andimate
New Member
Posts โข 52
Likes โข 16
August 2009
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by andimate on Aug 6, 2010 17:25:08 GMT 1, I've asked for help on this site a few times and received some positive responses.
I bought an item off a seller on here via Ebay.
It arrived damaged and seller has refused a refund, even though the item has been posted back to them and signed for.
I was travelling so missed the paypal / ebay window.
Any advice and would anyone like to know who the seller is who appears on this forum?
I have all the relevant docs and pictures to prove what I am saying and considering going to court just for the principle. Item was 160 pounds.
Thanks for any guidance.
Matt
I've asked for help on this site a few times and received some positive responses.
I bought an item off a seller on here via Ebay.
It arrived damaged and seller has refused a refund, even though the item has been posted back to them and signed for.
I was travelling so missed the paypal / ebay window.
Any advice and would anyone like to know who the seller is who appears on this forum?
I have all the relevant docs and pictures to prove what I am saying and considering going to court just for the principle. Item was 160 pounds.
Thanks for any guidance.
Matt
|
|
Warm Gun
Junior Member
Posts โข 4,646
Likes โข 1,130
August 2009
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by Warm Gun on Aug 6, 2010 17:36:40 GMT 1, So he's now got your money AND the returned print?!
What a git!
So he's now got your money AND the returned print?!
What a git!
|
|
rinaceirde
New Member
Posts โข 613
Likes โข 15
April 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by rinaceirde on Aug 6, 2010 17:40:39 GMT 1, name and shame
name and shame
|
|
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by rosstierney on Aug 6, 2010 17:42:40 GMT 1, how do you think the item was damaged? was there external damage to the packaging? was it a print? if so, was it secure internally or was it free to roam around?
how do you think the item was damaged? was there external damage to the packaging? was it a print? if so, was it secure internally or was it free to roam around?
|
|
maadbeats
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,272
Likes โข 19
September 2007
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by maadbeats on Aug 6, 2010 18:20:11 GMT 1, it always best to open up a claim when you get near the 30 day window. that way if everything doesnt work out you can get reimburssed. And if things get fixed you can easily take down the claim.
Like said above, its now name and shame. No offense your f'ed in terms of getting your money or damaged print back.
it always best to open up a claim when you get near the 30 day window. that way if everything doesnt work out you can get reimburssed. And if things get fixed you can easily take down the claim.
Like said above, its now name and shame. No offense your f'ed in terms of getting your money or damaged print back.
|
|
mmmike
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,421
Likes โข 759
March 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by mmmike on Aug 6, 2010 18:59:05 GMT 1, If you paid by credit card. You may be able to make a claim through there. Not sure since it sounds like PayPal did its job. But it is worth a call to explain the problem. They are supposed to cover you when the seller does not deliver.
If you paid by credit card. You may be able to make a claim through there. Not sure since it sounds like PayPal did its job. But it is worth a call to explain the problem. They are supposed to cover you when the seller does not deliver.
|
|
|
harryh74
New Member
Posts โข 871
Likes โข 438
May 2008
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by harryh74 on Aug 6, 2010 19:02:18 GMT 1, A name and shame action will flush out the culprit so they will have a chance to put their side of the story. This will also help fellow forum members to make an informed decision on future trades/sales with this member. If after a name and shame has been played the accused has 30 days to defend himself, if no defence is offered under forum rule 30:05 you can post the guilty(as they will now be called) members address where upon at a pre stated time and place all forum members in a 50 mile radius must gather in a howling mob armed with pitchforks, clubs and burning torches and march upon the address seeking satisfaction for the wronged.
But as stated earlier you are pretty f'ed with paypal if you missed your window (unless your paypal payment was funded with your credit card then you might be able to claim through them)
A name and shame action will flush out the culprit so they will have a chance to put their side of the story. This will also help fellow forum members to make an informed decision on future trades/sales with this member. If after a name and shame has been played the accused has 30 days to defend himself, if no defence is offered under forum rule 30:05 you can post the guilty(as they will now be called) members address where upon at a pre stated time and place all forum members in a 50 mile radius must gather in a howling mob armed with pitchforks, clubs and burning torches and march upon the address seeking satisfaction for the wronged.
