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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by des77 on Aug 12, 2011 20:09:55 GMT 1,
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by warsaw project on Aug 12, 2011 20:37:42 GMT 1, BBC3 now, should be an interesting debate, as im an old git...
BBC3 now, should be an interesting debate, as im an old git... |
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simonf
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 418
๐๐ป 46
February 2009
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by simonf on Aug 12, 2011 21:07:31 GMT 1, Interesting fact.
Labour MP Jim Devine, - a wealthy man- systematically over a period of years deliberately, with malice of forethought, cheated his expenses to the cost of 8 thousand pounds
he got 3 months in prison.
A student, spontaneously steals water worth ยฃ3.50p. He gets 6 months in prison.
And apparently it's called Justice!
Interesting fact.
Labour MP Jim Devine, - a wealthy man- systematically over a period of years deliberately, with malice of forethought, cheated his expenses to the cost of 8 thousand pounds
he got 3 months in prison.
A student, spontaneously steals water worth ยฃ3.50p. He gets 6 months in prison.
And apparently it's called Justice!
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ricobenfico
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 3,174
๐๐ป 364
May 2008
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by ricobenfico on Aug 12, 2011 21:38:04 GMT 1, simonf, I have to commend your posts over the past few days. Although not strictly a forum dedicated to this type of subject matter, I think these views and points should be shared as widely as possible. Eloquently put, strong arguments and evidence. Refreshing reading.
I enjoy a good debate and think what was behind the looting and rioting is so deep rooted in society that I worry the real lessons will not be learnt here. There is fundamental change required here that government and legislation cannot solve on their own. This has to come from parents (as CG and others point out), from the media (newspapers, magazines, advertising etc) and the way they report things, from the famous in the way the conduct themselves etc, from our schools and communities etc etc I could go on and on and that is why I fear the real lessons won't be learnt here and only the surface will be scratched with a sticking plaster stuck over things for now whilst the country picks it's self up form a very low point.
simonf, I have to commend your posts over the past few days. Although not strictly a forum dedicated to this type of subject matter, I think these views and points should be shared as widely as possible. Eloquently put, strong arguments and evidence. Refreshing reading.
I enjoy a good debate and think what was behind the looting and rioting is so deep rooted in society that I worry the real lessons will not be learnt here. There is fundamental change required here that government and legislation cannot solve on their own. This has to come from parents (as CG and others point out), from the media (newspapers, magazines, advertising etc) and the way they report things, from the famous in the way the conduct themselves etc, from our schools and communities etc etc I could go on and on and that is why I fear the real lessons won't be learnt here and only the surface will be scratched with a sticking plaster stuck over things for now whilst the country picks it's self up form a very low point.
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gibbin82
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,008
๐๐ป 180
April 2008
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by gibbin82 on Aug 12, 2011 21:50:55 GMT 1, Thought this was a quite amusing from the Mau Mau web site
Thought this was a quite amusing from the Mau Mau web site |
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by freeview on Aug 12, 2011 22:14:06 GMT 1, Interesting fact. Labour MP Jim Devine, - a wealthy man- systematically over a period of years deliberately, with malice of forethought, cheated his expenses to the cost of 8 thousand pounds he got 3 months in prison. A student, spontaneously steals water worth ยฃ3.50p. He gets 6 months in prison. And apparently it's called Justice!
Apparently he was thirsty !
Interesting fact. Labour MP Jim Devine, - a wealthy man- systematically over a period of years deliberately, with malice of forethought, cheated his expenses to the cost of 8 thousand pounds he got 3 months in prison. A student, spontaneously steals water worth ยฃ3.50p. He gets 6 months in prison. And apparently it's called Justice! Apparently he was thirsty ! |
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simonf
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 418
๐๐ป 46
February 2009
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by simonf on Aug 12, 2011 22:31:46 GMT 1, simonf, I have to commend your posts over the past few days. Although not strictly a forum dedicated to this type of subject matter, I think these views and points should be shared as widely as possible. Eloquently put, strong arguments and evidence. Refreshing reading. I enjoy a good debate and think what was behind the looting and rioting is so deep rooted in society that I worry the real lessons will not be learnt here. There is fundamental change required here that government and legislation cannot solve on their own. This has to come from parents (as CG and others point out), from the media (newspapers, magazines, advertising etc) and the way they report things, from the famous in the way the conduct themselves etc, from our schools and communities etc etc I could go on and on and that is why I fear the real lessons won't be learnt here and only the surface will be scratched with a sticking plaster stuck over things for now whilst the country picks it's self up form a very low point.
cheers Ricobenfico 
I really love arguing lol
I got a birthday card once from a family member that had an Oscar Wild quote
"When I find people start agreeing with me then I know I'm completely wrong"
I think as a kid I drove them mad.
