sevrin
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๐จ๏ธ 796
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February 2022
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by sevrin on Nov 7, 2024 12:38:54 GMT 1, Anyone tried a uv light on theirs yet? The print description say UV pigment and the original crack had some hidden uv characters - I wonder if thereโs any secret surprise here. I doubt it, the UV pigment ink in the description is referring to a particular type of drying process, see below for further information;
"UV Printing, otherwise know as Ultra Violet Printing is a printing technique that uses special UV curing ink that allows the ink to be printed onto a large range of materials or โsubstratesโ. The printer will place the ink on the material and a specifically design UV light, acting as a catalyst, will follow behind, drying (or curing) the ink so that it drys hard instantly. This reaction causes something called polymerisation to occur. The UV ink curing process was originally designed to rapidly dry gel nail-polish during ladies manicures. It quickly became apparent that this quick drying print technology could be very useful in more commercial and industrial applications such as within the sign and print industry."
"Will a UV printed material glow under UV light? After all, a Ultraviolet light was used in the printing process. No. Youโre finished print will not glow under ultra violet light. The fact that an ultra violet light was used in the curing/drying process does not mean the finished print will glow in the dark."
Anyone tried a uv light on theirs yet? The print description say UV pigment and the original crack had some hidden uv characters - I wonder if thereโs any secret surprise here. I doubt it, the UV pigment ink in the description is referring to a particular type of drying process, see below for further information; "UV Printing, otherwise know as Ultra Violet Printing is a printing technique that uses special UV curing ink that allows the ink to be printed onto a large range of materials or โsubstratesโ. The printer will place the ink on the material and a specifically design UV light, acting as a catalyst, will follow behind, drying (or curing) the ink so that it drys hard instantly. This reaction causes something called polymerisation to occur. The UV ink curing process was originally designed to rapidly dry gel nail-polish during ladies manicures. It quickly became apparent that this quick drying print technology could be very useful in more commercial and industrial applications such as within the sign and print industry." "Will a UV printed material glow under UV light? After all, a Ultraviolet light was used in the printing process. No. Youโre finished print will not glow under ultra violet light. The fact that an ultra violet light was used in the curing/drying process does not mean the finished print will glow in the dark."
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by King and a Duck on Nov 7, 2024 13:13:25 GMT 1, As in all things these are only worth what someone would pay. As a buyer I would not pay the same for the image with 3 figures as I would for 1000. What it costs to print has never been factored into these images or others so your arguments fall pretty flat to me. I paid more for a tier 7 print not because I couldnโt get an earlier print but because I wanted a better defined image. I do not expect the different tiers to price the same on secondary. Did print number 1 have literally one figure on it? Or did they start with a load?
As in all things these are only worth what someone would pay. As a buyer I would not pay the same for the image with 3 figures as I would for 1000. What it costs to print has never been factored into these images or others so your arguments fall pretty flat to me. I paid more for a tier 7 print not because I couldnโt get an earlier print but because I wanted a better defined image. I do not expect the different tiers to price the same on secondary. Did print number 1 have literally one figure on it? Or did they start with a load?
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yoss
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 484
๐๐ป 404
November 2020
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by yoss on Nov 7, 2024 18:18:10 GMT 1, As in all things these are only worth what someone would pay. As a buyer I would not pay the same for the image with 3 figures as I would for 1000. What it costs to print has never been factored into these images or others so your arguments fall pretty flat to me. I paid more for a tier 7 print not because I couldnโt get an earlier print but because I wanted a better defined image. I do not expect the different tiers to price the same on secondary. Did print number 1 have literally one figure on it? Or did they start with a load? Print #001 had three dudes/dudettes on it. Each print thereafter got three more than the last one.
As in all things these are only worth what someone would pay. As a buyer I would not pay the same for the image with 3 figures as I would for 1000. What it costs to print has never been factored into these images or others so your arguments fall pretty flat to me. I paid more for a tier 7 print not because I couldnโt get an earlier print but because I wanted a better defined image. I do not expect the different tiers to price the same on secondary. Did print number 1 have literally one figure on it? Or did they start with a load? Print #001 had three dudes/dudettes on it. Each print thereafter got three more than the last one.