But as stated earlier you are pretty f'ed with paypal if you missed your window (unless your paypal payment was funded with your credit card then you might be able to claim through them)
|
|
Deleted
Posts โข 0
Likes โข
January 1970
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by Deleted on Aug 6, 2010 19:30:54 GMT 1, it always best to open up a claim when you get near the 30 day window. that way if everything doesnt work out you can get reimburssed. And if things get fixed you can easily take down the claim. Like said above, its now name and shame. No offense your f'ed in terms of getting your money or damaged print back.
Surely this isn't the case? You're not f'ed that is?
You have neither the item that you paid for nor the money that you paid for it? You need some legal.
If you own your own house then there's every chance you have paid for, without knowing, family legal protection on your policy. Use it. If you bought an item and it arrived in a condition that was contrary to description then it has perhaps been misrepresented, either innocently, negligently or fraudulently. If it has been damaged in transit then I think it might be the senders responsibility to ensure that arrives in the same condition in which it left. The courier / post is their agent, not yours.
Depends on how much money ยฃ160.00 is to you - I wouldn't name and shame until you know the facts as that might prejudice your interest.
Good luck.....
it always best to open up a claim when you get near the 30 day window. that way if everything doesnt work out you can get reimburssed. And if things get fixed you can easily take down the claim. Like said above, its now name and shame. No offense your f'ed in terms of getting your money or damaged print back. Surely this isn't the case? You're not f'ed that is? You have neither the item that you paid for nor the money that you paid for it? You need some legal. If you own your own house then there's every chance you have paid for, without knowing, family legal protection on your policy. Use it. If you bought an item and it arrived in a condition that was contrary to description then it has perhaps been misrepresented, either innocently, negligently or fraudulently. If it has been damaged in transit then I think it might be the senders responsibility to ensure that arrives in the same condition in which it left. The courier / post is their agent, not yours. Depends on how much money ยฃ160.00 is to you - I wouldn't name and shame until you know the facts as that might prejudice your interest. Good luck.....
|
|
jackstranger
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,132
Likes โข 23
April 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by jackstranger on Aug 6, 2010 20:51:07 GMT 1, Some things are not clear to me: 1. Did the item arrived damaged? What type of damage? Was the package damaged too? 2. Did the seller asked you to return the item? If not you should not return the item until you open a Paypal/Ebay claim and they tell you to return the item. 3. What the seller replied to your first complaint? 4. The claim window is 45 days at first and then 20 days to escalate. So it is not that easy to loose. 5. Is this related with your previous post:
urbanartassociation.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=ebaychat&thread=53440&page=1#658545
Just wondering
Some things are not clear to me: 1. Did the item arrived damaged? What type of damage? Was the package damaged too? 2. Did the seller asked you to return the item? If not you should not return the item until you open a Paypal/Ebay claim and they tell you to return the item. 3. What the seller replied to your first complaint? 4. The claim window is 45 days at first and then 20 days to escalate. So it is not that easy to loose. 5. Is this related with your previous post: urbanartassociation.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=ebaychat&thread=53440&page=1#658545Just wondering
|
|
Warm Gun
Junior Member
Posts โข 4,646
Likes โข 1,130
August 2009
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by Warm Gun on Aug 6, 2010 21:22:07 GMT 1, If you bought this item in May then you may well be screwed. Sadly it'd be your own fault for taking so long (if that is the case), you need to be on the ball for these things.
Do you still have his address?
It might be worth subtly reminding him of that fact.
If you bought this item in May then you may well be screwed. Sadly it'd be your own fault for taking so long (if that is the case), you need to be on the ball for these things.
Do you still have his address?
It might be worth subtly reminding him of that fact.
|
|
jackstranger
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,132
Likes โข 23
April 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by jackstranger on Aug 6, 2010 21:31:39 GMT 1, If this is the same item and if you made the claim to Paypal and provided them all the necessary info they should have refund you. I had an issue in the past that the seller was not replying after they asked me to return the item and they refunded me with no worries.
If this is the same item and if you made the claim to Paypal and provided them all the necessary info they should have refund you. I had an issue in the past that the seller was not replying after they asked me to return the item and they refunded me with no worries.
|
|
Deleted
Posts โข 0
Likes โข
January 1970
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by Deleted on Aug 6, 2010 21:33:50 GMT 1, The law's the law - check out how you stand legally and take it from there. No one's above the law (well, except me - as I'm on the run for various offensive remarks made towards women at Dukes nightclub Chelmsford between 1993-1997, the bastards will never take me alive....)
