season of Mist on Apr 10, 2020 7:25:02 GMT 1, Quite a low price for CWY...
Quite a low price for CWY...
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by Season of Mist on Apr 10, 2020 12:42:11 GMT 1, Crisis anomaly, maybe....
Crisis anomaly, maybe....
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by covertshadowops on Apr 10, 2020 13:02:37 GMT 1, Jonas and kaws results please???
Jonas and kaws results please???
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irl1
Full Member
๐จ๏ธ 9,274
๐๐ป 9,381
December 2017
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by irl1 on May 29, 2020 21:02:32 GMT 1, Artnet
Urban Art
Live now through June 11, 2020
Banksy Donuts (Chocolate), 2009
Screenprint in colors on Arches 88 paper
22.05 x 29.92 in. (56 x 76 cm.)
Frame: 32.76 x 40 x 1.97 in. (83.2 x 101.6 x 5 cm.)
Signed and numbered in red crayon; accompanied by a Certificate of Authenticity from Pest Control
Current bid $24,000
KAWS, KAWSBOB (Red), 2011
Estimate, $18,000 to $22,000
Banksy, People Who Enjoy Waving Flags Don't Deserve to Have One, 2003
Spray paint on St. George's flag
51.97 x 37.4 in. (132 x 95 cm.)
Frame: 56.69 x 40.94 x 1.57 in. (144 x 104 x 4 cm.)
Accompanied by a certificate of authenticity from Pest Control
Estimate, $250,000 to $350,000
Banksy, No Ball Games (Grey), 2009
Screenprint in colors on wove paper
Image: 24.29 x 25.43 in. (61.7 x 64.6 cm.)
Sheet: 26.38 x 27.56 in. (67 x 70 cm.)
Frame: 37 x 37.5 x 1.97 in. (93.98 x 95.25 x 5 cm.)
Signed and and numbered in pencil; accompanied by a Certificate of Authenticity from Pest Control.
Current bid, $20,000
KAWS Kate Moss, White Gloves, 2001
Screenprint in colors on Arches 88 paper
17 x 28 in. (43.18 x 71.12 cm.)
Frame: 21.5 x 32.5 x 1.25 in. (54.61 x 82.55 x 3.18 cm.)
Signed, dated and numbered in pencil
Estimate, $30,000 to $50,000
www.artnet.com/auctions/urban-art-0620/?
Artnet Urban Art Live now through June 11, 2020 Banksy Donuts (Chocolate), 2009 Screenprint in colors on Arches 88 paper 22.05 x 29.92 in. (56 x 76 cm.) Frame: 32.76 x 40 x 1.97 in. (83.2 x 101.6 x 5 cm.) Signed and numbered in red crayon; accompanied by a Certificate of Authenticity from Pest Control Current bid $24,000 KAWS, KAWSBOB (Red), 2011 Estimate, $18,000 to $22,000 Banksy, People Who Enjoy Waving Flags Don't Deserve to Have One, 2003 Spray paint on St. George's flag 51.97 x 37.4 in. (132 x 95 cm.) Frame: 56.69 x 40.94 x 1.57 in. (144 x 104 x 4 cm.) Accompanied by a certificate of authenticity from Pest Control Estimate, $250,000 to $350,000 Banksy, No Ball Games (Grey), 2009 Screenprint in colors on wove paper Image: 24.29 x 25.43 in. (61.7 x 64.6 cm.) Sheet: 26.38 x 27.56 in. (67 x 70 cm.) Frame: 37 x 37.5 x 1.97 in. (93.98 x 95.25 x 5 cm.) Signed and and numbered in pencil; accompanied by a Certificate of Authenticity from Pest Control. Current bid, $20,000 KAWS Kate Moss, White Gloves, 2001 Screenprint in colors on Arches 88 paper 17 x 28 in. (43.18 x 71.12 cm.) Frame: 21.5 x 32.5 x 1.25 in. (54.61 x 82.55 x 3.18 cm.) Signed, dated and numbered in pencil Estimate, $30,000 to $50,000 www.artnet.com/auctions/urban-art-0620/? |