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sevrin
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 796
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February 2022
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by sevrin on Nov 7, 2024 19:54:01 GMT 1, Did print number 1 have literally one figure on it? Or did they start with a load? Print #001 had three dudes/dudettes on it. Each print thereafter got three more than the last one. I was at the printers 'Make-Ready' when these were being printed, and I was informed that there were going to be alot more than 3 figures on the first print, I'm not sure how many exactly, but quite a few, each subsequent print had 3 more figures added.
Did print number 1 have literally one figure on it? Or did they start with a load? Print #001 had three dudes/dudettes on it. Each print thereafter got three more than the last one. I was at the printers 'Make-Ready' when these were being printed, and I was informed that there were going to be alot more than 3 figures on the first print, I'm not sure how many exactly, but quite a few, each subsequent print had 3 more figures added.
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ck1
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 187
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August 2022
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by ck1 on Nov 7, 2024 20:06:01 GMT 1, Print #001 had three dudes/dudettes on it. Each print thereafter got three more than the last one. I was at the printers 'Make-Ready' when these were being printed, and I was informed that there were going to be alot more than 3 figures on the first print, I'm not sure how many exactly, but quite a few, each subsequent print had 3 more figures added. Strange. This link supposedly shows print 15 and I count 45 people. The movie on this page starts with an image of 3 people. avantarte.com/products/pejac-hope-release-1
Print #001 had three dudes/dudettes on it. Each print thereafter got three more than the last one. I was at the printers 'Make-Ready' when these were being printed, and I was informed that there were going to be alot more than 3 figures on the first print, I'm not sure how many exactly, but quite a few, each subsequent print had 3 more figures added. Strange. This link supposedly shows print 15 and I count 45 people. The movie on this page starts with an image of 3 people. avantarte.com/products/pejac-hope-release-1
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Londown 01
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,214
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Member is Online
September 2021
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by Londown 01 on Nov 7, 2024 20:16:07 GMT 1, I was at the printers 'Make-Ready' when these were being printed, and I was informed that there were going to be alot more than 3 figures on the first print, I'm not sure how many exactly, but quite a few, each subsequent print had 3 more figures added. Strange. This link supposedly shows print 15 and I count 45 people. The movie on this page starts with an image of 3 people. I think it is a possibility that this video (and maybe the photos too) don't show actual prints but only the images that were taken during creation.
I was at the printers 'Make-Ready' when these were being printed, and I was informed that there were going to be alot more than 3 figures on the first print, I'm not sure how many exactly, but quite a few, each subsequent print had 3 more figures added. Strange. This link supposedly shows print 15 and I count 45 people. The movie on this page starts with an image of 3 people. I think it is a possibility that this video (and maybe the photos too) don't show actual prints but only the images that were taken during creation.
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hellomoon
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 4
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February 2022
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by hellomoon on Nov 7, 2024 21:25:43 GMT 1, How were you expecting this to work? They were more expensive as the tiers increased and most only got 1. Would you swap for a lower tier? Swap up with cash? I may want a second would you just sell for cost? Out of curiosity do you see higher tiers as being more valuable - or do you make the same comparison to tiered pricing on a standard drop. That those who got the early numbers got a discount? If someone has a higher tier one they want to swap for a lower tier one, I'm more than happy to pay the cost difference as part of swap for one of my tier3s. I won't be selling the other for now otherwise, and definitely not at cost! I really want to make a diptych, kicking myself for not applying for the higher tiers!
How were you expecting this to work? They were more expensive as the tiers increased and most only got 1. Would you swap for a lower tier? Swap up with cash? I may want a second would you just sell for cost? Out of curiosity do you see higher tiers as being more valuable - or do you make the same comparison to tiered pricing on a standard drop. That those who got the early numbers got a discount? If someone has a higher tier one they want to swap for a lower tier one, I'm more than happy to pay the cost difference as part of swap for one of my tier3s. I won't be selling the other for now otherwise, and definitely not at cost! I really want to make a diptych, kicking myself for not applying for the higher tiers!