The law's the law - check out how you stand legally and take it from there. No one's above the law (well, except me - as I'm on the run for various offensive remarks made towards women at Dukes nightclub Chelmsford between 1993-1997, the bastards will never take me alive....)
|
|
jackstranger
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,132
Likes โข 23
April 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by jackstranger on Aug 6, 2010 21:59:57 GMT 1, The law's the law - check out how you stand legally and take it from there. No one's above the law (well, except me - as I'm on the run for various offensive remarks made towards women at Dukes nightclub Chelmsford between 1993-1997, the bastards will never take me alive....)
You are from a protected specie
The law's the law - check out how you stand legally and take it from there. No one's above the law (well, except me - as I'm on the run for various offensive remarks made towards women at Dukes nightclub Chelmsford between 1993-1997, the bastards will never take me alive....) You are from a protected specie
|
|
andimate
New Member
Posts โข 52
Likes โข 16
August 2009
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by andimate on Aug 7, 2010 3:00:28 GMT 1, My own fault for missing the Paypal / Ebay windows - I was travelling a lot. Item was a figurine and arrived with poor packaging and broken. I started with Paypal, they opened a dispute and I sent the item back.
In the meantime they then asked for a copy of the registered post receipt of the item being returned - took me a while to manage to do that but it was after the window, Paypal declined to refund on the grounds I was too late.
Seller has now said Paypal made their decision so tough shit. He has the piece and the money.
Thanks for the credit card advice, I'll try. If not pitchforks and howling it is.
I will name and shame once I've given him one last chance after seeing this thread.
Cheers
My own fault for missing the Paypal / Ebay windows - I was travelling a lot. Item was a figurine and arrived with poor packaging and broken. I started with Paypal, they opened a dispute and I sent the item back.
In the meantime they then asked for a copy of the registered post receipt of the item being returned - took me a while to manage to do that but it was after the window, Paypal declined to refund on the grounds I was too late.
Seller has now said Paypal made their decision so tough shit. He has the piece and the money.
Thanks for the credit card advice, I'll try. If not pitchforks and howling it is.
I will name and shame once I've given him one last chance after seeing this thread.
Cheers
|
|
|
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by fingerz on Aug 7, 2010 6:37:40 GMT 1, put all of the replies in his/her inbox/pm just so you know he/she has got the message then out him
put all of the replies in his/her inbox/pm just so you know he/she has got the message then out him
|
|
a11ad1n
New Member
Posts โข 39
Likes โข 0
May 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by a11ad1n on Aug 7, 2010 9:08:32 GMT 1, It happens to me 2 months ago with the Soldier by Gee Vaucher : the print was dirty, folded, a real crap ... The seller, with good feedbacks, after apologized, told me that it was an oversight. So, after all the ebay/paypal process : print resent, 2 cases opened, and, of course, no response from the seller, paypal wrote me last week that it got back the money last week. I'm waiting now for the complete refund. I don't know how paypal managed that
It happens to me 2 months ago with the Soldier by Gee Vaucher : the print was dirty, folded, a real crap ... The seller, with good feedbacks, after apologized, told me that it was an oversight. So, after all the ebay/paypal process : print resent, 2 cases opened, and, of course, no response from the seller, paypal wrote me last week that it got back the money last week. I'm waiting now for the complete refund. I don't know how paypal managed that
|
|
jackstranger
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,132
Likes โข 23
April 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by jackstranger on Aug 7, 2010 9:48:48 GMT 1, My own fault for missing the Paypal / Ebay windows - I was travelling a lot. Item was a figurine and arrived with poor packaging and broken. I started with Paypal, they opened a dispute and I sent the item back. In the meantime they then asked for a copy of the registered post receipt of the item being returned - took me a while to manage to do that but it was after the window, Paypal declined to refund on the grounds I was too late. Seller has now said Paypal made their decision so tough s**t. He has the piece and the money. Thanks for the credit card advice, I'll try. If not pitchforks and howling it is. I will name and shame once I've given him one last chance after seeing this thread. Cheers
Hi andimate, I see the issue that you were traveling, but in your first post for this, at 10th of May you stated 'Seller has gone quiet, so I've had no choice but to complain to Paypal. They want proof that I have returned the item to the seller'. So why didn't you send the proof of return to Paypal at that time?
