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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by mcnuts on Aug 7, 2007 9:07:36 GMT 1, I've seen the two terms used interchangeably and also used to differentiate two strategies.
So, what is the difference between a bagger and a flipper?
A bagger is just in it for the cash? A shrew and calculating opportunist? A flipper does it for the love of art and his/her art collection?
What is the accepted time delay to transition between the two  ?
VS
There was a similar thread on Obey a while back which generated a very interesting discussion.
I've seen the two terms used interchangeably and also used to differentiate two strategies. So, what is the difference between a bagger and a flipper? A bagger is just in it for the cash? A shrew and calculating opportunist? A flipper does it for the love of art and his/her art collection? What is the accepted time delay to transition between the two ? VSThere was a similar thread on Obey a while back which generated a very interesting discussion. |
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by jonpud on Aug 7, 2007 9:10:03 GMT 1, This one's easy, a Bagger appears to be human and the flipper a dolphin!? Is there a prize for the right answer?? ;D
This one's easy, a Bagger appears to be human and the flipper a dolphin!? Is there a prize for the right answer?? ;D
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by mcnuts on Aug 7, 2007 9:19:48 GMT 1, see, its a tough one. Seems like the difference is more of a moral one or some time of collective norm than a purely ideological one.
No pot calling the kettle black here. I don't work int he City or have deep pockets so without selling a few things i couldnt pay for other stuff. At the same time, i havent bought a ton of POW releases such as the silver sid just to sell on. Again, a fine line as clear as London fog 
see, its a tough one. Seems like the difference is more of a moral one or some time of collective norm than a purely ideological one. No pot calling the kettle black here. I don't work int he City or have deep pockets so without selling a few things i couldnt pay for other stuff. At the same time, i havent bought a ton of POW releases such as the silver sid just to sell on. Again, a fine line as clear as London fog |
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by manchestermike on Aug 7, 2007 9:30:00 GMT 1, I see it as a bagger buys everything, throws it all in their bag and then sells. The flipper is the more discerning bagger, these people buy up selected items where the profit margin is bigger.
No flipper would have been stung by Eric the Dog, Beautiful Losers etc
I see it as a bagger buys everything, throws it all in their bag and then sells. The flipper is the more discerning bagger, these people buy up selected items where the profit margin is bigger.
No flipper would have been stung by Eric the Dog, Beautiful Losers etc
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by mcnuts on Aug 7, 2007 9:34:02 GMT 1, I see it as a bagger buys everything, throws it all in their bag and then sells. The flipper is the more discerning bagger, these people buy up selected items where the profit margin is bigger. No flipper would have been stung by Eric the Dog, Beautiful Losers etc
MM... i like that.... "The flipper is the more discerning bagger" very interesting.... what about claims that one difference is an "appreciation" for the work?
Too true re EtD and BL as well....
I see it as a bagger buys everything, throws it all in their bag and then sells. The flipper is the more discerning bagger, these people buy up selected items where the profit margin is bigger. No flipper would have been stung by Eric the Dog, Beautiful Losers etc MM... i like that.... "The flipper is the more discerning bagger" very interesting.... what about claims that one difference is an "appreciation" for the work? Too true re EtD and BL as well.... |
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lesroy
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by lesroy on Aug 7, 2007 9:38:08 GMT 1, Good point Mike about the Eric the dog etc.
This is a hard question. Selling of any type is so frowned apon, unless you hold on for a while atleast.
I bought a few Micallef's from Eyestorm for about ยฃ500 each... I bought coz I love them yet they were still REALLY expensive to me at the time. Now they are worth more I have sold one to pay for a more desirable print from Laz (imo)... now that "technically" is flipping but I have owned the print for over a year and have it framed etc so that seems to be ok?!
I agree that a bagger will simply by everything and anything as soon as it appears on POW... regardless of quality etc (like the recent set of 6 cows perhaps?)
Good point Mike about the Eric the dog etc.
This is a hard question. Selling of any type is so frowned apon, unless you hold on for a while atleast.
I bought a few Micallef's from Eyestorm for about ยฃ500 each... I bought coz I love them yet they were still REALLY expensive to me at the time. Now they are worth more I have sold one to pay for a more desirable print from Laz (imo)... now that "technically" is flipping but I have owned the print for over a year and have it framed etc so that seems to be ok?!
I agree that a bagger will simply by everything and anything as soon as it appears on POW... regardless of quality etc (like the recent set of 6 cows perhaps?)