but writing is easier than verbal debate in a way, because you can formulate your ideas and take your time to express them.. and even revise them.. can't do that in an argument.
simonf, I have to commend your posts over the past few days. Although not strictly a forum dedicated to this type of subject matter, I think these views and points should be shared as widely as possible. Eloquently put, strong arguments and evidence. Refreshing reading. I enjoy a good debate and think what was behind the looting and rioting is so deep rooted in society that I worry the real lessons will not be learnt here. There is fundamental change required here that government and legislation cannot solve on their own. This has to come from parents (as CG and others point out), from the media (newspapers, magazines, advertising etc) and the way they report things, from the famous in the way the conduct themselves etc, from our schools and communities etc etc I could go on and on and that is why I fear the real lessons won't be learnt here and only the surface will be scratched with a sticking plaster stuck over things for now whilst the country picks it's self up form a very low point. cheers Ricobenfico I really love arguing lol I got a birthday card once from a family member that had an Oscar Wild quote "When I find people start agreeing with me then I know I'm completely wrong" I think as a kid I drove them mad. but writing is easier than verbal debate in a way, because you can formulate your ideas and take your time to express them.. and even revise them.. can't do that in an argument. |
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simonf
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 418
๐๐ป 46
February 2009
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by simonf on Aug 12, 2011 22:41:46 GMT 1, Interesting fact. Labour MP Jim Devine, - a wealthy man- systematically over a period of years deliberately, with malice of forethought, cheated his expenses to the cost of 8 thousand pounds he got 3 months in prison. A student, spontaneously steals water worth ยฃ3.50p. He gets 6 months in prison. And apparently it's called Justice! Apparently he was thirsty !
Interesting fact. Labour MP Jim Devine, - a wealthy man- systematically over a period of years deliberately, with malice of forethought, cheated his expenses to the cost of 8 thousand pounds he got 3 months in prison. A student, spontaneously steals water worth ยฃ3.50p. He gets 6 months in prison. And apparently it's called Justice! Apparently he was thirsty ! |
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.dappy
Full Member
๐จ๏ธ 9,841
๐๐ป 9,462
December 2010
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by .dappy on Aug 12, 2011 23:02:41 GMT 1,
No really - that was his excuse in court!
No really - that was his excuse in court!
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balibob
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 1,782
๐๐ป 326
November 2010
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by balibob on Aug 13, 2011 10:27:23 GMT 1, Their have been some interesting points made in this debate, some I agree with and some I don't, which is good otherwise it would be boring if everyone had the same point of view. The ''harshness'' of some of the jail terms have got some annoyed and they are comparing it with the dishonest MP's court verdicts.
While I admit to being appalled at the leniency handed down to said MP's who swindled the country to fund their craving for plasma tv's, they didn't smash the front door down and then torch the place afterwards.
Any sensible person can see that their are a lot of things wrong with the country at the moment, but how does smashing it up help.
p.s If anyone posts that its the only way they know of expressing themselves, please add your address so I can come round and express my feelings in similar fashion.
Their have been some interesting points made in this debate, some I agree with and some I don't, which is good otherwise it would be boring if everyone had the same point of view. The ''harshness'' of some of the jail terms have got some annoyed and they are comparing it with the dishonest MP's court verdicts.
While I admit to being appalled at the leniency handed down to said MP's who swindled the country to fund their craving for plasma tv's, they didn't smash the front door down and then torch the place afterwards.
Any sensible person can see that their are a lot of things wrong with the country at the moment, but how does smashing it up help.
p.s If anyone posts that its the only way they know of expressing themselves, please add your address so I can come round and express my feelings in similar fashion.
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sakyamuni
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 2,451
๐๐ป 1,671
July 2009
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by sakyamuni on Aug 13, 2011 10:38:01 GMT 1, Thought this was a quite amusing from the Mau Mau web site
i like that ;D thanks for sharing !
Thought this was a quite amusing from the Mau Mau web site i like that ;D thanks for sharing ! |
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by boatyb on Aug 13, 2011 12:03:01 GMT 1, Thought this was a quite amusing from the Mau Mau web site i like that ;D thanks for sharing !
i like it loads too -
just getting in from hanging out with some college students down the block - it started with some japanese dreads on the block were partying, jumped the fence at 2am and came knocking on the back door begging to borrow our little stove thing so they can cook dunno what (i'm too old for this cr*p - what time is it? )... but, ok...
anyways, the kids are just plain old bored - not a good enough excuse, but there it is...
they're probably frustrated... i wonder what's next for them - what are they going to create... my creativity is lacking lately, but we moved woodstock, disco, hip/hop, technology, the internet etc. etc. etc. movements... what are they going to move... they need to find their way... and we MUST keep connected to them... they are not enemies - they are us... haven't had beer for a while - they had some good stuff...
need sleep (too old for this cr*p) - they'll have to figure it out from here - they can keep the little stovey thing...
