tonys
New Member
Posts โข 427
Likes โข 344
July 2012
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by tonys on Sept 18, 2020 22:51:29 GMT 1, I think we might see โLove is in the binโ back in an auction room very soon. And to think that was a โshockingโ ยฃ1million just 2 years ago. ยฃ10m plus now
I think we might see โLove is in the binโ back in an auction room very soon. And to think that was a โshockingโ ยฃ1million just 2 years ago. ยฃ10m plus now
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
Likes โข
January 1970
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Deleted on Sept 18, 2020 22:54:05 GMT 1, Look at other collectible markets. They are all approaching unsustainable territory with prices. And in the next few months you've got the US election, Brexit deadline, and we still have covid and a vaccine to deal with. The unemployment rate is still high, places are going through shutdowns businesses are filing for bankruptcies and having layoffs. People are trying to move money out of traditional things like the stock market and housing and into other non traditional assets. If these are at the top of the bubble, you will see a massive crash and sell off in the near future. If the stock market crashes on top of non standard speculative assets, it will be a blood bath. Or Alternatively - liquidity from central governments continue to support markets and alternative investments continue to steadily rise. Traditional investments, inc. property and old style โblue chipโ stocks (oil, banks etc.) remain unattractive. TINA comes in to play - there is no alternative - money canโt be spent on luxury items like holidays, interests rates give little return on cash - those with cash continue to invest in things like art. Limited supply comes into play too, sustaining prices, supported by a small number of v wealthy investors with too much invested to allow a crash to play out.ย
Fully agree with you! The wealthy people are always looking for different ways to spend their money and Art is for sure one way and to be honest who thinks, that they care about 10k or 20k or at the end of 50k, for them it is like you spend 50โฌ/$/ยฃ for a nice dinner.
Look at other collectible markets. They are all approaching unsustainable territory with prices. And in the next few months you've got the US election, Brexit deadline, and we still have covid and a vaccine to deal with. The unemployment rate is still high, places are going through shutdowns businesses are filing for bankruptcies and having layoffs. People are trying to move money out of traditional things like the stock market and housing and into other non traditional assets. If these are at the top of the bubble, you will see a massive crash and sell off in the near future. If the stock market crashes on top of non standard speculative assets, it will be a blood bath. Or Alternatively - liquidity from central governments continue to support markets and alternative investments continue to steadily rise. Traditional investments, inc. property and old style โblue chipโ stocks (oil, banks etc.) remain unattractive. TINA comes in to play - there is no alternative - money canโt be spent on luxury items like holidays, interests rates give little return on cash - those with cash continue to invest in things like art. Limited supply comes into play too, sustaining prices, supported by a small number of v wealthy investors with too much invested to allow a crash to play out.ย Fully agree with you! The wealthy people are always looking for different ways to spend their money and Art is for sure one way and to be honest who thinks, that they care about 10k or 20k or at the end of 50k, for them it is like you spend 50โฌ/$/ยฃ for a nice dinner.
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Gunny
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,603
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July 2012
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Gunny on Sept 18, 2020 22:55:32 GMT 1, You can only sell one item per year on cap gains, or maybe more as long as its not what you trade in. You also should have had the item for at least a year. You can also use your capital gains tax allowance for the previous year if you didn't use it........... this was discussed the other week after the last auction, Forum, i think. You cant use previous years allowance, its use it or lose it, you cant bank amy of your allowance. There used to be some sort of sliding scale based on how long you owned an item but that bit the dust a while ago. The thread from a few weeks back covered it in good detail, some accountant / tax advisor types contributed, one chap from canada explained it all in detail. Canada is not the UK, however, i don't know exactly, but this is what i was told. Happy weekend!