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by jonpud on Aug 7, 2007 9:38:31 GMT 1, I have absolutely no problem with people selling on what are ultimately their possessions, and no problem with them making a profit from it either really, if it wasn't for people selling then I wouldn't have the pieces hanging on my wall that I now have!
In theory anyone who has sold on or swapped a piece of art is a flipper, I am guilty of it myself, but I have NEVER bought a piece and sold it on within a day or even a year, I genuinely only buy art I like and that I would want to frame, hang on a wall and enjoy.
People like dankster really fuck me off, embarrassing for him/her but they didn't even remove the print from the tube before advertising it for sale, it was another forum member who pointed the small issue out to him that POW had not sent the prints out yet!
This is a new 'member' to the forum who has simply joined to sell for a profit to other forum members and then has the cheek to neg me for letting him know that I disapprove! Surely all true members of the forum feel ripped off by people like this?
I don't think this person falls into either of your categories, I am sure I can think of another word to describe him!! ;D
I have absolutely no problem with people selling on what are ultimately their possessions, and no problem with them making a profit from it either really, if it wasn't for people selling then I wouldn't have the pieces hanging on my wall that I now have!
In theory anyone who has sold on or swapped a piece of art is a flipper, I am guilty of it myself, but I have NEVER bought a piece and sold it on within a day or even a year, I genuinely only buy art I like and that I would want to frame, hang on a wall and enjoy.
People like dankster really fuck me off, embarrassing for him/her but they didn't even remove the print from the tube before advertising it for sale, it was another forum member who pointed the small issue out to him that POW had not sent the prints out yet!
This is a new 'member' to the forum who has simply joined to sell for a profit to other forum members and then has the cheek to neg me for letting him know that I disapprove! Surely all true members of the forum feel ripped off by people like this?
I don't think this person falls into either of your categories, I am sure I can think of another word to describe him!! ;D
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by jonpud on Aug 7, 2007 9:43:18 GMT 1, Good point Mike about the Eric the dog etc. This is a hard question. Selling of any type is so frowned apon, unless you hold on for a while atleast. I bought a few Micallef's from Eyestorm for about ยฃ500 each... I bought coz I love them yet they were still REALLY expensive to me at the time. Now they are worth more I have sold one to pay for a more desirable print from Laz (imo)... now that "technically" is flipping but I have owned the print for over a year and have it framed etc so that seems to be ok?! I agree that a bagger will simply by everything and anything as soon as it appears on POW... regardless of quality etc (like the recent set of 6 cows perhaps?)
Exactly Lesroy, I went on to POW the other day, there was only 1 signed Invader print left,I put it in my basket but then had a guilty moment, I didn't actually like it and it was the LAST one. Left it for someone who actually wanted it, don't know if its still there?
And the beautiful loser prints were an excellent example of buying up art that people didn't actually like!!
Good point Mike about the Eric the dog etc. This is a hard question. Selling of any type is so frowned apon, unless you hold on for a while atleast. I bought a few Micallef's from Eyestorm for about ยฃ500 each... I bought coz I love them yet they were still REALLY expensive to me at the time. Now they are worth more I have sold one to pay for a more desirable print from Laz (imo)... now that "technically" is flipping but I have owned the print for over a year and have it framed etc so that seems to be ok?! I agree that a bagger will simply by everything and anything as soon as it appears on POW... regardless of quality etc (like the recent set of 6 cows perhaps?) Exactly Lesroy, I went on to POW the other day, there was only 1 signed Invader print left,I put it in my basket but then had a guilty moment, I didn't actually like it and it was the LAST one. Left it for someone who actually wanted it, don't know if its still there? And the beautiful loser prints were an excellent example of buying up art that people didn't actually like!! |
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by jonpud on Aug 7, 2007 9:47:13 GMT 1, Oh and thanks for the respect back chaps! It wasn't my intention to gain points, just hate being neg'd for offering an opinion, after all thats what this forum is all about, isn't it??
Oh and thanks for the respect back chaps! It wasn't my intention to gain points, just hate being neg'd for offering an opinion, after all thats what this forum is all about, isn't it??