Thought this was a quite amusing from the Mau Mau web site i like that ;D thanks for sharing ! i like it loads too - just getting in from hanging out with some college students down the block - it started with some japanese dreads on the block were partying, jumped the fence at 2am and came knocking on the back door begging to borrow our little stove thing so they can cook dunno what (i'm too old for this cr*p - what time is it? )... but, ok... anyways, the kids are just plain old bored - not a good enough excuse, but there it is... they're probably frustrated... i wonder what's next for them - what are they going to create... my creativity is lacking lately, but we moved woodstock, disco, hip/hop, technology, the internet etc. etc. etc. movements... what are they going to move... they need to find their way... and we MUST keep connected to them... they are not enemies - they are us... haven't had beer for a while - they had some good stuff... need sleep (too old for this cr*p) - they'll have to figure it out from here - they can keep the little stovey thing... |
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by baileymontana on Aug 13, 2011 14:08:45 GMT 1, Their have been some interesting points made in this debate, some I agree with and some I don't, which is good otherwise it would be boring if everyone had the same point of view. The ''harshness'' of some of the jail terms have got some annoyed and they are comparing it with the dishonest MP's court verdicts. While I admit to being appalled at the leniency handed down to said MP's who swindled the country to fund their craving for plasma tv's, they didn't smash the front door down and then torch the place afterwards. Any sensible person can see that their are a lot of things wrong with the country at the moment, but how does smashing it up help. p.s If anyone posts that its the only way they know of expressing themselves, please add your address so I can come round and express my feelings in similar fashion.
I remember reading Chuck D once saying something along the lines of: There might be some stealing going on at Hip Hop concerts but that is because all the people at the Opera do their stealing at their day job at the Bank.
The majority of MP's really did get away with stealing. Seeing the difference between the prison sentences for the MP & the student quoted in a post earlier is really striking.
Many of the people doing the looting have no access to a system to steal without breaking and entering. If they had a way to claim expenses or steal a few million via a computer with access to lots of people's bank accounts, there would be no "smashing".
The majority of people know that theft is wrong (it's not a class or income thing). David Cameron knew it was wrong to claim from the taxpayers for the cleaning of his chimney, which is why he paid the money back when caught out. Most people looting know it is wrong to steal but they will try to justify it (like the MP's did). If the looters where asked to pay back or return the goods they stole when caught, I am sure they would too.
Their have been some interesting points made in this debate, some I agree with and some I don't, which is good otherwise it would be boring if everyone had the same point of view. The ''harshness'' of some of the jail terms have got some annoyed and they are comparing it with the dishonest MP's court verdicts. While I admit to being appalled at the leniency handed down to said MP's who swindled the country to fund their craving for plasma tv's, they didn't smash the front door down and then torch the place afterwards. Any sensible person can see that their are a lot of things wrong with the country at the moment, but how does smashing it up help. p.s If anyone posts that its the only way they know of expressing themselves, please add your address so I can come round and express my feelings in similar fashion. I remember reading Chuck D once saying something along the lines of: There might be some stealing going on at Hip Hop concerts but that is because all the people at the Opera do their stealing at their day job at the Bank. The majority of MP's really did get away with stealing. Seeing the difference between the prison sentences for the MP & the student quoted in a post earlier is really striking. Many of the people doing the looting have no access to a system to steal without breaking and entering. If they had a way to claim expenses or steal a few million via a computer with access to lots of people's bank accounts, there would be no "smashing". The majority of people know that theft is wrong (it's not a class or income thing). David Cameron knew it was wrong to claim from the taxpayers for the cleaning of his chimney, which is why he paid the money back when caught out. Most people looting know it is wrong to steal but they will try to justify it (like the MP's did). If the looters where asked to pay back or return the goods they stole when caught, I am sure they would too. |
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by des77 on Aug 13, 2011 14:13:12 GMT 1,
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simonf
New Member
๐จ๏ธ 418
๐๐ป 46
February 2009
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by simonf on Aug 13, 2011 14:27:41 GMT 1, Their have been some interesting points made in this debate, some I agree with and some I don't, which is good otherwise it would be boring if everyone had the same point of view. The ''harshness'' of some of the jail terms have got some annoyed and they are comparing it with the dishonest MP's court verdicts. While I admit to being appalled at the leniency handed down to said MP's who swindled the country to fund their craving for plasma tv's, they didn't smash the front door down and then torch the place afterwards. Any sensible person can see that their are a lot of things wrong with the country at the moment, but how does smashing it up help. p.s If anyone posts that its the only way they know of expressing themselves, please add your address so I can come round and express my feelings in similar fashion.