Three months later is pretty obvious that they had closed the case.
Even trying to use the Credit Card company complaint there is probably a time schedule that you may be close to miss.
My own fault for missing the Paypal / Ebay windows - I was travelling a lot. Item was a figurine and arrived with poor packaging and broken. I started with Paypal, they opened a dispute and I sent the item back. In the meantime they then asked for a copy of the registered post receipt of the item being returned - took me a while to manage to do that but it was after the window, Paypal declined to refund on the grounds I was too late. Seller has now said Paypal made their decision so tough s**t. He has the piece and the money. Thanks for the credit card advice, I'll try. If not pitchforks and howling it is. I will name and shame once I've given him one last chance after seeing this thread. Cheers Hi andimate, I see the issue that you were traveling, but in your first post for this, at 10th of May you stated 'Seller has gone quiet, so I've had no choice but to complain to Paypal. They want proof that I have returned the item to the seller'. So why didn't you send the proof of return to Paypal at that time? Three months later is pretty obvious that they had closed the case. Even trying to use the Credit Card company complaint there is probably a time schedule that you may be close to miss.
|
|
a11ad1n
New Member
Posts โข 39
Likes โข 0
May 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by a11ad1n on Aug 7, 2010 9:51:31 GMT 1, Paypal asks for a proof, I 've only sent the tracking number
Paypal asks for a proof, I 've only sent the tracking number
|
|
jackstranger
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,132
Likes โข 23
April 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by jackstranger on Aug 7, 2010 10:02:05 GMT 1, With the issue I had once they asked me too to attach a scan of the sending document or to fax it to them.
With the issue I had once they asked me too to attach a scan of the sending document or to fax it to them.
|
|
a11ad1n
New Member
Posts โข 39
Likes โข 0
May 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by a11ad1n on Aug 7, 2010 10:17:09 GMT 1, That's I have purposed to paypal but no response from them so I guess that's the tracking number is enough
That's I have purposed to paypal but no response from them so I guess that's the tracking number is enough
|
|
jackstranger
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,132
Likes โข 23
April 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by jackstranger on Aug 7, 2010 10:25:26 GMT 1, As long as you do what they ask to, you should be fine. If you received the email stating that the refund was processed, it is only a matter for the funds to be transferred to your account again, using the same method that you used for payment. V.G.: If you paid by Paypal using your credit card the funds will be back to your credit card.
As long as you do what they ask to, you should be fine. If you received the email stating that the refund was processed, it is only a matter for the funds to be transferred to your account again, using the same method that you used for payment. V.G.: If you paid by Paypal using your credit card the funds will be back to your credit card.
|
|
a11ad1n
New Member
Posts โข 39
Likes โข 0
May 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by a11ad1n on Aug 7, 2010 10:36:32 GMT 1, That's it. I'm waiting for a refund of 80 ยฃ, and the grand total will be divided in 2 partes because one parte was paid by paypal, the other with my bank account.
That's it. I'm waiting for a refund of 80 ยฃ, and the grand total will be divided in 2 partes because one parte was paid by paypal, the other with my bank account.
|
|
|
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by Brushstrokes 75 on Aug 7, 2010 11:21:46 GMT 1, Paypal sucks for this... and the 40 days window sucks in some cases. It happened to me also.
You're only recourse now is that you make a court claim because if you make a credit card claim, paypal will ask the seller the tracking number of the parcel to the seller. If it came to your address they will refuse the claim.
But how much is it going to cost you for going to court....that's another question...
Paypal sucks for this... and the 40 days window sucks in some cases. It happened to me also.
You're only recourse now is that you make a court claim because if you make a credit card claim, paypal will ask the seller the tracking number of the parcel to the seller. If it came to your address they will refuse the claim.
But how much is it going to cost you for going to court....that's another question...
|
|
jackstranger
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,132
Likes โข 23
April 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by jackstranger on Aug 7, 2010 11:52:29 GMT 1, Paypal sucks for this... and the 40 days window sucks in some cases. It happened to me also. You're only recourse now is that you make a court claim because if you make a credit card claim, paypal will ask the seller the tracking number of the parcel to the seller. If it came to your address they will refuse the claim. But how much is it going to cost you for going to court....that's another question...