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by mcnuts on Aug 7, 2007 9:47:27 GMT 1, on a similar line though, I would, for example buy "sale ends" though I don't really like it but I know I could trade it for a "festival" print which I like more. So, less of a flip and more of getting a leg up to make a horizontal move. Again a technique already discussed in other context but no doubt an accepted practice and I will call anyone who says they would pass up the opportunity to do so
on a similar line though, I would, for example buy "sale ends" though I don't really like it but I know I could trade it for a "festival" print which I like more. So, less of a flip and more of getting a leg up to make a horizontal move. Again a technique already discussed in other context but no doubt an accepted practice and I will call anyone who says they would pass up the opportunity to do so |
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pezlow
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by pezlow on Aug 7, 2007 9:50:09 GMT 1, I don't really think there is much difference in terminology. I think the only thing that annoys people on these boards is the out and out blatant buying of something one day and selling it on at a hugely inflated price the next day.
Apart from that a little bit of buying and selling and trading up makes the world go round. I would never have been able to afford an adam neate print had I not thought that I would be able to sell a few bits to pay for it.
I don't really think there is much difference in terminology. I think the only thing that annoys people on these boards is the out and out blatant buying of something one day and selling it on at a hugely inflated price the next day.
Apart from that a little bit of buying and selling and trading up makes the world go round. I would never have been able to afford an adam neate print had I not thought that I would be able to sell a few bits to pay for it.
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by jonpud on Aug 7, 2007 9:52:38 GMT 1, on a similar line though, I would, for example buy "sale ends" though I don't really like it but I know I could trade it for a "festival" print which I like more. So, less of a flip and more of getting a leg up to make a horizontal move. Again a technique already discussed in other context but no doubt an accepted practice and I will call anyone who says they would pass up the opportunity to do so
Perfectly acceptable practise as the swap would be beneficial to both parties, this is not the same as buying for 600, selling for 3k+ and pissing it up the wall!! Wankers!!!!
on a similar line though, I would, for example buy "sale ends" though I don't really like it but I know I could trade it for a "festival" print which I like more. So, less of a flip and more of getting a leg up to make a horizontal move. Again a technique already discussed in other context but no doubt an accepted practice and I will call anyone who says they would pass up the opportunity to do so Perfectly acceptable practise as the swap would be beneficial to both parties, this is not the same as buying for 600, selling for 3k+ and pissing it up the wall!! Wankers!!!! |
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by mcnuts on Aug 7, 2007 9:53:41 GMT 1, I don't really think there is much difference in terminology. I think the only thing that annoys people on these boards is the out and out blatant buying of something one day and selling it on at a hugely inflated price the next day. Apart from that a little bit of buying and selling and trading up makes the world go round. I would never have been able to afford an adam neate print had I not thought that I would be able to sell a few bits to pay for it.
that makes sense to me...
so baggers remains a noun while flipper/flip is more of a verb ... a process that baggers expedite
I don't really think there is much difference in terminology. I think the only thing that annoys people on these boards is the out and out blatant buying of something one day and selling it on at a hugely inflated price the next day. Apart from that a little bit of buying and selling and trading up makes the world go round. I would never have been able to afford an adam neate print had I not thought that I would be able to sell a few bits to pay for it. that makes sense to me... so baggers remains a noun while flipper/flip is more of a verb ... a process that baggers expedite |
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by finsburyparkranger on Aug 7, 2007 9:54:19 GMT 1, I don't really think there is much difference in terminology. I think the only thing that annoys people on these boards is the out and out blatant buying of something one day and selling it on at a hugely inflated price the next day. Apart from that a little bit of buying and selling and trading up makes the world go round. I would never have been able to afford an adam neate print had I not thought that I would be able to sell a few bits to pay for it.
Another very reasonable and ballanced comment from your good self pezlow. I'll second that.
I don't really think there is much difference in terminology. I think the only thing that annoys people on these boards is the out and out blatant buying of something one day and selling it on at a hugely inflated price the next day. Apart from that a little bit of buying and selling and trading up makes the world go round. I would never have been able to afford an adam neate print had I not thought that I would be able to sell a few bits to pay for it. Another very reasonable and ballanced comment from your good self pezlow. I'll second that. |
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by jonpud on Aug 7, 2007 9:54:28 GMT 1, on a similar line though, I would, for example buy "sale ends" though I don't really like it but I know I could trade it for a "festival" print which I like more. So, less of a flip and more of getting a leg up to make a horizontal move. Again a technique already discussed in other context but no doubt an accepted practice and I will call anyone who says they would pass up the opportunity to do so Perfectly acceptable practise as the swap would be beneficial to both parties, this is not the same as buying for 600, selling for 3k+ and pissing it up the wall!! Wankers!!!!