I don't think anyone said smashing things up helps. Any more than fiddling your expenses helps, police taking bribes from journalists helps, lying in court helps. Or breaking the data communications act and hacking peoples phones. None of it helps... it's all profiting from criminal activity.
The only point I thought might be worth making, is poor young uneducated people want to profit by criminal activity, they will not be able to move their assets off shore to avoid tax. They will not be able to claim for a second home at the taxpayers expense.They will not be able to claim for expensive meals, or transport costs to work from the british public. They will not be able to make their wives directors of a separate company, thus avoiding a whole raft of laws regarding the legality of the profit.
All the above activities have netted the individuals thousands and in some cases millions of pounds.
We have even had MPS trying to get the tax payer to pay for their porn videos, let alone pay for mortgages that were paid off years ago
If a young lad from a poor housing estate wants to copy the top journalists, top policemen, and top politicians of this country, and go on an extended spree of criminal activity. His only real option is kicking in a window and legging it with a telly.
But no one is saying it's right. I would however say it is a symptom of what it going on in the larger society. And remember the people who have been rioting will have made a lot less money out of criminal activity than many of the top people in this county... including a lot of the police officers that are now arresting them.
Their have been some interesting points made in this debate, some I agree with and some I don't, which is good otherwise it would be boring if everyone had the same point of view. The ''harshness'' of some of the jail terms have got some annoyed and they are comparing it with the dishonest MP's court verdicts. While I admit to being appalled at the leniency handed down to said MP's who swindled the country to fund their craving for plasma tv's, they didn't smash the front door down and then torch the place afterwards. Any sensible person can see that their are a lot of things wrong with the country at the moment, but how does smashing it up help. p.s If anyone posts that its the only way they know of expressing themselves, please add your address so I can come round and express my feelings in similar fashion. I don't think anyone said smashing things up helps. Any more than fiddling your expenses helps, police taking bribes from journalists helps, lying in court helps. Or breaking the data communications act and hacking peoples phones. None of it helps... it's all profiting from criminal activity. The only point I thought might be worth making, is poor young uneducated people want to profit by criminal activity, they will not be able to move their assets off shore to avoid tax. They will not be able to claim for a second home at the taxpayers expense.They will not be able to claim for expensive meals, or transport costs to work from the british public. They will not be able to make their wives directors of a separate company, thus avoiding a whole raft of laws regarding the legality of the profit. All the above activities have netted the individuals thousands and in some cases millions of pounds. We have even had MPS trying to get the tax payer to pay for their porn videos, let alone pay for mortgages that were paid off years ago If a young lad from a poor housing estate wants to copy the top journalists, top policemen, and top politicians of this country, and go on an extended spree of criminal activity. His only real option is kicking in a window and legging it with a telly. But no one is saying it's right. I would however say it is a symptom of what it going on in the larger society. And remember the people who have been rioting will have made a lot less money out of criminal activity than many of the top people in this county... including a lot of the police officers that are now arresting them. |
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by stillborncrisps on Aug 14, 2011 9:29:15 GMT 1,
Last night I had a little altercation
They wobbled menacingly beneath the yellow street light it became a situation
Well, they wanted my brand-new phone with all the pictures of the kids and the wife
A struggle ensued and then fat children took my life
Well, some passers-by took me to the station
The police force was elsewhere, putting bullets in some guy's head for no particular reason
So I died in the back of the cab but I'll be back to haunt them
This thing does not end here, my spirit walks the streets of Tottenham
Singing 'Fat children took my life'
Oh, the parents are the problem
Giving birth to maggots without the sense to become flies
So pander to your pampered little princess
of such enormous size
Last night I had a little altercation
They wobbled menacingly beneath the yellow street light it became a situation
Well, they wanted my brand-new phone with all the pictures of the kids and the wife
A struggle ensued and then fat children took my life
Well, some passers-by took me to the station
The police force was elsewhere, putting bullets in some guy's head for no particular reason
So I died in the back of the cab but I'll be back to haunt them
This thing does not end here, my spirit walks the streets of Tottenham
Singing 'Fat children took my life'
Oh, the parents are the problem
Giving birth to maggots without the sense to become flies
So pander to your pampered little princess
of such enormous size
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Warm Gun
Junior Member
๐จ๏ธ 4,646
๐๐ป 1,130
August 2009
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TOTTENHAM RIOTS, by Warm Gun on Aug 14, 2011 9:55:00 GMT 1, Love those lyrics!
When I was reading them I was wondering how could you put them to a pleasant melody..then I listened to the actual song and realised you can't
Love those lyrics! When I was reading them I was wondering how could you put them to a pleasant melody..then I listened to the actual song and realised you can't |
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