You can only sell one item per year on cap gains, or maybe more as long as its not what you trade in. You also should have had the item for at least a year. You can also use your capital gains tax allowance for the previous year if you didn't use it........... this was discussed the other week after the last auction, Forum, i think. You cant use previous years allowance, its use it or lose it, you cant bank amy of your allowance. There used to be some sort of sliding scale based on how long you owned an item but that bit the dust a while ago. The thread from a few weeks back covered it in good detail, some accountant / tax advisor types contributed, one chap from canada explained it all in detail. Canada is not the UK, however, i don't know exactly, but this is what i was told. Happy weekend!
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Lazarus II
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,803
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August 2019
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Lazarus II on Sept 18, 2020 23:11:31 GMT 1, this was discussed the other week after the last auction, Forum, i think. You cant use previous years allowance, its use it or lose it, you cant bank amy of your allowance. There used to be some sort of sliding scale based on how long you owned an item but that bit the dust a while ago. The thread from a few weeks back covered it in good detail, some accountant / tax advisor types contributed, one chap from canada explained it all in detail. Canada is not the UK, however,ย i don't know exactly, but this is what i was told. Happy weekend! the chap from Canada acknowledged that he was not in UK but he had a good grasp of UK tax laws as did the others from the UK who contributed to that thread and it covered the questions raised here tonight. Anyhow, death and taxes and that includes CGT๐
this was discussed the other week after the last auction, Forum, i think. You cant use previous years allowance, its use it or lose it, you cant bank amy of your allowance. There used to be some sort of sliding scale based on how long you owned an item but that bit the dust a while ago. The thread from a few weeks back covered it in good detail, some accountant / tax advisor types contributed, one chap from canada explained it all in detail. Canada is not the UK, however,ย i don't know exactly, but this is what i was told. Happy weekend! the chap from Canada acknowledged that he was not in UK but he had a good grasp of UK tax laws as did the others from the UK who contributed to that thread and it covered the questions raised here tonight. Anyhow, death and taxes and that includes CGT๐
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aki
New Member
Posts โข 565
Likes โข 356
June 2017
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by aki on Sept 18, 2020 23:11:42 GMT 1, So using this if I sold half a million quids worth of prints Iโm paying nearly 100k in capital gains. Car parks and briefcases full of cash anyone?๐ depends on what you paid for them. The tax is on the gain you make after you consume your annual allowance.
Cost me about a grand, I should make sure I have a year off before selling for the extra 10k
So using this if I sold half a million quids worth of prints Iโm paying nearly 100k in capital gains. Car parks and briefcases full of cash anyone?๐ depends on what you paid for them. The tax is on the gain you make after you consume your annual allowance. Cost me about a grand, I should make sure I have a year off before selling for the extra 10k
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Rubberneck
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,050
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October 2018
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Rubberneck on Sept 18, 2020 23:15:00 GMT 1, If youโre married your wife also has a ยฃ12300 allowance as does any child over 18 who lives with you, could actually be from 14 for kids but double check with your accountant. You can claim any cost tied to the print, purchase price, restoration, framing, security, storage, humidity control.. there is a thread on cgt on here which goes through.. essentially the equivalent paye earnings would be taxed at 40% but ...
If youโre married your wife also has a ยฃ12300 allowance as does any child over 18 who lives with you, could actually be from 14 for kids but double check with your accountant. You can claim any cost tied to the print, purchase price, restoration, framing, security, storage, humidity control.. there is a thread on cgt on here which goes through.. essentially the equivalent paye earnings would be taxed at 40% but ...
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Lazarus II
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,803
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August 2019
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Lazarus II on Sept 18, 2020 23:15:46 GMT 1, depends on what you paid for them. The tax is on the gain you make after you consume your annual allowance. Cost me about a grand, I should make sure I have a year off before selling for the extra 10k if you paid ยฃ1k for it, sold it for say ยฃ53k then youd pay tax on ยฃ40k. Ie the gain was ยฃ52k, your annual allowamce is ยฃ12k so you pay tax on ยฃ40k.
If you are married or have civil partner and you both own the print then you can use both your ยฃ12k allowances.