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yoss
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 484
๐๐ป 404
November 2020
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by yoss on Nov 7, 2024 22:20:18 GMT 1, Print #001 had three dudes/dudettes on it. Each print thereafter got three more than the last one. I was at the printers 'Make-Ready' when these were being printed, and I was informed that there were going to be alot more than 3 figures on the first print, I'm not sure how many exactly, but quite a few, each subsequent print had 3 more figures added. My bad!!! Thanks for the clarification!!!!
Print #001 had three dudes/dudettes on it. Each print thereafter got three more than the last one. I was at the printers 'Make-Ready' when these were being printed, and I was informed that there were going to be alot more than 3 figures on the first print, I'm not sure how many exactly, but quite a few, each subsequent print had 3 more figures added. My bad!!! Thanks for the clarification!!!!
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by Boost the goat on Nov 7, 2024 22:54:37 GMT 1,
Out of curiosity do you see higher tiers as being more valuable - or do you make the same comparison to tiered pricing on a standard drop. That those who got the early numbers got a discount? If someone has a higher tier one they want to swap for a lower tier one, I'm more than happy to pay the cost difference as part of swap for one of my tier3s. I won't be selling the other for now otherwise, and definitely not at cost! I really want to make a diptych, kicking myself for not applying for the higher tiers! Willing to swap your tier 3 for a tier 2 + cost difference ?
Out of curiosity do you see higher tiers as being more valuable - or do you make the same comparison to tiered pricing on a standard drop. That those who got the early numbers got a discount? If someone has a higher tier one they want to swap for a lower tier one, I'm more than happy to pay the cost difference as part of swap for one of my tier3s. I won't be selling the other for now otherwise, and definitely not at cost! I really want to make a diptych, kicking myself for not applying for the higher tiers! Willing to swap your tier 3 for a tier 2 + cost difference ?
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jp226
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,074
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July 2010
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by jp226 on Nov 7, 2024 23:18:11 GMT 1, Buddy of mine is looking to sell his Tier 2 -- told him I'd ask around.
Buddy of mine is looking to sell his Tier 2 -- told him I'd ask around.
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ck1
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 187
๐๐ป 199
August 2022
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by ck1 on Nov 7, 2024 23:20:22 GMT 1, Out of curiosity do you see higher tiers as being more valuable - or do you make the same comparison to tiered pricing on a standard drop. That those who got the early numbers got a discount? If someone has a higher tier one they want to swap for a lower tier one, I'm more than happy to pay the cost difference as part of swap for one of my tier3s. I won't be selling the other for now otherwise, and definitely not at cost! I really want to make a diptych, kicking myself for not applying for the higher tiers! If you wont accept cost for your print why would someone take cost for the difference between prints. Sounds like you will need to pay more than cost if prices have increased so much since release.
Out of curiosity do you see higher tiers as being more valuable - or do you make the same comparison to tiered pricing on a standard drop. That those who got the early numbers got a discount? If someone has a higher tier one they want to swap for a lower tier one, I'm more than happy to pay the cost difference as part of swap for one of my tier3s. I won't be selling the other for now otherwise, and definitely not at cost! I really want to make a diptych, kicking myself for not applying for the higher tiers! If you wont accept cost for your print why would someone take cost for the difference between prints. Sounds like you will need to pay more than cost if prices have increased so much since release.