It is 45 days to raise a claim and why does 45 days sucks? 45 days to realize that you are unhappy with something you bought is more than enough. At the worst scenario the item will 3 weeks to arrive to you and you still have another 3 weeks to raise a complaint.
Not sure about the process with Paypal when you raise a complaint to your credit card company but I doubt it is that easy as you described because you have the proof that you returned the item to the seller.
Paypal sucks for this... and the 40 days window sucks in some cases. It happened to me also. You're only recourse now is that you make a court claim because if you make a credit card claim, paypal will ask the seller the tracking number of the parcel to the seller. If it came to your address they will refuse the claim. But how much is it going to cost you for going to court....that's another question... It is 45 days to raise a claim and why does 45 days sucks? 45 days to realize that you are unhappy with something you bought is more than enough. At the worst scenario the item will 3 weeks to arrive to you and you still have another 3 weeks to raise a complaint. Not sure about the process with Paypal when you raise a complaint to your credit card company but I doubt it is that easy as you described because you have the proof that you returned the item to the seller.
|
|
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by Brushstrokes 75 on Aug 7, 2010 12:24:15 GMT 1, 45 days sucks because it only helps you if the item is not as described or damaged.. If you buy a fake print then you're down. How long does it take to have a pest control certificate?
I'm not even talking about other artists... For Warhol, for example you have only 3 sessions of authentifications per year (and they also only accept a limited amount of works / session).
For the credit card, I'm not sure that visa or any bank will care that the item has been returned since it's processed through paypal and paypal won't care since the dispute was closed..... But it's just my opinion.
For example, it happened to me last year, one guy made a credit card claim for a transaction through ebay that happened almost a year prior to the claim. The guy said that someone stole his credit card to make the purchase.... Paypal contacted me to ask me the tracking number and posting receipt... Hopefully, I had everything and they dismissed his claim...
45 days sucks because it only helps you if the item is not as described or damaged.. If you buy a fake print then you're down. How long does it take to have a pest control certificate?
I'm not even talking about other artists... For Warhol, for example you have only 3 sessions of authentifications per year (and they also only accept a limited amount of works / session).
For the credit card, I'm not sure that visa or any bank will care that the item has been returned since it's processed through paypal and paypal won't care since the dispute was closed..... But it's just my opinion.
For example, it happened to me last year, one guy made a credit card claim for a transaction through ebay that happened almost a year prior to the claim. The guy said that someone stole his credit card to make the purchase.... Paypal contacted me to ask me the tracking number and posting receipt... Hopefully, I had everything and they dismissed his claim...
|
|
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by walshy on Aug 7, 2010 12:33:06 GMT 1, 45 days sucks because it only helps you if the item is not as described or damaged.. If you buy a fake print then you're down. How long does it take to have a pest control certificate?
If you buy a Banksy without getting prov sorted first, imo you only have yourself to blame if it turns out to be fake. TBH if you buy any high end work like you just mentioned, without doing some research.. you are asking for trouble.
45 days sucks because it only helps you if the item is not as described or damaged.. If you buy a fake print then you're down. How long does it take to have a pest control certificate? If you buy a Banksy without getting prov sorted first, imo you only have yourself to blame if it turns out to be fake. TBH if you buy any high end work like you just mentioned, without doing some research.. you are asking for trouble.
|
|
jackstranger
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,132
Likes โข 23
April 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by jackstranger on Aug 7, 2010 12:37:13 GMT 1, 45 days sucks because it only helps you if the item is not as described or damaged.. If you buy a fake print then you're down. How long does it take to have a pest control certificate? I'm not even talking about other artists... For Warhol, for example you have only 3 sessions of authentifications per year (and they also only accept a limited amount of works / session). For the credit card, I'm not sure that visa or any bank will care that the item has been returned since it's processed through paypal and paypal won't care since the dispute was closed..... But it's just my opinion. For example, it happened to me last year, one guy made a credit card claim for a transaction through ebay that happened almost a year prior to the claim. The guy said that someone stole his credit card to make the purchase.... Paypal contacted me to ask me the tracking number and posting receipt... Hopefully, I had everything and they dismissed his claim...
Would you buy a Banksy or Warhol work without know that the seller have a COA in advance? I wouldn't!