What no *******'s? Oops sorry silky!! 
on a similar line though, I would, for example buy "sale ends" though I don't really like it but I know I could trade it for a "festival" print which I like more. So, less of a flip and more of getting a leg up to make a horizontal move. Again a technique already discussed in other context but no doubt an accepted practice and I will call anyone who says they would pass up the opportunity to do so Perfectly acceptable practise as the swap would be beneficial to both parties, this is not the same as buying for 600, selling for 3k+ and pissing it up the wall!! Wankers!!!! What no *******'s? Oops sorry silky!! |
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by jonpud on Aug 7, 2007 9:56:07 GMT 1, I don't really think there is much difference in terminology. I think the only thing that annoys people on these boards is the out and out blatant buying of something one day and selling it on at a hugely inflated price the next day. Apart from that a little bit of buying and selling and trading up makes the world go round. I would never have been able to afford an adam neate print had I not thought that I would be able to sell a few bits to pay for it.
Spot on pezlow, and I am your perfect annoyed example!!
I don't really think there is much difference in terminology. I think the only thing that annoys people on these boards is the out and out blatant buying of something one day and selling it on at a hugely inflated price the next day. Apart from that a little bit of buying and selling and trading up makes the world go round. I would never have been able to afford an adam neate print had I not thought that I would be able to sell a few bits to pay for it. Spot on pezlow, and I am your perfect annoyed example!! |
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pezlow
Junior Member
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by pezlow on Aug 7, 2007 9:56:24 GMT 1, I don't really think there is much difference in terminology. I think the only thing that annoys people on these boards is the out and out blatant buying of something one day and selling it on at a hugely inflated price the next day. Apart from that a little bit of buying and selling and trading up makes the world go round. I would never have been able to afford an adam neate print had I not thought that I would be able to sell a few bits to pay for it. that makes sense to me then... so baggers remains a noun then while flipping is more of an adjective
Or verb maybe. Hell who knows and who cares
I don't really think there is much difference in terminology. I think the only thing that annoys people on these boards is the out and out blatant buying of something one day and selling it on at a hugely inflated price the next day. Apart from that a little bit of buying and selling and trading up makes the world go round. I would never have been able to afford an adam neate print had I not thought that I would be able to sell a few bits to pay for it. that makes sense to me then... so baggers remains a noun then while flipping is more of an adjective Or verb maybe. Hell who knows and who cares |
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alvington89
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by alvington89 on Aug 7, 2007 9:58:01 GMT 1, A flipper is the same as a bagger, the only difference is that a flipper sells immediately wheras a bagger is more patient.
A flipper is the same as a bagger, the only difference is that a flipper sells immediately wheras a bagger is more patient.
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by mcnuts on Aug 7, 2007 9:58:21 GMT 1, spot on. I always had a hard time with grammar
spot on. I always had a hard time with grammar |
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by mcnuts on Aug 7, 2007 9:59:04 GMT 1, A flipper is the same as a bagger, the only difference is that a flipper sells immediately wheras a bagger is more patient.
sounds like the US school of thought...
A flipper is the same as a bagger, the only difference is that a flipper sells immediately wheras a bagger is more patient. sounds like the US school of thought... |
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Harveyn
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by Harveyn on Aug 7, 2007 10:05:09 GMT 1, What if someone buys two or three pieces with the sole intention to sell straightaway for a profit but their motive is to fund the purchase of another piece of art that they cannot afford without using this method.
By the way I have never done this just thought I would throw it into the debate.
What if someone buys two or three pieces with the sole intention to sell straightaway for a profit but their motive is to fund the purchase of another piece of art that they cannot afford without using this method.
By the way I have never done this just thought I would throw it into the debate.
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by irf2112 on Aug 7, 2007 10:08:19 GMT 1, I also feel its about whether you have a passion for art or are in it strictly for business.
(Still remembering the thread about the tits who thought they'd bag DFace's 'what wars are for' prints'. Well done to those that ensured they left Stolen Space pissed off)
I also feel its about whether you have a passion for art or are in it strictly for business.
(Still remembering the thread about the tits who thought they'd bag DFace's 'what wars are for' prints'. Well done to those that ensured they left Stolen Space pissed off)
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by jonpud on Aug 7, 2007 10:09:30 GMT 1, What if someone buys two or three pieces with the sole intention to sell straightaway for a profit but their motive is to fund the purchase of another piece of art that they cannot afford without using this method. By the way I have never done this just thought I would throw it into the debate.