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ck1
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 187
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August 2022
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by ck1 on Nov 8, 2024 0:43:39 GMT 1, Strange. This link supposedly shows print 15 and I count 45 people. The movie on this page starts with an image of 3 people. I think it is a possibility that this video (and maybe the photos too) don't show actual prints but only the images that were taken during creation. "With the edition, Pejac reinterprets his iconic crevice which, seen up close, you will be surprised to see is made up from a multitude of tiny, individually-painted people. Each one plays their part in an overarching story of humanity. In the first print, just three figures appear, in the second, there are six and so on until the final print in the series of 1000, which features several thousand figures โ each one unique."
avantarte.com/releases/pejac-hope
Strange. This link supposedly shows print 15 and I count 45 people. The movie on this page starts with an image of 3 people. I think it is a possibility that this video (and maybe the photos too) don't show actual prints but only the images that were taken during creation. "With the edition, Pejac reinterprets his iconic crevice which, seen up close, you will be surprised to see is made up from a multitude of tiny, individually-painted people. Each one plays their part in an overarching story of humanity. In the first print, just three figures appear, in the second, there are six and so on until the final print in the series of 1000, which features several thousand figures โ each one unique." avantarte.com/releases/pejac-hope
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demeisen
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 13
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August 2023
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by demeisen on Nov 8, 2024 10:00:03 GMT 1, My triptych was delivered today. I didn't order them framed since I'm renovating my house, so I wont open them up to look at until framing time. There is a note about the nature of the gold leaf which discouraged me from opening and repacking them until I can ensure they are protected. I was so looking forward to viewing them properly in the flesh asap. But very happy with the edition numbers assigned - it looks like there is method to the numbers for triptych: x/1000, 4x/1000, 9x/1000, with x being a constant number between 1-99
My triptych was delivered today. I didn't order them framed since I'm renovating my house, so I wont open them up to look at until framing time. There is a note about the nature of the gold leaf which discouraged me from opening and repacking them until I can ensure they are protected. I was so looking forward to viewing them properly in the flesh asap. But very happy with the edition numbers assigned - it looks like there is method to the numbers for triptych: x/1000, 4x/1000, 9x/1000, with x being a constant number between 1-99
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yoss
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 484
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November 2020
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by yoss on Nov 8, 2024 14:42:53 GMT 1, Are you located in the States, demeisen? just wondering for those that got delivery to the States, how long did the delivery actually take once Fedex got a hold of the shipment? Not sure why it took a day's travel between Oude Meer NL and Grace-Hollogne BE and the day (so far) just sitting in Grace-Hollogne BE...
Are you located in the States, demeisen? just wondering for those that got delivery to the States, how long did the delivery actually take once Fedex got a hold of the shipment? Not sure why it took a day's travel between Oude Meer NL and Grace-Hollogne BE and the day (so far) just sitting in Grace-Hollogne BE...
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cemltz
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 496
๐๐ป 920
October 2022
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by cemltz on Nov 8, 2024 15:39:11 GMT 1, I've had shipments from AA to the USA sit/bounce back and forth between NL and BE for over a week recently. Something with how they ship with Fedex...
I've had shipments from AA to the USA sit/bounce back and forth between NL and BE for over a week recently. Something with how they ship with Fedex...
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demeisen
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 13
๐๐ป 7
August 2023
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by demeisen on Nov 8, 2024 15:58:25 GMT 1, Are you located in the States, demeisen? just wondering for those that got delivery to the States, how long did the delivery actually take once Fedex got a hold of the shipment? Not sure why it took a day's travel between Oude Meer NL and Grace-Hollogne BE and the day (so far) just sitting in Grace-Hollogne BE... No, I'm UK based. Hopefully it's with you soon mate ๐ค
Are you located in the States, demeisen? just wondering for those that got delivery to the States, how long did the delivery actually take once Fedex got a hold of the shipment? Not sure why it took a day's travel between Oude Meer NL and Grace-Hollogne BE and the day (so far) just sitting in Grace-Hollogne BE... No, I'm UK based. Hopefully it's with you soon mate ๐ค