You can raise a complaint to Ebay and Paypal if you buy (or suspect) an item that is fake or counterfeit too, so why do you need more than 45 days to realize it seems fake to you?
45 days sucks because it only helps you if the item is not as described or damaged.. If you buy a fake print then you're down. How long does it take to have a pest control certificate? I'm not even talking about other artists... For Warhol, for example you have only 3 sessions of authentifications per year (and they also only accept a limited amount of works / session). For the credit card, I'm not sure that visa or any bank will care that the item has been returned since it's processed through paypal and paypal won't care since the dispute was closed..... But it's just my opinion. For example, it happened to me last year, one guy made a credit card claim for a transaction through ebay that happened almost a year prior to the claim. The guy said that someone stole his credit card to make the purchase.... Paypal contacted me to ask me the tracking number and posting receipt... Hopefully, I had everything and they dismissed his claim... Would you buy a Banksy or Warhol work without know that the seller have a COA in advance? I wouldn't! You can raise a complaint to Ebay and Paypal if you buy (or suspect) an item that is fake or counterfeit too, so why do you need more than 45 days to realize it seems fake to you?
|
|
jackstranger
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,132
Likes โข 23
April 2010
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by jackstranger on Aug 7, 2010 12:38:29 GMT 1, 45 days sucks because it only helps you if the item is not as described or damaged.. If you buy a fake print then you're down. How long does it take to have a pest control certificate? If you buy a Banksy without getting prov sorted first, imo you only have yourself to blame if it turns out to be fake. TBH if you buy any high end work like you just mentioned, without doing some research.. you are asking for trouble.
Agreed! Sorry if my post doubled yours.
45 days sucks because it only helps you if the item is not as described or damaged.. If you buy a fake print then you're down. How long does it take to have a pest control certificate? If you buy a Banksy without getting prov sorted first, imo you only have yourself to blame if it turns out to be fake. TBH if you buy any high end work like you just mentioned, without doing some research.. you are asking for trouble. Agreed! Sorry if my post doubled yours.
|
|
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by walshy on Aug 7, 2010 13:02:31 GMT 1, If you buy a Banksy without getting prov sorted first, imo you only have yourself to blame if it turns out to be fake. TBH if you buy any high end work like you just mentioned, without doing some research.. you are asking for trouble. Agreed! Sorry if my post doubled yours.
no worries mate, great minds and all that
If you buy a Banksy without getting prov sorted first, imo you only have yourself to blame if it turns out to be fake. TBH if you buy any high end work like you just mentioned, without doing some research.. you are asking for trouble. Agreed! Sorry if my post doubled yours. no worries mate, great minds and all that
|
|
|
What to do when seller refuses refund?, by Brushstrokes 75 on Aug 7, 2010 13:02:40 GMT 1, Don't want to enter in a debate of buying high end stuff on ebay. But you can still make research and still buy a fake. I saw a case like this a while back (but it was with a painting instead) that was meant to explain that provenance means nothing. Imagine a print (other than contemporary living artists) with perfect provenance. Imagine that one of the owners needed money so he asked/made a knock off for himself and sold the original work. The guy dies or sell his house with everything inside (it's very common). The provenance is still perfect but the work has been subtitued with a fake..
Other examples the warhol brillo box sculptures that sold for millions at christie's / sotheby's, all fakes. So imagine I'm sure you have the same stuff in smaller scale and which are ended on ebay.
So sometimes 40 days is not enough. Why do you think that international law provides recourse for 3 to 5 years (depending on the countries) for buying art fakes.....
Don't want to enter in a debate of buying high end stuff on ebay. But you can still make research and still buy a fake. I saw a case like this a while back (but it was with a painting instead) that was meant to explain that provenance means nothing. Imagine a print (other than contemporary living artists) with perfect provenance. Imagine that one of the owners needed money so he asked/made a knock off for himself and sold the original work. The guy dies or sell his house with everything inside (it's very common). The provenance is still perfect but the work has been subtitued with a fake..
Other examples the warhol brillo box sculptures that sold for millions at christie's / sotheby's, all fakes. So imagine I'm sure you have the same stuff in smaller scale and which are ended on ebay.
So sometimes 40 days is not enough. Why do you think that international law provides recourse for 3 to 5 years (depending on the countries) for buying art fakes.....
|
|