Hmmmmm, difficult, but the galleries are stopping this now with the one per person rule. However if you had ยฃ705,000.00 you could have bought all 150 Micallef prints from LAZ!!
What if someone buys two or three pieces with the sole intention to sell straightaway for a profit but their motive is to fund the purchase of another piece of art that they cannot afford without using this method. By the way I have never done this just thought I would throw it into the debate. Hmmmmm, difficult, but the galleries are stopping this now with the one per person rule. However if you had ยฃ705,000.00 you could have bought all 150 Micallef prints from LAZ!! |
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by carlito on Aug 7, 2007 10:12:39 GMT 1, if you do not have unlimited funds than you will have to sell to buy on occasion.... ppl who don't understand this and neg others for having to do this...either are related to Roman Abromavich or don't live in the real world or both
if you do not have unlimited funds than you will have to sell to buy on occasion.... ppl who don't understand this and neg others for having to do this...either are related to Roman Abromavich or don't live in the real world or both |
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by jonpud on Aug 7, 2007 10:14:22 GMT 1, Thinking a little more how can you critisize anyone who buys 10 Grin Reapers from Ebay and pays the going rate at the time and then makes a bigger profit 10 months later? I would have thought the after market is fair game??
Thinking a little more how can you critisize anyone who buys 10 Grin Reapers from Ebay and pays the going rate at the time and then makes a bigger profit 10 months later? I would have thought the after market is fair game??
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paulah
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by paulah on Aug 7, 2007 10:15:10 GMT 1, Maybe Silky could make a special green star for baggers/flippers!
Maybe Silky could make a special green star for baggers/flippers!
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by jonpud on Aug 7, 2007 10:17:06 GMT 1, if you do not have unlimited funds than you will have to sell to buy on occasion.... ppl who don't understand this and neg others for having to do this...either are related to Roman Abromavich or don't live in the real world or both
No argument from me, don't think anyone on this thread or forum has a problem with people selling, I want a silver Sid, I am willing to pay the going rate but I refuse point blank to buy it from dankster!!
if you do not have unlimited funds than you will have to sell to buy on occasion.... ppl who don't understand this and neg others for having to do this...either are related to Roman Abromavich or don't live in the real world or both No argument from me, don't think anyone on this thread or forum has a problem with people selling, I want a silver Sid, I am willing to pay the going rate but I refuse point blank to buy it from dankster!! |
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by carlito on Aug 7, 2007 10:18:26 GMT 1, Thinking a little more how can you critisize anyone who buys 10 Grin Reapers from Ebay and pays the going rate at the time and then makes a bigger profit 10 months later? I would have thought the after market is fair game??
they've paid the market rate..and will sell at the market rate...expensive game to play but hats off to them whether we like it or not
Thinking a little more how can you critisize anyone who buys 10 Grin Reapers from Ebay and pays the going rate at the time and then makes a bigger profit 10 months later? I would have thought the after market is fair game?? they've paid the market rate..and will sell at the market rate...expensive game to play but hats off to them whether we like it or not |
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Flipping Art โข The Debate, by jonpud on Aug 7, 2007 10:26:57 GMT 1, Lets face it, most of this stems from jealousy or simple frustration about not being able to obtain a copy of your favorite art for the original price.
I live in Peterborough and Billy Connolly is coming to town for 2 nights, I wanted 4 tickets at ยฃ30.00 each from the Box Office, all sold out within a few hours.
Checked Ebay and arseholes are selling them for ยฃ70.00 each and I have to buy them from some arse in Rugby if I want to see the show in my home town!. Bought the family a DVD instead, and all are dissappointed!! Same thing really?
These people bought up 10,20,30+ tickets!! Boils my blood!!
Lets face it, most of this stems from jealousy or simple frustration about not being able to obtain a copy of your favorite art for the original price.
I live in Peterborough and Billy Connolly is coming to town for 2 nights, I wanted 4 tickets at ยฃ30.00 each from the Box Office, all sold out within a few hours.
Checked Ebay and arseholes are selling them for ยฃ70.00 each and I have to buy them from some arse in Rugby if I want to see the show in my home town!. Bought the family a DVD instead, and all are dissappointed!! Same thing really?
These people bought up 10,20,30+ tickets!! Boils my blood!!
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