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alexbigo
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 7
๐๐ป 62
November 2020
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by alexbigo on Nov 9, 2024 12:43:15 GMT 1, I received my triptyque yesterday and sent it for framing. The lowest edition looks very good as the gold character is more obvious. I will put install it in a staircase to make a nice effect.[img src="i.ibb.co/KrL5CXY/IMG-5124.jpg" src="https://i.ibb.co/QKcv37M/IMG-5125.jpg" style="max-width:100%;"]
I received my triptyque yesterday and sent it for framing. The lowest edition looks very good as the gold character is more obvious. I will put install it in a staircase to make a nice effect. [img src="i.ibb.co/KrL5CXY/IMG-5124.jpg" src="https://i.ibb.co/QKcv37M/IMG-5125.jpg" style="max-width:100%;"]
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by Posters And Prints Blog on Nov 9, 2024 20:44:27 GMT 1, I see the Lottery was 100% "random" #smh
I see the Lottery was 100% "random" #smh
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Londown 01
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,214
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Member is Online
September 2021
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by Londown 01 on Nov 9, 2024 21:52:44 GMT 1, I see the Lottery was 100% "random" #smh not a lottery, but thanks for playing
I see the Lottery was 100% "random" #smh not a lottery, but thanks for playing
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yoss
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 484
๐๐ป 404
November 2020
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by yoss on Nov 12, 2024 17:24:04 GMT 1, I received my triptyque yesterday and sent it for framing. The lowest edition looks very good as the gold character is more obvious. I will put install it in a staircase to make a nice effect. [img src="i.ibb.co/KrL5CXY/IMG-5124.jpg" src="https://i.ibb.co/QKcv37M/IMG-5125.jpg" style="max-width:100%;"] Love the pic with all three right next to each other!!! Can't wait!
And a question for art collectors in the US buying art from outside the country: I had to fill out a customs form for the Pejac shipment. By filling this out, does there mean that I am going to have to pay some sort of customs fees to get the package??
Thanks in advance for any info...
I received my triptyque yesterday and sent it for framing. The lowest edition looks very good as the gold character is more obvious. I will put install it in a staircase to make a nice effect. [img src="i.ibb.co/KrL5CXY/IMG-5124.jpg" src="https://i.ibb.co/QKcv37M/IMG-5125.jpg" style="max-width:100%;"] Love the pic with all three right next to each other!!! Can't wait! And a question for art collectors in the US buying art from outside the country: I had to fill out a customs form for the Pejac shipment. By filling this out, does there mean that I am going to have to pay some sort of customs fees to get the package?? Thanks in advance for any info...
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yoss
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 484
๐๐ป 404
November 2020
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by yoss on Nov 12, 2024 17:26:20 GMT 1, I received my triptyque yesterday and sent it for framing. The lowest edition looks very good as the gold character is more obvious. I will put install it in a staircase to make a nice effect. [img src="i.ibb.co/KrL5CXY/IMG-5124.jpg" src="https://i.ibb.co/QKcv37M/IMG-5125.jpg" style="max-width:100%;"] How are you going to frame these Alexbigo? What color frame are you going with? Are you planning on floating them? I have that in mind, but my other Pejac's were too large of prints to float...these look to be a size that floating is do-able...
I received my triptyque yesterday and sent it for framing. The lowest edition looks very good as the gold character is more obvious. I will put install it in a staircase to make a nice effect. [img src="i.ibb.co/KrL5CXY/IMG-5124.jpg" src="https://i.ibb.co/QKcv37M/IMG-5125.jpg" style="max-width:100%;"] How are you going to frame these Alexbigo? What color frame are you going with? Are you planning on floating them? I have that in mind, but my other Pejac's were too large of prints to float...these look to be a size that floating is do-able...
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quinn
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,318
๐๐ป 1,600
December 2017
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by quinn on Nov 12, 2024 18:25:46 GMT 1, I received my triptyque yesterday and sent it for framing. The lowest edition looks very good as the gold character is more obvious. I will put install it in a staircase to make a nice effect. [img src="i.ibb.co/KrL5CXY/IMG-5124.jpg" src="https://i.ibb.co/QKcv37M/IMG-5125.jpg" style="max-width:100%;"] How are you going to frame these Alexbigo? What color frame are you going with? Are you planning on floating them? I have that in mind, but my other Pejac's were too large of prints to float...these look to be a size that floating is do-able... I float all my prints and some are far larger than the pejacโฆlast one was a miaz bros Mona Lisa itโs massive Iโve never encountered any issues really other than some waving but it comes and goes.