Ps not sure about civil partner tax allowance.
depends on what you paid for them. The tax is on the gain you make after you consume your annual allowance. Cost me about a grand, I should make sure I have a year off before selling for the extra 10k if you paid ยฃ1k for it, sold it for say ยฃ53k then youd pay tax on ยฃ40k. Ie the gain was ยฃ52k, your annual allowamce is ยฃ12k so you pay tax on ยฃ40k. If you are married or have civil partner and you both own the print then you can use both your ยฃ12k allowances. Ps not sure about civil partner tax allowance.
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Pipes
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,438
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January 2012
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Pipes on Sept 18, 2020 23:20:50 GMT 1, First time I have seen Hangup have 0 prints for sale.
They used to have 30 at any time a few years ago.
hanguppictures.com/artists/banksy
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Lazarus II
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,803
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August 2019
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Lazarus II on Sept 18, 2020 23:23:02 GMT 1, this was discussed the other week after the last auction, Forum, i think. You cant use previous years allowance, its use it or lose it, you cant bank amy of your allowance. There used to be some sort of sliding scale based on how long you owned an item but that bit the dust a while ago. The thread from a few weeks back covered it in good detail, some accountant / tax advisor types contributed, one chap from canada explained it all in detail. Canada is not the UK, however,ย i don't know exactly, but this is what i was told. Happy weekend!
This thread here covers lots of it.
urbanartassociation.com/thread/165590/banksy-owners-intend-avoid-capital?page=2
this was discussed the other week after the last auction, Forum, i think. You cant use previous years allowance, its use it or lose it, you cant bank amy of your allowance. There used to be some sort of sliding scale based on how long you owned an item but that bit the dust a while ago. The thread from a few weeks back covered it in good detail, some accountant / tax advisor types contributed, one chap from canada explained it all in detail. Canada is not the UK, however,ย i don't know exactly, but this is what i was told. Happy weekend! This thread here covers lots of it. urbanartassociation.com/thread/165590/banksy-owners-intend-avoid-capital?page=2
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shaunyboy
New Member
Posts โข 559
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March 2008
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by shaunyboy on Sept 18, 2020 23:25:37 GMT 1, Hiscox working late tonight.
Hiscox working late tonight.
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Lazarus II
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,803
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August 2019
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Lazarus II on Sept 18, 2020 23:28:21 GMT 1, Hiscox working late tonight. hiscox making as much as Sothebys after today๐
Hiscox working late tonight. hiscox making as much as Sothebys after today๐
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topboy
New Member
Posts โข 122
Likes โข 141
February 2020
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by topboy on Sept 18, 2020 23:32:08 GMT 1, Nola AP (Green Rain) ยฃ226,800 / $294 So after that result, do you think a white rain will reach ยฃ150,000?
Nola AP (Green Rain) ยฃ226,800 / $294 So after that result, do you think a white rain will reach ยฃ150,000?
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Pipes
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,438
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January 2012
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Pipes on Sept 18, 2020 23:44:00 GMT 1, Nola AP (Green Rain) ยฃ226,800 / $294 So after that result, do you think a white rain will reach ยฃ150,000?
That wasnโt an AP itโs edition of 31.
Orange edition 32
APโs edition of 66
If you look closely - the APโs are signed in the grey part of the image.
The editions are signed in the white border.
I need to get out more.
Nola AP (Green Rain) ยฃ226,800 / $294 So after that result, do you think a white rain will reach ยฃ150,000? That wasnโt an AP itโs edition of 31. Orange edition 32 APโs edition of 66 If you look closely - the APโs are signed in the grey part of the image. The editions are signed in the white border. I need to get out more.