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irl1
Full Member
๐จ๏ธ 9,274
๐๐ป 9,381
December 2017
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by irl1 on Jun 10, 2020 9:56:03 GMT 1, Artnet Urban Art Live now through June 11, 2020 Banksy Donuts (Chocolate), 2009 Screenprint in colors on Arches 88 paper 22.05 x 29.92 in. (56 x 76 cm.) Frame: 32.76 x 40 x 1.97 in. (83.2 x 101.6 x 5 cm.) Signed and numbered in red crayon; accompanied by a Certificate of Authenticity from Pest Control Current bid $24,000 KAWS, KAWSBOB (Red), 2011 Estimate, $18,000 to $22,000 Banksy, People Who Enjoy Waving Flags Don't Deserve to Have One, 2003 Spray paint on St. George's flag 51.97 x 37.4 in. (132 x 95 cm.) Frame: 56.69 x 40.94 x 1.57 in. (144 x 104 x 4 cm.) Accompanied by a certificate of authenticity from Pest Control Estimate, $250,000 to $350,000 Banksy, No Ball Games (Grey), 2009 Screenprint in colors on wove paper Image: 24.29 x 25.43 in. (61.7 x 64.6 cm.) Sheet: 26.38 x 27.56 in. (67 x 70 cm.) Frame: 37 x 37.5 x 1.97 in. (93.98 x 95.25 x 5 cm.) Signed and and numbered in pencil; accompanied by a Certificate of Authenticity from Pest Control. Current bid, $20,000 KAWS Kate Moss, White Gloves, 2001 Screenprint in colors on Arches 88 paper 17 x 28 in. (43.18 x 71.12 cm.) Frame: 21.5 x 32.5 x 1.25 in. (54.61 x 82.55 x 3.18 cm.) Signed, dated and numbered in pencil Estimate, $30,000 to $50,000 www.artnet.com/auctions/urban-art-0620/?
Artnet Urban Art Live now through June 11, 2020 Banksy Donuts (Chocolate), 2009 Screenprint in colors on Arches 88 paper 22.05 x 29.92 in. (56 x 76 cm.) Frame: 32.76 x 40 x 1.97 in. (83.2 x 101.6 x 5 cm.) Signed and numbered in red crayon; accompanied by a Certificate of Authenticity from Pest Control Current bid $24,000 KAWS, KAWSBOB (Red), 2011 Estimate, $18,000 to $22,000 Banksy, People Who Enjoy Waving Flags Don't Deserve to Have One, 2003 Spray paint on St. George's flag 51.97 x 37.4 in. (132 x 95 cm.) Frame: 56.69 x 40.94 x 1.57 in. (144 x 104 x 4 cm.) Accompanied by a certificate of authenticity from Pest Control Estimate, $250,000 to $350,000 Banksy, No Ball Games (Grey), 2009 Screenprint in colors on wove paper Image: 24.29 x 25.43 in. (61.7 x 64.6 cm.) Sheet: 26.38 x 27.56 in. (67 x 70 cm.) Frame: 37 x 37.5 x 1.97 in. (93.98 x 95.25 x 5 cm.) Signed and and numbered in pencil; accompanied by a Certificate of Authenticity from Pest Control. Current bid, $20,000 KAWS Kate Moss, White Gloves, 2001 Screenprint in colors on Arches 88 paper 17 x 28 in. (43.18 x 71.12 cm.) Frame: 21.5 x 32.5 x 1.25 in. (54.61 x 82.55 x 3.18 cm.) Signed, dated and numbered in pencil Estimate, $30,000 to $50,000 www.artnet.com/auctions/urban-art-0620/? |
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Artnet Auctions ๐บ๐ฒ, by Yeah Yeah Yeah Round2 on Jun 11, 2020 19:33:26 GMT 1, Results?
Results?
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