I received my triptyque yesterday and sent it for framing. The lowest edition looks very good as the gold character is more obvious. I will put install it in a staircase to make a nice effect. [img src="i.ibb.co/KrL5CXY/IMG-5124.jpg" src="https://i.ibb.co/QKcv37M/IMG-5125.jpg" style="max-width:100%;"] How are you going to frame these Alexbigo? What color frame are you going with? Are you planning on floating them? I have that in mind, but my other Pejac's were too large of prints to float...these look to be a size that floating is do-able... I float all my prints and some are far larger than the pejacโฆlast one was a miaz bros Mona Lisa itโs massive Iโve never encountered any issues really other than some waving but it comes and goes.
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chazawalla
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 67
๐๐ป 40
October 2022
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by chazawalla on Nov 15, 2024 21:23:01 GMT 1, Iโve got a low tier 5 and low tier 7, both with pretty well defined cracks, would be interested in selling the 5 and acquiring a 2 and 3/4. Really wanted that triptych.
Wouldnโt be against upgrading the 7 for an 8 that says Hope in the corner also.
DM and we can chat
Iโve got a low tier 5 and low tier 7, both with pretty well defined cracks, would be interested in selling the 5 and acquiring a 2 and 3/4. Really wanted that triptych.
Wouldnโt be against upgrading the 7 for an 8 that says Hope in the corner also.
DM and we can chat
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hellomoon
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 4
๐๐ป 0
February 2022
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by hellomoon on Nov 16, 2024 9:39:12 GMT 1, I've decided to let go of one my tier3s if anyone is interested, DM me!
I've decided to let go of one my tier3s if anyone is interested, DM me!
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howies
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 942
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July 2008
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by howies on Nov 18, 2024 10:00:17 GMT 1, Very impressed with the detail in these, Really need to see up close to truly appreciate, Quality framing as always from Avant, if anyone selling edition numbers 150,250,350 or 650 please get in touch.
a 1 air facebook
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by King and a Duck on Nov 18, 2024 17:45:46 GMT 1, Very impressed with the detail in these, Really need to see up close to truly appreciate, Quality framing as always from Avant, if anyone selling edition numbers 150,250,350 or 650 please get in touch. a 1 air facebook
wow! ๐คฉ
Great that you got such nice numbers. Good luck completing the set.
Very impressed with the detail in these, Really need to see up close to truly appreciate, Quality framing as always from Avant, if anyone selling edition numbers 150,250,350 or 650 please get in touch. a 1 air facebookwow! ๐คฉ Great that you got such nice numbers. Good luck completing the set.
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yoss
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 484
๐๐ป 404
November 2020
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by yoss on Nov 19, 2024 22:02:46 GMT 1, where was the gold person in the last two prints? I could only find him/her in the first pic...
where was the gold person in the last two prints? I could only find him/her in the first pic...
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howies
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 942
๐๐ป 517
July 2008
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by howies on Nov 19, 2024 22:27:19 GMT 1, Don't think I will have much luck TBH, but you never know.
Gold in other two didnt reflect but they are hidden in the crevice, one is a child the other is top half of an adult.
Don't think I will have much luck TBH, but you never know.
Gold in other two didnt reflect but they are hidden in the crevice, one is a child the other is top half of an adult.
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by Fluffy Pillow on Nov 19, 2024 22:28:19 GMT 1, A gentleman in the FB group posted his triptych package containing the overall #1 with three characters.
A gentleman in the FB group posted his triptych package containing the overall #1 with three characters.
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Pejac & Avant Arte - A new print series, by Acme Thunderer on Nov 19, 2024 22:31:57 GMT 1, A gentleman in the FB group posted his triptych package containing the overall #1 with three characters. โฆand they wanted another one to make a quadriptych
A gentleman in the FB group posted his triptych package containing the overall #1 with three characters. โฆand they wanted another one to make a quadriptych
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