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topboy
New Member
Posts โข 122
Likes โข 141
February 2020
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by topboy on Sept 18, 2020 23:59:26 GMT 1, Nola AP (Green Rain) ยฃ226,800 / $294 So after that result, do you think a white rain will reach ยฃ150,000? That wasnโt an AP itโs edition of 31. Orange edition 32 APโs edition of 66 If you look closely - the APโs are signed in the grey part of the image. The editions are signed in the white border. I need to get out more.
OK thanks. I just copied and pasted the part of the previous post. So maybe closer to ยฃ120,000 then? Yeah I guess we will have to wait and see when one comes up for sale ( at a big(ish) auction house).
Nola AP (Green Rain) ยฃ226,800 / $294 So after that result, do you think a white rain will reach ยฃ150,000? That wasnโt an AP itโs edition of 31. Orange edition 32 APโs edition of 66 If you look closely - the APโs are signed in the grey part of the image. The editions are signed in the white border. I need to get out more. OK thanks. I just copied and pasted the part of the previous post. So maybe closer to ยฃ120,000 then? Yeah I guess we will have to wait and see when one comes up for sale ( at a big(ish) auction house).
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Pipes
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,438
Likes โข 2,883
January 2012
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Pipes on Sept 19, 2020 0:00:55 GMT 1, That wasnโt an AP itโs edition of 31. Orange edition 32 APโs edition of 66 If you look closely - the APโs are signed in the grey part of the image. The editions are signed in the white border. I need to get out more. OK thanks. I just copied and pasted the part of the previous post. So maybe closer to ยฃ120,000 then? Yeah I guess we will have to wait and see when one comes up for sale ( at a big(ish) auction house).
Not a long wait
onlineonly.christies.com/s/banksy-i-cant-believe-you-morons-actually-buy-sh-t/banksy-b-1974-3/99332
That wasnโt an AP itโs edition of 31. Orange edition 32 APโs edition of 66 If you look closely - the APโs are signed in the grey part of the image. The editions are signed in the white border. I need to get out more. OK thanks. I just copied and pasted the part of the previous post. So maybe closer to ยฃ120,000 then? Yeah I guess we will have to wait and see when one comes up for sale ( at a big(ish) auction house). Not a long wait onlineonly.christies.com/s/banksy-i-cant-believe-you-morons-actually-buy-sh-t/banksy-b-1974-3/99332
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ssg08
New Member
Posts โข 85
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October 2016
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by ssg08 on Sept 19, 2020 0:19:00 GMT 1, Wow ยฃ44,1000 for applause and flags ๐
Wow ยฃ44,1000 for applause and flags ๐
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Charlie Bronson
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,443
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February 2014
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Charlie Bronson on Sept 19, 2020 0:27:55 GMT 1, I was going to put my Choose your weapon in this sale. They were going to put it on the front cover of the catalog. i declined in the current climate, wrong decision! Im regretting it now. Mad prices indeed.
No way, bud. Keep that thing. Arguably one of his top 5. Warholโs Marilyn numbers in 20 years.
I was going to put my Choose your weapon in this sale. They were going to put it on the front cover of the catalog. i declined in the current climate, wrong decision! Im regretting it now. Mad prices indeed. No way, bud. Keep that thing. Arguably one of his top 5. Warholโs Marilyn numbers in 20 years.
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ssg08
New Member
Posts โข 85
Likes โข 41
October 2016
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by ssg08 on Sept 19, 2020 1:38:05 GMT 1, Wow ยฃ44,1000 for applause and flags ๐ Maybe one too many zerosย
๐ sorry about that, my bad.
Wow ยฃ44,1000 for applause and flags ๐ Maybe one too many zerosย ๐ sorry about that, my bad.
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duffer31
New Member
Posts โข 382
Likes โข 359
November 2016
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by duffer31 on Sept 19, 2020 6:07:43 GMT 1, Maybe one too many zerosย ๐ sorry about that, my bad.
Give it another two - three months / years that zero could be a reality lol. Nobody knows what way this market is heading.
Maybe one too many zerosย ๐ sorry about that, my bad. Give it another two - three months / years that zero could be a reality lol. Nobody knows what way this market is heading.
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duffer31
New Member
Posts โข 382
Likes โข 359
November 2016
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by duffer31 on Sept 19, 2020 6:14:47 GMT 1,
They had a chocolate donuts on Monday, it was sold by Tuesday (anyone know the price?)
They had a chocolate donuts on Monday, it was sold by Tuesday (anyone know the price?)
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sfnyc
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,117
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August 2017
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by sfnyc on Sept 19, 2020 6:58:43 GMT 1, mine is in mint condition
If that's sitting in a flat file, I dont want to imagine what you got framed on the walls!
mine is in mint condition If that's sitting in a flat file, I dont want to imagine what you got framed on the walls!
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Number48
New Member
Posts โข 167
Likes โข 206
July 2015
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Number48 on Sept 19, 2020 7:57:15 GMT 1, They had a chocolate donuts on Monday, it was sold by Tuesday (anyone know the price?)
It was ยฃ60K
They had a chocolate donuts on Monday, it was sold by Tuesday (anyone know the price?) It was ยฃ60K
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duffer31
New Member
Posts โข 382
Likes โข 359
November 2016
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by duffer31 on Sept 19, 2020 9:15:31 GMT 1, mine is in mint condition If that's sitting in a flat file, I dont want to imagine what you got framed on the walls!
His portfolio
mine is in mint condition If that's sitting in a flat file, I dont want to imagine what you got framed on the walls! His portfolio
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F*X
New Member
Posts โข 556
Likes โข 400
February 2009
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by F*X on Sept 19, 2020 9:32:45 GMT 1, If this was mine I would be tempted to pull it and consign to a higher profile auction house.
If this was mine I would be tempted to pull it and consign to a higher profile auction house.
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bob60
New Member
Posts โข 238
Likes โข 152
May 2014
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by bob60 on Sept 19, 2020 10:23:01 GMT 1, If this was mine I would be tempted to pull it and consign to a higher profile auction house. Personally I'd be too scared to sell now as I feel we've not hit the top yet.
You never know when prices are at their peak until afterwards, same as you don't know when they are at their lowest. If we did then we'd all be rich. It's the same as in property, plenty of people buy at the peak of a boom then spend years in negative equity unable to sell.
If this was mine I would be tempted to pull it and consign to a higher profile auction house. Personally I'd be too scared to sell now as I feel we've not hit the top yet. You never know when prices are at their peak until afterwards, same as you don't know when they are at their lowest. If we did then we'd all be rich. It's the same as in property, plenty of people buy at the peak of a boom then spend years in negative equity unable to sell.
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by My Name is Frank on Sept 19, 2020 11:09:25 GMT 1, Didn't you say you were rich enough to buy at these prices? i wouldn't pay 40k+ for an unsigned damaged print from any artist living or dead. not for me, regardless of if i have the funds. this seems like a super rich person's game now. takes a lot of the fun out of it, and it's definitely changing the culture of the forum. i posted think tank process pictures a few days ago and no one even commented. everyone too busy posting the latest auction results. I may not have commented on that thread, but I did put on Think Tank again as a result, it's a really great album!
Didn't you say you were rich enough to buy at these prices? i wouldn't pay 40k+ for an unsigned damaged print from any artist living or dead. not for me, regardless of if i have the funds. this seems like a super rich person's game now. takes a lot of the fun out of it, and it's definitely changing the culture of the forum. i posted think tank process pictures a few days ago and no one even commented. everyone too busy posting the latest auction results. I may not have commented on that thread, but I did put on Think Tank again as a result, it's a really great album!
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
Likes โข
January 1970
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Deleted on Sept 19, 2020 11:36:56 GMT 1, Iโve got a feeling that prices wonโt be this high in the coming months... and Flags wonโt continue to sell for ยฃ40,000. Interesting that this was billed as a dedicated Banksy sale, though, perhaps other items have gone unnoticed by people looking for Banksy prints as theyโve been part of a broader theme Of course no one knows but my take on it is the people spending these sums aren't stupid, they're not going to spend ยฃ230k on a print that was ยฃ30k a few months back if they didn't know Banksy is going to be heavily backed in the coming years.
Fully agree with your post, the people who have the money are not stupid, they are not thinking from month to month or maybe in a period of one year, they are thinking long term. I hope that, a lot of people will put now there works at the market, that the prices fall a bit, so it is a nice opportunity to get them for a nice price.
Iโve got a feeling that prices wonโt be this high in the coming months... and Flags wonโt continue to sell for ยฃ40,000. Interesting that this was billed as a dedicated Banksy sale, though, perhaps other items have gone unnoticed by people looking for Banksy prints as theyโve been part of a broader theme Of course no one knows but my take on it is the people spending these sums aren't stupid, they're not going to spend ยฃ230k on a print that was ยฃ30k a few months back if they didn't know Banksy is going to be heavily backed in the coming years. Fully agree with your post, the people who have the money are not stupid, they are not thinking from month to month or maybe in a period of one year, they are thinking long term. I hope that, a lot of people will put now there works at the market, that the prices fall a bit, so it is a nice opportunity to get them for a nice price.
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bob60
New Member
Posts โข 238
Likes โข 152
May 2014
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by bob60 on Sept 19, 2020 12:15:24 GMT 1, Of course no one knows but my take on it is the people spending these sums aren't stupid, they're not going to spend ยฃ230k on a print that was ยฃ30k a few months back if they didn't know Banksy is going to be heavily backed in the coming years. Fully agree with your post, the people who have the money are not stupid, they are not thinking from month to month or maybe in a period of one year, they are thinking long term. I hope that, a lot of people will put now there works at the market, that the prices fall a bit, so it is a nice opportunity to get them for a nice price.
Even if prices do 'fall a bit' these prints are still out of reach to almost everyone. Very few people can afford ยฃ40.000-ยฃ250.000 + for a print. Most people are a couple of paychecks away from not being able to pay their rent or mortgage..
Of course no one knows but my take on it is the people spending these sums aren't stupid, they're not going to spend ยฃ230k on a print that was ยฃ30k a few months back if they didn't know Banksy is going to be heavily backed in the coming years. Fully agree with your post, the people who have the money are not stupid, they are not thinking from month to month or maybe in a period of one year, they are thinking long term. I hope that, a lot of people will put now there works at the market, that the prices fall a bit, so it is a nice opportunity to get them for a nice price. Even if prices do 'fall a bit' these prints are still out of reach to almost everyone. Very few people can afford ยฃ40.000-ยฃ250.000 + for a print. Most people are a couple of paychecks away from not being able to pay their rent or mortgage..
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Pipes
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,438
Likes โข 2,883
January 2012
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by Pipes on Sept 19, 2020 12:39:50 GMT 1,
8 prints for sale on here on 24 hours !
First time I have seen that too ๐
(Yes I realise I am talking to myself)
8 prints for sale on here on 24 hours ! First time I have seen that too ๐ (Yes I realise I am talking to myself)
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tab1
Full Member
Posts โข 8,519
Likes โข 3,679
September 2011
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Sotheby's Art Auctions โข LONDON ๐ฌ๐ง, by tab1 on Sept 19, 2020 12:43:16 GMT 1, 8 prints for sale on here on 24 hours ! First time I have seen that too ๐ (Yes I realise I am talking to myself)
Direct to the market and auctions from now on with the monies involved for most sellers They had a good run Gdp rats, posters and mats from now on ๐ฌ
8 prints for sale on here on 24 hours ! First time I have seen that too ๐ (Yes I realise I am talking to myself) Direct to the market and auctions from now on with the monies involved for most sellers They had a good run Gdp rats, posters and mats from now on ๐ฌ
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